Salary Cap: The Endless Speculation Edition

[Zirakzigil]

Colorado have 28m free for next year and can probably shed a bit more. Not many important new contracts to hand out either. Carolina could probably make it work too.

The Avs dont have 28mil in free space, they have 23.5mil to fill the positions they need to. Also, the following off season they will have some major contracts due, including Landeskog, Makar and Grubauer. They may be able to afford Hall at 11mil next year, but the following season they would have to gut their team. I dont see them making a play for Hall long term.

The story is the same for the Jerks. They have 18mil to sign 2 top 6 defensemen and a few other pieces. They actually might be in a better position long term to get Hall, but I dont see Hall going there. Hall has said he wants to play in a hockey market.

Sorry, I just dont see Hall getting 11mil from a contender.

 

[BlindWillyMcHurt]

Missing the playoffs is missing millions of dollars in revenue. If they were already making wheelbarrows of cash regardless that would maybe be one thing. But they rely on that money to put the books in the black at the end of the year.

Missing the playoffs while Crosby and Malkin are still a thing and while the team is spending to the cap is unacceptable.

 

[Gurglesons]

The Avs dont have 28mil in free space, they have 23.5mil to fill the positions they need to. Also, the following off season they will have some major contracts due, including Landeskog, Makar and Grubauer. They may be able to afford Hall at 11mil next year, but the following season they would have to gut their team. I dont see them making a play for Hall long term.

The story is the same for the Jerks. They have 18mil to sign 2 top 6 defensemen and a few other pieces. They actually might be in a better position long term to get Hall, but I dont see Hall going there. Hall has said he wants to play in a hockey market.

Sorry, I just dont see Hall getting 11mil from a contender.

Not sure why he wouldn’t. Marner just got 10 mil and Hall is a better wing and has shown he can produce without an elite C.

 

[Turin]

Not sure why he wouldn’t. Marner just got 10 mil and Hall is a better wing and has shown he can produce without an elite C.

Marner got overpaid for potential. Hall will be 28 and his durability is somewhat questionable. I could see him getting a huge UFA deal from a bubble/basement team I guess. Maybe there’s a contender out there who’d do it, I certainly wouldn’t though.

 

[Zirakzigil]

Not sure why he wouldn’t. Marner just got 10 mil and Hall is a better wing and has shown he can produce without an elite C.

Because no contender has the cap space to give him that. The next 2-3 years are going to create a squeeze on FA, last summer was the start. With the cap only going up 2mil each of the next 2 years, if the rumours are correct, no contender has the space to give him 11mil. Doesnt matter if he deserves it or not. Toronto screwed themselves with the Marner and Matthews contracts. Look at what guys like Tkachuk, Point and Rantanen got. Id argue the last two are better players than Marner as well, with Tkachuk arguably just as valuable or more depending the make up of your team.

 

[JTG]

With all due respect to Taylor Hall, he's not getting $11 million, imo. He'll get something around Geno's $9.5 million.

I disagree. Hall has hardware, and there are guys making more than 9.5 who do not.

Because no contender has the cap space to give him that. The next 2-3 years are going to create a squeeze on FA, last summer was the start. With the cap only going up 2mil each of the next 2 years, if the rumours are correct, no contender has the space to give him 11mil. Doesnt matter if he deserves it or not. Toronto screwed themselves with the Marner and Matthews contracts. Look at what guys like Tkachuk, Point and Rantanen got. Id argue the last two are better players than Marner as well, with Tkachuk arguably just as valuable or more depending the make up of your team.

If Hall were legitimately available, some team would do with him like the Sharks did with Karlsson. You make room. There could be a good team that wants a retool, and they will just trade someone out and bring hall in.

Hall is also going to be a UFA. Basically everyone we are comparing him against now was an RFA. Though the team friendly 2nd contracts are a thing of the past, teams still ultimately hold the power in those negotiations. Some team is going to pay the dude because he is about as close to the complete package at wing that you're going to get.

 

[Zirakzigil]

I disagree. Hall has hardware, and there are guys making more than 9.5 who do not.



If Hall were legitimately available, some team would do with him like the Sharks did with Karlsson. You make room. There could be a good team that wants a retool, and they will just trade someone out and bring hall in.

Hall is also going to be a UFA. Basically everyone we are comparing him against now was an RFA. Though the team friendly 2nd contracts are a thing of the past, teams still ultimately hold the power in those negotiations. Some team is going to pay the dude because he is about as close to the complete package at wing that you're going to get.

Huge difference, Karlsson was signed by the team who held his rights, Hall wouldnt be in this case. Im not saying he wont be paid, cause he will, I am saying that if he wants to sign with a contender, the cap will be lower.

 

[JTG]

Huge difference, Karlsson was signed by the team who held his rights, Hall wouldnt be in this case. Im not saying he wont be paid, cause he will, I am saying that if he wants to sign with a contender, the cap will be lower.

If Shero cannot get Hall signed, it's going to be the exact same situation. There is zero shot Shero lets him walk free. The team that trades for him will more than likely re-sign him.

Even if the guy gets to free agency, he's going to get 11m a year. The cap is going to be tight for 2 years, but then it's going to open wide up. These guys signing big deals in the next couple years will take that into consideration.

 

[Gurglesons]

Marner got overpaid for potential. Hall will be 28 and his durability is somewhat questionable. I could see him getting a huge UFA deal from a bubble/basement team I guess. Maybe there’s a contender out there who’d do it, I certainly wouldn’t though.

Avs, Edmonton, Calgary, Philly, Boston, Buffalo, Florida, Carolina, Columbus and Islanders are all teams I see as “contenders” that would offer Hall 10mil+. It’s Tavares all over again. You literally can create a 1st or 2nd line with him.

 

[Empoleon8771]

Pretty much any team in on Panarin last off-season who didn't get him would offer Hall a bunch of money. My bet is on Columbus, I think they make a ton of sense to go hard after Hall.

 

[Ryder71]

it's a win-win if we miss the p. o. it will be because we don't belong there and we will get a high pick and know where we need to improve/ trade .. ..and if by chance we do, we will know the best combo's we can play and where/who we should move.

Fair point, well stated.

 

[Honour Over Glory]

it's a win-win if we miss the p. o. it will be because we don't belong there and we will get a high pick and know where we need to improve/ trade .. ..and if by chance we do, we will know the best combo's we can play and where/who we should move.

If we miss or are bounced in the first round it's just going to be more of the same old. I feel like the easiest thing people default to for complaints is lack of quality players and a bad gm. But when you compare this roster to most around the league and what the gm has done with his warts and all, we really don't have much cause for that whining.

 

[Peat]

My bad on Colorado's cap figure, but they can make Hall happen in that figure as well (particularly as Girard's 5m is accounted for in that figure). Maybe its awkward next year with Makar/Grubauer/Landeskog but they can make that work if they want to.

I don't know whether either side is interested or whether it'll happen, but there are good sides with cap available next season out there.

 

[Riptide]

Yep... in most rankings he is listed as somewhere around 15th in nhl wingers...despite his hart... this isn’t a top notch hof level guy... he is just a star winger... he will get a notch above Kessel money due to inflation... still quite pricey though

A notch above Kessel... you mean a notch above Stone (9.5m) right? Because I really struggle to see him getting less than ~10m. He might take it, but that's him giving some team one hell of a discount.

 

[66-30-33]

What would it cost to land Fowler?

Dumo-Letang
Fowler-Marino

Next season.

 

[Gurglesons]

What would it cost to land Fowler?

Dumo-Letang
Fowler-Marino

Next season.

I mean, I want to say a lot but then I see how Murray has handled Vatanen, Montour, Theodore, Pettersson, etc.

I would love Fowler here and I think our defensive staff could really get him back to the Norris level he arguably was when Anaheim was a legit contender.

 

[Gurglesons]

My bad on Colorado's cap figure, but they can make Hall happen in that figure as well (particularly as Girard's 5m is accounted for in that figure). Maybe its awkward next year with Makar/Grubauer/Landeskog but they can make that work if they want to.

I don't know whether either side is interested or whether it'll happen, but there are good sides with cap available next season out there.

They will be out from Ian Cole in a year’s time and could probably easy pawn him off. They do not have to resign Zadorov and they have Timmins coming up. Honestly, I bet they are the forerunner for a talent like Hall along with CBJ.

The scary part is they could drop Rantanen to the second line and have Landeskog - MacK - Burky and then Hall - Kadri - Ratanen as their top six. Jesus f***.

 

[Big Friggin Dummy]

You must of missed this past offseason.

Halls also worth more then 9.5.

When people thought Duchene was getting $10 million+ but he signed for $8 million?

I mean, Panarin got a huge pay day but the Rangers were literally paying to put people in the seats. It's the same as Buffalo handing Skinner a blank check because they simply had to.

Hall's getting Geno-money. Bank it.

 

[Peat]

They will be out from Ian Cole in a year’s time and could probably easy pawn him off. They do not have to resign Zadorov and they have Timmins coming up. Honestly, I bet they are the forerunner for a talent like Hall along with CBJ.

The scary part is they could drop Rantanen to the second line and have Landeskog - MacK - Burky and then Hall - Kadri - Ratanen as their top six. Jesus ****.

Yeah, there's a decent group of well paid but not essential players there that can be moved if Colorado want to go nuts. I think if they were to do this Erik Johnson would have to eventually go to give Landeskog etc.etc. their money, which may or may not hurt, but guys like Cole and Zadorov and Donskoi and Compher? They can live without them. Can they win without a scary second line?

 

[Gurglesons]

Yeah, there's a decent group of well paid but not essential players there that can be moved if Colorado want to go nuts. I think if they were to do this Erik Johnson would have to eventually go to give Landeskog etc.etc. their money, which may or may not hurt, but guys like Cole and Zadorov and Donskoi and Compher? They can live without them. Can they win without a scary second line?

I don’t think moving EJ is smart for that young core. Dude is a legit top four D. That being said, they could entertain it with the other group.

 

[Peat]

I don’t think moving EJ is smart for that young core. Dude is a legit top four D. That being said, they could entertain it with the other group.

Other group may not get them past the Landeskog/Makar/Grubauer hurdle. That set of contract renewals is the one big hurdle for Colorado if they want to get Hall - ensuring they don't lose core guys in a season's time. They're be scary as hell for the season before that though, maybe scary enough that they'd gamble on Hall and hope it works out.

They're certainly going to do something big. They're not just going to sit on that cap, not when they're ready to start going deep in playoffs now.

 

[Dipsy Doodle]

My point was Schultz has been more injured than Letang during the last two seasons so your whole “obviously Letang is injured and we need to keep Schultz” shtick is almost as played out as the “we miss Kessel” one.

The point is we shouldn’t pay 5.5 to a player whose produced 1 PP goal over the entirety of his 5.5 contract and 7 total.

Moved to more relevant thread.

JS's production in Letang's absence and overall playoff production here speaks for itself. He's always produced for us when it matters, and excessive parsing doesn't change that. He's essential until someone else shows they can do what he does.

 

[Sidney the Kidney]

Taylor Hall's injury history should scare teams off signing him to a max contract for more than a 7 digit salary. It looks like the kind of contract where you'll get around 40-50 games out of Hall, with a bunch of IR visits in between.

 

[Gurglesons]

Moved to more relevant thread.

JS's production in Letang's absence and overall playoff production here speaks for itself. He's always produced for us when it matters, and excessive parsing doesn't change that. He's essential until someone else shows they can do what he does.

Ah. So it is the Kessel or Sprong argument. His production speaks for itself so any argument is pointless because you say so despite the fact he has 7 goals in 108 games through 3 seasons since signing for 5.5 mil.

 

[dustybreaks]

When people thought Duchene was getting $10 million+ but he signed for $8 million?

I mean, Panarin got a huge pay day but the Rangers were literally paying to put people in the seats. It's the same as Buffalo handing Skinner a blank check because they simply had to.

Hall's getting Geno-money. Bank it.

Yeah and Philly had to give Kevin Hayes 7.14 to put them over the top. The landscape is changing it’s not 2013 anymore.