Stevens and Nachbaur Fired

[Raccoon Jesus]

That’s not the issue, the players wanted Stevens and he lasted a little over a season. We’re going to have 4 coaches in 3 seasons.

At what point do players become held accountable?

1. your math is putrid.

2. I'm sure they're now doing what we've talked about all along--gotten a new coach and now it's put up or shut up time. With respect to this season, I don't expect Blake to make trades when guys are at their all-time low values, hence the new coach for evaluation and moves.

I'm with you on that though, I want whoever was whining about getting called out on effort shuttled to the moon, even if it's Doughty.

 

[kingsfan28]

I can't tell if you are serious or not, Robitaille, 30 yearss + in the game, Blake, 30+ years in the game, if those aren't knowledgeable hockey ops guys, I don't know what is, now they might have a different vision, different ideas than you, but holy ****.....to they aren't knowledgeable about the game, about what it takes to play at that level, to succeed at that level, what characteristics to look out for, what can be taught, what can't be taught, that's just...self-absorbed hubris...

I get it, a lot of you guys don't like Blake for what he did as a player, or don't like Luc because of whatever...but holy **** batman, talk about not giving guys a chance

I see the Kings caught in outdated style trying to transition to a new NHL. They didn't see it coming [which DL, the all knowing, smartest guy in the room ignored] and weren't prepared for it, the way others have. Hell, DL called the whole fast NHL just a fad and that heavy hockey can still win. Rob and Luc are caught in the mess and know it will take a while to fix.

 

[Sol]

It's Christmas for me baby!!!









So I know the narrative here is the players are coach killers, but look around the league: Longest tenured coach is Q, and probably not for long--but he's been there for a decade now. Clear outlier. Cooper has been in TB since 2013--5 years. Maurice in WPG and Laviolette in NSH--4 years. everyone else is 3 years or sooner. Median tenure right now is 2 years. 1/3 of the league's coaches have been hired between the start of last year and now.

Coaches are hired to be fired and lets stop acting like this is abnormal.





Let's also be fair and recognize some of these things aren't able to be managed around in a sense. You can't replace some of those players and we talked about it all along; it's easy to get a player 'better' than Stoll or Greene or Mitchell, but you can't 'replace' them if that makes sense. over the course of a couple of years, those are assets we lost for nothing--Stoll, Williams, Regehr, Greene, Voynov, Mitchell, even Richards--retired or moved on. Maybe he didn't adapt, but also maybe he couldn't, since those guys are products of a different era and neither that type of player nor era exists right now.

This is why I'm big on vision and identity and that was my big issue with Stevens (and right now until I see otherwise, Blake and Luc too).

I don't disagree and can't say how I would do if I saw the boys every day and knew them personally so my opinion is only good as an outsiders could be. I do truly feel like he made some significant errors, but it's in the past. We got two cups. Time to move on.


Hope Blake turns this around. Will know how serious he is as a GM by the end of the year and how the staff looks.

 

[DryIslandBartender]

I can't tell if you are serious or not, Robitaille, 30 yearss + in the game, Blake, 30+ years in the game, if those aren't knowledgeable hockey ops guys, I don't know what is, now they might have a different vision, different ideas than you, but holy ****.....to they aren't knowledgeable about the game, about what it takes to play at that level, to succeed at that level, what characteristics to look out for, what can be taught, what can't be taught, that's just...self-absorbed hubris...

I get it, a lot of you guys don't like Blake for what he did as a player, or don't like Luc because of whatever...but holy **** batman, talk about not giving guys a chance

At least Blake got some tutelage under DL but I even think that’s enough to replace someone like DL, who brought the franchise 2 cups and it’s most successful run in its history. Blake is clearly working under Luc, who has zero experience in hockey operations prior to his current gig.

I don’t know what the AEG folks were thinking but they were clearly persuaded by Luc that all this team needs is a fun/easygoing culture and they need to dump DL/Sutter. Clearly that was a miscalculation and now they find themselves in a huge mess.

 

[LAKings88]

I’m not impressed with Desjardins as a hire.

It very well could be Sturm next year and Willie will be the fall guy for a losing/transition season.

LA is likely out by the deadline. I expect Muzzin/Pearson/Carter/Thompson will be shopped then. Possibly Clifford/Lewis too.

 

[DryIslandBartender]

Sutter, Stevens, Willie,

Not sure if I am counting correctly though....

Willie going to be here long term? I don’t think so.

 

[GoldenBearHockey]

At least Blake got some tutelage under DL but I even think that’s enough to replace someone like DL, who brought the franchise 2 cups and it’s most successful run in its history. Blake is clearly working under Luc, who has zero experience in hockey operations prior to his current gig.

I don’t know what the AEG folks were thinking but they were clearly persuaded by Luc that all this team needs is a fun/easygoing culture and they need to dump DL/Sutter. Clearly that was a miscalculation and now they find themselves in a huge mess.

Just curious, what do you think hockey operations does?

 

[DryIslandBartender]

1. your math is putrid.

2. I'm sure they're now doing what we've talked about all along--gotten a new coach and now it's put up or shut up time. With respect to this season, I don't expect Blake to make trades when guys are at their all-time low values, hence the new coach for evaluation and moves.

I'm with you on that though, I want whoever was whining about getting called out on effort shuttled to the moon, even if it's Doughty.

Again, you think Willie is a long term coach?

 

[Moses Doughty]

Willie going to be here long term? I don’t think so.

Agreed. Fact of the matter is that they appointed him interim coach for a reason. If he blows by expectations he'll have earned the job, but more likely than not it's just to carry on with the year and Lowry/Stothers are 100% NOT future HC quality in the eyes of management. It seems to be as much an audition for Sturm too

 

[Reclamation Project]

I can't think of another scenario of a coach being brought in from outside the organization and being labelled interim from day one. The Kings are keeping the expectations at rock bottom from the get-go with this guy. I'm sure this will give the Kings a short jolt, but I still see them failing to miss the playoffs and drafting around 10-12 which is just about as bad a scenario you could pick. If the divas on this team can't handle criticism from someone like Stevens, how the hell will they react to this guy? This orga-ni-za-tion has no identity, what a mess.

 

[Raccoon Jesus]

Again, you think Willie is a long term coach?

I don't think he is, given the interim tag, but you can't pre-emptively fire him, and you can't have it both ways just so you can complete your faulty equation.

And even if he gets canned in favor of Sturm or someone else next year, why does it matter? Isn't hiring the 'best' guy the goal? Rest assured by that point it won't be 'player choice' and we'd still be right around the typical coaching lifespan if you don't count this unusual interim situation. 5 years of Sutter is the exception, he was the second longest tenured guy to Q when he was let go. Then a year of Stevens, let's say a partial year of Willie D, then Coach X starting next year--that's not 4 coaches in 3 years as we don't know the lifespan of Coach X. I'm more happy that they're making necessary change and correcting mistakes.

I just don't see why this is a problem at all. I actually think its' a really good solution. Either he succeeds with flying colors and sticks, or he fails and we get a good draft pick and he's gone next year anyway.

 

[DryIslandBartender]

Just curious, what do you think hockey operations does?

Depends on the structure of the organization but in general hockey operations deal with scouting professional and amateur, player development, player nutrition, player health/strength and conditioning, legal counsel etc.

 

[Bandit]

It's Christmas for me baby!!!









So I know the narrative here is the players are coach killers, but look around the league: Longest tenured coach is Q, and probably not for long--but he's been there for a decade now. Clear outlier. Cooper has been in TB since 2013--5 years. Maurice in WPG and Laviolette in NSH--4 years. everyone else is 3 years or sooner. Median tenure right now is 2 years. 1/3 of the league's coaches have been hired between the start of last year and now.

Coaches are hired to be fired and lets stop acting like this is abnormal.





Let's also be fair and recognize some of these things aren't able to be managed around in a sense. You can't replace some of those players and we talked about it all along; it's easy to get a player 'better' than Stoll or Greene or Mitchell, but you can't 'replace' them if that makes sense. over the course of a couple of years, those are assets we lost for nothing--Stoll, Williams, Regehr, Greene, Voynov, Mitchell, even Richards--retired or moved on. Maybe he didn't adapt, but also maybe he couldn't, since those guys are products of a different era and neither that type of player nor era exists right now.

This is why I'm big on vision and identity and that was my big issue with Stevens (and right now until I see otherwise, Blake and Luc too).

Let’s be honest here. The real coach killer: Matt Luff. 1 game, TWO coaches shitcanned.

 

[GoldenBearHockey]

Depends on the structure of the organization but in general hockey operations deal with scouting professional and amateur, player development, player nutrition, player health/strength and conditioning, legal counsel etc.

And you think a player who has been around for 30 years knows nothing of that? I mean, legal counsel, sure, ok, but not every hockey ops is a lawyer, agreed?

 

[Johnny Utah]

The NHL is totally different and everyone should have known we were doomed the way Lombardi built Team USA.

Ottawa can trade Karlsson and look decent and have the building blocks for a better future.

I kinda agree with some posters, that deal for Kopitar was a sign of things to come. The deal is too much and too long for someone that age. Kings could have done something with Kopitar and just given the long term deal to Doughty - that’s who you build around not a 29 year old center. I would have moved him for assets and have the future number one center playing behind or in front of Carter, who has a shorter and smaller deal.

 

[DryIslandBartender]

I don't think he is, given the interim tag, but you can't pre-emptively fire him, and you can't have it both ways just so you can complete your faulty equation.

And even if he gets canned in favor of Sturm or someone else next year, why does it matter? Isn't hiring the 'best' guy the goal? Rest assured by that point it won't be 'player choice' and we'd still be right around the typical coaching lifespan if you don't count this unusual interim situation. 5 years of Sutter is the exception, he was the second longest tenured guy to Q when he was let go. Then a year of Stevens, let's say a partial year of Willie D, then Coach X starting next year--that's not 4 coaches in 3 years as we don't know the lifespan of Coach X. I'm more happy that they're making necessary change and correcting mistakes.

I just don't see why this is a problem at all. I actually think its' a really good solution. Either he succeeds with flying colors and sticks, or he fails and we get a good draft pick and he's gone next year anyway.

We’re firing/relieving three coaches in 3 seasons, and going to add a fourth. That’s not a good thing organizationally as it shows that it is unstable.

I’m not arguing against Willie or the firing of Stevens. My issue is we’re burning through coaches fast because the players are not responding. AEG can’t be happy that they are paying still paying the salaries of Stevens/Sutter and assistant coaches while paying for a new staff.

 

[DryIslandBartender]

And you think a player who has been around for 30 years knows nothing of that? I mean, legal counsel, sure, ok, but not every hockey ops is a lawyer, agreed?

Do you think Gretzky with his knowledge of the game makes him a great coach?

Just because your great on the ice or been around an organization for a few years doing cocktail parties/promos for the organization doesn’t make you a good hockey ops guy.

 

[GoldenBearHockey]

Do you think Gretzky with his knowledge of the game makes him a great coach?

Just because your great on the ice or been around an organization for a few years doing cocktail parties/promos for the organization doesn’t make you a good hockey ops guy.

LOL apples to oranges there bud....you literally said LA needed an KNOWLEDGEABLE hockey ops guy, now please prove that Luc does not have the KNOWLEDGE, of say, scouting, what it takes to play in the league, what characteristics to stay in the league, what can be coached, what can't be coached. Please show that Luc does not have the KNOWLEDGE of training, strength and conditioning etc,

I have no idea if Luc will be a good hockey ops or not, NO ONE ON THIS BOARD DOES, if you do, please PM me the winning powerball numbers.... but the fact that you think he lacks the necessary knowledge of hockey ops is...shocking.

 

[DryIslandBartender]

LOL apples to oranges there bud....you literally said LA needed an KNOWLEDGEABLE hockey ops guy, now please prove that Luc does not have the KNOWLEDGE, of say, scouting, what it takes to play in the league, what characteristics to stay in the league, what can be coached, what can't be coached. Please show that Luc does not have the KNOWLEDGE of training, strength and conditioning etc,

I have no idea if Luc will be a good hockey ops or not, NO ONE ON THIS BOARD DOES, if you do, please PM me the winning powerball numbers.... but the fact that you think he lacks the necessary knowledge of hockey ops is...shocking.

How much experience does Luc have in hockey operations prior to his current position?

 

[kingsfan28]

Are you ****ing serious... Desjardins? ****.

And of course, Sturm. A former King.

So you're one of the guys in the Tippet/Byslma camp? I'm glad those guys are nowhere near this team.

 

[Sol]

So you're one of the guys in the Tippet/Byslma camp? I'm glad those guys are nowhere near this team.

What? I hate those dudes too

 

[Axl Rhoadz]

It’s not a question of “try”, and I think his plan behind every decision was to win the cup. It just sucks it played out pretty much the worst possible ways.

Of course it sucks...and?? You know what doesn't suck? The moves he made that made us cup champions in 12 and 14. Either way, we all know the story...why don't you start a thread called 'let's live in the past' and you guys can make pages upon pages of how life sucks because of past moves.

 

[kingsfan28]

Agree 100%. The results Ranford and Imoo have brought to the organization SHOULD make them the safest members of the organization.

Exactly! The Kings have the best goalie coach/dev system in the league. Ranford is even in the conversation.

 

[Winger23]

I can't tell if you are serious or not, Robitaille, 30 yearss + in the game, Blake, 30+ years in the game, if those aren't knowledgeable hockey ops guys, I don't know what is, now they might have a different vision, different ideas than you, but holy ****.....to they aren't knowledgeable about the game, about what it takes to play at that level, to succeed at that level, what characteristics to look out for, what can be taught, what can't be taught, that's just...self-absorbed hubris...

I get it, a lot of you guys don't like Blake for what he did as a player, or don't like Luc because of whatever...but holy **** batman, talk about not giving guys a chance

I'm not arguing about not giving them a chance, but just because players have been around 30 years does not mean they are going to be good on the business side. It's pretty damn naive to think just because a guy was in the locker room automatically gives them the knowledge and insight on how to run a team or even what to look for in players or coaches.

 

[KINGS17]

Years of being involved in something doesn't equal knowledge.