Proposal: St.Louis-Arizona Blockbuster

[PocketNines]

You realize Chychrun OUTSCORED Kyrou last year (and the seasons before).

Chychrun, a 23-year-old #1 D is worth way more than an emerging RW.

It’s a great point about Chychrun outscoring Kyrou before Kyrou was in the league, I guess you think your argument needed that aspect

 

[Heldig]

It’s a great point about Chychrun outscoring Kyrou before Kyrou was in the league, I guess you think your argument needed that aspect

Nice try. Kyrou played 55 games last year. Chychrun 56.

The fact it has taken several seasons for Kyrou to establish himself is not really a plus in his favour.

Nobody trades a proven top pairing D (on a great contract) for a good RW.

 

[PocketNines]

Nice try. Kyrou played 55 games last year. Chychrun 56.

The fact it has taken several seasons for Kyrou to establish himself is not really a plus in his favour.

Nobody trades a proven top pairing D (on a great contract) for a good RW.

Lol I didn’t “try” anything. Look there’s a reason Toronto fans want to trade Marner to get Kyrou or get Bowen Byram. There’s no point in trying to convince you of Kyrou’s value. I don’t care about it.

 

[Heldig]

Lol I didn’t “try” anything. Look there’s a reason Toronto fans want to trade Marner to get Kyrou or get Bowen Byram. There’s no point in trying to convince you of Kyrou’s value. I don’t care about it.

Well, you are enough to comment.

And I am not saying Kyrou is a bad player. I am saying he would not be enough to acquire a Dman like Chychrun 1 for 1.

 

[PocketNines]

Well, you are enough to comment.

And I am not saying Kyrou is a bad player. I am saying he would not be enough to acquire a Dman like Chychrun 1 for 1.

I’m telling you how the Blues value Kyrou. The part I don’t care about is whether you believe me. He is 12 games into a dominant looking season. His issue was adding strength his skating and skills at top speed were always world class. He took a little longer but he has made it. And thus the Blues look at a player they have developed patiently for 5 years on a great value for the next two years while they try to contend. So his value to the Blues is more than “a good RW” he has world class speed and looks like the team’s most dangerous forward and they have a lot of good players up front.

 

[westc2]

Lol how much do u think he’s worth?

31st rounders plus a blue chip goalie spec+ a superior skating young D who’s been playing in the NHL plus a replacement defensive D in Scandella u can flip for more specs/picks

Scandella is a negative asset...dude is horrible. He's the biggest liability on the Blues right now. Even Bortuzzo is better than him. Sometimes I wonder if he just flies under the radar of a lot of "fans" because they don't watch him play.

 

[Adam da bomb]

Lol at people thinking goalies have that much value unless they are of top 3 goalies.

 

[westc2]

You realize Chychrun OUTSCORED Kyrou last year (and the seasons before).

Chychrun, a 23-year-old #1 D is worth way more than an emerging RW.

Pretty solid 1 assist for Chychrun in his 13 games so far this season. I'd take Kyrou over Chychrun if I had to choose one. I'm not denying Chychrun is good, but of course he's gonna stand out on that awful Coyotes team, so he's for sure overrated a bit.

Also this is Kyrou's first season getting consistent top 6 minutes and now he's got 14 points in 12 games and is +6. He just had his first PP goal ever.

 

[BlueMed]

Nice try. Kyrou played 55 games last year. Chychrun 56.

The fact it has taken several seasons for Kyrou to establish himself is not really a plus in his favour.

Nobody trades a proven top pairing D (on a great contract) for a good RW.

Believe it or not, Kyrou is 23 going into this season. Tarasenko didn't really put his game together until he was 23. Truthfully, no one cares how long it took to establish a player. As long as the player is still young and can bring high value moving forward, then the investment is totally worth it.

 

[Moose and Squirrel]

If Kyrou reaches that level, I agree that it's much closer than it is today. I also agree that the Blues should absolutely value him like he'll definitely get there, and have no reason to trade him. But, until he actually shows that he's a 70-80 point winger, I'd much rather have the 35+ point top pairing D on the great contract, and would pay more for Chychrun.

I agree with this, but (and no offense) Chych has hit 35+ 1 time

so the Blues fan is 'projecting' for Kyrou (a bit much imo) but think that's being done for Chych as well (and no, I'm not trying to use cutesy nicknames.. I just don't wanna keep mispelling his name lol )

taking out his 'big' season he's avg'ng 20pts/season. I didnt' include this season cause it's serious SSS and give him a chance to right the ship. we shall see how it looks at the end of the season.

kyrou, on the other hand, hasn't shown much for his resume either. to temper things, he got off to a bit of a hot start last year as well. we shall see how this season works out as well.

would STL like to add Chych? who wouldn't? but why would AZ trade him unless it makes STL wince? they shouldn't

 

[rumrokh]

The fact it has taken several seasons for Kyrou to establish himself is not really a plus in his favour.

Define "several." Is it more than "a few," which is more than "a couple," which is more than one?

 

[Heldig]

Define "several." Is it more than "a few," which is more than "a couple," which is more than one?

Context matters.

For arguments sake, we are talking about players drafted in the same year. Chychrun is in his 6th season. Kyrou his 2nd. So 4 season's would be several.

 

[rumrokh]

Context matters.

For arguments sake, we are talking about players drafted in the same year. Chychrun is in his 6th season. Kyrou his 2nd. So 4 season's would be several.

I'm in no way invested in the argument over the value of either player, independent or relative to one another; but you know it's horseshit to describe a 23 year old in his second full season that way. If your words right there are your point, it's completely fine just to say exactly that: "Chychrun is in his 6th season and Kyrou is in his 2nd." Instead, you've chosen to frame it like Kyrou has struggled to become an impact player over an exceptional period of time.

 

[BleedBlue14]

I really don’t see why Arizona would be considering trading Chychrun. I’m not so sold that he’s a #1 D but he’s more than capable of being a #2 already and he’s already 23.

I’d imagine for them to really consider moving him they’d want a piece who is younger with a little bit of success at the nhl level (18-21) and some draft capitol. They assuredly won’t get a player of the same impact. I would venture to guess that a team like Detroit could line up well for a trade for him as they have a lot of younger higher end draft guys.

STL just simply doesn’t have that that they can really part with given their window and cap situation. I would venture to guess Neighbors or Perunovich would have to be the centerpiece for a deal. I’m not really sure Neighbors is enough for that at the moment.

 

[Ranksu]

Why is this thread up?

Clearly there isn't trade for made.

 

[IWantSakicAsMyGM]

I agree with this, but (and no offense) Chych has hit 35+ 1 time

so the Blues fan is 'projecting' for Kyrou (a bit much imo) but think that's being done for Chych as well (and no, I'm not trying to use cutesy nicknames.. I just don't wanna keep mispelling his name lol )

taking out his 'big' season he's avg'ng 20pts/season. I didnt' include this season cause it's serious SSS and give him a chance to right the ship. we shall see how it looks at the end of the season.

kyrou, on the other hand, hasn't shown much for his resume either. to temper things, he got off to a bit of a hot start last year as well. we shall see how this season works out as well.

would STL like to add Chych? who wouldn't? but why would AZ trade him unless it makes STL wince? they shouldn't

Yes, he has only hit 35+ once, but you're ignoring some pretty important context to say he's only a 20 point guy. He had 20 points in 53 games (31 point pace over 82 games), and 26 in 63 (34 point pace), and was 0.51 PPG over a 172 game sample, including the big season (42 point pace). Is thinking he can continue to produce at a lower rate than he has averaged over 172 games really that much of a projection? Maybe it won't happen in Arizona this year, but literally anywhere else, I think that's a pretty safe bet.

I do agree that there's no reason for Arizona to trade him without it being extremely uncomfortable for the other team, but that's also true of Kyrou as well. They are both good young players, which are always in high demand. I just think that Chychrun is the more valuable of the two, by a pretty significant margin right now. D > W and more proven > less proven.

 

[Moose and Squirrel]

Yes, he has only hit 35+ once, but you're ignoring some pretty important context to say he's only a 20 point guy. He had 20 points in 53 games (31 point pace over 82 games), and 26 in 63 (34 point pace), and was 0.51 PPG over a 172 game sample, including the big season (42 point pace). Is thinking he can continue to produce at a lower rate than he has averaged over 172 games really that much of a projection? Maybe it won't happen in Arizona this year, but literally anywhere else, I think that's a pretty safe bet.

I do agree that there's no reason for Arizona to trade him without it being extremely uncomfortable for the other team, but that's also true of Kyrou as well. They are both good young players, which are always in high demand. I just think that Chychrun is the more valuable of the two, by a pretty significant margin right now. D > W and more proven > less proven.

def agree that Chych is more valuable than kyrou now, and heck.. maybe even going forward. 1D's are in VERY high demand. teams seem to think that wingers can be 'developed'. so there's that.
and like I said, Kyrou doesn't exactly have a track record yet either. right now, he looks very good. he needs to keep it up, and then judge his value. but for a 2nd round pick... not too shabby, potential wise at least.
and I agree about Chych's short season thingy,but when I looked at his stats, it seems that's about the # of games he gets in per season. admittedly I don't get to see much of AZ on the tube, but not sure why the reason he's not hitting more games. haven't heard anyone discuss injuries, so figuring being 'nicked up' and whatnot. happens to all of em. especially if you're a big target sitting in front of guys shooting pucks at ya lol
as far as this year goes, they're off to such a bad start that I'm not sure this isn't one ya throw out of the discussion for the 'bell curve'. only so much one or 2 players can do when a team is like this... Ladd? Ericksson?? seriously??

 

[St Louis515]

1. Chychrun, Jakob ($1,500,000 retained)

1. Scandella, Marco
2. Bolduc, Zachary
3. Walman, Jake
4. Hofer, Joel
5. 2022 1st round pick (STL)
6. 2023 1st round pick (STL)

Blues need defence.Question is is that enough?

Sorry, but Chychrun is not Bobby Orr. WAY to much going from St Louis.

 

[rt]

If you replaced Bolduc with Neighbors, I’d think about it. But ONLY because of how hard AZ is tanking. I’m not sure Chychrun will want to endure this much pain. Better to get in front of a looming fiasco.

 

[Reality Czech]

Scandella is a negative asset...dude is horrible. He's the biggest liability on the Blues right now. Even Bortuzzo is better than him. Sometimes I wonder if he just flies under the radar of a lot of "fans" because they don't watch him play.

Thanks for the laugh. Funny how "fans" like you think your opinion matters more than coaches and GMs....you know, the ones who actually get paid to evaluate players and make roster decisions. Scandella has his limitations, but your opinion isn't even close to accurate.

Not interested in a Kyrou/Chychrun swap. Kyrou is a gamebreaker who's just getting comfortable in the league, Chychrun is well on his way to winning the green jacket this year.

 

[Stealth JD]

If you replaced Bolduc with Neighbors, I’d think about it. But ONLY because of how hard AZ is tanking. I’m not sure Chychrun will want to endure this much pain. Better to get in front of a looming fiasco.

Would ya, though? Would ya?
Proposal: - STL/ARZ: All-in for Chychrun

 

[rt]

Would ya, though? Would ya?
Proposal: - STL/ARZ: All-in for Chychrun

1. That proposal is worse than this one.
2. That was before we knew AZ was going to get blown out literally every single game and start 1-13-1 with zero hope in sight and Chychrun getting absolutely shell-shocked.

(EDIT: didn’t realize their was retention in this OP. So it’s a no thanks either way)

EDIT: x2 - just noticed the “No Chychrun for Thomas and Kyrou bit” - yeah. That’s not aging well at all. Haha. Got me there!!!

EDIT: x3: Kyrou and Thomas have the same number of combined points as Arizona’s top FOUR point leaders combined. Lol. And Chychrun isn’t on that list. Haha. Did NOT see ANY of that coming. Life comes at you quick. Haha.

 

[The Moose is Loose]

I think if the Blues offered this the Arizona management might take it based off their track record.

 

[PocketNines]

1. That proposal is worse than this one.
2. That was before we knew AZ was going to get blown out literally every single game and start 1-13-1 with zero hope in sight and Chychrun getting absolutely shell-shocked.

(EDIT: didn’t realize their was retention in this OP. So it’s a no thanks either way)

EDIT: x2 - just noticed the “No Chychrun for Thomas and Kyrou bit” - yeah. That’s not aging well at all. Haha. Got me there!!!

EDIT: x3: Kyrou and Thomas have the same number of combined points as Arizona’s top FOUR point leaders combined. Lol. And Chychrun isn’t on that list. Haha. Did NOT see ANY of that coming. Life comes at you quick. Haha.

The difference in the two proposals is that one has Scandella, Walman, Hofer and Bolduc and the other has Tarasenko plus choice of Neighbors or Perunovich. I would take Tarasenko (who you can trade and potentially retain on) and Perunovich over the other group every day of the week.

 

[CupCrazySTL]

1. Chychrun, Jakob ($1,500,000 retained)

1. Scandella, Marco
2. Bolduc, Zachary
3. Walman, Jake
4. Hofer, Joel
5. 2022 1st round pick (STL)
6. 2023 1st round pick (STL)

Blues need defence.Question is is that enough?

No..Only way this is happening is a trade starting with Keller!