The jury is officially in: Alexis Lafreniere is a complete bust

[FoxysExpensiveNYDigs]

It's crazy that this wasn't even half a season ago.

Its as dumb as fans on the trade board thinking he would be waiver fodder.

 

[ozzie]

He seems to be playing a little better with some flashes. He will never live up to his draft position. However, he is more than a servicable player. He's on a succesfull team, just not sure if'ts the best enviroment for his growth. He may even hit 20 goals this season.

Strikes me as a player who needs a scenry change to take another step, but as I said NY is a pretty good team to be on right now. I'm actually really curious if he suddenly just gets it in the next few seasons.

Trade him away and you may regret it, the potential is still there.

 

[FightingEmu]

The thing that worries me here- there's plenty actually- but on top of the massive issue of how.young he is- there are people arguing that he's not producing... do you have any idea how strong his ES numbers are??!! To be getting this kind of scoring with virtually no pp deployment is really quite outstanding! Yea he plays with Panarin but again only at even strength and on top of that most people would call that their 2nd line.

Anyone writing off a players upside this early is drunk, crazy or crazy drunk to begin with- but people still calling him a bust still are way out on a line. How many ppp does the average topline player get?? 20? 30? More? You can literally add that to his 50 point pace because it's a pretty safe assumption thats what he will get if and when he gets deployed that way.

The problem with all of this is that when he does show the obvious markers of success like say a Quinton Byfield the whole crowd thats formed around Lafreniere will just evaporate and those people.will pretend they were always on board lol! Look at a guy like Keller even- lol- its just a dumb argument to get caught up in.

As another poster stated- if you know. Remember when people were shouting that Jack Hughes was a bust? Where is he now?

 

[GG96]

Stealing this from the Rangers board

2023-2024 5v5 numbers:
Alexis Lafreniere g/60 .7 a/60 1.2
Jack Hughes g/60 .8 a/60 1.2

 

[SnowblindNYR]

He seems to be playing a little better with some flashes. He will never live up to his draft position. However, he is more than a servicable player. He's on a succesfull team, just not sure if'ts the best enviroment for his growth. He may even hit 20 goals this season.

Strikes me as a player who needs a scenry change to take another step, but as I said NY is a pretty good team to be on right now. I'm actually really curious if he suddenly just gets it in the next few seasons.

Trade him away and you may regret it, the potential is still there.

I really don't know how you know that a 22 year old ascending player will never live up to his draft position. I guess if the only way to do so is to dominate from 18 years of age. He's not a perfect player but people are comparing apples to oranges when they look at his raw numbers because he doesn't get PP time with the first unit.

 

[Junohockeyfan]

He's a bust per the expectations of being a 1OA thus far. On pace for 50 pts which is disappointing in D + 4.

 

[HabsCode]

I really don't know how you know that a 22 year old ascending player will never live up to his draft position. I guess if the only way to do so is to dominate from 18 years of age. He's not a perfect player but people are comparing apples to oranges when they look at his raw numbers because he doesn't get PP time with the first unit.

Go ahead and provide example of former 1st overall pick that didn’t live up to their hype until their D+5 (because he isn’t in his D+4 which is currently).

 

[Cuckoo4Kakko]

Stealing this from the Rangers board

For context: This was not about saying Laf is Hughes. The point was Laf deserves PP time. Without quality PP time he’s still in good company.

 

[ESH]

Go ahead and provide example of former 1st overall pick that didn’t live up to their hype until their D+5 (because he isn’t in his D+4 which is currently).

MacKinnon didn’t break out until his 5th season in the NHL

 

[GeoRox89]

Go ahead and provide example of former 1st overall pick that didn’t live up to their hype until their D+5 (because he isn’t in his D+4 which is currently).

Mack looked disappointing in D+2 through D+4 before exploding. His rookie season was a lot better than anything Lafreniere has shown so far but it’s the closest example you’re ever going to get

 

[HabsCode]

I see your point, but besides that 38 points season, Mackinnon was mostly a 50pts+ 3 out of those 4 first season. Maybe Lafreniere could become a PPG player with time, but live up to his draft hype? Getting late.

But what do I know, I literally never watched him play for the last 2 seasons.

MacKinnon didn’t break out until his 5th season in the NHL

Mack looked disappointing in D+2 through D+4 before exploding. His rookie season was a lot better than anything Lafreniere has shown so far but it’s the closest example you’re ever going to get

 

[SnowblindNYR]

Go ahead and provide example of former 1st overall pick that didn’t live up to their hype until their D+5 (because he isn’t in his D+4 which is currently).

Why does it matter what other 1st overall picks did? Most 1st overalls don't play on teams with the type of talent he has in front of him. Besides, players develop at different rates and have different circumstances. Him being a 1st overall doesn't automatically mean that he has to be a star at 18 or 19. He can follow a different development curve. With PP time and some improvements to his shot he can easily be a PPG player. That's not McDavid but a middle of the road 1st overall sure. Look at Tavares's production always around there.

I see your point, but besides that 38 points season, Mackinnon was mostly a 50pts+ 3 out of those 4 first season. Maybe Lafreniere could become a PPG player with time, but live up to his draft hype? Getting late.

But what do I know, I literally never watched him play for the last 2 seasons.

I mean PPG player even in today's NHL is probably an average 1st overall.

 

[Regal]

Why does it matter what other 1st overall picks did? Most 1st overalls don't play on teams with the type of talent he has in front of him. Besides, players develop at different rates and have different circumstances. Him being a 1st overall doesn't automatically mean that he has to be a star at 18 or 19. He can follow a different development curve. With PP time and some improvements to his shot he can easily be a PPG player. That's not McDavid but a middle of the road 1st overall sure. Look at Tavares's production always around there.



I mean PPG player even in today's NHL is probably an average 1st overall.

I don’t think that’s true at all. In today’s league that’s still probably in the bottom 1/4 -1/3 of 1st overalls. Tavares at his best would be scoring over 100 points today.

 

[SnowblindNYR]

I don’t think that’s true at all. In today’s league that’s still probably in the bottom 1/4 -1/3 of 1st overalls. Tavares at his best would be scoring over 100 points today.

If he becomes a relatively consistent PPG player he'll be at least in the range of like half the picks since 2000. Some of these are too early but yes is for sure better than that and no is in that range or worse:

 

[Montreal Shadow]

If he becomes a relatively consistent PPG player he'll be at least in the range of like half the picks since 2000. Some of these are too early but yes is for sure better than that and no is in that range or worse:

View attachment 805398

Lafrenière isn't better than Rick Nash lmao.

Edit: Ah, you mean if he becomes a ppg guy. I was confused as f***.

 

[SnowblindNYR]

Lafrenière isn't better than Rick Nash lmao.

He's not better than him now. If he becomes a PPG player then he'll be in his tier. The guy said he might become a PPG player but won't live up to the hype, I said he becomes a consistent PPG player he'll be an average #1 overall. Someone said he'll be in the bottom 1/4. My response was if he becomes a consistent PPG player he'll be in the range of the guys I mentioned. I never said he's better than any of them now (other than maybe Yakupov).

Lafrenière isn't better than Rick Nash lmao.

Edit: Ah, you mean if he becomes a ppg guy. I was confused as f***.

Yes

 

[islandersbob]

If he becomes a relatively consistent PPG player he'll be at least in the range of like half the picks since 2000. Some of these are too early but yes is for sure better than that and no is in that range or worse:

View attachment 805398

This list blows. Even if he got to be a PPG player for a few years, which is HIGHLY unlikely, there is no way that he is in the league of some of your 'NO's. John Tavares >>>> hypothetical PPG Alexis Lafrenière. Rick Nash won a Richard. Taylor Hall was MVP. Nico Hischier had a good argument for Selke last year. AAron Ekblad and Erik Johnson were minute eating top pairing defensemen. Would a PPG Lafrenière even be a first liner?

 

[SnowblindNYR]

This list blows. Even if he got to be a PPG player for a few years, which is HIGHLY unlikely, there is no way that he is in the league of some of your 'NO's. John Tavares >>>> hypothetical PPG Alexis Lafrenière. Rick Nash won a Richard. Taylor Hall was MVP. Nico Hischier had a good argument for Selke last year. AAron Ekblad and Erik Johnson were minute eating top pairing defensemen. Would a PPG Lafrenière even be a first liner?

A PPG player is not a first liner in the NHL? LMAO! Dude, literally every PPG player on the NHL is a first line quality player. As far as the players on that list Tavares has been a PPG player his entire career. If you want to give him points for starting earlier, fine but that's not the discussion. Rick Nash wasn't near PPG most of his career, granted he's played in a lower scoring league. HIGHLY unlikely that Laf would get a few PPG seasons? He's on pace for 50 points with hardly any PP time. He'd be most likely be a 60-70 point player this year if he were on the PP. I didn't say it would be better than any of those guys, I said in the range of all those guys.

Lafreniere has 22 even strength points if he had 13 PP points like our LEAST productive forward on PP1 (Kreider), he'd be on pace for 67 points.

 

[SnowblindNYR]

The funny thing about this thread is that most Rangers fans are very level headed. All they're saying is he's been valuable player for us one of our best 5 on 5 and has turned into a good top 6 player. No one's calling him a star or anything, people like me are saying if he gets PP time and improves his shot he might reach his potential or close to it. Meanwhile the Ranger/Laf haters have jumped the shark about how he's a bust and how much he sucks. Like objectively he doesn't suck. He hasn't yet been what he was supposed to be, but this season is legit one of our best players. And to further the point, this thread was started by a Rangers fan. Until this season for ever Laf supporter there were 9 haters on our board. So no even this tiny bit of optimism isn't homerism considerinng how much hate he got from Rangers fans. The ridiculous discrepancy between the tempered optimism from the Rangers fanbase and the venom he's getting from his haters is absolutely comical. If you hate a team and a player so much I suggest you find a hobby.

 

[islandersbob]

A PPG player is not a first liner in the NHL? LMAO! Dude, literally every PPG player on the NHL is a first line quality player. As far as the players on that list Tavares has been a PPG player his entire career. If you want to give him points for starting earlier, fine but that's not the discussion. Rick Nash wasn't near PPG most of his career, granted he's played in a lower scoring league. HIGHLY unlikely that Laf would get a few PPG seasons? He's on pace for 50 points with hardly any PP time. He'd be most likely be a 60-70 point player this year if he were on the PP. I didn't say it would be better than any of those guys, I said in the range of all those guys.

Lafreniere has 22 even strength points if he had 13 PP points like our LEAST productive forward on PP1 (Kreider), he'd be on pace for 67 points.

Do you even know how good John Tavares and Rick Nash were during their primes? Since the year 2000 they are 12th and 13th in goals scored. That means that there were only 11 total players (since the year 2000) that have scored more NHL goals than them. That is significantly more valuable than a player that might hypothetically eventually maybe get to PPG. Also, Taylor Hall has 2 season (adjusted to 82 games played) where he accumulated more assists than Laf has in his entire CAREER (260ish games)

Rangers have Josh Bailey 2.0. (also, Josh Bailey was at .93 ppg one season and let me say, he wasn't a first liner)

 

[irishlaxburger2]

He's a bust per the expectations of being a 1OA thus far. On pace for 50 pts which is disappointing in D + 4.

Considering there’s basically zero power play production, that’s not a bad total. He could easily have 25 additional points if he was on PP1 for the Rangers.

Our first line center is currently on pace for less than 25 5v5 points, for reference.

 

[Zajacs Bowl Cut]

If he becomes a relatively consistent PPG player he'll be at least in the range of like half the picks since 2000. Some of these are too early but yes is for sure better than that and no is in that range or worse:

View attachment 805398

wait

you're saying Nico is not better than Laf? lmaoooooo

 

[The Crypto Guy]

wait

you're saying Nico is not better than Laf? lmaoooooo

You seem confused.

 

[WhiskeyYerTheDevils]

Considering there’s basically zero power play production, that’s not a bad total. He could easily have 25 additional points if he was on PP1 for the Rangers.

Our first line center is currently on pace for less than 25 5v5 points, for reference.

You think he could easily have 31 PP points if he was on pp1? Panarin only has 26...

 

[Donner]

If he becomes a relatively consistent PPG player he'll be at least in the range of like half the picks since 2000. Some of these are too early but yes is for sure better than that and no is in that range or worse:

View attachment 805398

Laf doesn't hold RNHs jock strap