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The Michael Del Zotto is a delsaster.

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smoneil said:
I'd be more inclined to give your opinion on MDZ some credibility if you didn't do this EVERY effing offseason. You just aren't happy unless you pick a player you don't like, and then wall-paper the boards with this tired old "he's stupid/low hockey iq" bit. Last year it was Dubinsky. This year it's Del Zotto. Who's next?

Michael Del Zotto is inconsistent. It is not because he's stupid. It is not because he lacks talent. It's because he's 22 years of age. When Staal was that age, he was in his second year in the league, and trying to develop some semblance of an offensive game. That attempt resulted in his defensive game suffering. He was inconsistent and people here were not too high on him. When Dan Girardi was that age, he was still 2 years removed from being an NHL player. When Stralman was that age, he was getting run out of Toronto and wearing the "bust" label. Those of you who want him moved at all costs keep piping up that he's "our fourth defenseman." Yeah. He's behind three other guys right now. Two of those three are significantly older than MDZ, and MDZ at 22 is significantly better than those guys were at the same age (McD is the only one who was as good/better, as young).

People used to say that NY couldn't rebuild because the fans would never allow it. You guys are proving that now. You don't trade a 22 year old kid who has shown as much as Del Zotto already has. It's just idiocy.
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Imo the decision is rather simple.

I am rather optimistic for the Rangers chances over the next few years. Weren't they 3rd scoring 5 on 5 in the playoffs? Did we see Nash at his best (or even a healthy Nash)? My guess? NO.
Could the PP be worse (Don't we say that every year?)? I submit that the team would be playing Pitt if the team could score with the special teams.

If the Rangers shop DZ, hopefully they will be stunned at the offers they receive from the other Gm's. After all how many teams are dreaming of acquiring a 22 yr old Dman who has the "talent" DZ has? The offers should be hard to reject. Trading DZ could help this team now. As I look a few years down the road the window for Lundy might close? How strong a player will Nash be in 5 years? Acquiring talent to help Lundy for the next 5 few years is how I view the game plan. If anyone wants to restart a youth movement then move both Lundy and Nash.

If, however, DZ fails to yield an attractive return then the Rangers might as well retain him and hope for the best.
 
HatTrick Swayze said:
Come on now. Have you met many hockey players?

Of all the things I will give DZ **** for, what he does off ice is his own business.
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Yes, I have. I was one in high school.

What a player does off the ice reflects his team. Richards and Carter partying hard probably had something to do with getting traded and to different places too. Radulov and AKostitsyn were suspended last playoffs by their team, and now they don't have a contract. Just saying that off ice behavior is pretty important to control.
 
As dumb as DZ has been I'd give him another chance with a new coach unless we can trade him for a good return.
 
To me Del Zotto wasn't really ready his rookie year with the Rangers. He might have been the most creative offensive defenseman in their organization but the other aspects of his game lagged behind. Basically they pushed him into the lineup too soon and it's stunted his development a bit.
 
eco's bones said:
To me Del Zotto wasn't really ready his rookie year with the Rangers. He might have been the most creative offensive defenseman in their organization but the other aspects of his game lagged behind. Basically they pushed him into the lineup too soon and it's stunted his development a bit.
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This Exactly!
 
Beardacus said:
As dumb as DZ has been I'd give him another chance with a new coach unless we can trade him for a good return.
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MDZ was playing so tight in the Boston series, he regressed to the point that he was almost paralyzed by fear of making a mistake (how many breakout passes ended up on the stick of someone in black and yellow?). I put a lot of that on the coach. He deserves a shot with a new leader and a new system.

If Slats does go the trade route, I am quite sure that there will be no shortage of takers for a young, offensively talented defenseman.
 
Kris Chreider said:
Yes, I have. I was one in high school.

What a player does off the ice reflects his team. Richards and Carter partying hard probably had something to do with getting traded and to different places too. Radulov and AKostitsyn were suspended last playoffs by their team, and now they don't have a contract. Just saying that off ice behavior is pretty important to control.
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Kris Chreider said:
Like how many leather jackets to wear.

Anyone seen what pics come up on Google Images when you Google "Michael Del Zotto girlfriend"? Clearly a ladies' man.

I'm not saying his off-ice behavior causes his inconsistency, but you can't ignore that.
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Does Del Zotto's affinity for leather jackets truely "reflect his team"? Really?? What about what happens when you google him? Do you think he is behind that, in control of it?

Did Del Zotto ever violate team rules IN THE PLAYOFFS a la Radulov or Kostitsyn?

Let's put aside the fact that Richards/Carter's "off ice issues" were never confirmed. It could very well be Holmgren just trying to be cover own ass. By many accounts, Richards and Carter were shipped out to accomodate the "new sheriff in town" Chris Pronger. Lol.

Think the Kings are concerned about "off ice issues" right now? Unless players are showing up to practice 3 sheets to the wind there are far worse things.

Look I am NO Del Zotto fan. But put down the damn pitchforks.
 
HatTrick Swayze said:
Does Del Zotto's affinity for leather jackets truely "reflect his team"? Really?? What about what happens when you google him? Do you think he is behind that, in control of it?

Did Del Zotto ever violate team rules IN THE PLAYOFFS a la Radulov or Kostitsyn?

Let's put aside the fact that Richards/Carter's "off ice issues" were never confirmed. It could very well be Holmgren just trying to be cover own ass. By many accounts, Richards and Carter were shipped out to accomodate the "new sheriff in town" Chris Pronger. Lol.

Think the Kings are concerned about "off ice issues" right now? Unless players are showing up to practice 3 sheets to the wind there are far worse things.

Look I am NO Del Zotto fan. But put down the damn pitchforks.
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I'm far from a DZ hater. I'm just defending my point. Agree to disagree.
 
smoneil said:
I'd be more inclined to give your opinion on MDZ some credibility if you didn't do this EVERY effing offseason. You just aren't happy unless you pick a player you don't like, and then wall-paper the boards with this tired old "he's stupid/low hockey iq" bit. Last year it was Dubinsky. This year it's Del Zotto. Who's next?

Michael Del Zotto is inconsistent. It is not because he's stupid. It is not because he lacks talent. It's because he's 22 years of age. When Staal was that age, he was in his second year in the league, and trying to develop some semblance of an offensive game. That attempt resulted in his defensive game suffering. He was inconsistent and people here were not too high on him. When Dan Girardi was that age, he was still 2 years removed from being an NHL player. When Stralman was that age, he was getting run out of Toronto and wearing the "bust" label. Those of you who want him moved at all costs keep piping up that he's "our fourth defenseman." Yeah. He's behind three other guys right now. Two of those three are significantly older than MDZ, and MDZ at 22 is significantly better than those guys were at the same age (McD is the only one who was as good/better, as young).

People used to say that NY couldn't rebuild because the fans would never allow it. You guys are proving that now. You don't trade a 22 year old kid who has shown as much as Del Zotto already has. It's just idiocy.
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Simple answer: I do it every effing offseason because it comes up every effing offseason. I'm not starting the threads. And the threads exist because Del Zotto continues to be a frustrating player. People don't make this **** up because they don't like Del Zotto. He has holes in his game.

The excuse was "he's 19". Then the excuse was "he's 20". Then the excuse was "he's 21". Now the excuse is "he's 22". Now after 4 years in the NHL, I'm beginning to wonder where the cutoff point is, and when his age will stop being an excuse for the holes in his game.

And yes, like you said, Marc Staal struggled in his youth as well. But but Staal's 4th year in the league was 10-11. He was already an elite shutdown defenseman by then and went to an all-star game that year. Stralman was given the bust label because he was expected to be elite offensively. That's really not his game. But by his 4th year his defensive game was far beyond where Del Zotto's is now. By a player's 4th year, we should be seeing more improvements than Del Zotto has shown.
 
Machinehead said:
Simple answer: I do it every effing offseason because it comes up every effing offseason. I'm not starting the threads. And the threads exist because Del Zotto continues to be a frustrating player. People don't make this **** up because they don't like Del Zotto. He has holes in his game.

The excuse was "he's 19". Then the excuse was "he's 20". Then the excuse was "he's 21". Now the excuse is "he's 22". Now after 4 years in the NHL, I'm beginning to wonder where the cutoff point is, and when his age will stop being an excuse for the holes in his game.

And yes, like you said, Marc Staal struggled in his youth as well. But but Staal's 4th year in the league was 10-11. He was already an elite shutdown defenseman by then and went to an all-star game that year. Stralman was given the bust label because he was expected to be elite offensively. That's really not his game. But by his 4th year his defensive game was far beyond where Del Zotto's is now. By a player's 4th year, we should be seeing more improvements than Del Zotto has shown.
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I'm curious to see what you guys mean when you say "holes". It's becoming a buzzword around here.
 
JCresty said:
I'm curious to see what you guys mean when you say "holes". It's becoming a buzzword around here.
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Consistently missing the net by 10 or more feet. That's a hole.

Jumping deep into the zone and being an absolute non-factor when he does. If you're gonna jump in, you better do something with it. Too many times he pinches or rushes into the corner and ends up not even touching the puck. That's a 3 on 1 the other way. That's a hole.

Alarmingly low panic threshold which often causes him to slide across the ice like an idiot any time the other team has a decent scoring chance. That's a hole.

Joining the rush and completely fanning on the drop pass from the forward. He does that very often. That's a hole.
 
Machinehead said:
Simple answer: I do it every effing offseason because it comes up every effing offseason. I'm not starting the threads. And the threads exist because Del Zotto continues to be a frustrating player. People don't make this **** up because they don't like Del Zotto. He has holes in his game.

The excuse was "he's 19". Then the excuse was "he's 20". Then the excuse was "he's 21". Now the excuse is "he's 22". Now after 4 years in the NHL, I'm beginning to wonder where the cutoff point is, and when his age will stop being an excuse for the holes in his game.

And yes, like you said, Marc Staal struggled in his youth as well. But but Staal's 4th year in the league was 10-11. He was already an elite shutdown defenseman by then and went to an all-star game that year. Stralman was given the bust label because he was expected to be elite offensively. That's really not his game. But by his 4th year his defensive game was far beyond where Del Zotto's is now. By a player's 4th year, we should be seeing more improvements than Del Zotto has shown.
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A defenseman with as much experience as Del Zotto has at his age is quite rare. It took a solid guy like Sauer longer than that just to make it to his rookie year--so at least in my books MDZ has achieved quite a lot.

My problem with him is his game seems to be stagnating. This year IMO he didn't appear to improve in a single area of his game and that's a bit troubling. To some degree I think he even regressed a bit. It doesn't help when he's not paired with another solid d-man who can back him up. His size and strength are another area of concern. I think a lot of teams focus on forechecking him particularly hard because he can be rattled and overpowered and outmatched by bigger guys.
 
By the way, MH and HBH, I agree there are holes. I was just wondering if I was thinking of a different set of systematic flaws then the rest of you.
 
JCresty said:
By the way, MH and HBH, I agree there are holes. I was just wondering if I was thinking of a different set of systematic flaws then the rest of you.
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I was thinking of the movie "Holes" with Shia Lebeouf

531212_488.jpg


:sarcasm:
 
Kris Chreider said:
Yes, I have. I was one in high school.

What a player does off the ice reflects his team. Richards and Carter partying hard probably had something to do with getting traded and to different places too. Radulov and AKostitsyn were suspended last playoffs by their team, and now they don't have a contract. Just saying that off ice behavior is pretty important to control.
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Probably not the best example because they won a Cup together last season and are in the WCF right now.
 
eco's bones said:
A defenseman with as much experience as Del Zotto has at his age is quite rare. It took a solid guy like Sauer longer than that just to make it to his rookie year--so at least in my books MDZ has achieved quite a lot.

My problem with him is his game seems to be stagnating. This year IMO he didn't appear to improve in a single area of his game and that's a bit troubling. To some degree I think he even regressed a bit. It doesn't help when he's not paired with another solid d-man who can back him up. His size and strength are another area of concern. I think a lot of teams focus on forechecking him particularly hard because he can be rattled and overpowered and outmatched by bigger guys.
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I too was concerned that Del Zotto never really seems to get into a groove and play as well or better than he had last season. I also think that some of the problem is related to the fact that he was playing the right side with Staal--he just never seemed to get comfortable.
 
Brooklyn Ranger said:
I too was concerned that Del Zotto never really seems to get into a groove and play as well or better than he had last season. I also think that some of the problem is related to the fact that he was playing the right side with Staal--he just never seemed to get comfortable.
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Actually, that's where his best part of the season was spent.

Staal can cover up for his boneheaded pinches that lead to odd-man rushes against.
 
Brooklyn Ranger said:
I disagree--playing a player out of position is not the best way to bring out their potential. Del Zotto looks much more comfortable playing the left side.
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I remember DZ actually playing well and not like a complete moron when he was paired with Staal early in the season.
 
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