The 2024-2025 Roster Thread

[Sabre the Win]

I think a smart Cozens trade could be made but it needs to be 1:1 and Adams needs to target an actual 2C so essentially you're trading a 2W for a 2C. The problem with Cozens is he played the wing for team Canada when he was good. Cozens is a winger at th NHL level, find a solid hockey trade for a smart two way playmaker center 2C and I can see both teams winning.

I don't think you need to be built down the center to win, you just need capable centers and you can have PPG wingers like a Patrick Kane driving the offense.

 

[dickiedunnwrotethis]

I take Borgen over Joki 10 times out of 10. I would have already made that trade.


I personally would prioritize winning over trade value right now. If you can make a trade and improve the team, but lose on value a little bit, that's ok. Winning will raise the value of all your assets.

The one line I would draw in terms of value is positional. Im less likely to trade Cozens vs Quinn/Peterka because if you trade the one guy who might be a good 2C someday, you leave a huge hole. If we traded Cozens after trading Mitts, we couldn't really hope to be good down the middle any time soon and that means we couldn't expect to have a good team any time soon.

Right now we should be trying to turn Quinn/Peterka+ picks and prospects into top 6 F help (preferably C) or top 4D help.

Only prospects who are off limits for me are Levi and Hele. Edit: and Kulich.

Agree with a lot of your points.

However.

I don't see Cozens ever being a 2C on a contending team. He can be a 2C on a mediocre team and even thrive for a few months like he did in Granato's zero structure system. But his lack of discernible hockey sense will always hold him back. So, in my opinion, his departure won't leave a huge hole because that hole already exists. We traded the wrong center, but that's where we're at sadly.

Sidenote: Happy to be wrong about Cozens.

 

[toddkaz]

I am basically to the same place as I was with Rasmus Ristolainen. Yes, he obiously has a ton of natural ability, was drafted high, plays a valuable position, and he performed very well in international games. He could theoretically be a late bloomer, but he already has a lot of NHL games. He is a complete moron on the ice, and I would like him to go hurt another team. Maybe he blooms when he is not burdened in hockey hell, which is all the more reason to trade him.

Yup, if Cozens is traded teams will pay for the blooming Cozens because the Cozens we have now just isn't worth trading. Its the same situation Anaheim has with Zegras.

No one is gonna pay for what Zegras could be and Anaheim isn't going to trade him at his lowest value.

Same as us you just hope there is a stupid GM who is willing to pay.

 

[zenthusiast]

what if he just never consistently rebounds at all?

 

[Fjordy]

Watch him play without the puck or sometimes with the puck, it just looks like the guy doesn't have high hockey IQ. Ruff is unhappy with him at center, he's not a great in D-zone, he's not a great shooter or playmaker, he's not a good faceoff guy. All he has is speed and athleticism, but he doesn't play with grit. Maybe he could be a decent top 6 wing, but that's not a given. I'm not selling him cheap, but I'm listening to every offer. If we can get a good top 6 C in a Cozens deal plus maybe other pieces on both sides where we also get a top 4 RD, it might be worth considering, but that's just my opinion.

 

[zenthusiast]

Watch him play without the puck or sometimes with the puck, it just looks like the guy doesn't have high hockey IQ. Ruff is unhappy with him at center, he's not a great in D-zone, he's not a great shooter or playmaker, he's not a good faceoff guy. All he has is speed and athleticism, but he doesn't play with grit. Maybe he could be a decent top 6 wing, but that's not a given. I'm not selling him cheap, but I'm listening to every offer. If we can get a good top 6 C in a Cozens deal plus maybe other pieces on both sides where we also get a top 4 RD, it might be worth considering, but that's just my opinion.

I’ve said this elsewhere but I’d rather have the Zegras problem than the cozens problem

 

[toddkaz]

I think a smart Cozens trade could be made but it needs to be 1:1 and Adams needs to target an actual 2C so essentially you're trading a 2W for a 2C. The problem with Cozens is he played the wing for team Canada when he was good. Cozens is a winger at th NHL level, find a solid hockey trade for a smart two way playmaker center 2C and I can see both teams winning.

I don't think you need to be built down the center to win, you just need capable centers and you can have PPG wingers like a Patrick Kane driving the offense.

If I am trading Cozens it would have to be something like a package for Barzal, Petterson, Boldy thats what I would be looking at and of course we will have to add but thats what I would be asking for if I am Adams. Sure they probably hang up the phone but thats the point. Find a stupid GM or keep Cozens.
(Players are just examples don't get hung up on them)

The best player in the trade has to be coming to Buffalo.

 

[GellMann]

They absolutely should not be moving Cozens now unless its a similar caliber player coming back or part of a package for an upgrade.

And frankly, the next GM should get to decide what to do with him.

This would be terrifying, because he is horrible

 

[Ace]

People are missing the point completely on this Cozens thing,

Will he be better elsewhere? Of course. Almost anywhere else is a real organization that will surround him with a real NHL caliber team.

Since Adams will NEVER build one of those…it literally doesn’t matter if we keep him. He’s not going to be good here. Unless he has another lucky shooting season and people pretend that’s who he is again.

Everyone worth anything on this team will be better elsewhere. Because they won’t have to play a line over their head with players two lines over their heads.

Adams has spent five years not fixing that problem.

Keep him…trade him…the team is going to continue to end up in the same spot until someone who knows what they’re doing takes the wheel.

 

[SundherDome]

I think a smart Cozens trade could be made but it needs to be 1:1 and Adams needs to target an actual 2C so essentially you're trading a 2W for a 2C. The problem with Cozens is he played the wing for team Canada when he was good. Cozens is a winger at th NHL level, find a solid hockey trade for a smart two way playmaker center 2C and I can see both teams winning.

I don't think you need to be built down the center to win, you just need capable centers and you can have PPG wingers like a Patrick Kane driving the offense.

Centerpiece of a Pettersson trade

 

[Ace]

The only right answer to any trade speculation is to fire Kevyn Adams and see what a qualified person wants to do.

Until that happens this is a discussion of rearranging the deck chairs on the titanic.

 

[Fjordy]

I’ve said this elsewhere but I’d rather have the Zegras problem than the cozens problem

Well, Zegras' problem now is injuries.

 

[GellMann]

My very first posts on internet forums about Cozens expressed a worry that his hands and his brain didn't work well at all at speed, after watching a bunch of his highlight videos. I dismissed that because a few minutes of selective tape don't really mean anything.

But to this day, whenever this guy has the puck and there's some amount of pressure or focus on him, he has the worst hands and decision making of anyone I've seen in a skill role in the NHL. You can't have a top six player who is so allergic to doing something meaningful with the puck. And he doesn't just f*** plays up on offense, his fumbling and inaccuracy consistently hands teams odd man rushes the other way, which they score on, as recently as two games ago

 

[Ace]

Oh and one other thing for the “the fact that teams want him should be a sign to keep him” crowd…

What should the fact that the buzzards are circling the roster built completely by this GM after five years tell them? Because Adams keeps talking (not doing, talking) about adding to the core. And the rest of the league is pouncing on a rebuild because he’s failed so spectacularly. They should continue to build around a core that the league views as DOA? With the GM that built it?

I’d like someone to learn the macro lesson here. And fire the architect.

 

[zenthusiast]

Well, Zegras' problem now is injuries.

Who among us

 

[Zman5778]

The only right answer to any trade speculation is to fire Kevyn Adams and see what a qualified person wants to do.

Until that happens this is a discussion of rearranging the deck chairs on the titanic.

You're assuming that if Terry fires Kevyn that a "qualified person" would be hired.

 

[MOGlLNY]

The only right answer to any trade speculation is to fire Kevyn Adams and see what a qualified person wants to do.

Until that happens this is a discussion of rearranging the deck chairs on the titanic.

As someone who watched a lot of the Kings in their almost dynasty era, Dean Lombardi I think is the right guy for the job.

What ended up being his downfall after the cups was that the veterans and established players he traded the young guys and draft picks for, he ended up being too loyal to those guys. But he did that after they had already won it twice and gone to the conference finals three times. I'd like to think he's learned from that and won't be loyal to a fault anymore.

So we have a guy who has won 2 cups and we know has established success in taking a young team that has an abundance of picks, prospects and young guys and turning around a situation. Kings were also considered one of the worst franchises in the history of the NHL before their run.

Sound familiar? Only difference is the Kings owners were as hands off as you can possibly get.

 

[MOGlLNY]

Maybe Dean is enjoying his job as a "senior advisor" of the Flyers too much though. Working in the shadows with Bobby Clarke and the boys

 

[OkimLom]

Centerpiece of a Pettersson trade

Cozens will probably be a value-bolstering piece for a trade package for Pettersson. He's not going to be a centerpiece for that highly value of a player. The Sabres 1st round pick would be a bigger piece than what Cozens is now.

 

[stokes84]

Other teams want Dylan Cozens??? It’s a Christmas miracle. LFG!!!!

 

[Ace]

You're assuming that if Terry fires Kevyn that a "qualified person" would be hired.

I never assume Terry Pegula will do the right thing. I’m simply stating what it so obviously is.

 

[TehDoak]

Re: Cozens

I think you should probably look at the worst case scenarios here:

1. If you trade him:

You sell him for pennies on the dollar, He becomes a star player elsewhere and you look stupid, again

2. If you keep him:

He never rebounds and you buy him out in 2 summers.

Now look at the best case scenarios:

1. If you trade him:

You get a key piece in return and the team turns the season around

2. If you keep him:

He turns it around and becomes a core piece.

I think the LEAST likely thing of these best/worst case scenarios if you getting a key piece back.

The MOST likely is you end up eating a buyout of at 1/3rd the value in two years.

I don't see the value in a Cozens trade right now unless you are getting a quality player in return.
And I don't think you are.

 

[Chainshot]

The number of 1-goal losses in this stretch. Just imagine if Jack Quinn was the player we thought? Or if Palm Frond had used his Skinner cap savings on another player?

Maybe Dean is enjoying his job as a "senior advisor" of the Flyers too much though. Working in the shadows with Bobby Clarke and the boys

It's crazy how many advisors that team has. Clark, Holmgren, Lombardi... I'm sure there are more.

 

[MOGlLNY]

Re: Cozens

I think you should probably look at the worst case scenarios here:

1. If you trade him:

You sell him for pennies on the dollar, He becomes a star player elsewhere and you look stupid, again

2. If you keep him:

He never rebounds and you buy him out in 2 summers.

Now look at the best case scenarios:

1. If you trade him:

You get a key piece in return and the team turns the season around

2. If you keep him:

He turns it around and becomes a core piece.

I think the LEAST likely thing of these best/worst case scenarios if you getting a key piece back.

The MOST likely is you end up eating a buyout of at 1/3rd the value in two years.

I don't see the value in a Cozens trade right now unless you are getting a quality player in return.
And I don't think you are.

Cozens has been my whipping boy all year but despite it this being rock bottom he has definitely played better than the beginning of the season. I don't see the value in trading him right now unless you can get a real legitimate piece back to replace him... which won't happen.

 

[Ace]

The most likely scenario is they keep him, he sucks, but then had a week where pucks go in and people attempt victory laps….and then he goes back to not producing and maintaining his suck. He will be moved long after most teams were calling.

One day he will win a Cup as a third line winger and people will blame the team for the wrong thing. Moving him instead of ever pretending he was a center…in the top six no less.

Bottom line is…I’m on to the next group. The question is do I want them insulated with Dylan Cozens or what I can get back for Dylan Cozens?

He will never be a part of a successful core here. Especially making 7 million on a team that won’t spend to the cap.

Need to know the offers…but I know where I lean.