The Next Ones (after Bedard)

[Pavel Buchnevich]

DuPont is the best since McDavid. Maybe best of the 2000’s. No one else of the last 10 years has been generational either.

 

[Patty Ice]

“Good authority” lol…You can comfortably stop listening to that person

@frontsfan67

Whoever told you that clearly must watch soccer instead

Sorry. Apparently some people need a and a full explanation that I was referring to a person's post because I was able to read all the way down the first page.

 

[LeProspector]

i think McKenna is well on his way to be a top 5 pick next year, nothing guaranteed at this point but he’s making some positive steps.

Landon Dupont is special and (the next one) as the title suggests, McKenna is more Taylor Hall in my opinion, a very good offensive winger and may even win some hardware in his career. But not at all on the Bedard/McDavid/Dupont/Crosby levels.

 

[Sasha Orlov]

DuPont is the best since McDavid. Maybe best of the 2000’s. No one else of the last 10 years has been generational either.

Agreed, DuPont is head and shoulders above everyone not named McDavid/Crosby

 

[wetcoast]

Ovechkin before 2010 was better than Draisaitl ever was, his skating ability in addition to his skill and stature is something that simply doesn’t exist today. And I think Draisaitl is a top 3 player in the world

This is fair but Ovi had an excellent 3 year peak then was meh, in elite terms after that.

Some highs, some lows but became less dynamic and more of a volume shooter after that peak.

Draisaitl has had the much better prime which is 7 years.

Jaxon Jacobson (2027 draft) is tracking as a name to watch...

I like him alot but he isn't elite like some others being mentioned here.

 

[Fantomas]

Ovechkin's and Draisaitl's best 7 seasons in order by adjusted goals created:

O: 52.9, 47.2, 46.9, 46.1, 42.6, 41.2, 40.1

D: 50.5*, 48.6, 47.5, 46.9, 43.1, 42.8, 39.6

* so far this season (subject to change).

We'll see how Drai fares the rest of the way. Great player, but does he have the staying power?

Ovechkin, by the way, had two outstanding seasons after 2010 in which he finished first in Hart voting among skaters (once he won, other time he finished second to a goalie). Apparently this means "meh" to certain people, but not everybody has common sense.

 

[Eternal Leaf]

I think at this point, if we're talking generational, the only guy you could talk about is Landon Dupont.

Some others are definitely franchise level.

100% agree.

Dupont is the only one with a legitimate claim at that tag and he's a prospect you can use "the next one" for.

Probably the best 15-year-old defenseman I've ever watched.

 

[wetcoast]

Ovechkin's and Draisaitl best 7 seasons in order by adjusted goals created:

O: 52.9, 47.2, 46.9, 46.1, 42.6, 41.2, 40.1

D: 50.5*, 48.6, 47.5, 46.9, 43.1, 42.8, 39.6

* so far this season (subject to change).

We'll see how Drai fares the rest of the way. Great player, but does he have the staying power?

Ovechkin, by the way, had two outstanding seasons after 2010 in which he finished first in Hart voting among skaters (once he won, other time he finished second to a goalie). Apparently this means "meh" to certain people, but not everybody has common sense.

2 things here.

First adjusted goals created is basically another way to say goals.

I also use a 7 year consecutive prime for prime but others don't which is fair but they are slightly different metrics.

So using a 7 year consecutive prime makes this look quite different and the meh years were parts outside of the 3 year peak and we are comparing the elite of the elite not everyone.

Even if we take your "anytime 7 year prime" which is fair as it's a metric but not what I was referring to.

Even if we take your "anytime 7 year prime" which is fair as it's a metric but not what I was referring to Draisatal comes out on top as here are there 7 year adjusted point totals.

Drai 128,127,124,122,106,105,104

Ovi 122,117,114,107,104,94,92.

Draisatal comes consecutively also which was the point I was trying to convey and he might add more 100+ points adjusted seasons after this one still.

 

[wetcoast]

Its hillarious that the NHL previously had like 3 generational players ever, then now these little kids think every other draft has a generational player. Fans are so out of touch with reality

Yes and no.

If you are referring to Orr, Gretzky and Mario then since then we've had incredible growth of top NHL producing regions that simply didn't exist that pump out elite type of prospects today.

Quick name the elite prospects, heck even good NHL players coming out of British columbia or the maritimes before the 80's?

While the level of quality in the NHL has risen one would expect that exceptional, ie generational players won't stand out as much.

 

[independent observer]

i think McKenna is well on his way to be a top 5 pick next year, nothing guaranteed at this point but he’s making some positive steps.

Landon Dupont is special and (the next one) as the title suggests, McKenna is more Taylor Hall in my opinion, a very good offensive winger and may even win some hardware in his career. But not at all on the Bedard/McDavid/Dupont/Crosby levels.

To say Bedard is on a level of Crosby and McDavid is and insult… he may have been great in jr league but in the NHL he is a disappointment.

 

[LeProspector]

To say Bedard is on a level of Crosby and McDavid is and insult… he may have been great in jr league but in the NHL he is a disappointment.

still far too early to make any sort of proclamations on a 19 year old kid.

He is one of the most dominant junior players ever and is/was considered to be on that level at the time of his draft. What he has done in the NHL is redundant to what I said. DuPont is on Bedard/McDavid/Crosby level of talent.

 

[wetcoast]

still far too early to make any sort of proclamations on a 19 year old kid.

Sure career wise but both Crosby and McDavid won Art Ross trophies in their second NHL seasons so we can make the proclamation that Bedard isn't on their level and almost certainly will never catch up.

He is one of the most dominant junior players ever and is/was considered to be on that level at the time of his draft

He was dominant statistically but many could see that his skillset wouldn't translate as easily as Crosby/McDavid and I'm a huge fan of Bedard.

. What he has done in the NHL is redundant to what I said.

In what way, do you know what redundant means?

DuPont is on Bedard/McDavid/Crosby level of talent.

It may end up

Crosby
McDavid (one could do 1A/1B)

Bedard


and Dupont somewhere in the middle way too early to tell though.

 

[LeProspector]

Sure career wise but both crosby and McDavid won Art ross trophies in their second NHL seasons so we can make the proclamation that Bedard isn't on their level and almost certainly will never catch up.



He was dominant statistically but many could see that his skillset wouldn't translate as easily as Crosby/McDavid and I'm a huge fan of Bedard.



In what way, do you know what redundant means?



It may end up

Crosby
McDavid (one could do 1A/1B)

Bedard


and Dupont somewhere in the middle way too early to tell though.

Bedard was on their level coming out of the CHL. How the f*** is this even an argument?

DuPont is going to be on that level too. What’s so hard to comprehend?

 

[Pavel Buchnevich]

Bedard was on their level coming out of the CHL. How the f*** is this even an argument?

DuPont is going to be on that level too. What’s so hard to comprehend?

I think his point is that although he had similar stats and accolades he didn’t project as well to the NHL as they did.

 

[JackSlater]

It's hard to know what to look for in Dupont compared to forwards. We've seen various "generational" talents at forward, but few on defence. Realistically it's just Orr and probably Potvin on defence (too hard to compare Fetisov in 1970s USSR to a prospect today) and that's it. They both started in the OHA at 14 at were very good from the start, and in Orr's case he was elite as a 15 year old. The world juniors didn't really exist, but in Orr's case he played against the Soviet men's team as a 17 year old and was player of the game (I think) in a losing effort. By the time he was 19 Orr was the best defenceman in the NHL, Potvin was the best non-Orr defenceman as a 21 year old.

They would have played in the strongest junior league available at the time, and it was an OHA that had some players from Quebec and had not excessively expanded, but development systems are so different~50 years later that comparisons are really difficult. That Dupont can more than hold his own in the WHL as a 15 year old defenceman is impressive. I can't imagine him being less than an all star at least.

 

[wetcoast]

Bedard was on their level coming out of the CHL. How the f*** is this even an argument?

DuPont is going to be on that level too. What’s so hard to comprehend?

I think his point is that although he had similar stats and accolades he didn’t project as well to the NHL as they did.

Exactly, one only though this if one was simply stat watching and like I said I'm a huge fan of Bedard but he simply didn't project as NHL impact ready like Crosby and McDavid did for the next level.

There was simply no scenario that Bedard goes to any NHL team and wins the Art Ross in year 2 post draft.

 

[Zalos]

Looking forward at what teams should be at the bottom of the standings for Dupont's draft year, it would be pretty hilarious if the Pens got another generational player again. I bet their fans are hoping for something like that!

 

[Jay Gray]

Looking forward at what teams should be at the bottom of the standings for Dupont's draft year, it would be pretty hilarious if the Pens got another generational player again. I bet their fans are hoping for something like that!

Hoping for Bettman's going away present to be McKenna and then Dupoint.

 

[Mattb124]

still far too early to make any sort of proclamations on a 19 year old kid.

Exactly, and yet you did.

 

[LeProspector]

Exactly, and yet you did.

That he’s a superstar in the NHL and is going to be a generational talent? Oh god, no. How could I!

 

[Mattb124]

That he’s a superstar in the NHL and is going to be a generational talent? Oh god, no. How could I!

I have no idea, because he is not near the level of McDavid or Crosby. And yet you did.

 

[seadawg]

It's hard to know what to look for in Dupont compared to forwards. We've seen various "generational" talents at forward, but few on defence. Realistically it's just Orr and probably Potvin on defence (too hard to compare Fetisov in 1970s USSR to a prospect today) and that's it. They both started in the OHA at 14 at were very good from the start, and in Orr's case he was elite as a 15 year old. The world juniors didn't really exist, but in Orr's case he played against the Soviet men's team as a 17 year old and was player of the game (I think) in a losing effort. By the time he was 19 Orr was the best defenceman in the NHL, Potvin was the best non-Orr defenceman as a 21 year old.

They would have played in the strongest junior league available at the time, and it was an OHA that had some players from Quebec and had not excessively expanded, but development systems are so different~50 years later that comparisons are really difficult. That Dupont can more than hold his own in the WHL as a 15 year old defenceman is impressive. I can't imagine him being less than an all star at least.

I've always considered Lidstrom to be generational. In my opinion he is the second greatest defenseman to ever play the game, after Orr.

 

[daver]

Bedard was on their level coming out of the CHL. How the f*** is this even an argument?

Lots of players put up huge CHL numbers but are never objectively labeled by scouts to have that translate into the NHL equivalent. Most scouts were not putting him on Crosby/McDavid level despite the similar statistical domination.

 

[JackSlater]

I've always considered Lidstrom to be generational. In my opinion he is the second greatest defenseman to ever play the game, after Orr.

As a talent no one would apply that label though. As great as Lidstrom became, and I have him as one of the top five defencemen of all time, his prospect profile is nothing special. Bourque is the same way, though he became a star as a teenager while Lidstrom took a few more years. Dupont is a much higher profile prospect than Lidstrom at the same age, which does not mean that he will be as good as Lidstrom became of course.

 

[Fatass]

Bedard was definitely good enough in junior for the media and the nhl to promote him as “the next one”. Clearly it’s a rare player who actually lives up to such expectations. There are names of current young players who are being floated as future stars. It’s what the media does. Bit Bedard has the double hype of the media and the nhl. Not so sure there is a young guy currently who will get that hype from the league like Bedard got.