The Loss of Broberg and Holloway Gripe Thread

[CupofOil]

Its becoming very clear...the team traded Ceci and as a result they downgraded the defence.

Now they have to fix an even bigger problem (2nd pairing RHD) than they had last season.
Is that progress?

Losing Ceci is not the problem.

The Oilers aren't scoring and Skinner has had another slow start. Ceci doesn't remedy any of these things and he's been garbage, at least by the numbers, with the Sharks.

The problems are that the top guys haven't woken up fully yet, Arvidsson, Hyman and RNH have been big fat zeros, the 3rd line isn't scoring and the goaltending poop. The defense has actually been fine for the most part.

 

[KeithIsActuallyBad]

Losing Ceci is not the problem.

The Oilers aren't scoring and Skinner has had another slow start. Ceci doesn't remedy any of these things and he's been garbage, at least by the numbers, with the Sharks.

The problems are that the top guys haven't woken up fully yet, Arvidsson, Hyman and RNH have been big fat zeros, the 3rd line isn't scoring and the goaltending poop. The defense has actually been fine for the most part.

The problem wasn't losing Ceci, you're right.

But part of the problem is the replacements for the defensemen we lost, including Ceci, are not playing up to snuff.

I wouldn't call the defense fine. They got shredded by the Jets, Hawks, Flames, and Stars when they actually decided to play.

 

[CupofOil]

The problem wasn't losing Ceci, you're right.

But part of the problem is the replacements for the defensemen we lost, including Ceci, are not playing up to snuff.

I wouldn't call the defense fine. They got shredded by the Jets, Hawks, Flames, and Stars when they actually decided to play.

The Oilers were outplaying the Stars significantly before Skinner let in the stinker by Duchene, hardly gave the Stars a sniff. The Oilers couldn't capitalize on the many chances they had, as per usual this season, then the goalie lets in a weak goal and it all goes to shit and I say this as a defender of Skinner generally. They aren't scoring and aren't getting saves, those are the two biggest issues so far this season.

Not saying the defense is great but Cody Ceci isn't making one iota of difference the way they started this season. Lament the loss of Broberg all you want and I'd be with you on that, not Cody freaking Ceci, what are we even talking about here?

 

[bobbythebrain]

Feeling sorry for Bowman in how he handled the offer sheets is a fools errand.

Bowman failed miserably. He should have operated from a place of understanding what each player brought to this team through thier playoff run, then made a call to match one. He decided he was too smart for the average fan, and would look like a fn genius by letting both go as vindication of putting the Oilers in a tough position.

It was stupid when it happened and it looks even worse now. He then decided he was going to drop 3 million on 3 pylons , but in his eyes 2 of them had top 4 potential.

You gotta be some kind of naive or have an agenda to post this.
Bowman went thru the entire org to discuss these players. They weighed all the options and facts, and there were many.

This wasn't an egomaniacal decision.
The post on the other hand....

 

[KeithIsActuallyBad]

The Oilers were outplaying the Stars significantly before Skinner let in the stinker by Duchene, hardly gave the Stars a sniff. The Oilers couldn't capitalize on the many chances they had, as per usual this season, then the goalie lets in a weak goal and it all goes to shit and I say this as a defender of Skinner generally. They aren't scoring and aren't getting saves, those are the two biggest issues so far this season.

Not saying the defense is great but Cody Ceci isn't making one iota of difference the way they started this season. Lament the loss of Broberg all you want and I'd be with you on that, not Cody freaking Ceci, what are we even talking about here?

I'm saying that the defense is arguably worse than last year, and that those brought in to replace Ceci, Desharnais and Broberg are not helping.

If one weak goal (and maybe we shouldn't be letting guys take shots from the slot) is all it takes to sink this team then book the tee times now.

 

[CantHaveTkachev]

The Oilers were outplaying the Stars significantly before Skinner let in the stinker by Duchene, hardly gave the Stars a sniff. The Oilers couldn't capitalize on the many chances they had, as per usual this season, then the goalie lets in a weak goal and it all goes to shit and I say this as a defender of Skinner generally. They aren't scoring and aren't getting saves, those are the two biggest issues so far this season.

Not saying the defense is great but Cody Ceci isn't making one iota of difference the way they started this season. Lament the loss of Broberg all you want and I'd be with you on that, not Cody freaking Ceci, what are we even talking about here?

Cody Ceci was their top penalty killer last season and this season the PK sucks
he is far from perfect they massively downgraded their defense from last season

 

[CupofOil]

I'm saying that the defense is arguably worse than last year, and that those brought in to replace Ceci, Desharnais and Broberg are not helping.

If one weak goal (and maybe we shouldn't be letting guys take shots from the slot) is all it takes to sink this team then book the tee times now.

And I'm saying that losing Ceci is barely a fart in the wind. The Oilers shit the bed last season as well with that Ceci pillar manning the blueline.

McDrai are barely a PPG with all their gravy minutes, 3 goals TOTAL this is TOTAL through 7 games for all Oiler forwards combined outside of McDavid, Draisaitl and Skinner. McLeod has more than that on his own, for posterity sakes.
Skinner is rocking an .866 save pct.

Yet we have people lamenting the loss of Cody Ceci. I mean, come on now.

Cody Ceci was their top penalty killer last season and this season the PK sucks
he is far from perfect they massively downgraded their defense from last season

lol, come on man.

Ceci was an ok PKer, he is NOT the reason why the PK crumbled. You're acting like Chris Pronger was lost from the PK.
You don't go from a historically good PK in the playoffs to one of the worst in the league because you lost Cody Ceci. I do think the combination of losing rangy guys like McLeod, Foegele and, yes, Cody Ceci and Desharnais is playing a part in that but it's not a MASSIVE loss.

If the team was scoring like it usually does, none of this would be much of an issue. The poor PK start would be far less magnified.

 

[KeithIsActuallyBad]

And I'm saying that losing Ceci is barely a fart in the wind. The Oilers shit the bed last season as well with that Ceci pillar manning the blueline.

McDrai are barely a PPG with all their gravy minutes, 3 goals TOTAL this is TOTAL through 7 games for all Oiler forwards combined outside of McDavid, Draisaitl and Skinner. McLeod has more than that on his own, for posterity sakes.
Skinner is rocking an .866 save pct.

Yet we have people lamenting the loss of Cody Ceci. I mean, come on now.


lol, come on man.

Ceci was an ok PKer, he is NOT the reason why the PK crumbled. You're acting like he was Chris Pronger was lost from the PK.
You don't go from a historically good PK in the playoffs to one of the worst in the league because you lost Cody Ceci. I do think the combination of losing rangy guys like McLeod, Foegele and, yes, Cody Ceci and Desharnais is playing a part in that but it's not a MASSIVE loss.

If the team was scoring like it usually does, none of this would be much of an issue. The poor PK start would be far less magnified.

You keep beating this drum and I keep telling you you're misunderstanding. I don't care if they lose Cody Ceci but I care if his replacement is worse.

His replacement is worse.

 

[CantHaveTkachev]

lol, come on man.

Ceci was an ok PKer, he is NOT the reason why the PK crumbled. You're acting like he was Chris Pronger was lost from the PK.
You don't go from a historically good PK in the playoffs to one of the worst in the league because you lost Cody Ceci. I do think the combination of losing rangy guys like McLeod, Foegele and, yes, Cody Ceci and Desharnais is playing a part in that but it's not a MASSIVE loss.

it's not just Ceci..it's Ceci, Broberg and Desharnais
those are 3 legit NHL defensemen..2 of which can easily play in the 2nd pair

we replaced them with Stetcher (6-7 at best ), Emberson (6-7 rookie) Dermott (PTO player, AHLer), J. Brown (can't even crack this defense...AHLer)

yes, it's a huge downgrade

 

[Canovin]

You keep beating this drum and I keep telling you you're misunderstanding. I don't care if they lose Cody Ceci but I care if his replacement is worse.

His replacement is worse.

His replacement is keeping the seat warm for someone better than Ceci at the deadline

 

[KeithIsActuallyBad]

His replacement is keeping the seat warm for someone better than Ceci at the deadline

Cap space is doing wonders for them right now.

 

[Canovin]

Cap space is doing wonders for them right now.

We have no cap space. It's accruing. If you think Kane on LTIR is a reason to spend, you're setting the team up for bigger problem

 

[CupofOil]

You keep beating this drum and I keep telling you you're misunderstanding. I don't care if they lose Cody Ceci but I care if his replacement is worse.

His replacement is worse.

I keep beating this drum because it's absurd to blame the failures of this season on the loss of Cody Ceci in any capacity outside of a slight bit on the PK I suppose but how could we possibly determine that. Is Stecher even worse? Nurse has actually played ok this season after a rough start without Cody Ceci. That pairing is no worse than it was last season outside of a game or two with Dermott.

Cap space is doing wonders for them right now.

Clearly you don't understand how accruing cap space works.

Make fun of it all you want but you'd be shitting all over Oilers management if they had no deadline flexibility and were stuck in the mud without the ability to upgrade.

it's not just Ceci..it's Ceci, Broberg and Desharnais
those are 3 legit NHL defensemen..2 of which can easily play in the 2nd pair

we replaced them with Stetcher (6-7 at best ), Emberson (6-7 rookie) Dermott (PTO player, AHLer), J. Brown (can't even crack this defense...AHLer)

yes, it's a huge downgrade

Broberg is the real loss there agreed but we're comparing the defense of last season at this time to now. The Oilers won't look the same post-deadline when they had Desharnais and then later Broberg on the blueline so the comparison with those two will be more valid when we see what the Oilers do to add.
Right now, it's Ceci and, I forget who was the 6 to start last season, vs. Stecher, Emberson and Dermott. It's a minor difference really and I haven't given up on Emberson yet.

 

[KeithIsActuallyBad]

I keep beating this drum because it's absurd to blame the failures of this season on the loss of Cody Ceci in any capacity outside of a slight bit on the PK I suppose but how could we possibly determine that. Is Stecher even worse? Nurse has actually played ok this season after a rough start without Cody Ceci. That pairing is no worse than it was last season outside of a game or two with Dermott.


Clearly you don't understand how accruing cap space works.

Make fun of it all you want but you'd be shitting all over Oilers management if they had no deadline flexibility and were stuck in the mud without the ability to upgrade.

Stecher is passable at best. As CHT already pointed out, the other additions have been subtractions. I don't pine for Cody Ceci, I pine for a better defenseman than him. Dermott and Brown are terrible and Emberson isn't ready.

As for cap space, I saw this movie in 2018. Hopefully it doesn't have the same ending. That blue line is one injury away from lottery time. Why we didn't upgrade it in the offseason is a question I'll continue to ask until this team gets back into a respectable position in the standings.

We have no cap space. It's accruing. If you think Kane on LTIR is a reason to spend, you're setting the team up for bigger problem

Right, I'm sure there's another Ekholm just waiting for us to spend the assets we don't have.

We have no cap space. It's accruing. If you think Kane on LTIR is a reason to spend, you're setting the team up for bigger problem

Right, I'm sure there's another Ekholm just waiting for us to spend the assets we don't have.

 

[CupofOil]

Stecher is passable at best. As CHT already pointed out, the other additions have been subtractions. I don't pine for Cody Ceci, I pine for a better defenseman than him. Dermott and Brown are terrible and Emberson isn't ready.

As for cap space, I saw this movie in 2018. Hopefully it doesn't have the same ending. That blue line is one injury away from lottery time. Why we didn't upgrade it in the offseason is a question I'll continue to ask until this team gets back into a respectable position in the standings.


Right, I'm sure there's another Ekholm just waiting for us to spend the assets we don't have.


Right, I'm sure there's another Ekholm just waiting for us to spend the assets we don't have.

Yes, that's why they're accruing cap space. In order to accrue cap space you need to actually accrue it which takes time so, yeah, nobody who understands this should have expected an upgrade to start the season.
They don't need an Ekholm sized addition to have a Ceci upgrade.

As I mentioned to Tkachev, I haven't given up on Emberson yet either. Broberg was terrible early last season as well, Emberson is barely older than him and has good AHL pedigree like Broberg had. I'd like to see what he could do with growth before throwing him in the trash heap.

In the meantime, if the team could score some goals that would help I'd think.

 

[KeithIsActuallyBad]

Yes, that's why they're accruing cap space. In order to accrue cap space you need to actually accrue it which takes time so, yeah, nobody who understands this should have expected an upgrade to start the season.
They don't need an Ekholm sized addition to have a Ceci upgrade.

As I mentioned to Tkachev, I haven't given up on Emberson yet either. Broberg was terrible early last season as well, Emberson is barely older than him and has good AHL pedigree like Broberg had. I'd like to see what he could do with growth before throwing him in the trash heap.

In the meantime, if the team could score some goals that would help I'd think.

If they're not comfortably in a playoff position by the time the TDL rolls around, then what? We keep banking on this team surging up the standings as they continuously fumble away games they should be winning. One extended injury to the top 4 and the season is toast.

 

[McDoused]

Thank god this has it's own thread.

Losing two guys who put up a combined 11 points for us last year is not why this team is struggling out the gates.

 

[CupofOil]

If they're not comfortably in a playoff position by the time the TDL rolls around, then what? We keep banking on this team surging up the standings as they continuously fumble away games they should be winning. One extended injury to the top 4 and the season is toast.

If they're not it won't be due to Cody Ceci not being here, I'll tell you that much. If they're not in a playoff spot at the deadline, the problems will be core team problems.

 

[Canovin]

If they're not comfortably in a playoff position by the time the TDL rolls around, then what? We keep banking on this team surging up the standings as they continuously fumble away games they should be winning. One extended injury to the top 4 and the season is toast.

Stuart is a bigger problem than whoever was replacing Ceci right now. One good game once in a blue moon doesn't cut it

 

[CantHaveTkachev]

Thank god this has it's own thread.

Losing two guys who put up a combined 11 points for us last year is not why this team is struggling out the gates.

could use their 5 goals and 11 points this year though couldn't we?

 

[Canovin]

could use their 5 goals and 11 points this year though couldn't we?

Yes we could. But we would be 12M over the cap. We are not Vegas. We can't play by the rule

 

[Behind Enemy Lines]

it's not just Ceci..it's Ceci, Broberg and Desharnais
those are 3 legit NHL defensemen..2 of which can easily play in the 2nd pair

we replaced them with Stetcher (6-7 at best ), Emberson (6-7 rookie) Dermott (PTO player, AHLer), J. Brown (can't even crack this defense...AHLer)

yes, it's a huge downgrade

This team's offense will come around. Their challenge will be goal suppression and a 94% outscoring PK that's not a repeatable function. There was also no guarantee that Stu Skinner would elevate his game this season so keeping pucks out of their net is important. A function that increases in tighter, heavier playoff hockey competition where notably this team's size reach and range on defense has shrunk. RD is a problem.

I'm not going to navel gaze on the McLeod deal. I liked it but notably with some qualified risk in that this team will miss McLeod's solid defensive forward work including transporting the puck out of their zone. Another layer of their work to keep pucks out of their net and frankly away from their net.

The Oilers game will stabilize in all areas including ice-cold speciality teams. However this defense is such a question mark that they are experimenting with Nurse moonlighting at 2RD. A coach that preached patience and consistency with his roster last year when taking over is spinning the defence's platoon of journeymen and even fiddling with a PP that's been among the elite for four+ seasons. That catches my attention.

 

[GhostfaceWu]

could use their 5 goals and 11 points this year though couldn't we?

Lol you think they put that up in the first 7 games

 

[CantHaveTkachev]

Yes we could. But we would be 12M over the cap. We are not Vegas. We can't play by the rule

a good GM finds way to make it work

 

[finnishflash13]

Broberg was never gonna stay. Wish we kept Holloway at least.
That's as plainly as I'd put it.

Wonder if we will do the same offersheet and target STL Joel Hofer though.

first it was neighbours and now hofer. afraid you all are going to be disappointed again!