OT: The Pittsburgher Thread: No 3peat for the Swifts

[xlm34]

Also James Pearce from Tennessee just ran a 4.47, more of an Edge/DE though

Shemar Stewart was already a projected top 10 pick before the combine and this kind of testing will probably make it a lock.

Stewart has combine star that doesn’t work out written all over him.

 

[Snooki Stackhouse]

It’s possible he’s just a bad player. I only shared this because people here have been penciling him in as the next slot WR instead of drafting Egbuka (a good player).


Is your argument that the Steelers can’t develop WRs? History would disagree with you.

My argument is that they're not developing players of any position well enough, and Antonio Brown FIFTEEN years ago doesn't count anymore.

 

[T1K]

My argument is that they're not developing players of any position well enough, and Antonio Brown FIFTEEN years ago doesn't count anymore.

This is a silly and emotional stance to take

 

[WickedWrister]

Stewart has combine star that doesn’t work out written all over him.

They've updated his RAS, he's actually got the #1 DE score - for a position that's got probably some of the biggest athletic freaks in football, that's pretty remarkable. Obviously athletic testing isn't everything but it's a significant piece of the eval for these guys and he certainly helped himself today.

I didn't watch a whole lot of Texas A&M but I trust Brugler (who has him 9th) and Jeremiah (1st round grade - said he "screams Raven" ).

 

[Peat]

Mildly tangential but, insofar as I understand the term, I feel like pressure as a stat covers a multitude of conditions from barely annoying to a QB to utterly killing the play, sort of how like a shot in hockey covers everything from no hope 30 yard slappers to getting into the slot all alone. I do not say that to say sack is a better stat than pressure, but I do hope at some point the stat heads start bringing some granularity to that.

I wonder when someone will get to the study on how high RAS low production prospects do in the NFL. Brugler brought up Hunter, Nolan Smith, and Rashan Gary as examples of guys who succeeded but I'm sure better informed guys than me could bring up plenty of examples of it failing too.

All almost certainly academic for the Steelers in this case mind.

 

[Snooki Stackhouse]

This is a silly and emotional stance to take

It's not emotional at all. They've drafted horribly for over a decade until Colbert retired, and still aren't reliably developing their players.

 

[Empoleon8771]

The Steelers have shown to be so good at drafting and evaluating WRs that I think it's silly to question their evaluation of WRs.

 

[WickedWrister]

Mildly tangential but, insofar as I understand the term, I feel like pressure as a stat covers a multitude of conditions from barely annoying to a QB to utterly killing the play, sort of how like a shot in hockey covers everything from no hope 30 yard slappers to getting into the slot all alone. I do not say that to say sack is a better stat than pressure, but I do hope at some point the stat heads start bringing some granularity to that.

I wonder when someone will get to the study on how high RAS low production prospects do in the NFL. Brugler brought up Hunter, Nolan Smith, and Rashan Gary as examples of guys who succeeded but I'm sure better informed guys than me could bring up plenty of examples of it failing too.

All almost certainly academic for the Steelers in this case mind.

Sacks>Pressures but sacks are generally such a low event stat that I think it makes sense to value pressures as well. There's also the film vs. analytics conversation. Personally I think going and looking at how valuable those 39 pressures were this year would answer it the best but nobody got time for that . That's why I trust some of these more reputable draft guys.

I can't speak to the bolded part but these are the top 10 RAS for DE's since he's been tracking them. Just eyeballing it but it looks like a pretty decent hit rate.

 

[WickedWrister]

Sort of related to pressures/pass rush win rate/run stop rate...I've overdosed on NFL DT content today but wanted to share a good visualization of just how many stud interior defensive lineman are in this class.

 

[Pens1566]

These guys must be pretty dumb to not understand this offense.

This is what makes me seriously doubt the story in the first place. It just screams that this is a PR move of some sort. The Rooney/Steelers version of the whole "Despres is a drunken degenerate gambler that eats babies" shit that they pumped through that skeevy perv DK.

 

[Mr Jiggyfly]

The Steelers are great at drafting and developing WRs is a myth that relies on past success, long in the rear view.

Much like “Tomlin is a great coach because he won a SB 17 years ago.”

It’s living off a rep that’s no longer true and living in the past.

Steelers haven’t drafted a game breaking, legit #1 WR since Brown, 15 years ago.

JuJu, Dj, and Pickens in 13 combined seasons put up a total of 3 1000 seasons.

Only Juju when he had 111 @ 1426, put up true #1 numbers, and never came close again.

None of these three have ever had year in and out consistency like a #1.

So the Steelers are good at drafting #2 type receivers the last 15 years, is much more appropriate and accurate.

 

[bigdaddyk88]

The Steelers are great at drafting and developing WRs is a myth that relies on past success, long in the rear view.

Much like “Tomlin is a great coach because he won a SB 17 years ago.”

It’s living off a rep that’s no longer true and living in the past.

Steelers haven’t drafted a game breaking, legit #1 WR since Brown, 15 years ago.

JuJu, Dj, and Pickens in 13 combined seasons put up a total of 3 1000 seasons.

Only Juju when he had 111 @ 1426, put up true #1 numbers, and never came close again.

None of these three have ever had year in and out consistency like a #1.

So the Steelers are good at drafting #2 type receivers the last 15 years, is much more appropriate and accurate.

Wr is the most dependent position in all of sports. If you don’t have qb to throw the ball to you you can’t put up numbers. We saw AB literally disappear when Ben was hurt.

 

[JTG]

Give me a break.

DL/LB running at the combine today. Full tracker is on steelersdepot but they've met with the following guys:

DT Kenneth Grant | Michigan
DT Derrick Harmon| Oregon
DT Alfred Collins | Texas
DT Vernon Broughton | Texas
DE Jordan Burch | Oregon
DL Shemar Turner | Texas A&M

Darius Alexander put up really good testing numbers, like 97th percentile. Was also a standout at the Senior Bowl. Might go top 50. Landon Jackson another guy that could go in that range, 40.5" vert at 6'6" 270

This may be the best DL class ever.

Also James Pearce from Tennessee just ran a 4.47, more of an Edge/DE though

Shemar Stewart was already a projected top 10 pick before the combine and this kind of testing will probably make it a lock.

Stewart has combine star that doesn’t work out written all over him.

Coming here to say this lol. Lukas Van Ness type player. Demarvin Leal type player. Whatever team drafts him needs to rethink how to deploy him.

They've updated his RAS, he's actually got the #1 DE score - for a position that's got probably some of the biggest athletic freaks in football, that's pretty remarkable. Obviously athletic testing isn't everything but it's a significant piece of the eval for these guys and he certainly helped himself today.

I didn't watch a whole lot of Texas A&M but I trust Brugler (who has him 9th) and Jeremiah (1st round grade - said he "screams Raven" ).

Sort of related to pressures/pass rush win rate/run stop rate...I've overdosed on NFL DT content today but wanted to share a good visualization of just how many stud interior defensive lineman are in this class.

We need Tyleik Williams, I think. I'm big on him and Grant. I think both of those guys are going to be awesome. I'd have a wet dream if they picked two DL with the first two picks and the defense would be basically done for a decade. Offensive line could be ready to roll. We would just need to find WRs and upgrade QB maybe.

 

[bigdaddyk88]

I am hoping for a trade down pick up another 3rd. Give me 2 DL in the first 3 picks a rb and wr/te
Give me 2 cbs in free agency and a DL guy plus a wr. Go nickel with 4 pass rushers like Buffalo and Philly rotating them.

 

[JTG]

There would be something awesome about having a 320lb white nose tackle named Thor here.

 

[JTG]

Stud level measurements here.

 

[Mr Jiggyfly]

Wr is the most dependent position in all of sports. If you don’t have qb to throw the ball to you you can’t put up numbers. We saw AB literally disappear when Ben was hurt.

DJ Moore put up the best numbers of his career with Fields in 2023.

Jefferson put up big numbers with a journeyman QB.

Guys like Wilson and McLaurin have trucked along without any star QBs.

Make more excuses I guess, but once again facts are facts.

Tomlin hasn’t drafted a legit #1 WR since 2010, and GP route running suggests he’s far from a top dog.

 

[bigdaddyk88]

DJ Moore put up the best numbers of his career with Fields in 2023.

Jefferson put up big numbers with a journeyman QB.

Guys like Wilson and McLaurin have trucked along without any star QBs.

Make more excuses I guess, but once again facts are facts.

Tomlin hasn’t drafted a legit #1 WR since 2010.

Mclaurin was literally complaining about doing weekly cardio before Daniels arrived in Washington. Wilson was complaining this past season about lack of targets and creativity in the Jets offense. 70 catches and 1100 yards leading the nfl in yac with mason mitch and pickett not bad for a wr 2 like GP. People want to pay Higgins 30 million aav but year to put up GP numbers.

 

[xlm34]

I am hoping for a trade down pick up another 3rd. Give me 2 DL in the first 3 picks a rb and wr/te
Give me 2 cbs in free agency and a DL guy plus a wr. Go nickel with 4 pass rushers like Buffalo and Philly rotating them.

If they sign a starter level DL type in FA, then I think 2 DL in the first three picks is overkill.

 

[MrBrightside]

The Steelers have shown to be so good at drafting and evaluating WRs that I think it's silly to question their evaluation of WRs.

Is anyone who would reasonably be responsible for that still around (other than Tomlin)?

 

[Ulf5]

Also James Pearce from Tennessee just ran a 4.47, more of an Edge/DE though

Shemar Stewart was already a projected top 10 pick before the combine and this kind of testing will probably make it a lock.

Who's the rest of the top 5 on that list and how did they fare in the NF of L?

 

[Mr Jiggyfly]

Mclaurin was literally complaining about doing weekly cardio before Daniels arrived in Washington. Wilson was complaining this past season about lack of targets and creativity in the Jets offense. 70 catches and 1100 yards leading the nfl in yac with mason mitch and pickett not bad for a wr 2 like GP. People want to pay Higgins 30 million aav but year to put up GP numbers.

Has McLaurin been consistent year after year no matter who is under center?

Yep - because he’s a legit #1.

Did Moore put up his best season with a QB on the Steelers roster? Yep.

Cowher developed Thigpen, Ward and Plex with QBs like O’D, Stewart and Maddox.

One dude was selling insurance before Cowher plucked him off the scrap heap - so uh…

And the most impressive thing is Cowher was conservative as f*** and still developed these guys.

Again, just more excuses for Tomlin.

 

[bigdaddyk88]

If they sign a starter level DL type in FA, then I think 2 DL in the first three picks is overkill.

Why? Cam has maybe 2 years left. You cut Larry O Lowry you sign a real guy to start . You draft cams replacement and Benton backup. They couldn’t function without Cam against bmore in the playoffs. Leal has no position Adams is cut able

 

[Buddy Bizarre]

It’s possible he’s just a bad player. I only shared this because people here have been penciling him in as the next slot WR instead of drafting Egbuka (a good player).

Certainly anything is possible. But as someone posted above, this organization doesn't get the benefit of the doubt at this point. If this were the KC Chiefs, I'd be more apt to believe he's a bad player.

 

[bigdaddyk88]

GP if he was healthy literally would have matched Terry in everything he did before Daniels showed up. Gp is putting up Moore numbers in Carolina