Prospect Info: The 2021 NHL Entry Draft Thread

[Whileee]

Boss's kid went to Okanagan hockey school and Rink hockey academy here in Winnipeg. I think it's like 50k a year. I think the player is undrafted and playing in the MJHL now? Better than me lol.

This is probably the best route to trying to playing pro even though the chances are slim.

If you look at most pro's elite prospects page a lot of them have gone to one of these "hockey schools".

I think I'll just get my kid to play baseball or something lol.

I have a friend/colleague who was a convener of a local community club, and he often had to mediate disputes between parents and coaches about playing time, linemates, etc. His standard line was that in each age group, on average maybe 1 or 2 hockey players might make the NHL, so unless your son was one of the top few players in his age group in the province, maybe best to focus on hockey as recreation rather than as a lucrative career.

I played a few sports through my teen years, but by high school I had to make a decision between higher level hockey vs. high school basketball. I chose basketball because it was a school sport and I could play with school friends, with a crowd full of girls from our high school. I continued to play hockey at a lower level, and still play recreationally. I continued to play basketball recreationally for a number of years until an old knee injury caught up with me. My point is that I think we need more school-based hockey options, not just in high school.

 

[Buffdog]

Great read that puts things in perspective. My son (who played against Lambos at 8, 9 and 10) wasn't going anywhere in hockey and ended up among high school. My daughter (finishing grade 10) is likely ending up a with a scholarship somewhere.

I was lucky to see the ugly side of crazy hockey parents and politics with my son. It kept me grounded with my daughter, who has always been a special player. It also led me to get involved with the minor hockey board to try to temper the crazies. I'd come home from some of those meetings and want to kick my dog.

From this book... only 1/6 of the top 5 picks in the bantam WHL draft go on to have an average NHL career. On average, a parent invests $330,000 in their kids hockey development. So few players make a living doing it that you'd be better off buying Lotto 649 tickets with that cash if you think a career or scholarship is the goal.

That said, every penny I've invested in my kids hockey has been worth it to me. They've made friends, learned how to work on a team, etc.

 

[ps241]

I have a friend/colleague who was a convener of a local community club, and he often had to mediate disputes between parents and coaches about playing time, linemates, etc. His standard line was that in each age group, on average maybe 1 or 2 hockey players might make the NHL, so unless your son was one of the top few players in his age group in the province, maybe best to focus on hockey as recreation rather than as a lucrative career.

I played a few sports through my teen years, but by high school I had to make a decision between higher level hockey vs. high school basketball. I chose basketball because it was a school sport and I could play with school friends, with a crowd full of girls from our high school. I continued to play hockey at a lower level, and still play recreationally. I continued to play basketball recreationally for a number of years until an old knee injury caught up with me. My point is that I think we need more school-based hockey options, not just in high school.

The biggest advantage I had was neither of my kids (boy and girl) were born elite at hockey nor did they have a burning desire early on and their mom and dad didn't need to live out our dreams through them. When your kid laces up for Timbits and he (or she) is one of the best couple of players on the ice you get dropped on a treadmill and its tough to not let gravity take effect. When your kid is not good and also decides to try goaltending for two seasons then it becomes just an activity to have fun at. Honestly its a different situation to manage as a parent when your kid plays in the shittiest league (A3). Do they get teased at school, how is their self esteem etc. When my son hit 10 a few of his buddies on his team made the jump from the shittiest division to the middle division and my son came to me and said "Dad I want to get better at hockey this season". That was an interesting process because he had a goal for the first time in his life. We spent time talking about what goals are. Then I said Max do you want your dad to help you with your plan to hit your goal? He wanted my help and since that day my son has been a different person. Hockey has been really convenient tool to teach my son about the power of goal setting, building a plan, working extremely hard to achieve it (way more drive than his dad had at that age), and the gratification of success. That process led him to setting academic goals and achieving them too, its also led him to believe that you can accomplish allot with a plan and hard work. Watching him discover and master this critical life skill has been immensely gratifying for me as a dad and I have hockey to thank for it.

With Hockey or any sport for kids there is a massive value proposition at all skill levels in, fitness, success, failure, team work, FUN, and making great friendships. The key I believe as a parent is to enjoy the journey at any level. Have fun because its going to be a short ride and you don't want to miss the gift by spending time consumed by negative emotions like delusions of grandeur, envy, jealousy, anger, or worst of all embarrassment with your kids. I will have succeeded as a parent if both my kids look back at their time in sports with a smile on their face and no regrets.

 

[Daximus]

Great read that puts things in perspective. My son (who played against Lambos at 8, 9 and 10) wasn't going anywhere in hockey and ended up among high school. My daughter (finishing grade 10) is likely ending up a with a scholarship somewhere.
View attachment 447328
I was lucky to see the ugly side of crazy hockey parents and politics with my son. It kept me grounded with my daughter, who has always been a special player. It also led me to get involved with the minor hockey board to try to temper the crazies. I'd come home from some of those meetings and want to kick my dog.

From this book... only 1/6 of the top 5 picks in the bantam WHL draft go on to have an average NHL career. On average, a parent invests $330,000 in their kids hockey development. So few players make a living doing it that you'd be better off buying Lotto 649 tickets with that cash if you think a career or scholarship is the goal.

That said, every penny I've invested in my kids hockey has been worth it to me. They've made friends, learned how to work on a team, etc.

There is something be said for WHL though. I know a few people that played 4 years and got some schooling payed for. But at that point just save your money and pay for their schooling.

 

[surixon]

The biggest advantage I had was neither of my kids (boy and girl) were born elite at hockey nor did they have a burning desire early on and their mom and dad didn't need to live out our dreams through them. When your kid laces up for Timbits and he (or she) is one of the best couple of players on the ice you get dropped on a treadmill and its tough to not let gravity take effect. When your kid is not good and also decides to try goaltending for two seasons then it becomes just an activity to have fun at. Honestly its a different situation to manage as a parent when your kid plays in the shittiest league (A3). Do they get teased at school, how is their self esteem etc. When my son hit 10 a few of his buddies on his team made the jump from the shittiest division to the middle division and my son came to me and said "Dad I want to get better at hockey this season". That was an interesting process because he had a goal for the first time in his life. We spent time talking about what goals are. Then I said Max do you want your dad to help you with your plan to hit your goal? He wanted my help and since that day my son has been a different person. Hockey has been really convenient tool to teach my son about the power of goal setting, building a plan, working extremely hard to achieve it (way more drive than his dad had at that age), and the gratification of success. That process led him to setting academic goals and achieving them too, its also led him to believe that you can accomplish allot with a plan and hard work. Watching him discover and master this critical life skill has been immensely gratifying for me as a dad and I have hockey to thank for it.

With Hockey or any sport for kids there is a massive value proposition at all skill levels in, fitness, success, failure, team work, FUN, and making great friendships. The key I believe as a parent is to enjoy the journey at any level. Have fun because its going to be a short ride and you don't want to miss the gift by spending time consumed by negative emotions like delusions of grandeur, envy, jealousy, anger, or worst of all embarrassment with your kids. I will have succeeded as a parent if both my kids look back at their time in sports with a smile on their face and no regrets.

The fact that your kid has learned that at age 10 is awesome. Having that tool in his pocket will serve him well in life.

 

[Buffdog]

The biggest advantage I had was neither of my kids (boy and girl) were born elite at hockey nor did they have a burning desire early on and their mom and dad didn't need to live out our dreams through them. When your kid laces up for Timbits and he (or she) is one of the best couple of players on the ice you get dropped on a treadmill and its tough to not let gravity take effect. When your kid is not good and also decides to try goaltending for two seasons then it becomes just an activity to have fun at. Honestly its a different situation to manage as a parent when your kid plays in the shittiest league (A3). Do they get teased at school, how is their self esteem etc. When my son hit 10 a few of his buddies on his team made the jump from the shittiest division to the middle division and my son came to me and said "Dad I want to get better at hockey this season". That was an interesting process because he had a goal for the first time in his life. We spent time talking about what goals are. Then I said Max do you want your dad to help you with your plan to hit your goal? He wanted my help and since that day my son has been a different person. Hockey has been really convenient tool to teach my son about the power of goal setting, building a plan, working extremely hard to achieve it (way more drive than his dad had at that age), and the gratification of success. That process led him to setting academic goals and achieving them too, its also led him to believe that you can accomplish allot with a plan and hard work. Watching him discover and master this critical life skill has been immensely gratifying for me as a dad and I have hockey to thank for it.

With Hockey or any sport for kids there is a massive value proposition at all skill levels in, fitness, success, failure, team work, FUN, and making great friendships. The key I believe as a parent is to enjoy the journey at any level. Have fun because its going to be a short ride and you don't want to miss the gift by spending time consumed by negative emotions like delusions of grandeur, envy, jealousy, anger, or worst of all embarrassment with your kids. I will have succeeded as a parent if both my kids look back at their time in sports with a smile on their face and no regrets.

That's awesome. My kid learned in the opposite way.

He played A1 at 8, 9 and 10. He was the last kid cut from AA at 11. He cried, and said he wanted to make the team the next year. I told him I'd buy him pucks and a net and set it up in the driveway for him to practice his shot - but I WOULDN'T tell him to go do it. It had to be up to him.

He never shot pucks and got cut again. He cried again. Lather, rinse, repeat. Never shot pucks, always got cut. Lesson: you ain't gonna get anything in life for free, you have to work for it.

He still ended up having a blast playing high school hockey and went on to play a meaningful roll on his team as a grade 11 when they won cities.

 

[Mortimer Snerd]

Great read that puts things in perspective. My son (who played against Lambos at 8, 9 and 10) wasn't going anywhere in hockey and ended up among high school. My daughter (finishing grade 10) is likely ending up a with a scholarship somewhere.
View attachment 447328
I was lucky to see the ugly side of crazy hockey parents and politics with my son. It kept me grounded with my daughter, who has always been a special player. It also led me to get involved with the minor hockey board to try to temper the crazies. I'd come home from some of those meetings and want to kick my dog.

From this book... only 1/6 of the top 5 picks in the bantam WHL draft go on to have an average NHL career. On average, a parent invests $330,000 in their kids hockey development. So few players make a living doing it that you'd be better off buying Lotto 649 tickets with that cash if you think a career or scholarship is the goal.

That said, every penny I've invested in my kids hockey has been worth it to me. They've made friends, learned how to work on a team, etc.

Re: your last statement, they would have gained those same things playing HS or rec league hockey.

I'm glad that you are happy with the return on your investment, but it really should not be necessary.

 

[ps241]

That's awesome. My kid learned in the opposite way.

He played A1 at 8, 9 and 10. He was the last kid cut from AA at 11. He cried, and said he wanted to make the team the next year. I told him I'd buy him pucks and a net and set it up in the driveway for him to practice his shot - but I WOULDN'T tell him to go do it. It had to be up to him.

He never shot pucks and got cut again. He cried again. Lather, rinse, repeat. Never shot pucks, always got cut. Lesson: you ain't gonna get anything in life for free, you have to work for it.

He still ended up having a blast playing high school hockey and went on to play a meaningful roll on his team as a grade 11 when they won cities.

Good story and also a chance to learn. When you have that gift of talent and are the last cut of AA it must be tough. Also cool you provided the tools but left it up to him. Did you ever review it with him after the cuts or did you just leave it?

Pretty cool your son had a chance to contribute as a grade 11 to a HS championship. That’s something you always remember. That’s really good hockey too.

 

[Buffdog]

Good story and also a chance to learn. When you have that gift of talent and are the last cut of AA it must be tough. Also cool you provided the tools but left it up to him. Did you ever review it with him after the cuts or did you just leave it?

Pretty cool your son had a chance to contribute as a grade 11 to a HS championship. That’s something you always remember. That’s really good hockey too.

We'd sit down after he got cut each year and talk about why and what he'd have to work on to give himself a chance the next year. He's a hard worker who wasn't a great skater. I never wanted to be the crazy dad who lived vicariously through him. I had my run as a a AAA player and played a bit of junior/shitty college but I always marveled at how even the elite of the elite at my age group hardly got a sniff at the show. It was clear he wasn't going anywhere. Ultimately I wanted him to work on his game for the right reasons - because HE wanted to, not because I forced him to.

I often look back at the guys I played with growing up and how many DON'T play anymore because they got burnt out and pushed too hard by their parents. I vowed to never be that guy. My only goal for my kids was that someday they'd still be playing with their friends in shitty adult leagues for the fun of it (regardless of what they achieved earlier in their careers). The only way for someone to fail as a hockey parent is to make the experience so unenjoyable for your kid that they don't want to play anymore.

 

[Bob E]

I wonder what the Jets think about Corson Ceulemans?

 

[GJF]

Great read that puts things in perspective. My son (who played against Lambos at 8, 9 and 10) wasn't going anywhere in hockey and ended up among high school. My daughter (finishing grade 10) is likely ending up a with a scholarship somewhere.
View attachment 447328
I was lucky to see the ugly side of crazy hockey parents and politics with my son. It kept me grounded with my daughter, who has always been a special player. It also led me to get involved with the minor hockey board to try to temper the crazies. I'd come home from some of those meetings and want to kick my dog.

From this book... only 1/6 of the top 5 picks in the bantam WHL draft go on to have an average NHL career. On average, a parent invests $330,000 in their kids hockey development. So few players make a living doing it that you'd be better off buying Lotto 649 tickets with that cash if you think a career or scholarship is the goal.

That said, every penny I've invested in my kids hockey has been worth it to me. They've made friends, learned how to work on a team, etc.

The biggest advantage I had was neither of my kids (boy and girl) were born elite at hockey nor did they have a burning desire early on and their mom and dad didn't need to live out our dreams through them. When your kid laces up for Timbits and he (or she) is one of the best couple of players on the ice you get dropped on a treadmill and its tough to not let gravity take effect. When your kid is not good and also decides to try goaltending for two seasons then it becomes just an activity to have fun at. Honestly its a different situation to manage as a parent when your kid plays in the shittiest league (A3). Do they get teased at school, how is their self esteem etc. When my son hit 10 a few of his buddies on his team made the jump from the shittiest division to the middle division and my son came to me and said "Dad I want to get better at hockey this season". That was an interesting process because he had a goal for the first time in his life. We spent time talking about what goals are. Then I said Max do you want your dad to help you with your plan to hit your goal? He wanted my help and since that day my son has been a different person. Hockey has been really convenient tool to teach my son about the power of goal setting, building a plan, working extremely hard to achieve it (way more drive than his dad had at that age), and the gratification of success. That process led him to setting academic goals and achieving them too, its also led him to believe that you can accomplish allot with a plan and hard work. Watching him discover and master this critical life skill has been immensely gratifying for me as a dad and I have hockey to thank for it.

With Hockey or any sport for kids there is a massive value proposition at all skill levels in, fitness, success, failure, team work, FUN, and making great friendships. The key I believe as a parent is to enjoy the journey at any level. Have fun because its going to be a short ride and you don't want to miss the gift by spending time consumed by negative emotions like delusions of grandeur, envy, jealousy, anger, or worst of all embarrassment with your kids. I will have succeeded as a parent if both my kids look back at their time in sports with a smile on their face and no regrets.

Thank you two for those interesting takes!

 

[mazmin]

Based on the last 3 pages of this thread I'm going to predict the top 3 picks in the 2021 NHL entry Draft:

#1OA: son of a trust fundee, who was the son of a trust fundee, who was the son of old money in the old world

#2OA: son of a bankster who manages offshore tax havens; a future player agent

#3OA: son of an over tanned baby boomer dot com millionaire, on his third or fourth marriage

 

[trebendan]

I wonder what the Jets think about Corson Ceulemans?

I'm guessing they like him but I'm also guessing they like Scott Morrow even more. He's got good size, he's from Minnesota and he's going to U.S. college to play hockey (just like Samberg).

 

[trebendan]

In addition, the Hockey News draft preview states Cuelemans best case (NHL comparable) is Justin Schultz. For Morrow, it is John Carlson and for Carson Lambos, it is Dan Hamhuis.

 

[Bob E]

In addition, the Hockey News draft preview states Cuelemans best case (NHL comparable) is Justin Schultz. For Morrow, it is John Carlson and for Carson Lambos, it is Dan Hamhuis.

Then I’m picking Morrow.

 

[jimsabo21]

Regarding the cost of hockey, I'll say there's lots of sensationalism in this thread.

Yes, hockey can be very expensive, but that's the exception, not the norm.

My son is on Team Manitoba Brick which is the highest level you can play as a 10 year old. He was also age advanced into U11 A1 hockey as a 9 year old. This is what a typical year would look like for him (all in) in terms of fees, camps, etc.

Club Level Winter Hockey
APHA (Assiniboine Park Hockey Association) Winterhawks A1
$600 APHA Registration
$1000 Team Fees (ice, tournaments, etc)
Total Ice Time - 48 hrs practice, 18 league games, two tournaments (8 extra games)

Team Manitoba Brick -
$4500
50 hrs of practice ice, 2 local tournaments, Brick Invitational Tournament Edmonton
JP Vigier as head coach

* All other AAA spring teams registration is $2000 or less. Only Team MB Brick practices 50 hrs

Additional Development Winter
Many kids will practice an extra session or two above their winter team practices. This might add up to an extra $400-$600 per winter

Summer Camps - $350/week
The most *elite* kids I know might do two or three weeks of hockey camps (one in July, last two weeks of August)
$700-$1000/ summer

Typical Year for my son (most you can possibly pay): $7500
Winter Club Season + Team MB Brick Spring + 3 weeks Summer Camps (one week July, two weeks end August)
Total Hours on Ice: 180-200

2000 Registered Hockey Players per age group. Only the top 15 can even be selected to play Team MB Brick. There are only two other AAA spring teams per age group. Then you have open division spring hockey ($1500 per child).

In summary, if you are under 12 years old:

2000 registered hockey kids - $1600 for winter
50% (1000 kids) will play winter only - so $1600 to play hockey
40% (800 kids) will play winter AND do a week summer camp - so $2000 / season
9% (180 kids) will play winter, spring and do two weeks of summer camps - so $3500/season
1% (15 kids) will play winter, elite spring and three weeks of summer camps - so $7500 / season

Once you reach Bantam, RHA (Rink Hockey Academy) becomes an option for the super elite (1%). This is $25,000 per year. At most, you can play 4 seasons of RHA hockey. If you played all four years RHA ($100,000) and all your previous seasons for $7000 each (actually impossible to spend that much as a 5/6/7/8 year old), that would be an insane $150,000 on hockey. Again, this would be for the 1% only, and even that is an near impossible number. How you could possibly spend 700K, I don't know unless all your ice is private training ($200 / hr for a sheet), but even NHL players books as groups in summer, so can't imagine any kid renting out sheets for themselves as a primary method of improvement.

So yes absolutely hockey is expensive, but 90% of kids play for $2000 or less per year. If you're elite, you certainly don't have to join RHA. Cody Glass was a 1st round pick, chose not to play RHA and stuck with AAA Thrashers, then jumped to WHL.

My two cents only, but very much living in this world right now ...

 

[jimsabo21]

Of the players that *could* still be around for the Jets 17th pick (due to AZ forfeit), this is who I hope we get:

1. Logan Stankoven
2. Cole Sillenger
3. Isak Rosen
4. Chaz Lucius
5. Mackie Samoskevich
6. Aatu Raty
7. Carson Lambos
8. Matt Coronato

2nd Round (50th pick)

1. Scott Morrow
2. Nikita Chibrikov
3. Ville Koivunen

 

[Dirty30]

Would Zachary L’Heureux be someone the Jets May be interested in drafting? Button used Brad Marchand as a comparable. They have had a player that could consistently get under the skin of the opposition on a regular basis, besides Lemieux. L’Heuruex sounds like he has a bit more skilled though.

 

[surixon]

Would Zachary L’Heureux be someone the Jets May be interested in drafting? Button used Brad Marchand as a comparable. They have had a player that could consistently get under the skin of the opposition on a regular basis, besides Lemieux. L’Heuruex sounds like he has a bit more skilled though.

He's definitely on my radar the more I hear about him.

 

[Whileee]

Would Zachary L’Heureux be someone the Jets May be interested in drafting? Button used Brad Marchand as a comparable. They have had a player that could consistently get under the skin of the opposition on a regular basis, besides Lemieux. L’Heuruex sounds like he has a bit more skilled though.

Well, L'Heureux is a real agitator, but has a reputation for going over the line. He had 4 suspensions in one season in the QMJHL, including one for spitting in the face of an opponent. To be honest, I'm not all that enthusiastic about bringing in a player with a screw loose, or two.

 

[Whileee]

Anyone interested in Aatu Raty? He's had a strange trajectory, from top-end prospect to mid to late first round enigma.

He certainly has some very good tools, but really hasn't put it together. In some ways he's the "anti-Lundell" prospect. He seems to have a lot of tools that Lundell supposedly lacked, but Lundell had the toolbox and productivity.

I'm fairly skeptical, but always hoping the Jets can hit a home run from a lowish spot.

 

[snowkiddin]

Anyone interested in Aatu Raty? He's had a strange trajectory, from top-end prospect to mid to late first round enigma.

He certainly has some very good tools, but really hasn't put it together. In some ways he's the "anti-Lundell" prospect. He seems to have a lot of tools that Lundell supposedly lacked, but Lundell had the toolbox and productivity.

I'm fairly skeptical, but always hoping the Jets can hit a home run from a lowish spot.

If Lambos and Ceulemans are both gone than I’d take a swing at Raty (unless a team offers us some decent draft capital to move back in the first round).

 

[Gabe Kupari]

95 percent of the mocks I've seen including buttons I believe has us taking Corson Ceulemans. Perhaps the next Cale Makar. I'm fine with that.

Who says no. Dubois and 17 to Anaheim for Manson and 3rd overall.

Then take Brandt Clarke.

 

[Channelcat]

95 percent of the mocks I've seen including buttons I believe has us taking Corson Ceulemans. Perhaps the next Cale Makar. I'm fine with that.

Who says no. Dubois and 17 to Anaheim for Manson and 3rd overall.

Then take Brandt Clarke.

I'd be happy to move PLD to move into the top 3. Haven't watched Manson for a good while though, so can't comment on that.

 

[surixon]

I'd be happy to move PLD to move into the top 3. Haven't watched Manson for a good while though, so can't comment on that.

Manson wouldn't wave to come hear at the deadline and won't wave now. It's a moot point.