GDT: The Pittsburgher Thread: Football

[Buddy Bizarre]

Gerry Dulac
@gerrydulac
·
1h
Steelers might not be done making moves before today's trade deadline, per team source.

 

[pistolpete11]

If Kamara gets hurt, having Ingram isn’t really going to do much for them. Kamara is their offense. I don’t know. My point is just that giving a running back of Najee’s quality a ton of touches isn’t unique to the Steelers. And whether we like him or not, I think McFarland was their plan to spell Najee some but then he tore his MCL in camp. We’ll see if he gets more touches going forward.

Are they going to win the Superbowl with Ingram? Probably not. They probably aren't going to win it even with Kamara, but Ingram will help reduce the risk of Kamara getting hurt and he gives them a hell of a lot better chance at winning some games without him than McFarland gives the Steelers without Harris. Even just a regular season game could be the difference between making the playoffs or not.

I don't think they were planning on McFarland spelling Harris. First of all, that's not Tomlin's MO. Relying on 1 RB is more feature than bug when it comes to Tomlin's teams. Second, this balanced attack is a recent development. I think they were planning on Ben throwing the ball 50+ times a game again which was a big mistake.

 

[Smoke]

Agree… but was it worth it? They’re still in the thick of things even if they’re not a true contender and if Highsmith or Watt go down again, they don’t have anyone to take their place who’s as good as Ingram

Do you keep a disgruntled player around to be a backup? I'm sure there are varying opinions here about that, but the organization doesn't keep them around 10 out of 10 times.

 

[WheresRamziAbid]

1. Melvin Ingram is a backup playing the normal snap share of a backup.

He believes he still has the goods to be a starter, we afforded him the oppurtunity.

There is no villain here.

2. Harris, is a workhorse. Spelling him 10 snaps a game is very unlikely to change significantly the risks of being a work horse running back.

If you want to mix in other backs it should be because they give you advantages in specific situations (passing down guy etc) or Harris needs a breather in that specific moment.

there is no reason to take him out to protect him. He is a significant competitive advantage, so use him.

 

[xlm34]

Are they going to win the Superbowl with Ingram? Probably not. They probably aren't going to win it even with Kamara, but Ingram will help reduce the risk of Kamara getting hurt and he gives them a hell of a lot better chance at winning some games without him than McFarland gives the Steelers without Harris. Even just a regular season game could be the difference between making the playoffs or not.

I don't think they were planning on McFarland spelling Harris. First of all, that's not Tomlin's MO. Relying on 1 RB is more feature than bug when it comes to Tomlin's teams. Second, this balanced attack is a recent development. I think they were planning on Ben throwing the ball 50+ times a game again which was a big mistake.

I don’t think that’s true at all. Not when all the talk in the offseason from ownership down is about improving the run game. I know people think they’re stupid, but they aren’t that dumb.

 

[Smoke]

I would like to see them have at least a dependable backup RB who can be counted on to not suck when the time arises.

 

[pistolpete11]

I don’t think that’s true at all. Not when all the talk in the offseason from ownership down is about improving the run game. I know people think they’re stupid, but they aren’t that dumb.

Improved doesn't mean they were going to become a run-first or balanced team. It just means they wanted to be better at it. I think there's been a pretty clear shift in their commitment to run the ball the last several weeks.

If they planned to run the ball as much as they have the last 3 weeks and they didn't get a decent back up running back....I mean....that's on the same level of stupidity as letting Ben throw the ball 50 times a game.

 

[Night Shift]

If they were serious about becoming a run first team (never mind what I think of Tomlin for a second) and revamp the playbook, get yourself a burner so that you have a Thunder and Lightning threat scenerio. The Steelers would be hard to game plan against. There is nothing like a power and speed combo.

 

[ziggyjoe212]

Do you keep a disgruntled player around to be a backup? I'm sure there are varying opinions here about that, but the organization doesn't keep them around 10 out of 10 times.

I'm on the "should have kept Melvin" train but you make a good point. A disgruntled player will just cause drama. On the flip side it sends the wrong message that players have too much power. You want to leave? Just poute and you'll be traded and get your wish.

We don't have any good back up OLBs. We're screwed if/when TJ or Highsmith go down.

 

[ziggyjoe212]

Give Harris 50 touches a game. Who gives a turd? He's the entire offense. What's the point of keeping him on the bench? Our back ups suck so we have no choice but to give it to him every play.

It's no different than Henry, Kamara, CMC, Zeke (circa 2016-2019), AP in his prime, etc.

He's gonna have 300+ touches, and rightfully so.

 

[Double-Shift Lasse]

Serious question...

There are so many injuries at the RB position year after year. Gore, Lynch, and AP are the only RBs I can think of from a recent era that have lasted through time at the top of the depth chart. It seems like other RBs fizzle due to injuries within 5 or so years. They might stick around as journeyman backups but they're largely irrelevant.

We're concerned that our rookie RB will get worn down within his rookie deal like most other RBs have gotten worn down. How did RBs like Bettis, Eddie George, Emmitt Smith, Martin, Edgerrin James, Fred Taylor, Faulk, Barber, and Dillon all last a decade or more as productive players across several contracts - all within roughly the same era (a heavy rushing era also)?

An interesting question. I don’t think it’s as simple as ‘players are different’ or ‘the game is different’?

I was talking with a buddy a week or so ago. This has changed because AP is active again, but at the time, Mark Ingram was the leading active rusher with like 7600 yards, 55th all time. There just don’t seem to be active backs who are going to move up high in the career list. Part of this is the importance of the passing game, but some is that guys just don’t seem to be productive for more than a few seasons.

 

[ChaosAgent]

Serious question...

There are so many injuries at the RB position year after year. Gore, Lynch, and AP are the only RBs I can think of from a recent era that have lasted through time at the top of the depth chart. It seems like other RBs fizzle due to injuries within 5 or so years. They might stick around as journeyman backups but they're largely irrelevant.

We're concerned that our rookie RB will get worn down within his rookie deal like most other RBs have gotten worn down. How did RBs like Bettis, Eddie George, Emmitt Smith, Martin, Edgerrin James, Fred Taylor, Faulk, Barber, and Dillon all last a decade or more as productive players across several contracts - all within roughly the same era (a heavy rushing era also)?

Just saw this because @Double-Shift Lasse bumped it...

I think teams realized that they want running backs young & cheap. That it was such a plug & play position that paying a name-brand star big money against the cap was a waste of time and they'd rather throw some other rookies into the fray.

TBH I feel bad for the position. It attracted so many of the top athletes in HS & college because it was guaranteed to touch the ball and impact the game. But because of that glut of supply they became pretty much interchangable. There should be some sort of multiplier/kicker in rookie deals for any player drafted as a RB because their career is so short.

 

[JTG]

Ruggs will be out of the league for a year. Donte Stallworth 2.0

 

[dogthateats]

Just got a notification from ESPN from this

 

[DanielPlainview]

I don't understanding moving Ingram for a lousy 6th round pick. Wouldn't it be preferable to, you know, use him more so he doesn't feel wasted? Giving Watt and Highsmith plays off with a guy like Ingram is a luxury you'd think most coaches would love to have.

 

[bigdaddyk88]

I don't understanding moving Ingram for a lousy 6th round pick. Wouldn't it be preferable to, you know, use him more so he doesn't feel wasted? Giving Watt and Highsmith plays off with a guy like Ingram is a luxury you'd think most coaches would love to have.

He was playing more snaps then Highsmith and producing less. He thinks he should start over Highsmith

 

[ChaosAgent]

I really don't understand why it can be the org's fault that Ingram wanted out. HighSmith is better and the defense will never get a stop if Watt isn't on the field.

Maybe Ingram thought he was better than HighSmith but most fans expected HighSmith to be at least as good as Dupree was

 

[The Old Master]

I don't understanding moving Ingram for a lousy 6th round pick. Wouldn't it be preferable to, you know, use him more so he doesn't feel wasted? Giving Watt and Highsmith plays off with a guy like Ingram is a luxury you'd think most coaches would love to have.

if a guy wants out, what are you going to do? he could screw up the whole team.

 

[JTG]

And he got to walk away from the wreck. Crazy world.

That is also what I thought. He hit someone going over 100 mph. Unbelievable he just had minor injuries.

 

[DanielPlainview]

He’ll be lucky to not do time

 

[Mr Jiggyfly]

It's absolutely infuriating. This was entirely avoidable if Ruggs weren't a selfish and moronic prick. Now a 23 year old has had everything taken away. And he killed her dog.

Just read that she was alive and screaming for help and bystanders couldn’t get her out before the car exploded.

Thats f***ed up beyond comprehension.

If I was her father I wouldn’t be able to be in the same room with Ruggs - I’d lose it.

Feel so damn bad for her family man.

 

[Buddy Bizarre]

Source: Browns excuse OBJ from practice again

 

[Buddy Bizarre]

It really is a league wide thing. If a team has an elite running back (CMC, Dalvin Cook, Henry, Barkley, Kamara, etc.), they give them the ball a ton. And most get injured. Tomlin tries to do it with any running back he has, which as we saw with Conner was stupid. But most teams would be using Harris like this. It’s not really unique to the Steelers.

Harris is taking 89% of the offensive snaps.

Derrick Henry, the workhorse - mid 70% Only one game over 80%
Ez Elliot - 72% - First game of the season 83%......has not been over 75% in the last 6 games
Kamara - 81% -
Dalvin Cook - 74-77%
Chubb - not one game over 60%
Jonathan Taylor - only one game over 70% - the last game that went OT.
Mixon - only one game over 80%
Aaron Jones - only 2 games over 70 % - Single game high of 73%

 

[xlm34]

Harris is taking 89% of the offensive snaps.

Derrick Henry, the workhorse - mid 70% Only one game over 80%
Ez Elliot - 72% - First game of the season 83%......has not been over 75% in the last 6 games
Kamara - 81% -
Dalvin Cook - 74-77%
Chubb - not one game over 60%
Jonathan Taylor - only one game over 70% - the last game that went OT.
Mixon - only one game over 80%
Aaron Jones - only 2 games over 70 % - Single game high of 73%

Cool now do touches per game. I’m sure Najee is near the top but I doubt there’s this massive difference between what he’s getting and some others are getting.

 

[Buddy Bizarre]

Cool now do touches per game. I’m sure Najee is near the top but I doubt there’s this massive difference between what he’s getting and some others are getting.

So a player not touching the ball means he doesn't exert any energy?
There's route running, there's blocking, there's getting bumped.

Just because you don't touch the ball and get tackled, doesn't mean your body isn't taking a pounding.