Post-Game Talk: Stolarz & Marner Steal a Point - Leafs lose 4-3

[Matthews4Calder]

How is that the Leafs after playing 6 physical, tight defensively responsible games in a row just stop playing that way? PP woes aside, they don’t even resemble the team from last Monday. This is the ninth season for the core group of four including Rielly and seventh including Tavares and it’s groundhog year all over again. Teams have a game plan to defend their perimeter PP and know if they play hard enough at both ends of the ice, the Leafs will cough up scoring chances and their star players will not be willing to forecheck hard or go to the net to score dirty goals. It’s a mystery how Shanahan believes his overpaid core group has the will or the guts to play the way they need to make a deep playoff run. Berube is in for a long season of watching these ballerinas.


And 61% if you include Rielly. That’s a lot of money spent on offense that doesn’t show up a lot of nights.

Totally with you. Been saying it for years now how much does management have to see to figure out this core doesn't have it. Same song and dance. All of management should have been shown the door when Dubas left. Said part is with these NMC's they are kinda handcuffed. We are going to give Mitch more money or lose him for nothing. I said it way back we were screwed when Dubas gave 16 & 34 the contracts after coming out of their entry level contracts. Caving to Nylander after holding out and we just keep on giving. They dont have what it takes to make a run. First few games we looked good but now I'm thinking where would we be without Stolarz? I think you're bang on it's going to be a long season for Berube. Didn't care for his or Matthews post game especially Matthews who only touched on they got a big point but he f'd up with a pee wee play in OT.

 

[Ports]

JT was horrible from beginning to end, outside 2 decent shifts. Robertson was carrying him all night long and actually took a penalty because he was making up for John's inability to execute.

Matthews was the most dangerous player on the ice, but made 2 glaring defensive mistakes. His attention to detail is maddening right now. He's a microcosm for the whole team.

Marner made some nice east/west passes, played good on the PK and didn't bring much else. Invisible for LARGE stretches of the game. It also seems like his skating isn't as crisp as it used to be.

Nylander was horrible from beginning to end. Incredibly sloppy. Domi had his first bad game of the season too. McMann was pretty bad also. So yeah, the 2nd line sucked.

Stolarz is the man, excellent game. Best Leaf and outdid Swayman, which is why the leafs got a point.

Reilly was a mess all night and OEL had to pick up that garbage. Morgan is not making the end of that contract. He might be one bad injury away from being finished.

This game had no passion from either team. f***ing awful

Still say Rielly should have been traded after his 20 goal season. Dubas signing him for 8 years with a full NMC was a panic move and doubling down on their soft, perimeter game. That and signing Tavares are decisions that tied their hands. They’ve got a chance this offseason to make up for some of that by changing some of their core pieces but re-signing Rielly to play on their top pair was a decision that will haunt them for years to come.

 

[Roo]

Marner throwing bodychecks was something.. so rare, like seeing the northern lights

 

[Ports]

Totally with you. Been saying it for years now how much does management have to see to figure out this core doesn't have it. Same song and dance. All of management should have been shown the door when Dubas left. Said part is with these NMC's they are kinda handcuffed. We are going to give Mitch more money or lose him for nothing. I said it way back we were screwed when Dubas gave 16 & 34 the contracts after coming out of their entry level contracts. Caving to Nylander after holding out and we just keep on giving. They dont have what it takes to make a run. First few games we looked good but now I'm thinking where would we be without Stolarz? I think you're bang on it's going to be a long season for Berube. Didn't care for his or Matthews post game especially Matthews who only touched on they got a big point but he f'd up with a pee wee play in OT.

No on ice leadership from their so-called star players is a big problem. Lack of experience, courage and vision from top management is a bigger problem. They’ve had eight years to see what does and doesn’t work when it comes to contending for a cup. Shanahan and Dubas didn’t have a clue but were so arrogant they kept doubling down. JT’s done and Marner’s money needs to be spent elsewhere. Even if they’ve got the balls to let them walk, can a team led by Matthews, Nylander and Rielly ever win a cup ? I have my doubts that it’s fixable.

 

[ACC1224]

Then I guess it will be something that needs to be monitored throughout the season, with the amount of minutes they, Matthews especially, also play on the PK.

Definitely but it’s easy for a coach to revert back in game.
Best solution IMO, is to limit the PK time.

 

[ULF_55]

Hosting a party didn't have a chance to watch.
Just watched the condensed game on NHL.com.
Looked like it might have been a good game to watch.

Stolarz looked like he held them in for half the game.
Little m, with 3 apples.
And

 

[ACC1224]

Marner throwing bodychecks was something.. so rare, like seeing the northern lights

Yeah he dialed it up a bit more last night for sure.
Was surprised to se he had more hits and shots than Matthews

 

[rumman]

We have 50% of our cap in forwards and we can't score lol

It’ll never work, but keep running it back Shanahan and company. Stupid stupid stupid……..

How is that the Leafs after playing 6 physical, tight defensively responsible games in a row just stop playing that way? PP woes aside, they don’t even resemble the team from last Monday. This is the ninth season for the core group of four including Rielly and seventh including Tavares and it’s groundhog year all over again. Teams have a game plan to defend their perimeter PP and know if they play hard enough at both ends of the ice, the Leafs will cough up scoring chances and their star players will not be willing to forecheck hard or go to the net to score dirty goals. It’s a mystery how Shanahan believes his overpaid core group has the will or the guts to play the way they need to make a deep playoff run. Berube is in for a long season of watching these ballerinas.


And 61% if you include Rielly. That’s a lot of money spent on offense that doesn’t show up a lot of nights.

Not worth the squeeze, very little juice……

 

[Ports]

Last night, but I didn't see that vs STL or CLB. Last night looked like a game that meant more to them

By tight I mean playing scared to lose. Until Matthews scored in the third, they had like three shots on goal. That doesn’t show me a lot of heart.

 

[rumman]

Berube isn’t going to change who they are. No coach is.
You aren’t going to suddenly turn a sheep into a wolf or make Tavares and Marner skate like McDavid. No coach is.

Berube can put a new system in place and hold players accountable, but as a coach you have to try and win with what the players are and not what you want them to be. They aren’t going to play like Toews/Crosby/Tkachuk/etc. They are passive and can’t sustain for long periods. You have to coach Thornton and Marleau players. That’s what the 4 are.

Eight games in and they’ve abandoned the plan, it’s too much work, only a matter of time. Before they ruin Knies……

 

[Blanka]

Totally with you. Been saying it for years now how much does management have to see to figure out this core doesn't have it. Same song and dance. All of management should have been shown the door when Dubas left. Said part is with these NMC's they are kinda handcuffed. We are going to give Mitch more money or lose him for nothing. I said it way back we were screwed when Dubas gave 16 & 34 the contracts after coming out of their entry level contracts. Caving to Nylander after holding out and we just keep on giving. They dont have what it takes to make a run. First few games we looked good but now I'm thinking where would we be without Stolarz? I think you're bang on it's going to be a long season for Berube. Didn't care for his or Matthews post game especially Matthews who only touched on they got a big point but he f'd up with a pee wee play in OT.

TBH I don't think it would be that big of a deal if we did indeed let Marner go for nothing. I've heard several GM's on multiple occasions state that they rate these factors in this order: 1. cap space, 2. draft picks, 3. re-signing players, 4. free agents. Trying to sign Marner will no doubt include a NMC which will handcuff this club even more. Just let him walk, get the space and hopefully replace the production with some new signings/internally. Who knows? The bonus might actually be PLAYOFF production other than games 1 and 2 of the first round. *Bracing for feces to be thrown at my face

 

[Stephen]

No on ice leadership from their so-called star players is a big problem. Lack of experience, courage and vision from top management is a bigger problem. They’ve had eight years to see what does and doesn’t work when it comes to contending for a cup. Shanahan and Dubas didn’t have a clue but were so arrogant they kept doubling down. JT’s done and Marner’s money needs to be spent elsewhere. Even if they’ve got the balls to let them walk, can a team led by Matthews, Nylander and Rielly ever win a cup ? I have my doubts that it’s fixable.

The long term problem I'm seeing with Auston Matthews is he has no defined personality as the team alpha dog and that is enhanced in his role as captain this season.

If only he were wired to be the guy who crosschecked Rasmus Dahlin, I think you'd at least have trust in a fiery leader. But note all the suboptimal on ice everytime there's trouble. Getting roughed up and targeted by guys like Konecny, Stamkos, Chiarot, no point of pride in sticking up for yourself, let alone teammates. Historically that tells me he's not really in the fight, and can be pushed out by anyone who wants to elevate emotional hostility as a weapon. The multi season project to bring more snarl, snot, bite, size, veteran leadership all seems to be compensating for something. Furthermore, if your leader doesn't have the fight, it seems to dial down the emotional response of everyone else.

 

[crump]

Hero to goat in a matter of minutes. How many times that will happen to 34? Yes, not too often is the correct answer . File this one away as witnessing oddball history.

Maybe a struggle for wildcard spot is what this team needs to be humming in time for the playoffs. Could they be last at Christmas and still win the cup? Hellz yes. This coach even did it. It’s all in the plan brothers and sisters. Lol.

I’m just not invested in games until they count. Either win or blow it up at the end of the season .

 

[All Mod Cons]

Did Robertson just give up after the preseason?

 

[rumman]

Myers’ debut was good, very physical, no nonsense player. Stolarz, Knies, OEL and Tanev are fighters. The rest are meh.

Completely agree, Myers is better than Timmins, way better than Lilly, I’d shop both with Rifai as a option for call up……

They do. They absolutely kill it come contract negotiation time. They’d make Leatherface afraid.

Indeed…..

I would add zero guts to engage opponents physically. Soft, soft, soft.

Nylander and Marner both avoid contact to retrieve the puck on s regular basis, that will never change……

 

[Stephen]

Did Robertson just give up after the preseason?

Robertson doesn't look very good. On almost every play he's involved in he looks super dialed in and working extremely hard but then you realize it's probably because the game is very hard for him.

 

[Gallagbi]

By tight I mean playing scared to lose. Until Matthews scored in the third, they had like three shots on goal. That doesn’t show me a lot of heart.

So do I, that's been their reputation in big games. Last night was one

 

[Stephen]

Completely agree, Myers is better than Timmins, way better than Lilly, I’d shop both with Rifai as a option for call up……

I thought Myers looked shaky at times and quiet and basic at others. The quieter he plays the better he'll be.

 

[ULF_55]

A similar play happened the other night.

I think Flyers - Capitals.

This goal.

Philadelphia Flyers - Washington Capitals - Oct 23, 2024 | NHL.com

NHL Gamecenter - Philadelphia Flyers vs. Washington Capitals, Oct 23, 2024 - summary, stats, boxscore, play by play, recap and more.

www.nhl.com

Player passed to a player leaving the ice, with an empty net.

 

[Ports]

The long term problem I'm seeing with Auston Matthews is he has no defined personality as the team alpha dog and that is enhanced in his role as captain this season.

If only he were wired to be the guy who crosschecked Rasmus Dahlin, I think you'd at least have trust in a fiery leader. But note all the suboptimal on ice everytime there's trouble. Getting roughed up and targeted by guys like Konecny, Stamkos, Chiarot, no point of pride in sticking up for yourself, let alone teammates. Historically that tells me he's not really in the fight, and can be pushed out by anyone who wants to elevate emotional hostility as a weapon. The multi season project to bring more snarl, snot, bite, size, veteran leadership all seems to be compensating for something. Furthermore, if your leader doesn't have the fight, it seems to dial down the emotional response of everyone else.

Bang on. No fight in the Dog who wears the C and is the highest paid player in the league. I’ve been watching the Leafs for 60 years and I’ve actually never seen a more timid on ice demeanor. He’s got a lot of things going for him but lacking the courage to stand up for himself or his teammates has a big effect on the rest of the team. And the same can be said for Marner and Nylander. Star players still need some snarl. Look at players like Pasternak, Kutcherov, Point, MacKinnon, Mcdavid, Crosby and Draisaitl. They all get their noses dirty, respond to challenges and back up their teammates. Shanahan was delusional thinking that wasn’t still an important part of the game.

 

[rumman]

Marner throwing bodychecks was something.. so rare, like seeing the northern lights

I missed both…….

Hosting a party didn't have a chance to watch.
Just watched the condensed game on NHL.com.
Looked like it might have been a good game to watch.

Stolarz looked like he held them in for half the game.
Little m, with 3 apples.
And
View attachment 922383

 

[AvroArrow]

Another meaningless game. Playoffs are the only thing that matters

We are absolute dog shit though

Are we even in a playoff spot currently ?

 

[Ports]

So do I, that's been their reputation in big games. Last night was one

That’s a big problem isn’t it. They don’t get up for lesser opponents and don’t have the guts to win the big games. They’re not a properly built team. That needs to change this off season.

 

[rumman]

I thought Myers looked shaky at times and quiet and basic at others. The quieter he plays the better he'll be.

He, like Benny keeps his game simple, I thought he was very steady, it wasn’t his fault McMann gave the ouck away on that goal……

 

[Dayjobdave]

Bang on. No fight in the Dog who wears the C and is the highest paid player in the league. I’ve been watching the Leafs for 60 years and I’ve actually never seen a more timid on ice demeanor. He’s got a lot of things going for him but lacking the courage to stand up for himself or his teammates has a big effect on the rest of the team. And the same can be said for Marner and Nylander. Star players still need some snarl. Look at players like Pasternak, Kutcherov, Point, MacKinnon, Mcdavid, Crosby and Draisaitl. They all get their noses dirty, respond to challenges and back up their teammates. Shanahan was delusional thinking that wasn’t still an important part of the game.

We need to inject Domi's snarl and competitiveness into Auston's body.