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State of the Kings

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How are you feeling about the Kings today?

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I mean, I am still in the middle but now leaning more toward pitchfork mode. Blake hasn't been a disaster, he has made some very good moves, and his "plan" is pretty clear and basic, he was looking at developing a high-speed, high-skill, mobile team that could compete along the likes of Colorado or maybe old San Jose. It is just that he has had 6 seasons now and while some pieces are in place and they got prospects that could fit that identity, they have been unable to put it all together and I think Blake's overcautiousness has caused the roster to remain jammed and wonky.

I don't think Blake is an idiot. I was very against his signing/promotion, but he has proven to be a lot more calculating and patient than I thought he would be. However, I now think he is a little too much so. In the end, you are going to have to take some risks. Dean did so and got both burned and rewarded. I think a lot of the moves Blake has made have shown very little risk and it is clear that he is clutching hard onto prospects and has been waiting for the perfect moves and deals, but this market isn't really showing those options available. Because he has been trying to avoid lukewarm deals and moves he may be forcing himself into a corner where he is absolutely forced to make some terrible ones.

I don't hate the team he envisions or is trying to create, but I am also not sold that this group and management can achieve that vision. Literally, everyone is frustrated with the current state of the team. TMac himself said that the prospects in Ontario are indicating that they are tired of the situation, starting to desire to move to another team, and believe they are better than the current roster and should be called up. I honestly think they are mostly right. This team needs to shed some weight. It is time to have very hard conversations. It is easy for a fanbase to say jettison this person into space when they are used to just clicking a name and moving it to the trade box in a video game, but different when you have to actually find a mutual trade partner and have those conversations with players face to face that you've developed a real relationship over years.

But that is professional sports and there are difficult decisions and conversations that are unavoidable and need to happen. Kopitar needs to be moved down, prospects need to be placed in higher positions to succeed, logjams need to be addressed and it is time to part from various players in the lineup even if it comes at a cost to the team, and some moves need to be forced even if unfavorable if it allows for growth.
 
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kevsh said:
Not long ago a lot of people were raving about the Kings' deep prospect pool and what a great future this team had, but I was skeptical. Including Byfield, not a single "sure thing" and a lot of question marks. Some real possibilities for this team if a few exceeded their draft position, even better if one is a home run.

Today, I look at the Ontario roster and see too many of those same prospects that ideally should be on the big club by now, and those that are with the Kings not a single one in the top 6 forwards (while two are toiling on the 4th line). The blue line is marginally better. In net, a disaster area.

The team wants to develop young players properly, I get it, but with so few openings available after bringing in Arvidsson, Fiala, Danault, how can they be given the opportunity?

Or if the plan is that they want to fast track playoff success at the expense of the younger players, why waste away their potential (and therefore trade value) in the AHL when one or more could be flipped for assets that will help today, like a goalie? It just seems like Blake doesn't have much of a plan here, or he's scrapped it (like many GMs do) once they made the playoffs and was fooled into thinking they are "this close" to taking a run.
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See Dean Lombardi model.... At least I hope, they need to move some assets to get a serviceable goalie and left handed D Man.
 
EbonyRaptor said:
The Hawks will have an opportunity to draft an amazing talent - no guarantees unless they win the Bedard lottery.
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The top 5 are all similar great and would be 1st OA in any other draft.
I prefer this by far than being a fringe playoff team without any hope to make it to round 2 and a fading future
 
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Kurrilino said:
This Draft is a great year to pick early
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It's really a great year to pick in the top 40-50 players. There will be some gems found outside the traditional top-tier of top-10. Obviously Bedard is cemented in as 1OA and the season he's having is confirming that. Fantilli has had a great start to his season, and there are some guys that maybe were in the late-1st / early-2nd range that are playing themselves into the top-15 like Cristall, Ziemmer and Heidt. Some of the top Euro-prospects like Sale and Dvorsky have not had good starts to their season while Carlsson started well but has now slowed down. Then, there's the wild card in the deck - Mitchkov - who knows which team picks him and where does he go?
 
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Telos said:
Need more time before answering the poll. Things are literally just starting to happen. If everything that is going to happen has already happened then I would say fire everyone, but if they actually fire Walker into the sun, acquire a goaltender, and start moving things around then they can live another day. More needs to happen so we need a couple of days from just waiving Cal to see what steps are actually being taken.
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Walker ain't the problem. We need to package up some RDs and Kupari/Madden/Andersson for a 2nd pairing sah LD defenseman. That's what this team needs.
 
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Cianide said:
Walker ain't the problem. We need to package up some RDs and Kupari/Madden/Andersson for a 2nd pairing sah LD defenseman. That's what this team needs.
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Pretty much, but that deal may not be available. At the very least, spots need to be created on defense for other options because the current roster isn't doing the job.
 
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EbonyRaptor said:
It's really a great year to pick in the top 40-50 players. There will be some gems found outside the traditional top-tier of top-10. Obviously Bedard is cemented in as 1OA and the season he's having is confirming that. Fantilli has had a great start to his season, and there are some guys that maybe were in the late-1st / early-2nd range that are playing themselves into the top-15 like Cristall, Ziemmer and Heidt. Some of the top Euro-prospects like Sale and Dvorsky have not had good starts to their season while Carlsson started well but has now slowed down. Then, there's the wild card in the deck - Mitchkov - who knows which team picks him and where does he go?
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The Kings can barely develop an 11oa player. What makes you think they can develop any talent?
 
EbonyRaptor said:
some teams are better at finding and developing 2nd round picks than 1st round picks.
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EbonyRaptor said:
Yeah, no kidding. But, he's playing better on wing for Montreal so maybe he's figuring it out. You guys are hoping the same for Byfield - such potential but so for not able to tap into it with any consistency.
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I like Dach. I just felt like it was a mistake to throw him into the NHL full time right away as an 18 year old.

Unless a prospect is really special, I think it's better to be conservative and patient. Take your time bringing them along. Just my opinion.
 
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Deans CUP mantra: he acquired ALL Canadian players, betwen 23-28 over a few years and they got 2 cups - Stoll, Greene, Richards, Carter, Williams, Mitchell, Regher, Fraser, Penner and brought up Duh-Wight King and Jordan Nolan. All Canadians, all between 23-28, most with character and size.

There's a blueprint that worked. He only acquired Gaborik as a non Canadian...cuz he had his size and character, leaders...and needed 1 more goal scorer. Not surprising the outgoing ones were then non Canadians: Visnovsky, O'Sullivan, Frolov, Voynov. And of course, he brought in the most uber-Canadian coach ever...that was ran a farm in Canada.

As far as I know, this has NEVER been discussed and should have been discussed over 15 threads the past 10 years. So let's dicuss, Any insights into this?
 
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Peter James Bond II said:
Deans CUP mantra: he acquired ALL Canadian players, betwen 23-28 over a few years and they got 2 cups - Stoll, Greene, Richards, Carter, Williams, Mitchell, Regher, Fraser, Penner and brought up Duh-Wight King and Jordan Nolan. All Canadians, all between 23-28, most with character and size.

There's a blueprint that worked. He only acquired Gaborik as a non Canadian...cuz he had his size and character, leaders...and needed 1 more goal scorer. Not surprising the outgoing ones were then non Canadians: Visnovsky, O'Sullivan, Frolov, Voynov. And of course, he brought in the most uber-Canadian coach ever...that was ran a farm in Canada.

As far as I know, this has NEVER been discussed and should have been discussed over 15 threads the past 10 years. So let's dicuss, Any insights into this?
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I mean, it was pretty apparent, but it is hard to know if it would work if attempted again in the modern league. A lot of things clicked and it did help a lot that he had Kopitar, Doughty, and Quick all in that age group signed as they were and hitting their prime. Lombardi's mantra of not getting the best players but the right ones was a risky endeavor but worked seamlessly with Sutter's system and brand of hockey. However, that was a scorched-earth kind of system because it required the buy-in of the entire franchise and is unsustainable. You practically lost everyone after those three years or so because it was just impossible to keep up. The miraculous timing of it all is just hard to replicate.
 
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Telos said:
I mean, it was pretty apparent, but it is hard to know if it would work if attempted again in the modern league. A lot of things clicked and it did help a lot that he had Kopitar, Doughty, and Quick all in that age group signed as they were and hitting their prime. Lombardi's mantra of not getting the best players but the right ones was a risky endeavor but worked seamlessly with Sutter's system and brand of hockey. However, that was a scorched-earth kind of system because it required the buy-in of the entire franchise and is unsustainable. You practically lost everyone after those three years or so because it was just impossible to keep up. The miraculous timing of it all is just hard to replicate.
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I don’t comprehend how anyone can see what a heavy, tough checking team like Seattle is doing in 22/23 and doubt whether or not the 2012 Kings would have success.

Hockey doesn’t change. I realize people get hyped up about the new NHL and increases in scoring, etc etc. But it’s still a brutal physical sport that requires resilience and endurance and toughness above all else.
 
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Peter James Bond II said:
As far as I know, this has NEVER been discussed and should have been discussed over 15 threads the past 10 years. So let's dicuss, Any insights into this?
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I literally went on with Greg Wyshynski during the 2012 Cup run to talk about the fact that the Kings had the most Canadians in the NHL.
 
I think Blake should trade the Kings 1st round pick for some help to make sure the Kings make the playoffs this season. Kopitar, Quick and Doughty aren't getting any younger. Besides once you get into the playoffs anything can happen!

/sarc off
 
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KINGS17 said:
I think Blake should trade the Kings 1st round pick for some help to make sure the Kings make the playoffs this season. Kopitar, Quick and Doughty aren't getting any younger. Besides once you get into the playoffs anything can happen!

/sarc off
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Then Blake will have completed the full Dean Lombardi Life Cycle.

Except for, you know, winning multiple Cups and stuff.
 
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johnjm22 said:
I like Dach. I just felt like it was a mistake to throw him into the NHL full time right away as an 18 year old.

Unless a prospect is really special, I think it's better to be conservative and patient. Take your time bringing them along. Just my opinion.
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I agree in principle but with the CHL/NHL rule Dach was not eligible for the AHL so it was either the NHL or back to the WHL. Plus there were a couple circumstances that limited his development time - he broke his wrist in a WJC prelim game and then he missed games due to the Covid outage.
 
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KINGS17 said:
I think Blake should trade the Kings 1st round pick for some help to make sure the Kings make the playoffs this season. Kopitar, Quick and Doughty aren't getting any younger. Besides once you get into the playoffs anything can happen!

/sarc off
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Seriously, I really hope the Kings keep their 1st round draft pick this year. They've got two third round picks, so I'm thinking one of them gets used as a trade asset.
 
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