The Battle for USA-CAN Dual Citizen Players

[chunkylover53]

Dual citizenship has always been an interesting and touchy subject that leads to speculation, from prospects to pros. The most interesting is the USA/CAN players, as we have had a few interesting cases like Oleksiak, Matteau, Myers and more that I'm missing.


One to watch and I've noticed is Jakob Chychrun (Canadian father, but born and played in USA during his youth), 1st overall pick in the OHL. His request to play the USHL early was turned down by USAH. He represented Team Ontario and looks like he's in Canada's U17 challenge camp. Signs are pointing that he may end up on Canada's side even though he was born and developed in the USA, but we won't know until an IIHF tournament (Cole Cassels played for Ontario in the U17 challenge but tried for Team USA later on).

Any other interesting cases that we have had in the past?

Who are some players that we should be watching now for their decision?

Who's winning this battle at the moment?

Click to read more...

 

[SenzZen]

People tend to hold a grudge against whichever side cuts them at any point in time.

 

[Stud Muffin]

Say always pick your fathers nationality

 

[chunkylover53]

Say always pick your fathers nationality

Why fathers? I mean look at Matteau who's father was Canadian, and for him I think it makes sense for him to choose US.

 

[Scotty B]

Dual citizenship has always been an interesting and touchy subject that leads to speculation, from prospects to pros. The most interesting is the USA/CAN players, as we have had a few interesting cases like Oleksiak, Matteau, Myers and more that I'm missing.


One to watch and I've noticed is Jakob Chychrun (Canadian father, but born and played in USA during his youth), 1st overall pick in the OHL. His request to play the USHL early was turned down by USAH. He represented Team Ontario and looks like he's in Canada's U17 challenge camp. Signs are pointing that he may end up on Canada's side even though he was born and developed in the USA, but we won't know until an IIHF tournament (Cole Cassels played for Ontario in the U17 challenge but tried for Team USA later on).

Any other interesting cases that we have had in the past?

Who are some players that we should be watching now for their decision?

Who's winning this battle at the moment?

I dunno about going forward?...But you Yanks are ahead on pts + still owe us for the Golden Brett

 

[1Gold Standard]

It's all Brett Hull's fault. Damn you, Brett.

Actually, If the player has dual citizenship and the option to choose, then he should be free to make that choice without hearing or reading what we have to say about it. We should just shut it.

 

[Stud Muffin]

Why fathers? I mean look at Matteau who's father was Canadian, and for him I think it makes sense for him to choose US.

If he's played pro hockey is what I mean.

 

[Scotty B]

It's all Brett Hull's fault. Damn you, Brett.

Actually, If the player has dual citizenship and the option to choose, then he should be free to make that choice without hearing or reading what we have to say about it. We should just shut it.

I seem to recall Brett was snubbed from a Canadian World Junior Team , Wasn't even invited to camp cause of his skating. Think the coach might have been Dave King...

That snub, supposedly, led to Brett becoming a leading light for Team USA...winning World Cup 1996, yadda yadda

Big BIG MISTAKE by Dave King & Company

 

[1Gold Standard]

I seem to recall Brett was snubbed from a Canadian World Junior Team , Wasn't even invited to camp cause of his skating. Think the coach might have been Dave King...

That snub, supposedly, led to Brett becoming a leading light for Team USA...winning World Cup 1996, yadda yadda

Big BIG MISTAKE by Dave King & Company

I thought the snub came at the 84 Canada Cup. but, not 100% sure... you may be right...maybe it was the 87 Canada Cup... but either way, there was a snub in there somewhere.

According to Wikipedia it was the 86 World Hockey Championships that the Team Canada snub occurred. He then played for the U.S. at the very same WHC.

 

[chunkylover53]

If he's played pro hockey is what I mean.

Do you mean your fathers nationality if your father has played pro hockey? Because with Matteau...

 

[3 Minute Minor]

Most North Americans don't even know that there are citizenship rules in place for dual nats, you can't always just pick a side.

For a player like Chychrun that holds dual citizenship, he has to play at least 2 years after age 10 (use to be 12 until this year) in Canada to be eligible for Canada. If there was an IIHF event today, he wouldn't be eligible for Canada because he has only played 1 full season in the country.

There are exceptions. For example if Chychrun was born in Canada and/or never had an American passport, he could apply to represent Canada and shouldn't encounter any problems.

 

[chunkylover53]

I dunno about going forward?...But you Yanks are ahead on pts + still owe us for the Golden Brett

Yeah Brett is the most infamous case lol, but I was talking more about recently, like with prospects+active NHLers. Similar to Brett would be Pominville, who was born and grew up in Canada but got an opportunity to play because of American mother, whereas they wouldn't have played at all otherwise. Chychrun seems to be the opposite of this case if he does go with Canada.

Most North Americans don't even know that there are citizenship rules in place for dual nats, you can't always just pick a side.

For a player like Chychrun that holds dual citizenship, he has to play at least 2 years after age 10 (use to be 12 until this year) in Canada to be eligible for Canada. If there was an IIHF event today, he wouldn't be eligible for Canada because he has only played 1 full season in the country.

There are exceptions. For example if Chychrun was born in Canada and/or never had an American passport, he could apply to represent Canada and shouldn't encounter any problems.

True, pretty much the Matteau ruling, which is why Chychrun is an interesting case here. He could still end up playing for US if the US offers him a spot at the U18 to entice him because he would have to wait 2 years otherwise. Given this information, Chychrun couldn't even be locked into Canada until WJCs at the earliest because he would be 18 in 2 years no? So it's still very realistic that he ends up on USA, guess time will tell (playing for Canada at the U17 challenge isn't any big indicator, maybe he's still planning to play for the US in the future?)

 

[Scotty B]

I thought the snub came at the 84 Canada Cup. but, not 100% sure... you may be right...maybe it was the 87 Canada Cup... but either way, there was a snub in there somewhere.

According to Wikipedia it was the 86 World Hockey Championships that the Team Canada snub occurred. He then played for the U.S. at the very same WHC.

Ah yes, it appears you are right. Still World Juniors was the story I heard....Easy mistake to make since Dave King was coach for our 82 + 83 World Juniors, and also coached our WC 1986 team

Either way King gets the blame ( or so the story goes ) for Brett starRing for The Stars n Stripes steada Team Maple Leaf

 

[1Gold Standard]

Yeah Brett is the most infamous case lol, but I was talking more about recently, like with prospects+active NHLers. Similar to Brett would be Pominville, who was born and grew up in Canada but got an opportunity to play because of American mother, whereas they wouldn't have played at all otherwise. Chychrun seems to be the opposite of this case if he does go with Canada.




True, pretty much the Matteau ruling, which is why Chychrun is an interesting case here. He could still end up playing for US if the US offers him a spot at the U18 to entice him because he would have to wait 2 years otherwise. Given this information, Chychrun couldn't even be locked into Canada until WJCs at the earliest because he would be 18 in 2 years no?

He would be eligible to play for Canada at next year's IIHF U18 if available as an underager (next year the IIHF U18 tournment is for players born in 97) after the completion of the 2014/15 season, he would have fulfilled the 2 season requirement. That's my take on his situation.

 

[Bjorn Le]

It's not really a battle. Most of the elite players choose Canada. Even Brett Hull has essentially said he would have choose Canada (by saying he views himself as Canadian) if they chose him when he wanted to play.

For a player like Chychrun that holds dual citizenship, he has to play at least 2 years after age 10 (use to be 12 until this year) in Canada to be eligible for Canada. If there was an IIHF event today, he wouldn't be eligible for Canada because he has only played 1 full season in the country.

This rule exists but is it consistently enforced? For example, Galchenyuk has only one year of hockey in the US and he was able to represent the USA internationally. To date he still only has one year.

 

[chunkylover53]

He would be eligible to play for Canada at next year's IIHF U18 if available as an underager (next year the IIHF U18 tournment is for players born in 97) after the completion of the 2014/15 season, he would have fulfilled the 2 season requirement. That's my take on his situation.

Ahh you're right I forgot he played for the Jr.Canadiens in Toronto so he pretty much only has to play his rookie season in the OHL.

It's not really a battle. Most of the elite players choose Canada. Even Brett Hull has essentially said he would have choose Canada (by saying he views himself as Canadian) if they chose him when he wanted to play.



This rule exists but is it consistently enforced? For example, Galchenyuk has only one year of hockey in the US and he was able to represent the USA internationally. To date he still only has one year.

They did enforced this by not allowing Stefan Matteau to play for the US in the U18.

 

[UsernameWasTaken]

He would be eligible to play for Canada at next year's IIHF U18 if available as an underager (next year the IIHF U18 tournment is for players born in 97) after the completion of the 2014/15 season, he would have fulfilled the 2 season requirement. That's my take on his situation.

Yeah I think that's right - because he already played a year in Canada (when he played midget).

For the person who was asking about Galchenyuk, IIRC he gave up his Russian citizenship a bit before the NHL draft...so i now only a US citizen.

 

[JackSlater]

Canada is "winning" in the sense that more of these players seem to choose Canada. Most of them have stronger Canadian ties, so that makes sense.

USA is "winning" in that they have benefited from this situation more than Canada has thus far. I can't think of any dual players who were trained moreso in the United States than Canada and then chose Canada, though Day and Chychrun look like they will change that.

 

[ChiGuySez]

More Canadian born players choose to settle in the US after playing days are finished than the other way around. US wins on that. Thank you Canada.

 

[CRRhockey]

Canada is "winning" in the sense that more of these players seem to choose Canada. Most of them have stronger Canadian ties, so that makes sense.

USA is "winning" in that they have benefited from this situation more than Canada has thus far. I can't think of any dual players who were trained moreso in the United States than Canada and then chose Canada, though Day and Chychrun look like they will change that.

Griffin Luce and Michael Campoli played all their minor hockey in Canada and will represent the USA and play for the NTDP for the next two seasons. I think having dual citizenship gives these kids options and for kids who do not want to close the door on their NCAA eligibility the NTDP is a no brainier.

 

[GeeoffBrown]

I've always found Evgeni Nabokov to be an interesting case, since he played for Kazakhstan at the Olympics and then was allowed to play for Russia in a different Olympics.

 

[1Gold Standard]

I've always found Evgeni Nabokov to be an interesting case, since he played for Kazakhstan at the Olympics and then was allowed to play for Russia in a different Olympics.

I think the IIHF operates much like the U.N. Security Council, if you are 1 of the big 5, you pretty much can tell the IIHF how it's going to go down.

 

[Uncle Rotter]

USA is "winning" in that they have benefited from this situation more than Canada has thus far. I can't think of any dual players who were trained moreso in the United States than Canada and then chose Canada, though Day and Chychrun look like they will change that.

Is Day a US citizen? Kevin Dineen played most of his minor hockey in the U.S. but I think he was only a Canadian citizen at the time.

 

[Uncle Rotter]

This is a list I compiled a couple of years ago of players who played for the US in IIHF tournaments from 1977 who played most of their hockey in Canada prior to the age of 18:

Kevin McCloskey
Bob Crawford
Ed Hospodar
Venci Sebek
Moe Mantha
Tom Fergus
Brett Hull
Bill Lindsay
Brent Bilodeau
Adam Deadmarsh
Ashlin Halfnight
Jason McBain
Mike Lalor
Mike McBain
Donald Brashear
Jean-Marc Pelletier
Chris St. Croix
Ryan Murphy
Philippe Sauvé
David Inman
Francis Bouillon
Chris Holt
Brady Murray
Jason Bailey
Colin Wilson
Tyler Arnason
Justin Vaive
Jason Pominville
Nick Foligno
T.J. Galiardi

 

[UsernameWasTaken]

Is Day a US citizen? Kevin Dineen played most of his minor hockey in the U.S. but I think he was only a Canadian citizen at the time.

No he isn't. Only Canadian.