Prospect Info: The Second Overall Pick Thread: Part I (Kakko/Hughes Talk)

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What do you mean?
Forget that...

Who is a better goal scorer in the draft than Kakko? And would they have broke the finnish rookie record for goals like him?

Yes his mature frame helped compete at that level at 17, but you still have to be one hell of a goal scorer to break that record.
 
Ovechkin was not known for his shot in his draft year. It was very good, but not even close to what he developed later. Shot power, accuracy and release improves over time. If you watched OV in 2004 or 2005, he wasn’t only parked at the left circle or doing his one-on-one wrister.

Laine was known for his shot. I was comparing the release and timing to Kakko, not the raw power. If you watched Laine in 2016, he was hammering pucks off the pass because that was Tappara’s set play. Kakko is just as good as Laine at hammering hard cross-ice feeds, if not better because of his accuracy.

Receiving a cross-ice pass cleanly and slinging it on net in one motion is a lost art. All these kids try to settle it down and look for the perfect shot. Kakko, like OV/Laine, doesn’t. OV, Laine, Kucherov, Stamkos, Mika are on a short list of NHLers who don’t hesitate off the pass. Kakko has similar traits, albeit at a young age.

When I see Kakko ripping shots from the circle, it reminds me of Ovechkin, Laine and Stamkos not only for his timing, but because he shoots it against the grain and labels that far post.

It’s a deadly shot and will get better. If people disagree, then fine. MSG asked me my opinion and I gave it to them.
 
He is a wing.

Can we stop forcing guys who are not centers into the center position?

Who has been forced to play center that’s not a center? Chytil and Andersson were both playing center when drafted, guys like Namestnikov etc have all played center at some point...I think it’s only brought up for Kravtsov and Kakko because their current teams or national teams have played them there a bit
 
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Who has been forced to play center that’s not a center? Chytil and Andersson were both playing center when drafted, guys like Namestnikov etc have all played center at some point...I think it’s only brought up for Kravtsov and Kakko because their current teams or national teams have played them there a bit

CALM DOWN!

STOP TRYING TO CONVERT PEOPLE LIKE SOME KIND OF CENTER MISSIONARY!

;):)
 
He is a wing.

Can we stop forcing guys who are not centers into the center position?
What position he ultimately plays is not of any concern to me. There’s nothing wrong with having a winger as [potentially] your best player/forward. This site obsesses too much with Cup formulas and paint-by-numbers roster configurations.
 
Ovechkin was not known for his shot in his draft year. It was very good, but not even close to what he developed later. Shot power, accuracy and release improves over time. If you watched OV in 2004 or 2005, he wasn’t only parked at the left circle or doing his one-on-one wrister.

Laine was known for his shot. I was comparing the release and timing to Kakko, not the raw power. If you watched Laine in 2016, he was hammering pucks off the pass because that was Tappara’s set play. Kakko is just as good as Laine at hammering hard cross-ice feeds, if not better because of his accuracy.

Receiving a cross-ice pass cleanly and slinging it on net in one motion is a lost art. All these kids try to settle it down and look for the perfect shot. Kakko, like OV/Laine, doesn’t. OV, Laine, Kucherov, Stamkos, Mika are on a short list of NHLers who don’t hesitate off the pass. Kakko has similar traits, albeit at a young age.

When I see Kakko ripping shots from the circle, it reminds me of Ovechkin, Laine and Stamkos not only for his timing, but because he shoots it against the grain and labels that far post.

It’s a deadly shot and will get better. If people disagree, then fine. MSG asked me my opinion and I gave it to them.

Cool. Yeah people seem to mainly think about Ovechkin and Laine as just having an overpowering shot but it’s really that they can shoot it hard with some accuracy rather than just hammering it in the vague vicinity of the net. I don’t know much about Kakko other than highlights but I can understand comparing the ability to accurately get a one timer off even if it’s not with the same power we associate with Ovi or Laine
 
Who has been forced to play center that’s not a center? Chytil and Andersson were both playing center when drafted, guys like Namestnikov etc have all played center at some point...I think it’s only brought up for Kravtsov and Kakko because their current teams or national teams have played them there a bit

yep. exactly.

no one is saying he should be a center, just confirming that hes in fact played some center.

he is, to me, better suited for the wing. however, with chytl and andersson both having played both positions, it isn't out of the realm.

the freedom of thought here sometimes resembles that of communist soviet union.
 
Cool. Yeah people seem to mainly think about Ovechkin and Laine as just having an overpowering shot but it’s really that they can shoot it hard with some accuracy rather than just hammering it in the vague vicinity of the net. I don’t know much about Kakko other than highlights but I can understand comparing the ability to accurately get a one timer off even if it’s not with the same power we associate with Ovi or Laine

I've always found shooting and skating to be not all that dissimilar from pitching in baseball.

In pitching, it's not always about speed. It's about placement and accuracy and movement. Do batters have a hard time picking up the ball as it leaves the pitcher's hand?

Likewise, shooting isn't just about power. It's about placement and accuracy and whether a goalie can pick it up. Skating isn't all about straight ahead speed, it's about agility and the ability maneuver.
 
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Ovechkin was not known for his shot in his draft year. It was very good, but not even close to what he developed later. Shot power, accuracy and release improves over time. If you watched OV in 2004 or 2005, he wasn’t only parked at the left circle or doing his one-on-one wrister.

Laine was known for his shot. I was comparing the release and timing to Kakko, not the raw power. If you watched Laine in 2016, he was hammering pucks off the pass because that was Tappara’s set play. Kakko is just as good as Laine at hammering hard cross-ice feeds, if not better because of his accuracy.

Receiving a cross-ice pass cleanly and slinging it on net in one motion is a lost art. All these kids try to settle it down and look for the perfect shot. Kakko, like OV/Laine, doesn’t. OV, Laine, Kucherov, Stamkos, Mika are on a short list of NHLers who don’t hesitate off the pass. Kakko has similar traits, albeit at a young age.

When I see Kakko ripping shots from the circle, it reminds me of Ovechkin, Laine and Stamkos not only for his timing, but because he shoots it against the grain and labels that far post.

It’s a deadly shot and will get better. If people disagree, then fine. MSG asked me my opinion and I gave it to them.
Thank you.

Kakko is definitely a top 3 goal scorer in the draft, it’s insane for anyone to say it’s average.

In no order, Kakko, Caulfield, Cozens, maybe Kaliyev before Cozens....top goal scorers
 
The stockpiling is the single most important stage of rebuilding, by far. Yet, people can't wait to escape it. Keep stockpiling until the kids are so good, there's no way to get more lottery picks because the kids keep winning games.

The idea shouldn't be to put some artificial deadline on youth acquisition because we want to make the playoffs soon, by hook or by crook.
Particularly when next year's draft is supposed to be stacked. I'm fine with another year in the lottery and then ascend from there.
 
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Let's say we rate Kakko between 1 and 10. I would rank it like this:

Physicality: 9
Shooting: 7
Hockey IQ: 10
Hands: 10
Skating: 8
Passing: 9

Shooting is one of his "weaker" points but it doesn't mean he's bad at it. I would go a bit further into that shooting ability, and rank it like this:

Shooting accuracy: 9
Shooting velocity: 6

Isn't accuracy more important? You weighed it 2:1 in a favor of velocity here.
 
That’s a ridiculous statement then because Kakko’s shot isn’t close to Laine’s in their draft year. Again I’ve seen Kakko play countless times and as much I love him, it’s not an elite shot. You seem to act like me saying he just has a good shot is a bad thing. It’ll improve but right now it’s just good, nothing close to special. Anyone else who’s actually watched him would agree. Laine’s shot was powerful and had velocity to it whereas Kakko’s shots are calculated. Saying this again but his incredible shot placement and his ability to score around the net are what makes him a great goal scorer.

MSG networks also called both Kakko and Hughes generational

Ok but that is all part of the shot. So if you want to say he might not have the strongest shot that’s fine, but saying his shot is one of his weaker points is wrong.
 
accuracy and velocity aren't the only metrics for shooting. windup and release are huge too. these cover to axis, windup time, windup amount/distance and release time which is relative to the windup distance. Some players get high velocity shots off with relatively low amounts of windup which reduces the amount of time the goalie has to react which affects the harder to quantify "hard to pick up" aspect of shots Edge mentions. Ovechkin's windup is huge but he executes it and his release so damn quick, + accuracy + speed, obviously one of the best if not best one-timers in the league.
 
Ovechkin was not known for his shot in his draft year. It was very good, but not even close to what he developed later. Shot power, accuracy and release improves over time. If you watched OV in 2004 or 2005, he wasn’t only parked at the left circle or doing his one-on-one wrister.

Laine was known for his shot. I was comparing the release and timing to Kakko, not the raw power. If you watched Laine in 2016, he was hammering pucks off the pass because that was Tappara’s set play. Kakko is just as good as Laine at hammering hard cross-ice feeds, if not better because of his accuracy.

Receiving a cross-ice pass cleanly and slinging it on net in one motion is a lost art. All these kids try to settle it down and look for the perfect shot. Kakko, like OV/Laine, doesn’t. OV, Laine, Kucherov, Stamkos, Mika are on a short list of NHLers who don’t hesitate off the pass. Kakko has similar traits, albeit at a young age.

When I see Kakko ripping shots from the circle, it reminds me of Ovechkin, Laine and Stamkos not only for his timing, but because he shoots it against the grain and labels that far post.

It’s a deadly shot and will get better. If people disagree, then fine. MSG asked me my opinion and I gave it to them.
Please stop, I can only become so aroused
 
Who has been forced to play center that’s not a center? Chytil and Andersson were both playing center when drafted, guys like Namestnikov etc have all played center at some point...I think it’s only brought up for Kravtsov and Kakko because their current teams or national teams have played them there a bit

Chytil played exclusively on the wing in the Czech Extraliga
 
Thank you.

Kakko is definitely a top 3 goal scorer in the draft, it’s insane for anyone to say it’s average.

In no order, Kakko, Caulfield, Cozens, maybe Kaliyev before Cozens....top goal scorers

NP.

I might even put Caufield tied with Kakko in terms of pure finishing.

I hope Zegras, Boldy and Caufield all end up out west.
 
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What other players (besides Finns) does Kakko remind you of? The speed of his hands and processing is dizzying, and he is literally a tank.
 
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