Deadpool8812
Registered User
- Feb 10, 2018
- 13,100
- 16,717
It was just a boring movie, really. You keep waiting for something big to happen, but it never came. The villain was also...bland
Movies: The Marvels
- Thread starter Jussi
- Start date
Guardian17
Strong & Free
Excellent post.
What is really infuriating watching this bland, unimportant film is that Carol Danvers can be a great character.
All Disney needs to do is look at the source material like Carol and Tony Stark going to an AA meeting.
Instead, we get a character who is so "perfect" that she is boring and sterilized.
She's out of nowhere married to a dude for technical reasons!?!
Her girlfriend shows up out of nowhere to house Skrull refugees making Secret Invasion a waste of time.
I feel bad for Teyonah Paris and Iman Vellani for being thrown into this movie without a well written script.
It's too bad Kevin Feige has so little testosterone that he'd never consider this costume.
johnjm22
Pseudo Intellectual
- Aug 2, 2005
- 20,996
- 17,916
Bob Iger on Disney’s Movie Woes: “We Lost Some Focus”
The media and entertainment mogul said it's imperative to focus on quality and not quantity.
www.hollywoodreporter.com
Iger said this in the recent Disney earnings call:
“That said, as I looked at our overall output, meaning the studio, it’s clear that the pandemic created a lot of challenges creatively for everybody, including for us,” the media mogul said. “In addition, at the time the pandemic hit, we were leaning into a huge increase in how much we were making and I’ve always felt that quantity can be actually a negative when it comes to quality. And I think that’s exactly what happened. We lost some focus.”
That's good to hear. MCU and SW need a reset, and need to focus on quality not quantity.
Looks like the Marvels did 47M domestic, and 63M international. It could struggle to make 300M worldwide.
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Yeah, It looks like it's headed for The Flash numbers which likely means it will be one of the biggest money losers of all - time.
To add perspective, Five Nights at Freddy's opened in theaters two weeks ago, during the actors' strike and simultaneously on streaming, and still took in $80M domestically in its opening weekend. As johnjm22 said, the latest projection for The Marvels is only $47M.
deadline.com
‘The Marvels’ Meltdown: Disney MCU Posts Lowest B.O. Opening Ever At $47M — What Went Wrong – Sunday Update
‘The Marvels’ is heading to the lowest opening ever for a Disney MCU pics at $47M-$55M. despite its stars’ last-minute promotion after the actors strike deal.
deadline.com
LadyJet26
LETS GO BLUE!!!!!
I enjoyed it. Not my favourite MCU project but far from my least favourite.
Iman was fantastic in this and she needs to be the new star of the MCU. I agree with others that said the same thing.
Iman was fantastic in this and she needs to be the new star of the MCU. I agree with others that said the same thing.
Holden Caulfield
He's guilty
Well I enjoyed this one. Honestly the biggest problem to me was that it felt a little rushed. It could have stood to have 10-20 minutes of slower scenes to properly establish the characters a little better. And thats with me having watched and been a big fan of both Wandavision and Ms Marvel. For those who haven't seen those I can totally see how it might feel like this movie started in the middle of a story. When they failed at one point you never get to sit with it for a moment, you never feel the failure because literally 5 seconds later it's off the next fight. It ruins the stakes, IMO.
But I did like how the clawed Capt Marvel back to earth so to speak. This entire movie happens because she isn't all powerful, she isn't perfect. Everything here is her fault. She had to drop the cocky attitude and deal with her mistakes and listen to others. Which is a nice change for the character. Brie Larson did a good job.
Iman Vellani was fantastic as Ms Marvel, IMO. But her supporting cast did not need to be in this one as much as they were, IMO. I liked them all in the TV series, but they had nothing to do in this one and could and should have been left out of the 2nd half, IMO.
The rushing hurt Teyonnah Parris' Capt Rambeau character the most, IMO. The conflict between her and Capt Marvel felt under developed and her arc in the film felt the most unearned by the end. We just needed more time with the characters.
Overall though it's a solid MCU entry. It's nowhere near the high's of Endgame or Guardians 1 but it's not anywhere close to the lows of Iron Man 2 or 3. Pacing problems are becoming common place though from the slow as molasses Eternals to rushed feeling of this one and Thor Love and Thunder. They need to slow down the pace of movies and refine these things a little more before release. I think all 3 were decent enough but could have been refined a little better.
But I did like how the clawed Capt Marvel back to earth so to speak. This entire movie happens because she isn't all powerful, she isn't perfect. Everything here is her fault. She had to drop the cocky attitude and deal with her mistakes and listen to others. Which is a nice change for the character. Brie Larson did a good job.
Iman Vellani was fantastic as Ms Marvel, IMO. But her supporting cast did not need to be in this one as much as they were, IMO. I liked them all in the TV series, but they had nothing to do in this one and could and should have been left out of the 2nd half, IMO.
The rushing hurt Teyonnah Parris' Capt Rambeau character the most, IMO. The conflict between her and Capt Marvel felt under developed and her arc in the film felt the most unearned by the end. We just needed more time with the characters.
Overall though it's a solid MCU entry. It's nowhere near the high's of Endgame or Guardians 1 but it's not anywhere close to the lows of Iron Man 2 or 3. Pacing problems are becoming common place though from the slow as molasses Eternals to rushed feeling of this one and Thor Love and Thunder. They need to slow down the pace of movies and refine these things a little more before release. I think all 3 were decent enough but could have been refined a little better.
tarheelhockey
Offside Review Specialist
To add perspective, Five Nights at Freddy's opened in theaters two weeks ago, during the actors' strike and simultaneously on streaming, and still took in $80M domestically in its opening weekend. As johnjm22 said, the latest projection for The Marvels is only $47M.
‘The Marvels’ Meltdown: Disney MCU Posts Lowest B.O. Opening Ever At $47M — What Went Wrong – Sunday Update
‘The Marvels’ is heading to the lowest opening ever for a Disney MCU pics at $47M-$55M. despite its stars’ last-minute promotion after the actors strike deal.
That one was a much-anticipated horror franchise launching on Halloween weekend, I’m not sure there’s a meaningful comparison here.
That's why it's a meaningful comparison. It was much anticipated and this was not.
Iman is an absolute gem and she nailed this role.
I enjoyed the film a lot (after really enjoying Ms. Marvel). Solidly in the middle of my MCU rankings.
Marvel's issue right now is oversaturation, especially with the shows.
I think Covid condensed the timeline a bit, but the sheer amount of content, and content that was not nearly as mainstream, has pushed a lot of people away. And as mentioned above, it's a commitment to get back on the train.
I mean in under three years we've had:
Wandavision
Falcon and the Winter Soldier
Loki
Black Widow
What If
Shang Chi
Eternals
Hawkeye
No Way Home
Moon Knight
Multiverse of Madness
Ms. Marvel
Love and Thunder
She-Hulk
Wakanda Forever
Quantumania
Guardians Vol 3
Secret Invasion
Loki S2
The Marvels
That's what, 70-75 hours worth of content give or take? I mean the entirety of the Infinity Saga is something like 60 hours. And that was over 11 years.
I like the shows overall, but they need to seriously slow things down.
I enjoyed the film a lot (after really enjoying Ms. Marvel). Solidly in the middle of my MCU rankings.
Marvel's issue right now is oversaturation, especially with the shows.
I think Covid condensed the timeline a bit, but the sheer amount of content, and content that was not nearly as mainstream, has pushed a lot of people away. And as mentioned above, it's a commitment to get back on the train.
I mean in under three years we've had:
Wandavision
Falcon and the Winter Soldier
Loki
Black Widow
What If
Shang Chi
Eternals
Hawkeye
No Way Home
Moon Knight
Multiverse of Madness
Ms. Marvel
Love and Thunder
She-Hulk
Wakanda Forever
Quantumania
Guardians Vol 3
Secret Invasion
Loki S2
The Marvels
That's what, 70-75 hours worth of content give or take? I mean the entirety of the Infinity Saga is something like 60 hours. And that was over 11 years.
I like the shows overall, but they need to seriously slow things down.
Bocephus86
Registered User
This is a great way to sum up the problem IMO. This is what happened to me. I watched them all through End Game, and then a couple of the TV Shows (Loki S1, the one with Elizabeth Olsen, the Hawkeye/Arrow girl show, even the one where they introduced the new Captain America). I stopped midway through the one with the ancient Egyptian stuff and haven't watched any of the others. It was too much, and not entertaining enough to keep my interest (I can't even remember the names of them...). Around that time the same thing happened with the movies. I loved the new GotG. I watched the new Thor and was disappointed. I put The Eternals on in the background, technically watched it but don't remember much. Never got around to the other recent ones.
When I read about this movie I came to learn that there was a lot of setup in the various shows I did watch, and much more in the ones I didn't. Im sure I could go see this without that background, but I liked the continuity of the through End Game world so I would be missing that.
They've just put out too much content. If it was all good like GotG then that's one thing. But its not. Though I've heard good things about Loki S2 so I will probably check that out.
Part of this might be because of MCU fatigue and not as many homeruns for them of late but sadly for this specific movie part of it was the regular incels doing their best to trash the movie because it had Brie Larsson and 3 female leads. Not sue how many might have been deleted but when I looked at the it 2 days ago so many negative reviews were about that basically.
This movie was never going to do as well as the first one. First one got the boost being released in March before Avengers, so people wanted to see how she fit into the MCU. Giving it a nice bump.
So, realistic expectations were needed on the second film.
I've seen all of the Disney+ series, save for Ms Marvel. I watched the first episode, but didn't find it interesting. I think TV series are best served for those characters without wordly powers. Like a Daredevil, Iron Fist, Hawkeye. Even Hulk, since that's basically a different character than the alter ego.
I've seen just a few clips and maybe the first trailer. I don't think I got who the villian was in this movie. I understand that there was a swapping of powers among the 3 heroes for parts of the film. I will watch it on Disney+, but I don't think I'm making a trip to see it in theatres.
Quality of MCU movies has gone down, when compared to the solo films of Thor 3, the last 2 Capt. America ones, Black Panther.
Captain Marvel starred Brie Larson and was trashed on release, yet made $1.1B. Avengers: Endgame came out after that and had Brie Larson, yet made $2.8B and became the highest grossing movie of all time. Black Panther: Wakanda Forever came out last year and had 3 female leads who were also black, yet made $860M and was the 6th-most successful movie of the year. This movie isn't struggling because of sexism and racism, but because moviegoers aren't interested in this particular movie for a variety of other reasons.
Here's an article from March that I read a few days ago. It's a warning to be prepared for the "go woke, go broke" crowd to take credit if/when this movie flops, but it seems relevant because you're giving that crowd that credit by suggesting that the "incels" are part of the reason why the movie is failing. The article argues that it'll have failed for reasons other than that and that we should be honest about those reasons.
Don’t Blame Wokeness When The Marvels Fails
The Marvels combines a lot of factors, and a silly name, which suggest it could be the MCU's first major flop. Don't blame wokeness if it is
www.thegamer.com
NyQuil
Big F$&*in Q
I have no problem trashing movies that aren't good regardless of what gender or ethnicities the leads are.
Ground-breaking I know.
I'm not seeing a lot of movies right now because I have a 2 year old, and the fact that it will inevitably end up on Disney+ which I subscribe to, makes it pretty easy to skip it in the theatre.
Disney is getting my money anyway.
All this doom and gloom about movies is pretty funny when they're charging people monthly anyway, like virtually every other kind of product that has also moved to a subscription model to drive profits higher.
Ground-breaking I know.
I'm not seeing a lot of movies right now because I have a 2 year old, and the fact that it will inevitably end up on Disney+ which I subscribe to, makes it pretty easy to skip it in the theatre.
Disney is getting my money anyway.
All this doom and gloom about movies is pretty funny when they're charging people monthly anyway, like virtually every other kind of product that has also moved to a subscription model to drive profits higher.
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AtlantaWhaler
Thrash/Preds/Sabres
- Jul 3, 2009
- 20,244
- 3,503
I'm a big Marvel fan and I'm even having trouble keeping up with all the over-saturation.
Within the last month or two:
GotG 3 streams
Marvels
Loki 2
Echo trailer
Announcements of new movie release dates
It's non-stop and, IMO, hurting the overall product.
Within the last month or two:
GotG 3 streams
Marvels
Loki 2
Echo trailer
Announcements of new movie release dates
It's non-stop and, IMO, hurting the overall product.
NyQuil
Big F$&*in Q
They're so damned greedy and so incompetent.
I guess it depends on whether you care about any kind of lasting legacy or just the current stock price.
johnjm22
Pseudo Intellectual
- Aug 2, 2005
- 20,996
- 17,916
I know I might get accused of sexism for saying this, but I think men are less interested in female centric movies.Captain Marvel starred Brie Larson and was trashed on release, yet made $1.1B. Avengers: Endgame came out after that and had Brie Larson, yet made $2.8B and became the highest grossing movie of all time. Black Panther: Wakanda Forever came out last year and had 3 female leads who were also black, yet made $860M and was the 6th-most successful movie of the year. This movie isn't struggling because of sexism and racism, but because moviegoers aren't interested in this particular movie for a variety of other reasons.
Here's an article from March that I read a few days ago. It's a warning to be prepared for the "go woke, go broke" crowd to take credit if/when this movie flops, but it seems relevant because you're giving that crowd that credit by suggesting that the "incels" are part of the reason why the movie is failing. The article argues that it'll have failed for reasons other than that and that we should be honest about those reasons.
Don’t Blame Wokeness When The Marvels Fails
The Marvels combines a lot of factors, and a silly name, which suggest it could be the MCU's first major flop. Don't blame wokeness if it is
This isn't to say men don't like movies with female leads, many films with female leads garner a large male audience (Rogue One, TFA, Aliens, and so on). But there's a difference between a film with a female lead, and female centric film; or a movie that feels like it's made for a female audience.
I don't think this is the main reason it's failing. The Flash and Blue Beetle failed recently as well. But I do think women are more likely to see a "guy movie" like Gladiator or Top Gun, than men are to see a "chick flick".
The Marvels isn't a "chick flick", but it does kind of feel like a super hero movie for girls.
Teemu
Caffeine Free Since 1919
- Dec 3, 2002
- 28,900
- 5,574
The audience for The Marvels this weekend was 61% male, comparable to male-led Marvel films
Marvel Taught Us That Movies Need to Be Events, but the MCU No Longer Qualifies
"The Marvels" is a disaster while "Priscilla" and "The Holdovers" both stay strong. "Dream Scenario" and "Tiger 3" open strong.
www.indiewire.com
I don't think that there's any reason to doubt the conventional wisdom that
1. Disney released way too much Marvel in a small window
2. Captain Marvel only succeeded because of the timing of the film before Endgame
3. Movie-going habits have changed
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johnjm22
Pseudo Intellectual
- Aug 2, 2005
- 20,996
- 17,916
As always, it's not a single reason. I agree with these 3 factors you've listed. It's a combination of things.The audience for The Marvels this weekend was 61% male, comparable to male-led Marvel films
Marvel Taught Us That Movies Need to Be Events, but the MCU No Longer Qualifies
"The Marvels" is a disaster while "Priscilla" and "The Holdovers" both stay strong. "Dream Scenario" and "Tiger 3" open strong.
I don't think that there's any reason to doubt the conventional wisdom that
1. Disney released way too much Marvel in a small window
2. Captain Marvel only succeeded because of the timing of the film before Endgame
3. Movie-going habits have changed
If this movie came out 5 years ago, it would probably be doing much better.
But I still speculate that men have less interest in female centric movies. Grace even talked about this in her breakdown:
NyQuil
Big F$&*in Q
The audience for The Marvels this weekend was 61% male, comparable to male-led Marvel films
Marvel Taught Us That Movies Need to Be Events, but the MCU No Longer Qualifies
"The Marvels" is a disaster while "Priscilla" and "The Holdovers" both stay strong. "Dream Scenario" and "Tiger 3" open strong.
I don't think that there's any reason to doubt the conventional wisdom that
1. Disney released way too much Marvel in a small window
2. Captain Marvel only succeeded because of the timing of the film before Endgame
3. Movie-going habits have changed
37% of attendees for the opening weekend of Black Panther were black. They account for ~13.6% of the US population. (although numbers probably include Canada as well).
39% of attendees for the opening weekend of the Marvels were female or non-male. They account for ~51.1% of the US population.
Every time I read an article written by a woman that bemoans the lack of support for the Marvels, and the "toxic incel culture", I ask about where the support from the very large female demographic is...
Meanwhile, I’m still waiting for the hand-wringing regarding the lack of male viewership for Hallmark romance Christmas movies.
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I think the stock price has become the driver sadly due to other areas of disney's vast empire not doing very well. The media segment of Disney is the main driver for them these days, not the parks or IP stuff etc.
RandV
It's a wolf v2.0
Whether or not they succeed that's kind of the point though. Disney is selling to a global market place so when they have the white guy market cornered with Stark/Rogers/Thor/Parker/etc, so they try to seek growth in other markets. Which is why Brie Larson's Captain Marvel is a character that maybe little girls will look up to (again whether or not that works is beside the point), and not some big boobed blond in spandex and high heels.
This is a topic though that 'gamers' started getting pissy about some years back and it's expanded into other geek culture. And of course with social media & youtube you have a whole content creator model that earn their living peddling this nonsense.
Disney didn't seem to have much faith in the movie given how many times they pushed back the release date and did re-shoots. Also, no toy line which is pretty telling.
