The Roster Thread, Summer 2024

[Beerz]

What's teh downside of waiting to see how Skinner does this season and doing the buyout mid-season instead of the offseason? Basically waiting until one of the Rochester kids make too strong of a case to steal his spot.


YEah, not even worth discussing.

There are cutoff dates for buyouts... no?

 

[Dingo44]

There is a misconception that all good teams top 4 D are actually top 4 D. There is always someone being carried in the top 4 with inflated numbers no one can really afford 4 of them. I don't think there is even enough in the league. Our D is set outside of a 5/6 addition. Sammy Johnson or Clifton will be in the top 4.

Also I get the idea that Sammy will be better with a bit more structure which has to be coming next season. Health+Structure=Top 4 Samuelsson

 

[Dubi Doo]

If they buy out Skinner, I'd assume they'd need to have some ELCs playing to offset his cap hit or find a solid yet cheap top-9 winger who may not score a lot but can do the dirty work for a scoring line.

 

[Beerz]

With his play the last half of year and our roster structure and lines it makes sense to buyout Skinner but the actual buyout does not make sense. Not this year.
And I don't think management believes Skinner is done.

 

[RefsIdeas]

With his play the last half of year and our roster structure and lines it makes sense to buyout Skinner but the actual buyout does not make sense. Not this year.
And I don't think management believes Skinner is done.

I don’t think Adams thinks Skinner is done, but I have a hard time seeing a new coach coming in and not benching Skinner if he plays like he did this year.

 

[Gras]

There are cutoff dates for buyouts... no?

Thank You - CapFriendly - NHL Salary Caps

Thank you for the amazing 9 years

www.capfriendly.com

The buyout period begins the later of June 15 or 48 hours after the Stanley Cup Final ends. It concludes on June 30 at 5pm ET.

Clubs whom have 1 or more arbitration filings may be permitted to perform a buyout outside of the regular window. This gives teams another opportunity to become cap compliant following an arbitration case.

Clubs are permitted to perform a buyout outside the regular period during the 48 hour period beginning on the third day after the final of [CBA 13(c)ii]:

1. Settlement of the Club's final arbitration case, or
2. Receipt of the Club's last arbitration award

 

[jcbeze]

If they buy out Skinner, I'd assume they'd need to have some ELCs playing to offset his cap hit or find a solid yet cheap top-9 winger who may not score a lot but can do the dirty work for a scoring line.

we'll have no shortage of ELC options....

 

[TheBarnIsElectric]

I thought the talk of buying out Skinner was premature, but Adams' comments and the reports he's looking to add a scoring winger and a 3rd line center make it seem much more likely. If they're adding two more veterans, they almost have to jettison Skinner just for the roster spot.

For wingers, I'd be looking at guys like Bertuzzi or DeBrusk. Both can provide a little production and have size/net front presence, but I shudder to think what the contracts would have to look like.

I have no idea who would be good for 3C. Any good ideas out there?

 

[SundherDome]

Except, you know, you have 2c with a career high of 17 pts

Well we tried a 2c with a career high 68 points and that worked out swimmingly..

 

[SundherDome]

That's where he has looked comfortable?

I think there's value in Krebs but probably a few years away when he can develop into a true middle 6er.

He's not tough enough to be a grinder and not smart enough to be a skill player. He doesn't make enough space to use his passing abilities or to get his weak shot off.

Dude should have been living in front of the net the past 2 years hoping to keep an NHL job. And posters are tagging him for another contract for very little contribution. What's the hook?

Feels like groundhogs day, as this same convo happened two years ago with Mitts. I am not saying he is Mitts but the arc is similar. Krebs is a high IQ playmaker, trying to shoehorn him into a checking role doesn't fit him but he tried his best to make it work. The not smart enough thing is interesting, as he is most definitely smart enough, I think what gets lost in these teams is with little structure and accountability everyone makes dumb passes because they are playing street hockey and sometimes get away with it. Krebs has great vision and is a great passer, he lacks a great shot but can still score in the right spot.

As far as the living in front of the net, the whole team was allergic to the front of the net, sans Benny.

What will be important is the next coach, do they want to run three scoring lines or not. I actually would like to see a line of Quinn Krebs Tuch. Quinn can finish, Tuch can finish, Krebs and Tuch can forecheck and get the puck back. The line could be very good.

I'll leave it at that

I thought the talk of buying out Skinner was premature, but Adams' comments and the reports he's looking to add a scoring winger and a 3rd line center make it seem much more likely. If they're adding two more veterans, they almost have to jettison Skinner just for the roster spot.

For wingers, I'd be looking at guys like Bertuzzi or DeBrusk. Both can provide a little production and have size/net front presence, but I shudder to think what the contracts would have to look like.

I have no idea who would be good for 3C. Any good ideas out there?

Cozens

 

[Tatanka]

Feels like groundhogs day, as this same convo happened two years ago with Mitts. I am not saying he is Mitts but the arc is similar. Krebs is a high IQ playmaker, trying to shoehorn him into a checking role doesn't fit him but he tried his best to make it work. The not smart enough thing is interesting, as he is most definitely smart enough, I think what gets lost in these teams is with little structure and accountability everyone makes dumb passes because they are playing street hockey and sometimes get away with it. Krebs has great vision and is a great passer, he lacks a great shot but can still score in the right spot.

As far as the living in front of the net, the whole team was allergic to the front of the net, sans Benny.

What will be important is the next coach, do they want to run three scoring lines or not. I actually would like to see a line of Quinn Krebs Tuch. Quinn can finish, Tuch can finish, Krebs and Tuch can forecheck and get the puck back. The line could be very good.

I'll leave it at that


Cozens

There is no comparison between the two. Mitts has high hockey iq. Krebs is a rock head. He has below average shot, hands and is poor positionally.

 

[Nikolajs Sillers]

I hope they don't re-sign Girgensons. I'm not too sure he is all in hockey. As some said-Lost love for it.

 

[Aladyyn]

I hope they don't re-sign Girgensons. I'm not too sure he is all in hockey. As some said-Lost love for it.

Sure doesn't show on the ice if that's the case

 

[Matt Ress]

Feels like groundhogs day, as this same convo happened two years ago with Mitts. I am not saying he is Mitts but the arc is similar. Krebs is a high IQ playmaker, trying to shoehorn him into a checking role doesn't fit him but he tried his best to make it work. The not smart enough thing is interesting, as he is most definitely smart enough, I think what gets lost in these teams is with little structure and accountability everyone makes dumb passes because they are playing street hockey and sometimes get away with it. Krebs has great vision and is a great passer, he lacks a great shot but can still score in the right spot.

As far as the living in front of the net, the whole team was allergic to the front of the net, sans Benny.

What will be important is the next coach, do they want to run three scoring lines or not. I actually would like to see a line of Quinn Krebs Tuch. Quinn can finish, Tuch can finish, Krebs and Tuch can forecheck and get the puck back. The line could be very good.

I'll leave it at that


Cozens

That's fair I just don't see the same things. I was a Mitts supporter but I don't see Krebs as effective or as often as CM. I also worry that there's better players now for the top 6 and PK just hasn't adapted to the bottom 6. I think he can be a good player in a couple years but we won't be happy during the wonder years.

 

[Irie]

I really like what I am hearing from all the players in the exit interviews this year.

Last year, guys were disappointed about barely missing the playoffs, but talked about how they were looking forward to training camp next season.

Training camp is not where you practice and improve your game. It also is not where you get in shape for the season. Training camp is for getting caught up to speed on coaching systems and to hopefully develop some chemistry with linemates.

The offseason is when you work hard to improve areas of your game that need work, This year it feels like a lot of guys are talking about how they have a lot to work on this summer. It feels like a major shift in perception... a shift in a very positive direction.

 

[Djp]

There is a misconception that all good teams top 4 D are actually top 4 D. There is always someone being carried in the top 4 with inflated numbers no one can really afford 4 of them. I don't think there is even enough in the league. Our D is set outside of a 5/6 addition. Sammy Johnson or Clifton will be in the top 4.

Many teams have a bottom pair more Defensive D with an off D see Kings McNabb paired with Doughty

There are cutoff dates for buyouts... no?

thru end of June after cup finals and before UFA starts. They have to clear waivers so June 29 is the deadline to do waivers for a buyout

I thought the talk of buying out Skinner was premature, but Adams' comments and the reports he's looking to add a scoring winger and a 3rd line center make it seem much more likely. If they're adding two more veterans, they almost have to jettison Skinner just for the roster spot.

For wingers, I'd be looking at guys like Bertuzzi or DeBrusk. Both can provide a little production and have size/net front presence, but I shudder to think what the contracts would have to look like.

I have no idea who would be good for 3C. Any good ideas out there?

Buying out Skinner is not ideal to do. in 26/27 his cap hit will be over $6M If you wait till summer of 2026 this drops to around 5.67M


I see them with drafting a Center with their 1st. any Center they get would be a short term contract of 3 years or less.

buying out Skinner for what? there isnt much on the market., Some suggest signing Marchessault but hes 2 yrs older than Skinner

looking ahead at ehri roster for next year


I think they sign a vet, maybe just resign Comrie for a year. Have Levi play regularly in Rochester. he gets called up on occasion and plays mid week. they carry another ELC player they can do papaer transactions with when he plays

i think the team makes some moves trading one on Sam/Power/Byram for a RD in a big trade. They could include Jokiharju or Krebs in such a deal

I could see a framework of

Byram/Power/Sam+Jokiharju+krebs+ for Anderssen+Coleman+

 

[joshjull]

Feels like groundhogs day, as this same convo happened two years ago with Mitts. I am not saying he is Mitts but the arc is similar. Krebs is a high IQ playmaker, trying to shoehorn him into a checking role doesn't fit him but he tried his best to make it work.

I don’t see much similarity in their development are arcs. Mitts issue was not having enough strength/conditioning to bring his skill to the NHL. Once he got it, the only thing that held him back was Krueger and injury.

Krebs issue is his incredibly poor decision-making with the puck. From his call up in the middle of 21-22 to the middle of the 22-23 season. He was given a ton of chances at wing and center in the middle 6. After that roughy seasons worth of opportunities. It became abundantly clear he couldn’t break away from making those poor decisions.

So by the 2nd half of 22-23 he was put between Girgs/KO. The idea being they would help him break those bad habits. It eventually worked. But those habits seemed to creep back in this season.

The not smart enough thing is interesting, as he is most definitely smart enough, I think what gets lost in these teams is with little structure and accountability everyone makes dumb passes because they are playing street hockey and sometimes get away with it. Krebs has great vision and is a great passer, he lacks a great shot but can still score in the right spot.

This excuse doesn’t fly. His peers (Cozens/Quinn/Peterka) and someone 5yrs younger (Benson) have all been light years better in the same environment. Krebs is one of the very few youngsters who didn’t take a step forward the last couple years.



I’m not saying Krebs can’t eventually figure it out. He certainly can. I just have no interest in us relying on him to do so next season if the playoffs are the goal.

 

[joshjull]

Now thats a plan we can all get excited about…….

 

[SundherDome]

There is no comparison between the two. Mitts has high hockey iq. Krebs is a rock head. He has below average shot, hands and is poor positionally.

I was comparing their arc from the fan base, two years ago people were running Mitts out of town because of his dumb play and his draft status. Same thing is happening with Krebs and it is crazy how people are just burying it. Skill wise, Krebs and Mitts are similar playmakers. Mitts has the better shot but Krebs isn't afraid of the physical stuff. Imo we have shooters already and just need someone to get them the puck.

 

[Tatanka]

I was comparing their arc from the fan base, two years ago people were running Mitts out of town because of his dumb play and his draft status. Same thing is happening with Krebs and it is crazy how people are just burying it. Skill wise, Krebs and Mitts are similar playmakers. Mitts has the better shot but Krebs isn't afraid of the physical stuff. Imo we have shooters already and just need someone to get them the puck.

No they are not similar. You are comparing apples to watermelons. They are not remotely similar skill wise. Or IQ wise or positionally. Krebs is not a good player and his ceiling is likely been met. CM had a better shot was a netter passer, better instincts and a better vision. Those that were running him outta town were miffed he wasn’t more physical. Those that want Krebs around seem to be enthralled that he will throw hands , and lose, from time to time.

 

[SundherDome]

I don’t see much similarity in their development are arcs. Mitts issue was not having enough strength/conditioning to bring his skill to the NHL. Once he got it, the only thing that held him back was Krueger and injury.

Krebs issue is his incredibly poor decision-making with the puck. From his call up in the middle of 21-22 to the middle of the 22-23 season. He was given a ton of chances at wing and center in the middle 6. After that roughy seasons worth of opportunities. It became abundantly clear he couldn’t break away from making those poor decisions.

So by the 2nd half of 22-23 he was put between Girgs/KO. The idea being they would help him break those bad habits. It eventually worked. But those habits seemed to creep back in this season.


This excuse doesn’t fly. His peers (Cozens/Quinn/Peterka) and someone 5yrs younger (Benson) have all been light years better in the same environment. Krebs is one of the very few youngsters who didn’t take a step forward the last couple years.



I’m not saying Krebs can’t eventually figure it out. He certainly can. I just have no interest in us relying on him to do so next season if the playoffs are the goal.

Based on his time on line combinations over the last two years, he has usually been saddled with Okposo/Girgs/Skinner/Oloffson. When he was given a true second line combo Peterka/Quinn/Mitts/Benson he magically looked much better and his advanced metrics looked much better (I am not an advanced metrics savant but I can understand the concepts).

Re: his peers, I focus on Benson, he was never saddled with Skinner, Oloffson, Girgs or Okposo. That is impressive for a rookie to not be put in that spot. When Benson was with Krebs that was his two highest CF%, which tells me they work good together, put a trigger man on that line (Tuch or Quinn) and you could have a potent line.

To me it just seems like the coaching staff gave Krebs a game or two to go out and prove it and it takes more commitment than a game or two, but when given the chance he actually elevated his play and his linemates and the coaching staff then put him back to the black hole.

 

[Irie]

No they are not similar. You are comparing apples to watermelons. They are not remotely similar skill wise. Or IQ wise or positionally. Krebs is not a good player and his ceiling is likely been met. CM had a better shot was a netter passer, better instincts and a better vision. Those that were running him outta town were miffed he wasn’t more physical. Those that want Krebs around seem to be enthralled that he will throw hands , and lose, from time to time.

The belief that a kid that just turned 23 has likely hit his ceiling is extremely detached from reality.

 

[SundherDome]

No they are not similar. You are comparing apples to watermelons. They are not remotely similar skill wise. Or IQ wise or positionally. Krebs is not a good player and his ceiling is likely been met. CM had a better shot was a netter passer, better instincts and a better vision. Those that were running him outta town were miffed he wasn’t more physical. Those that want Krebs around seem to be enthralled that he will throw hands , and lose, from time to time.

What about the fan base pov comparison is missing for you?

The skill comparisons are closer than you would think, except when it comes to the shot, Mitts had a great release and speed combo. Krebs wont have a shot like that which is fine as we would need him to be a distributor and a net front.

I could careless that Krebs fights once a year, him being more physical is a good thing but it is towards the bottom of reasons why I would want him back.

Now thats a plan we can all get excited about…….

I'm only interested if Ellis gets an extension before the regular season, if not kick rocks

 

[Tatanka]

What about the fan base pov comparison is missing for you?

The skill comparisons are closer than you would think, except when it comes to the shot, Mitts had a great release and speed combo. Krebs wont have a shot like that which is fine as we would need him to be a distributor and a net front.

I could careless that Krebs fights once a year, him being more physical is a good thing but it is towards the bottom of reasons why I would want him back.


I'm only interested if Ellis gets an extension before the regular season, if not kick rocks

It is good to have dreams.

 

[Sabresfansince1980]

What about the fan base pov comparison is missing for you?

The skill comparisons are closer than you would think, except when it comes to the shot, Mitts had a great release and speed combo. Krebs wont have a shot like that which is fine as we would need him to be a distributor and a net front.

I could careless that Krebs fights once a year, him being more physical is a good thing but it is towards the bottom of reasons why I would want him back.


I'm only interested if Ellis gets an extension before the regular season, if not kick rocks

I'm not sure why some fans' misunderstanding of their differences is very relevant. Krebs doesn't have the shot, yes...and he also doesn't have the vision, IQ, or hands that Mitts has. At any comparable stage of their career so far, Mitts has been much better. The linemates comparison doesn't work either. Krebs was put in a safe space between Girgs and Okposo, while Mitts had the likes of Asplund, Olofsson, Jost, and then spurts of top line, Benson and Greenway. The majority of time Mitts was carrying his line, while Krebs was the one being protected.