The Loss of Broberg and Holloway Gripe Thread

[Jumptheshark]

The plan is clear as day at this point based on all the moves since the offer sheets landed. Scrape by until the trade deadline acquiring as much cap space as possible then combine that with double retention to fill the holes on D.

One may not like it or agree, but it's obvious that is the plan.

there is a problem to this plan--if it is their plan. It may be a day late and a buck short. We are going nowhere averaging 2 goals a game.

While not panicking--I am getting concerned over what I am seeing.

Hyman with goose eggs on across the score sheet is a problem

 

[Took a pill in Sbisa]

Has Kane been put on the LTIR? I see different things in different places

 

[Jumptheshark]

Thank you. I have been working a lot as of late and some information fell by the side. Last thing I had read was that the OIlers were not going to do it right away

 

[CycloneSweep]

Thank you. I have been working a lot as of late and some information fell by the side. Last thing I had read was that the OIlers were not going to do it right away

They had to wait till after Day1 was all. He is on LTIR but we aren’t using any of the cap space so it is essentially meaningless n

 

[The Panther]

My take:

Holloway was expendable, given the 'win now' Oilers' mentality. I would have preferred to keep him as I like the player, but his skill-set is already well established on the roster by several other players (albeit older players).

Broberg was mis-played by Ken Holland and Woodcroft / Knoblach. I think Broberg would have gotten his regular job with Edmonton... if they hadn't acquired Ekholm. Once Ekholm arrived, it sent Bouchard to the moon and relegated Brobeg to the minors, perpetually. Then, he started griping about it. My pet theory here is that Kenny Holland -- veteran GM / pal of Yzerman, Lidstrom, McDavid, etc. -- was never going to want to appear to be appeasing young Dmen who are unproven. So, he let Broberg wait. Meanwhile, Ekholm, Nurse's contract, and Kulak meant that Broberg wasn't going to get a chance in the short-term. That was sort-of understandable (maybe), but then it was really on Holland to deal him faster. They could have gotten a decent return, say, late last season or something. (Or in early summer if the Oilers had actually had a GM.)

But I don't get the Ryan McLeod thing at all. Sure, glad to have a prospect in Savoie, but if the club is in 'win-now' mentality, why trade a 25-year-old homegrown player who checks several boxes the Oilers need (youth, speed, PK, size) for a tiny-sized junior player who's not going to impact the McDavid era (much)? McLeod could be frustrating in his aversion to ever going to the net and his lack of physical play, but he is a player the Oilers spent years developing through the system, and successfully.

I have some sympathy for Bowman Jr. in that he was only on the job for 15 minutes when the St. Louis offer-sheet came around. He blew it, but it was a thing that Holland should have dealt with earlier.

I think the Oilers' brass need to be more hard-ass and less in thrall to the (a) the team's superstars and (b) the media. For example, when Bowman Jr. came aboard, I'm sure all the talk by the Oilers' brass to him was, "the priority is to sign Draisaitl"... because the media kept asking about it. And they want to please Connor and Leon. Which is fine, but where was Draisaitl going? He wasn't going anywhere, and he could have waited another week while they dealt with some slighly lesser players who are nevertheless very important.

I sometimes feel like the Oilers' org operates under the rule: "If the media is pacified for now, then we've done our job."

 

[Kolja]

Broberg was lost with extension of Kulak. Nothing else.

It was a stupid move to lose him.

 

[McFlash97]

Feeling sorry for Bowman in how he handled the offer sheets is a fools errand.

Bowman failed miserably. He should have operated from a place of understanding what each player brought to this team through thier playoff run, then made a call to match one. He decided he was too smart for the average fan, and would look like a fn genius by letting both go as vindication of putting the Oilers in a tough position.

It was stupid when it happened and it looks even worse now. He then decided he was going to drop 3 million on 3 pylons , but in his eyes 2 of them had top 4 potential.

 

[Drivesaitl]

Your finally coming around. Halfway there. Just admit we have 3 clowns playing D because of our asshat manager. Do it. You know its true. Jackson and Bowman are not fit to build a championship team. They will ruin this franchise within a year.

Yeah. I had this view in July.

So heres a scorecard thus far.

Oilers forward recruits 2 goals (combined Skinner, Arvid, Pod)

Lost Oilers forwards 9goals. McLeod 4, Foegele 3 Holloway 2.

The thing is there wasn't even valid reason to think the incoming would score more. Last season Foegele scored 20 Mcleod a dozen, and Holloway a prorated 13 goals and was only going to get better. Could be said we lost around 45 goals in the lineup with those 3 gone.

What we got is the bust player, Podkolzin who wasn't even an NHL caliber player last season. WE got ARvid at considerable price coming off 2 back surgeries, and we got Skinner who has good seasons and bad seasons.

So for expressing the view we got worse at forward I had all kinds of insults here which have only continued. But really look whats happening.

We not only lost youth, pace, we got older, slower, less goals.

One other thing is we could have had Hoffman and he couldn't possibly be a worse option out there than Arvid. WE just let him go. He was here PTO on the cheap.

Now I'm not saying the Oilers incoming forwards continue to get outscored this badly but its going to be clear we didn't increase the forward goal scoring with the additions. At all.

Foegele almost scored a hat trick in first period tonight. The most amazing game I've seen him play. He had flashes like this as an Oilers and lots of two goal games but he's fire with Laferriere and Turcotte. Kings got an unexpected third line there.

What a terrible OOT night again tonight seeing all these ex Oilers play starring games.

 

[Drivesaitl]

I refuse to care about Foegele. Everyone on these boards wanted him and his $2.75m off the books for 2 years before this summer. Him and Kulak literally had an inside joke about who would get traded first because everyone pointed at their contracts as the first to go for any upgrades.

I had plenty of mixed feelings about Foegele but last season was indisputably his best season here and he knocked in 20 goals and he and McLeod had awesome games playing along with Leon. Foegele was decent in playoffs as well.

We're paying 4M for crippled Arvid X2 to put it in perspective.

 

[McFlash97]

Yeah. I had this view in July.

So heres a scorecard thus far.

Oilers forward recruits 2 goals (combined Skinner, Arvid, Pod)

Lost Oilers forwards 9goals. McLeod 4, Foegele 3 Holloway 2.

The thing is there wasn't even valid reason to think the incoming would score more. Last season Foegele scored 20 Mcleod a dozen, and Holloway a prorated 13 goals and was only going to get better. Could be said we lost around 45 goals in the lineup with those 3.

What we got is the bust player, Podkolzin who wasn't even an NHL caliber player last season. WE got ARvid at considerable price coming off 2 back surgeries, and we got Skinner who has good seasons and bad seasons.

So for the view we got worst at forward I had all kinds of insults here which have only continued. But really look whats happening.

We not only lost youth, pace, we got older, slower, less goals.

One other thing is we could have had Hoffman and he couldn't possibly be a worse option out there than Arvid. WE just let him go. He was here PTO on the cheap.

Now I'm not saying the Oilers incoming forwards continue to get outscored this badly but its going to be clear we didn't increase the forward goal scoring with the additions. At all.

Foegele almost scored a hat trick in first period tonight. The most amazing game I've seen him play. He had flashes like this as an Oilers and lots of two goal games but he's fire with Laferriere and Turcotte. Kings got an unexpected third line there.

What a terrible OOT night again tonight seeing all these ex Oilers play starring games.

You won't get through to some of the fans in here. As soon as pylons, busts, minor leaguers put on the Oiler Jersey, thier shxt don't stink no more. That's why a player like McDavid has no cups. The guy is good enough to lead any team in this league to multiple cups, but stuck on this shxt hole of a franchise just killing his prime years by surrounding him with bums year after year. They were handed a key to a Ferrari in the summer, they turned it into a Hyundai. Lost every one of thier young developed talent in 1 summer. , signed a fn 40 year old castoff, spent the entire summer fawning over 1 player to get a contract signed and called it a day when the offer sheets came in.

 

[Jumptheshark]

What amuses me and I assume some others. If you go back to threads up to and including say July 6th? We had a great off season


Now? Not so much.

 

[MoontoScott]

I understand the cap implications. However you can't defend the organization there too. Incompetence leads to more incompetence. From Holland/Jackson to Bowman.

Lol, how much does Arvidsson have playing with Leon Fn

LOL for sure- but it doesn't change the fact that Holloway is on pace for 23 points. He is overpaid just like the Aardvark.

Edit--now on pace for 43 points. New poll results are in.

 

[Took a pill in Sbisa]

I had plenty of mixed feelings about Foegele but last season was indisputably his best season here and he knocked in 20 goals and he and McLeod had awesome games playing along with Leon. Foegele was decent in playoffs as well.

We're paying 4M for crippled Arvid X2 to put it in perspective.

I felt like I was one of the only ones that was standing up for Foegele so I never had an issue with him while he was here. I don't think he scores 20 goals again in his career and I also wouldn't have matched the contract LA offered him.

Judging Arvidsson now is just as unfair as when people judged Athanasiou after 9 games.

This is his first time in many years that he's not getting PP1 time while simultaneously trying to find chemistry with teammates that haven't been consistent through the first handful of games. I'm not even close to forming an opinion on him yet.

 

[MoontoScott]

Astronomical compared to Arvidsson's current zero point pace. And all for the bargain price of only 4 million per season for 2 years.

Still a long way to go before the final results are in and tabulated. It's like elections--6 months is an eternity until the carbon tax vote. Anything can happen..

 

[Drivesaitl]

I felt like I was one of the only ones that was standing up for Foegele so I never had an issue with him while he was here. I don't think he scores 20 goals again in his career and I also wouldn't have matched the contract LA offered him.

Judging Arvidsson now is just as unfair as when people judged Athanasiou after 9 games.

This is his first time in many years that he's not getting PP1 time while simultaneously trying to find chemistry with teammates that haven't been consistent through the first handful of games. I'm not even close to forming an opinion on him yet.

If you saw Foegele tonight he's scoring 20 again this year. He has been a solid scorer EV during his time in Edmonton and Career. Basically a player that is around 15EV goals a year. Foegele the best Kings player tonight by miles, was the first star, played 60mins, and is leading the Kings in expected goals this season by miles. He's been the Kings best forward so far. That part won't continue but holy hell Kopitar, Kempe, Byfield, Fiala were complete dogshit in this game. Not just Oilers stars that have to get untracked. Kings stars were AWFUL.

AA? I was one of the people saying he would amount to nothing here. His 30 goal season was a mirage, never to be repeated, exactly what I had said. He's a guy that needs to be on bad clubs where he can just goal suck all season long to get 10-20goals. So bad at 200ft hockey that it hurts your eyes. A player that was -45 one season on limited minutes. Basically the presence of AA will make your team worse, will contribute to your club losing more games. heh

 

[Drivesaitl]

LOL for sure- but it doesn't change the fact that Holloway is on pace for 23 points. He is overpaid just like the Aardvark.

Edit--now on pace for 43 points. New poll results are in.

This is another great name.

I shouldn't even watch OOT games. Most teams look like they have jump, energy, scroing goals, and all the ex Oilers looking very good then we got the bolded and Podz who looks like he'll never score and the no name D recruits. People didn't seem to follow that the team got worse in the offseason. Especially if one factors in Kane missing the team is far far worse than the one that was playing in June.

 

[MoontoScott]

This is another great name.

I shouldn't even watch OOT games. Most teams look like they have jump, energy, scroing goals, and all the ex Oilers looking very good then we got the bolded and Podz who looks like he'll never score and the no name D recruits. People didn't seem to follow that the team got worse in the offseason. Especially if one factors in Kane missing the team is far far worse than the one that was playing in June.

I didn't get the vibe that the team had improved. Merely that the chairs had been rearranged.

There is absolutely no question that the Oilers are not great at cap management and they left themselves in a vulnerable position. The "win now" philosophy was going to prevail but it was obvious to everyone that the "older" team bore certain risks. Older players can and do fall off the wagon in a hurry sometimes.

I was ticked that Lavoie hit the road but I see that he has no points in 3 games in the AHL so I guess you never know how these things will play out.

Its still very early in the season but undoubtedly the prospects cupboard is down to crumbs and the 3 bears have moved out. They may have left Pod for Goldilocks.

 

[Fishy McScales]

Thank you. I have been working a lot as of late and some information fell by the side. Last thing I had read was that the OIlers were not going to do it right away

They're under the cap and running a sub-23 roster so whether he's on LTIR or not doesn't matter right now.

I.e. they're still accruing cap.

 

[Fishy McScales]

Feeling sorry for Bowman in how he handled the offer sheets is a fools errand.

Bowman failed miserably. He should have operated from a place of understanding what each player brought to this team through thier playoff run, then made a call to match one. He decided he was too smart for the average fan, and would look like a fn genius by letting both go as vindication of putting the Oilers in a tough position.

It was stupid when it happened and it looks even worse now. He then decided he was going to drop 3 million on 3 pylons , but in his eyes 2 of them had top 4 potential.

Go fxxx yourself guy.

3 million on 3 guys is beside any hindsight point you're making here.

Those guys can be buried and keep the team below the cap which is what this entire conundrum is all about.

 

[KCC]

LOL for sure- but it doesn't change the fact that Holloway is on pace for 23 points. He is overpaid just like the Aardvark.

Edit--now on pace for 43 points. New poll results are in.

Holloway I don’t care about. It’s broberg. He’s doing well. 7 points in 8 games with a +7 playing 20+ minutes a night. Everything we hoped he would be but now is on the blues. At that pace he’s well worth his 4.5 mill deal. Obviously that won’t continue but even if he ends up with half that and say 50 points that’s still worth it. At the end of the day though he wanted out so what can you do.

 

[ExileNZ]

He wanted out early last season when he was 7th or 8th defender. 7th or 8th defender behind plugs like Desharnais.

He didn't want out after coach K eventually realised he was better than most defenders in the organisations and started playing him regularly in the Stanley Cup. Instead he requested 1.8 Million and a one way contract. The Oilers brass refused and didn't return to the negotiations.

Broberg would have been an Oiler earning 1.8 mil had we seen competent management. But management preferred useless playes like Dermott, Emberson and Stetcher over Broberg and Ceci. Sad...

 

[Zerotonine]

Feeling sorry for Bowman in how he handled the offer sheets is a fools errand.

Bowman failed miserably. He should have operated from a place of understanding what each player brought to this team through thier playoff run, then made a call to match one. He decided he was too smart for the average fan, and would look like a fn genius by letting both go as vindication of putting the Oilers in a tough position.

It was stupid when it happened and it looks even worse now. He then decided he was going to drop 3 million on 3 pylons , but in his eyes 2 of them had top 4 potential.

Go fxxx yourself guy.

Blaming those 2 losses in bowman is comical and fk. He was litterally hired the same week the offer sheets came out.

This was on Holland, and more so Jackson who was calling the shots probably most of the year anyways...

 

[Louis Cypher]

The writing is already on the wall with them trying Nurse at RD.

I think they figure it’s the best of the square peg round hole options left and if you run Kulak - Nurse as the second pairing then maybe it opens up more trade options instead of having to get a top 4 RHD.

Smells of us trying Taylor Hall at centre because we had no centre depth.

 

[CupofOil]

Unfortunately JJ doesn't have much choice other than playing the slow game with the way Holland left the cap.

It might not look like progress now, but if they're able to get an $8M defenseman at 50% at the deadline then every penny they accrue now is part of the progress.

Yeah, I don't get the people mocking cap space accrual. They're the same folks that would be dumping all over management if they had to do the ole money in money out thing at the deadline.

I'm still bitter about losing Broberg but at 4.6m, you're either taking the leap of faith with him with no cap flexibility to add at the deadline or have the flexibility to add a player more proven at the deadline to help more in the short term.

Personally, I was more in the let Broberg go at that number camp when it happened but I'm starting to really change my mind on that. What happens if the Oilers let go of a 10 year top pairing Dman, down the line? It's quite possible with his trajectory. He's already establishing as solid top 4.
Either way, it was a tough decision. The question is, can they find a Dman better than Broberg even currently is? Ehh, I don't know.
Can they find a Dman that will be better than him long term? Even more unlikely.

 

[KeithIsActuallyBad]

Blaming those 2 losses in bowman is comical and fk. He was litterally hired the same week the offer sheets came out.

This was on Holland, and more so Jackson who was calling the shots probably most of the year anyways...

Bowman isn't solely to blame but that doesn't mean he doesn't share some of it. When you start a new job are you not expected to actually start working right away?