TV: The Last of Us (HBO)

[TheBeastCoast]

The problem with this, is that The Last of us is not about great human stories, It's gritty and dark and doing whatever it takes to survive.

It's about a man that's lost everything, which you should have picked up on about 25 minutes in after the solider turned Sarah guts into spaghetti.

That scene, Sarah death, THAT is what the last of us is about, It's about romance It's about loss and redemption

I mean there can be romance inside a gritty and dark world. It isn't like they are taking a left turn here and changing the rest of the plot of the show for a rom-com lol

 

[Arthur Morgan]

imo Bill wasn't Bill. I mean it was him but he wasn't really close to his in game personality

 

[LEAFANFORLIFE23]

imo Bill wasn't Bill. I mean it was him but he wasn't really close to his in game personality

They got his look down pat.

But they also turned him from badass to whatever that was.

 

[93LEAFS]

I played the game and thought Episode three was outstanding. It's a much better way to move the story but it wouldnt' have worked in a video game format.

It definitely wasn't what I expected. Bill in the game is much more comedic relief rather than a tragic character (he's still a tragic loner). He's probably the wackiest character that Joel and Ellie encounter, atleast in a comedic sense. I wasn't expecting a complete re-enactment of the game, as that wouldn't make good television, I don't need to see Joel constantly crafting shivs and killing zombies. The Last of Us's hook is it's story, but it's also the fine detail in the game to craft the overall world complemented with good gameplay. I'm curious to see what other changes they make. I would just say, Bill was used to emphasize a very different thematic point in the game that could be just as poignant if done right.

Spoiler: In the game

It's alluded to that Bill is gay in the game, so that isn't a dramatic change and building up Frank who is only mentioned in the game in passing by Bill. But, thematically, a lot was changed. Bill alludes that caring for someone in this world will get you killed, hinting at Joel caring for Ellie. And, as you leave Billtown, you see a body hanging from a tree which is Frank. Bill, like Joel is hardened by the world he lives in, but isn't willing to soften up "referring in passing to his no good ex-partner." There was no romantic duel suicide, just a bitter excentric prepper, and an ex-lover who committed suicide for unknown reasons. I think Ron Offerman could have played either role extremely well, even if they used the flashbacks to show what happened with Bill/Frank, but kept the bitter ending from the game, with only really altering the last 25 minutes of this episode

 

[sdf]

Ellie?

 

[Pink Mist]

I do think the action scenes in that area of the game could translate to TV very well, I was pretty excited to see those parts. Ill take what we got but feels like they moved on a little too quickly

If I wanted the TV series to be a direct translation of the video game I would just simply play the video game again or watch a lets play of it.

 

[Arthur Morgan]

If I wanted the TV series to be a direct translation of the video game I would just simply play the video game again or watch a lets play of it.

so does that mean you hated the first and second episodes then? why did you even finish them? they were following the game almost to a tee

 

[Ol' Jase]

so does that mean you hated the first and second episodes then? why did you even finish them? they were following the game almost to a tee

There were multiple changes from the games in both the first and second episodes.

 

[Arthur Morgan]

There were multiple changes from the games in both the first and second episodes.

minor ones, like Robert selling a battery over weapons and that part kinda minorly skipped a bunch of area from the game like a longer path on the outside of the wall/killing Robert's men. which was fine and added a little backstory which was good to see as well but it still followed the same path,

Joel before is like almost scared to leave Boston/doesnt want to. in this he has a reason to leave to find Tommy which is little different but nothing big,

episode 2 was pretty damn close other than it being a horde of infected over fedra taking out Tess. it's slightly different but still on that same path which episode 3 kinda skipped in the final bit of the episode. great or not episode. the moments that happen at that part of the game would have been good tv even if it was saved for episode 4. I dont like that Bill died and really wasn't himself at all

everyone else imo while watching them I see the characters they are playing as, with Bill he just seemed like a different person from the one in the game. Im not really too surprised alot of people werent happy with the episode that really really love the game.

 

[sdf]

He might not want to watch the rest of the series then.

or he will watch, but just won't wear a T-shirt in support of this series

 

[World of Wardlow]

i enjoyed episode 3, but i can see why some hated it. Reminds me of "The Fly" episode of Breaking Bad. Mainly to develop characters, etc. But hopefully this leads to more development of Bill/Frank in future episodes. Because if this was just a one-off, where there's no future impact, etc, then it was an absolute waste of 1 hour dedication.

 

[The Merchant]

The problem with this, is that The Last of us is not about great human stories, It's gritty and dark and doing whatever it takes to survive.

It's about a man that's lost everything, which you should have picked up on about 25 minutes in after the solider turned Sarah guts into spaghetti.

That scene, Sarah death, THAT is what the last of us is about, It's not about romance It's about loss and redemption

Holy shit talk about losing the plot. TLoU is a love story. It is literally a "human story" about two people who happen upon each other and the lengths they will go to protect the ones they love under the most dire circumstances imaginable. Not only did the game capture this theme impeccably, but so did episode 3 of the show.

 

[Dubi Doo]

So I finally saw and I have to say Episode 1 and 2 were awesome I loved them, I'm not solid on Bella Rsmsay as Ellie but overall they were great.

Episode 3 sucks. It does, and before anybody says it, because I know it's coming so let's address it now, It's not because Bill and Frank are gay, I'm VERY familiar with the source material I knew that going in.

In fact the one change they did make that I like is that Frank did not hang himself because that's what was supposed to happen and for my own reasons I'm glad they changed that.

That being said that wasn't Bill, Bill is a badass.

We didn't get Bill's badass entrance

We didn't get Joel hanging upside-down shooting the infected which I wanted to see.

That's supposed to be the first appearance of the bloater, we didn't get the bloater.

We didn't get the letter from Frank to Bill saying how much Frank hated Bill's guts, that's not a huge deal but it is what that letter is supposed.

Also Bill is not supposed to die but he's a minor character so that's not a huge deal.

But not getting Bill's badass entrance, not getting the bloater, and not getting Joel hanging upside-down shooting the infected those are key moments and we didn't get ANY of them.

Going in blind to this series is so much better because I don't have to compare this or that. I can just sit back and enjoy it.

Right. So when we meet him he is a paranoid loner. This paranoid loner character invites someone into his home and leaves him unattended within MINUTES of this man coming on his property??

Sure, we see him evolve over the next 20 years. But as a viewer watching the show they told us 1 thing about him: He's a paranoid loner. If he is going to betray that within the first few minutes he is on screen, why tell us that at all? Why not tell us he's a man who is desperate for human interaction? His wife died and he's been looking for human interaction?

They could have told us any story they wanted. What they did tell us is this character is wildly inconsistent from scene to scene with no reason given. How the writing is being praised in particular is very confusing to me.

Because he was infatuated with the dude and not only hasn't had someone who wanted to bone in his sight in a long time, but also suppressed his sexuality his entire life.

Honestly, imagine you've been alone for a long time, and this hot woman just shows up at your house. You're almost obsessed with looks and wittiness. Some people will play it smart, some people will let their guard down in hopes to get laid.

I've let my guard down before when I shouldn't have. I had this cute girl I met at the bar years ago. She was giving off some crazy vibes, but I said 'F it!'...I want to get laid. The problem was- I lived with my mom and stepdad at the time.

So, I brought her back to their place. We do the deed, but I didn't satisfy her enough (too much foreplay killed my time!), so she wanted more. It was like 4 in the morning. I told her I was going to sleep. She was going a bit nutty, so I said I'd sleep on the couch. She ends up biting me (talk about zombie outbreaks!), then lays outside my mom's room naked telling me she's 'going to lay here until my mom wakes up'. I was like...'go ahead!'.

She then drives home drunk, tells her mom (who is friends with my mom) that I forced her to drive home drunk even though I was fine with her naked ass sleeping on the floor. I thought it'd make for a good story, heh.

Well, of course I see her mom and dad the next day at a charity golf event. Awkward. I still see them from time to time, and every time I see them I think "your daughter was going sleep outside my mom's room bare ass naked until she woke up". Every. Damn. Time.

So, there you go- a lot of people do dumb shit when it comes to get some action. Me included

 

[Arthur Morgan]

Holy shit talk about losing the plot. TLoU is a love story. It is literally a "human story" about two people who happen upon each other and the lengths they will go to protect the ones they love under the most dire circumstances imaginable. Not only did the game capture this theme impeccably, but so did episode 3 of the show.

Not sure what game you were playing but It really isn't a love story.....
Last Of Us isn;t about a friendly human story, it's about loss and survival at all costs.
Id say it missed it's mark on Bill. he doesn't even seem like the same character, he just seems like another person with a beard who is also named Bill.
was a great episode but there was alot missed but more than anything Bill didn't make me think he was Bill as the episode progressed

 

[Pink Mist]

Not sure what game you were playing but It really isn't a love story.....
Last Of Us isn;t about a friendly human story, it's about loss and survival at all costs.
Id say it missed it's mark on Bill. he doesn't even seem like the same character, he just seems like another person with a beard who is also named Bill.
was a great episode but there was alot missed but more than anything Bill didn't make me think he was Bill as the episode progressed

Paternal love

 

[John Price]

the companion podcast seems to be pretty good and has more detail on the series. i will give it a listen. I've been loading up on the ringer prestige podcast and TLOU podcast (official one) to get more breakdowns on what's going on.

 

[Arthur Morgan]

Paternal love.

ok ill give it that but there's still never a good human story anywhere in the game, everything has some kind of an evil behind it or ends in darkness.

Episode 3 was very well done, the acting was amazing, the story was interesting but it ended in away I didnt really like. and Bill didn't make me think he was the Bill from the game even though I knew he was.

some incredible scenes that were missed though, I think when people(the game fans) look back at this they will always be wondering how good Bill's Town could have been, there was no reason for Bill to join Frank and miss out on everything that happens with Joel, Ellie and Bill, people who never played the game wont give a shit.

 

[Peasy]

Sad how much episode 3 is getting review bombed.

Personally, I'm the type of person that loves character driven shows rather than plot driven ones. So I thought this episode was fantastic and easily my favourite of the 3. Also helps that I absolutely love Murray Bartlett (seriously go check out White Lotus if you haven't, he is amazing in that). They did a great job showing what it could be like living in a post apocalyptic world, and also that while you are fighting for your survival, it is still important to LIVE. If you you are still not living and enjoying what you are doing, then whats the point of surviving?

To the person that is upset because he didnt get to see someone hanging upside shooting guns, just lol... What a poor reason to hate on an episode. HBO makes shows with substance, not just summer box office type of shows with big action scenes. Maybe hit up Yellowstone if you wanna see some more gun action.

 

[izlez]

Going in blind to this series is so much better because I don't have to compare this or that. I can just sit back and enjoy it.


Because he was infatuated with the dude and not only hasn't had someone who wanted to bone in his sight in a long time, but also suppressed his sexuality his entire life.

Honestly, imagine you've been alone for a long time, and this hot woman just shows up at your house. You're almost obsessed with looks and wittiness. Some people will play it smart, some people will let their guard down in hopes to get laid.

I've let my guard down before when I shouldn't have. I had this cute girl I met at the bar years ago. She was giving off some crazy vibes, but I said 'F it!'...I want to get laid. The problem was- I lived with my mom and stepdad at the time.

So, I brought her back to their place. We do the deed, but I didn't satisfy her enough (too much foreplay killed my time!), so she wanted more. It was like 4 in the morning. I told her I was going to sleep. She was going a bit nutty, so I said I'd sleep on the couch. She ends up biting me (talk about zombie outbreaks!), then lays outside my mom's room naked telling me she's 'going to lay here until my mom wakes up'. I was like...'go ahead!'.

She then drives home drunk, tells her mom (who is friends with my mom) that I forced her to drive home drunk even though I was fine with her naked ass sleeping on the floor. I thought it'd make for a good story, heh.

Well, of course I see her mom and dad the next day at a charity golf event. Awkward. I still see them from time to time, and every time I see them I think "your daughter was going sleep outside my mom's room bare ass naked until she woke up". Every. Damn. Time.

So, there you go- a lot of people do dumb shit when it comes to get some action. Me included

I mean, that's cool. In your short story, you demonstrated you were aware of risk, had an internal conflict about that risk, made a decision, and faced consequences.

Did the writers demonstrate that Bill was aware of the risk? What indications were there of an internal conflict? Was there any drama around whether or not the risk would pay off?

I don't think so. We get a hard cut from pointing a gun telling him to go away, to having free range of his home completely unmonitored and living happily ever after.

Does Frank have a gun in the bathroom? Is he popping his head out the window to signal his fellow raiders? Did Bill do anything to ensure that these aren't happening? Is Bill even aware that he is putting himself in danger? Is he willing to take that risk based on his desires?

Subtext and subtlety are fine, and not everything needs to be spelled out, but it sure seems like these things are completely ignored.

 

[ThePhoenixx]

i enjoyed episode 3, but i can see why some hated it. Reminds me of "The Fly" episode of Breaking Bad. Mainly to develop characters, etc. But hopefully this leads to more development of Bill/Frank in future episodes. Because if this was just a one-off, where there's no future impact, etc, then it was an absolute waste of 1 hour dedication.

Bill and Frank are dead. There are no more character developments. It was a one-off.

The only way they are coming back is more Flashbacks.

 

[Unholy Diver]

I mean, that's cool. In your short story, you demonstrated you were aware of risk, had an internal conflict about that risk, made a decision, and faced consequences.

Did the writers demonstrate that Bill was aware of the risk? What indications were there of an internal conflict? Was there any drama around whether or not the risk would pay off?

I don't think so. We get a hard cut from pointing a gun telling him to go away, to having free range of his home completely unmonitored and living happily ever after.

Does Frank have a gun in the bathroom? Is he popping his head out the window to signal his fellow raiders? Did Bill do anything to ensure that these aren't happening? Is Bill even aware that he is putting himself in danger? Is he willing to take that risk based on his desires?

Subtext and subtlety are fine, and not everything needs to be spelled out, but it sure seems like these things are completely ignored.

Wasn't the raider attack like 4-7 years after Frank arrived? I'm sure someone would take some time to get Bill's trust but that is some serious long term booking there

 

[izlez]

Wasn't the raider attack like 4-7 years after Frank arrived? I'm sure someone would take some time to get Bill's trust but that is some serious long term booking there

I didn't mean to imply the raider attack that we did see and Frank showing up were related.

But raiders in general. We see Bill ask Frank if he's alone. We see Bill continue to point a gun at Frank after he tests him to see if he's sick. Bill is suspicious of Frank and his motivations, as he should be... and then he's just 100% trusting with nothing given to the viewer in between

 

[TheAngryHank]

I mean...argue about word choice all you want the general point is true. A direct port of video game Bill to the TV show doesn't really work. The character works in the video game...because it is a video game but it is very much your typical video game sidekick, meet up couple cut scenes go do missions together and off you go. They objectively told a better story with the TV version.


Yeah I have a hard time taking anyone seriously when they say you could take the episode away and it wouldn't effect the plot....when this episode is the one that drives the plot forward into the next episodes. Just because Joel and Ellie didn't have a lot of screen time does not mean the plot wasn't moved forward. I would think the end of the episode would have smacked people in the face as a major moment for the character of Joel but what do I know!

yeah I have a hard time taking you serious from now on..lol.. Don't you sound smug.

 

[TheBeastCoast]

yeah I have a hard time taking you serious from now on..lol.. Don't you sound smug.

Oh whatever will I do.

 

[The Merchant]

Not sure what game you were playing but It really isn't a love story.....
Last Of Us isn;t about a friendly human story, it's about loss and survival at all costs.
Id say it missed it's mark on Bill. he doesn't even seem like the same character, he just seems like another person with a beard who is also named Bill.
was a great episode but there was alot missed but more than anything Bill didn't make me think he was Bill as the episode progressed

Neil Druckmann has stated on multiple occasions that the first game is about love. Somehow I think the game's writer and director has a better grasp on the source material than you do.