The Management Thread | Live, Play, Repeat Edition

[CanuckleBerry]

Those comments from Benning on the Toffoli situation...

I'm genuinely on edge as a fan thinking about what comments he might have about Tanev, Stecher, and Markstrom.

 

[valkynax]

Those comments from Benning on the Toffoli situation...

I'm genuinely on edge as a fan thinking about what comments he might have about Tanev, Stecher, and Markstrom.

"We would've had to move money out but we ran out of time."

Done.

 

[I am toxic]

Those comments are indefensible

And yet, they will be defended.

 

[I am toxic]

I guess Jim misses Benning on Empty too...

Paging @Jyrki21

 

[Jyrki21]

It does not appear they have one on the amateur scouting side. This follows the trend of front office staff leaving and not being replaced. The Canucks probably have the leanest front office in the NHL.

Wasn't Todd Harvey basically moved into the role for the last draft? He's not listed anymore, what happened? Was the well poisoned that quickly?!

edit: No wait, Harvey's still there, listed among coaches and staff. He only has the title "Amateur Scout", but he was reported (e.g. by Sportsnet) to have become Director, and even his Wikipedia page says it.

For a while, at least on paper, it continued to mean Ron Delorme was the highest-placed dude. The same one who was most directly responsible for the poor drafting during the pre-Benning years, yet magically has fans prepared to rewrite history as long as he remains part of this management.

 

[VancouverJagger]

I've heard this before, too. I don't believe it. Under Aquilini, three very different GMs have run the team in 3 very different ways. That wouldn't be the case if these guys were just rubber stamping ownerships faves.

I don't doubt that ownership interferes. The Tortorella signing, for example. I'm sure they need to be heavily upmanaged - which I doubt Benning is capable of doing, frankly.

I've also heard (though ~~~sources~~~) that Toffoli was a Francesco favorite. If that's the case though, him walking is an even bigger head scratcher.

Oh don't kid yourself by thinking Aqua Man doesn't at least have some sort of input on some if not a decent amount of what happens with the Canucks.

On one hand I feel we are lucky to have an owner that is obviously invested at winning. On the other hand I'm always getting Jerry Jones/Al Davis kind of vibes from him in that he meddles a little bit and as a result our management sometimes feels pressure to do things they shouldn't do. I tend to think that the Luongo contract was a an example of this..........while management wasn't forced to sign him to such a term they felt some sort of pressure to do so.

 

[David71]

"We would've had to move money out but we ran out of time."

Done.

excuse after excuse... he could have traded roussel or sutter somewhere and still have money left to sign toffoli/tanev.

 

[mathonwy]

"We would've had to move money out but we ran out of time."

Done.

We’ve tried nothing and we’re out of ideas.

 

[vanuck]

2014 Virtanen when Nylander and Ehlers are on the board, McCann when Pastrnak is on the board
2015 Boeser, when Konecny is on the board
2016 Juolevi, when Tkachuk is on the board
2017: Glass, when Petey is on the board

Please get Benning as far away from our drafting as possible.

Please.

If there's anything I've learned over the last few years, it's that trusting A Potato would've been far better for us when it comes to the draft instead of hiring a supposed savant.

Ideally use the Potato for drafting and have the GM be someone who can actually manage people and let them play to their strengths. Would've saved us from horrible cap/asset/talent management.

 

[valkynax]

We’ve tried nothing and we’re out of ideas.

I now have some coke on my monitor, thanks~.

 

[mathonwy]

Wasn't Todd Harvey basically moved into the role for the last draft? He's not listed anymore, what happened? Was the well poisoned that quickly?!

edit: No wait, Harvey's still there, listed among coaches and staff. He only has the title "Amateur Scout", but he was reported (e.g. by Sportsnet) to have become Director, and even his Wikipedia page says it.

For a while, at least on paper, it continued to mean Ron Delorme was the highest-placed dude. The same one who was most directly responsible for the poor drafting during the pre-Benning years, yet magically has fans prepared to rewrite history as long as he remains part of this management.

Pre-Gillis days as well.

Delorme is the opposite of a Canuck treasure.

 

[RandV]

I was listening to a Patrick Johnson interview today and he made some points in that fashion that reports do who don't want to made to look like a pariah to the rights holder. Anyway, he intimated strongly that ownership approves ALL transactions and also implied they INITIATE transactions by providing lists to GMGB of who to sign etc. He went on to say that it's ownership's money so they can do as they please and they do, do as they please. Finally, he circled back and doubled down on the idea they had their hands in every pie, but said that strangely ownership had somehow tried to divest themselves from the bad decisions like hiring Torts. Johnson basically went on to say that it is hard to distance themselves since they signed Torts contract and his cheques, implying they make the decision on other contract including UFAs.

I found this kind of disturbing because it changes the narrative and instead of GMJB initiating transactions and seeking ownership approval, it suggests the converse and that GMJB has very little control over any of the decisions. Furthermore, it means nothing can change since ownership isn't going to change in the near future.
Therefore, we are stuck with this circus regardless of whomever is the GM. It also explains why they haven't fired GMJB and why GMJB says he plans to focus on the draft, since "that is my background": double speak for that is the only area he can impact.

The not so hidden hand...

I have a really hard time buying this, and find the implication to be pointless. First from the start of his tenure there was a clear pattern to the types of players Benning & crew went out and acquired, and they've remained entirely predictable. Second even if this was somewhat true it just sounds like Gilbert Gunderson excuses, like with drafting Benning is the GM and ultimately responsible for the decisions that are made. Finally if you look at all the decisions that have to get made running a hockey team it's really hard to believe Aquinili is there for everyone. Like in 2016 did he walk into the room and say 'I don't like that Forsling kid, go to Chicago and get me Adam Clendening'.

No doubt Aquilini dips his hand into team operations more than an owner should, but suggesting Benning "has very little control over any of the decisions" implies things like the above are happening.

 

[RandV]

"we would have had to move money out."

You would've had to move money out? Oh that's totally brand new information that nobody saw coming at all.

I mean who would've known right? WHO?????

Not to mention somehow they were chasing after OEL's $8.5M contract, had $2.55M to pay Virtanen, $4.3M for Holtby, and finally $5.95M space left to acquire Schmidt. That's $12.8M in contracts signed or acquired, so even though yes Benning blew his own foot off with previous contracts there was still space to retain 2/3 of Toffoli/Tanev/Markstrom, or even keep all 3 if you do something like buyout Sutter.

 

[Peen]

forums.canucks.com > any threads rn

twitter.com > Search "canucks" or "toffoli"

wonder if hfboards is still an echo chamber lol

 

[valkynax]

forums.canucks.com > any threads rn

twitter.com > Search "canucks" or "toffoli"

wonder if hfboards is still an echo chamber lol

wait I'm confused, aren't we suppose to be toxic anti-Benning conspiracy theorists who are horrible human beings undeserving to be called Canucks fans?

 

[AwesomeInTheory]

forums.canucks.com > any threads rn

twitter.com > Search "canucks" or "toffoli"

wonder if hfboards is still an echo chamber lol

That entire thread is just a bunch of "But Gillis" BS.

EDIT: I guess not all of it. There's some dissenting opinions. Surprising.

 

[Peen]

That entire thread is just a bunch of "But Gillis" BS.

but gillis
but linden
but covid
but francesco
but injuries
but schedule
but willie
but travis
but bonino scored 1 goal less than we thought
but veteran leadership
but media
but our fans are the worst

 

[Bourne Endeavor]

Why is the media/pr team letting Benning comment about the Toffoli situation and effectively admitting incompetency?

How do you run out of time when he signed on day 3 of free agency and you had the exclusive negotiating rights for multiple weeks (edit: 7 months)?

This completely inexcusable and really highlights how incompetent Benning is. Here we have a guy we traded for who wants to stay and our glorious moron of a GM sends what, two weeks, on OED? Ridiculous. It's like Benning finds one trade or UFA he likes and ignores everything else then wonders why no one waits for him.

 

[mathonwy]

Toffoli putting the boots to us.... is something every single serious hockey fan sees right now.

It's such a shocking and in your face thing to happen to a team that just made it to a round 2 game 7.

The tank thread would be absolutely rocking right now I tell you what.

 

[Javaman]

What. The. f***.

What do you mean you ran out of time?!?!

Also you had to move out money because of multiple of your own stupid ass contracts.

Also, you could have moved Virtanen for assets and signed Toffoli really quite easily.

Also, you paid alot for 12 games of him remember?!

This guy is a complete f***ing dumb idiot.

Remember when Benning blamed the Luongo recapture penalty for his inability to sign FAs? Cuz like nobody could have possibly predicted that was going to happen? Remember that?

Cuz like now, and it's totally similar becuz it's not Benning's fault becuz time is linear and Einstein and such, that it's just too bad that Benning didn't have the time to sign Toffoli. Cap space wasn't the issue here. Well, maybe it was, but only becuz time began in 2020. Damn that pandemic.

 

[TraderJim]

I've heard this before, too. I don't believe it. Under Aquilini, three very different GMs have run the team in 3 very different ways. That wouldn't be the case if these guys were just rubber stamping ownerships faves.

This is over a 15+ year period. It is not inconceivable that the older (less involved) generation passed more control to the younger (more involved) generation. Which is why we have Francesco running around tweeting.

Just a theory.

 

[Canucks1096]

He feels exactly how I feel, pissed off at management for becoming a lesser team than they were a year a go. It sucks losing your top goaltender, your top defenseman, and a top 6 forward who has won two cups for absolutely nothing. While keeping overpaid bums in Eriksson, Beagle, Myers, Virtanen, Roussel, and Beartschi. He wants to win in his prime years of hockey, not waste away going no where.

One cup

 

[Peter10]

Wasn't Todd Harvey basically moved into the role for the last draft? He's not listed anymore, what happened? Was the well poisoned that quickly?!

edit: No wait, Harvey's still there, listed among coaches and staff. He only has the title "Amateur Scout", but he was reported (e.g. by Sportsnet) to have become Director, and even his Wikipedia page says it.

For a while, at least on paper, it continued to mean Ron Delorme was the highest-placed dude. The same one who was most directly responsible for the poor drafting during the pre-Benning years, yet magically has fans prepared to rewrite history as long as he remains part of this management.

It was never made official. I think it was iMac who indicated in one of his post draft pieces that Harvey took on more responsibility and is thought to be groomed into the Director role but has not been promoted yet or even received the interim tag. Bracketts responsibilities were (temporary) taken up by others - so likely Weisbrod coordinating things right now along with Harvey.

 

[Peter10]

One cup

When did Miller win a cup?

 

[vanuck]

Per those quotes by Jimbo on Toffoli... will anyone even bother trying to defend what he said?

Even on other platforms like CDC and Reddit you can already kinda see more and more people turning against him - despite being the traditional havens of casual Canuck fandom. There's a lot more anger at Jimbo than in years past, and not just because of the team's early struggles so far too.

After the incompetence we've seen from Benning over his tenure, is the lack of thought process implied in his comments even surprising anymore? When you've seen the same **** for half a decade, you can only be fooled so many times...

It's gotten to the point where I'm just waiting for what we all know needs to happen. I like to think that Toffoli's Revenge is - as a necessary evil - just helping it arrive faster. And that he's a part of #teamtank as well.