The San Jose Sharks are horror-bad

[TheBeard]

Burns, Meier, Karlsson to name the big ones, all bad in their own way. He's made some smaller trades that have been bad too or a wash but you need to get back better returns for big players. The trade I'm most understanding for was the Meier one considering the circumstances but still not the return you would expect for a very good forward in his prime.

I didn’t know Grier was able to force other GMs to overpay.

 

[Gregor Samsa]

Who is the next team on a 2nd night of a back to back or a 3 in 4 the Sharks get to play ?

Idk but Sharks are playing with house money at this point. Everyone knows that they’re historically bad. Nothing to be ashamed of, it is what it is. I’m almost in awe of how bad they are. The pressure will always be on the other team

 

[Nowotny]

I saw Sharks in COW Palace in Daly City during their 1st season.They were quite awful.This Sharks team may be even worse

 

[Cas]

Burns, Meier, Karlsson to name the big ones, all bad in their own way. He's made some smaller trades that have been bad too or a wash but you need to get back better returns for big players. The trade I'm most understanding for was the Meier one considering the circumstances but still not the return you would expect for a very good forward in his prime.

I don't think Burns, Meier, or Karlsson were actually that valuable as assets, which is what determines trade value.

Burns was a 37-year-old defenseman with three years remaining on his contract at $8 million apiece, who was no longer performing at a game-breaking level offensively and whose defensive liability is well-known. He wanted out and had a near-full NTC.

Erik Karlsson was a 33-year-old defenseman with four years remaining on his contract at $11.5 million apiece, and a full NMC. He just had one of the most extraordinary seasons by a defenseman ever, and has long been a game-breaking offensive player, but he had also been hurt for the previous five seasons and isn't great shakes defensively either. He wanted out, but there were almost no teams that could afford him and he could pick his preferred destinations, and Sharks ownership apparently wanted to limit the amount of money retained.

Timo Meier was a 26-year-old winger on an expiring contract, going to be an RFA with a $10 million qualifying offer.

Meier was the only really good asset, and he brought back a late 1st, a conditional 2nd (potential late 1st), a good prospect (Mukhamadullin), a mediocre prospect (Okhotiuk), and a mediocre depth roster player (Zetterlund). I think that's about market value for Meier as an asset.

 

[DarrylshutzSydor]

But Hertl is a #1 center lol

 

[D Wakaluk]

Ridiculous. San Jose is deciding every fantasy match-up!

This is going beyond retro. This is just something else

Three home games next; PIT/PHI/EDM. How many points? 1?

 

[TheBeard]

Ridiculous. San Jose is deciding every fantasy match-up!

This is going beyond retro. This is just something else

Three home games next; PIT/PHI/EDM. How many points? 1?

WE’RE GONNA GET A POINT?? Sweet.

 

[Brent Burns]

Sharks fans understand the rationale and are fine with it. The team will look very different in 2-3 years.

 

[TheReelChuckFletcher]

Meier was the only really good asset, and he brought back a late 1st, a conditional 2nd (potential late 1st), a good prospect (Mukhamadullin), a mediocre prospect (Okhotiuk), and a mediocre depth roster player (Zetterlund). I think that's about market value for Meier as an asset.

There are some rumors, as well, that Meier specifically requested a trade to New Jersey, citing the Swiss roster core group of Hischier, Siegenthaler, and Schmid. Carolina allegedly offered a stronger trade package but Grier wanted to fulfill Meier's desired destination.

 

[Headshot77]

There is always Phil Kessel to round it out a bit and make it a bit more palatable. He said he was surprised he hadn't gotten any offers...

You can't lose all your fans while legit tanking otherwise you won't have a franchise to celebrate your hypothetical better future

This is a great point

 

[syz]

On the bright side they still have a better save percentage than the Oilers.

 

[HanSolo]

It's times like these I look back on a certain HF poster declaring unironically (and scoffing at people who doubted it) that the acquisition of Karlsson would herald an era of dominance for the Sharks akin to the 80s Oilers and I laugh.

 

[PattyLafontaine]

This concept has been a hot discussion on the Sharks board for a few years now (and is one that will never get resolved without knowing what happens behind closed doors).

Some fans are totally OK losing every game and getting the highest odds etc etc, but others, me included, are worried about the damage effects of a scorched earth rebuild. I guess we're getting force fed this reality now.

I keep coming back to that game against the Avs where Blackwood stole a point. Winning that game would have meant dick-all in the standings but maybe would have really helped this team figure something out.

The problem is that no one of the current team save for maybe Eklund will be on the Sharks when they become competitive again.

The Hertl contract was an abomination. I love Tomas as a person, but 8 year contracts at 29 for a 65 point player is the height of idiocy.

The Sharks are going to be late 2000s early 2010s Edmonton bad.

This is the price one pays when you constantly trade your 1st round pick and do not maintain the farm system.

Quinn is doing what he is paid to do and that is lose and makre sure the Sharks have the worst record.

Grier has been fairly good with his moves and drafting and he understands that this team isn't going to be competitive until 2028 at the earliest and more likely 2030.

The Sharks will bring in leadership when the team has the baseline level needed to compete.

Right now the Sharks have a few pieces but none are dominant pieces and they have 0 NHL-caliber defensemen at the moment.

 

[BruinsFan37]

Should maybe start a Mikkelson tracker. I.e. will anyone break the record for the worst plus/minus of all time (-82)

4 of 9 players currently on pace for it are on the Sharks, and Zadina is currently on a -98 pace.

 

[BlueSeal]

I think that’s a crazy prediction to make, I could see saying 32nd, but 1OA requires to finish 32nd which is tricky enough and win a lottery you have A 25% shot at. Let’s call a spade a spade, they’ll like pick top 3

Spade

 

[StreetHawk]

The problem is that no one of the current team save for maybe Eklund will be on the Sharks when they become competitive again.

The Hertl contract was an abomination. I love Tomas as a person, but 8 year contracts at 29 for a 65 point player is the height of idiocy.

You can't afford to ruin Eklund. If the Sharks are this bad, probably best to get him off this team and to the Barracudas so that he does not develop bad habits which come with constant losing.

SJ bet on their 30 year olds and it didn't work, which wasn't shocking. One, maybe 2 guys, but not all of Burns, EK, Couture, Vlasic, Kane. Had a chance to move Hertl, but the management group, likely with input from owner opted to extend him in 2022 TDL rather than trade him, like they did with Meier the following year.

 

[MS]

Not to throw stones - but do you remember the Leaf's roster the year that Matthews was eligible for the draft? (And I'm a Hawks fan - so I'm definitely not throwing stones. Sometimes when the team has so little talent on the roster and in the pipeline - the teardown is the best approach)

Honestly though - how much better is this team if you put Meier or Karlsson on it? Marginally better, but still in the running as the worst team in the league, right?

The 15-16 Leafs had a goal differential of -48 for the whole season.

The 23-24 Sharks have a goal differential of -34 after 10 games.

That Leafs team was shit but they were a pretty normal tanking team, coached with some structure by Babcock, and Phaneuf-Rielly-Gardiner-Polak with a Reimer/Bernier goaltending tandem isn't an embarrassing defensive group. GAA was under 3.00.

Hertl is the only player on that SJ roster last night who I'd describe as anything other than a replacement-level forward or a #6-7 defender.

 

[Goptor]

There are some rumors, as well, that Meier specifically requested a trade to New Jersey, citing the Swiss roster core group of Hischier, Siegenthaler, and Schmid. Carolina allegedly offered a stronger trade package but Grier wanted to fulfill Meier's desired destination.

This is revisionist history.
The Hurricanes management said they offered a better package at the time but it was mainly to appease their fan base because they did nothing at the deadline.

Truth is Grier thought NJ's package was more desirable to him than the Hurricanes'

 

[TheBeard]

This is the price one pays when you constantly trade your 1st round pick and do not maintain the farm system.

The thing is they didn't. They just didn't pan out. Goldobin was a bust, Mueller was a bust, Merkley was a bust and then you had Timo. the 2016 pick, Norris and Charlie Coyle were the only ones they did trade in a ten year span.

 

[weastern bias]

For those in this thread hand wringing that they didn't need to go this far scorched Earth, the Sharks are currently only in last by 4 points

So yes, yes they did

 

[gary69]

It's times like these I look back on a certain HF poster declaring unironically (and scoffing at people who doubted it) that the acquisition of Karlsson would herald an era of dominance for the Sharks akin to the 80s Oilers and I laugh.

That's the nature of the cap. If you overpay for one or two players, you ruin the franchise for years. Big contracts are rarely worth it.

It has worked for some teams, but even then it has usually taken three HHOF level of players in their prime (e.g Crosby, Malkin, Letang). Two just isn't enough and only wastes money (McDavid, Draisaitl) if you only add below-HHOF level players to their roster. Better go with "by the committee" approach like St.Louis did.

 

[Javaman]

Well when the Avs dropped from #1 to #4 they still got the best player in the 2017 draft.

*cough Pettersson cough**

 

[DarrylshutzSydor]

Goldubin - 20 goals in 25 games, never really given a chance in SJ......

 

[HabzSauce]

On the bright side at least sharks can tank in peace without having to worry about other basement dwellers.

 

[BelovedIsles]

It’s year one of a full rebuild, this is usually what happens. I’m glad for the franchise, they needed a direction instead of being stuck in perpetual mediocrity.