GDT: Sochi Part 2: Dis Gon Be Gud

[Blueline Bomber]

Yeah, Martin wasn't really an issue. About the only thing you might say about Martin is that if he wasn't on the team, the likeliness of Orpik being on the team would have lessened.

It appears, at the very least, Faulk is getting more than 1:15 this game. Not that it matters, since I doubt Team USA gets 3 past Rask

 

[What the Faulk]

I initially didn't like Martin's inclusion, but he played well enough. Really though, as a team, they underperformed. A few players here and there showed up and carried them to a (likely) 4th place finish, but that's not enough in an Olympic tournament. If 2018 does allow NHLers, it'll be very interesting to see how many of these players are included. I think it'll look far, far different.

 

[Sasha Cares]

You tell me you like Martin over Yandle?

 

[What the Faulk]

It was never Yandle vs. Martin. It was Yandle vs. Orpik/Fowler, or an out of position Yandle vs. Shattenkirk, which never seemed like a serious consideration. The coaches REALLY pushed for Orpik and REALLY pushed against Yandle. Another error by Bylsma and co.

Skimming the Burnside article again, it really doesn't seem like the two sides were on the same page -- at all -- with the defense.

 

[Boom Boom Apathy]

Martin was terrible in Sochi. The ice was way to big for him. Just my opinion.

I haven't seen all the games, but the ones I did, Martin was far from terrible so I disagree with your assessment, but that's fine. Assuming another player would have performed better is just that, an assumption.

The team never gave up more than 2 goals in a single game (so far) and up until the medal round (when Martin played), had scored 7, 2, 5 and 5. The problem is the team hasn't scored when it came to the medal round which was played in a more defensive, tighter manner. Canada is a better team, so losing to them by 1 isn't a surprise (at least to me). This game is disappointing, but Finland has held Russia and Canada to 1 goal (regulation) and Sweden to 2, so even if the US plays great (which they haven't), they aren't likely to score a lot on Finland.

 

[DaveG]

It was never Yandle vs. Martin. It was Yandle vs. Orpik/Fowler, or an out of position Yandle vs. Shattenkirk, which never seemed like a serious consideration. The coaches REALLY pushed for Orpik and REALLY pushed against Yandle. Another error by Bylsma and co.

Skimming the Burnside article again, it really doesn't seem like the two sides were on the same page -- at all -- with the defense.

Right. I chalk this one up to Bylsma gonna Bylsma. It's fine to push for your guy, but basically everyone and their dog knew that Orpik was a weak selection and that players better suited for the International ice were passed up as a result, Yandle being the most egregious of all the guys left off. What stunned me, at least from what I recall from the article, is that they really didn't push back nearly as much as they should have on the Orpik pick. For instance, there was more disagreement over a guy like Faulk, who was regarded as a lock by the committee after a bit, then there was Orpik who not just doesn't have the kind of game or mobility you want for the big ice, but was coming off a concussion as well. Just... mind bottling.


Martin I've had absolutely no problem with, and didn't have a problem with his selection from Day 1. If the Olympics were last year he would have been a horrendous selection (IMO) but he's come back into form this year and had a quietly good Olympics IMO.

Just gotta wonder what difference guys like Yandle or one of the Johnsons over Orpik, and Ryan over say Wheeler would have made here. Maybe enough to get us over Canada and into the Gold Medal Game, maybe not. But it's VERY fair to say we should be second guessing their selections and how those who were chosen were utilized. Just ridiculous that it took someone getting hurt for Faulk to get any ice time, the ONLY player on the US roster where that was the case, and that Orpik-Martin was basically the default 2nd pairing here, instead of Orpik being the #8 dman as he should have been from the start.

 

[Sasha Cares]

Patrick Kane leaving his mark

 

[tomdundo]

...can Teemu play forever, please?

It'll definitely be a dark day when he does retire.

 

[Blueline Bomber]

Bylsma screwed up the icetime for this game as well. JvR was one of the best players for Team USA in this tournament, yet gets demoted to only over a minute of icetime in the second period.

This tournament showing falls squarely on the coach. Playing favorites, demoting and/or refusing to play certain players without rhyme or reason.

 

[Sens1Canes2]

I'm having a hard time understanding how it's "blame the coach" after the offensive juggernaut scored no goals in their last two games. You can blame Burke and Co. for maybe one forward omission (Ryan) but damn...how about some player accountability? They are better players than the Finns, but laid an egg today. That's not a coaching issue. That's a player performance issue.

 

[Wild Caniac]

This has been an embarrassing last 24 hours for USA hockey.

 

[nobuddy]

huge disappointment in team usa. Our worst winter olympics in memory. People getting fired all over the place i'm sure. Hockey just capped off our awful showing.

2006?

 

[nobuddy]

Is someone seriously complaining about Martin? He didn't play either of the games we lost... was he even on the ice for a goal against AT ALL? I don't think he was.

 

[Blueline Bomber]

Orpik with a stellar defensive play there

 

[Sasha Cares]

Yes. Martin was a traffic cone. Are you seriously saying the lack of Martin cost us these two games? Bwahahaha

 

[daikan]

Bylsma screwed up the icetime for this game as well. JvR was one of the best players for Team USA in this tournament, yet gets demoted to only over a minute of icetime in the second period.

This tournament showing falls squarely on the coach. Playing favorites, demoting and/or refusing to play certain players without rhyme or reason.

Didn't he get hit by a puck earlier in the game? That might be the reason.

 

[Cardiac Jerks]

I want to say something about the game but that would just be adding insult to injury.

 

[tomdundo]

Is someone seriously complaining about Martin? He didn't play either of the games we lost... was he even on the ice for a goal against AT ALL? I don't think he was.

Goals Against

Slovakia
Suter-Martin was on the ice for Tatar's goal.

Russia
Orpik-Carlson on for Datsyuk's first goal.
Suter-McDonagh on for Datsyuk's second goal(PP goal).

Slovenia
Orpik-Carlson on for Rodman's goal.

Czech Republic
Suter-McDonagh on for Hemsky's first goal.
Orpik-Carlson on for Hemsky's second goal.

Canada
Orpik-Carlson on for Benn's goal.

Finland
Suter-McDonagh on for Selanne's first goal.
Suter-McDonagh on for Jokinen's goal.
Fowler-Faulk on for Hietanen's goal.
Suter-Carlson on for Selanne's second goal (PP goal).
Orpik-McDonagh on for Maatta's goal (PP goal).

Goals Against
Orpik: 4 ES goals, 1 PP goal
Carlson: 4 ES goals, 1 PP goal
Suter: 3 ES goals, 2 PP goals
McDonagh: 3 ES goals, 2 PP goals
Fowler: 1 ES goal
Faulk: 1 ES goal (in very limited ice time)
Martin: 1 ES goal
Shattenkirk: No goals against


So, that's one goal against Martin in the four games he played. The sad part is that Orpik-Carlson wasn't an actual pairing until the Canada game.



Goals For

Slovakia

Martin-Carlson on for Carlson's goal. (Carlson goal)
Fowler-Carlson on for Kesler's goal.
Orpik-McDonagh on for Stastny's first goal.
Suter-Fowler on for Backes' goal.
Suter-Shattenkirk on for Stastny's second goal. (Shattenkirk assist)
Suter-Orpik on for Kessel's goal.
Orpik-Carlson on for Brown's goal. (Carlson assist)

Russia

Suter-Fowler on for Fowler's goal. (PP goal, Fowler goal).
Shattenkirk on for Pavelski's goal. (PP goal, Shattenkirk assist).

Slovenia

Orpik-Martin on for Kessel's first goal.
Fowler-Shattenkirk on for Kessel's second goal. (Orpik assist before line change)
Fowler-Carlson on for Kessel's third goal.
Orpik-McDonagh on for McDonagh's goal. (McDonagh goal).
Suter-Carlson on for Backes' goal.

Czech Republic

Orpik-Martin on for JVR's goal.
Suter-McDonagh on for Brown's goal. (Suter assist).
Suter-McDonagh on for Backes' goal. (Suter assist).
Suter on for Parise's goal. (PP goal, Suter assist).
Fowler-Shattenkirk on for Kessel's goal (Shattenkirk assist).

Canada

No goals for

Finland

No goals for


Goals for (Points accumulated):

Suter: 6 ES goals, 2 PP goals, (3 assists)
Fowler: 5 ES goals, 1 PP goal, (1 assist)
Carlson: 5 ES goals, (goal, assist)
Orpik: 5 ES goals, (1 assist while not on ice)
McDonagh: 4 ES goals, (1 goal)
Shattenkirk: 3 ES goals, 1 PP goal, (3 assists)
Martin: 3 ES goals
Faulk: No goals for, although none were scored against Canada or Finland


Goal Responsibility

Player | ES Goals For While on Ice | PP Goals For While on Ice | ES Goals Against While on Ice | PP Goals Against While on Ice | Goals | Assists
Suter | 6 | 2 | 3 | 2 | 0 | 3
Fowler | 5 | 1 | 1 | 0 | 0 | 1
Carlson | 5 | 0 | 4 | 1 | 1 | 1
Orpik | 5 | 0 | 4 | 1 | 0 | 1
McDonagh | 4 | 0 | 3 | 2 | 1 | 0
Shattenkirk | 3 | 1 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 3
Martin | 3 | 0 | 1 | 0 | 0 | 0
Faulk | 0 | 0 | 1 | 0 | 0 | 0

 

[nobuddy]

Yes. Martin was a traffic cone. Are you seriously saying the lack of Martin cost us these two games? Bwahahaha

What the **** are you talking about?

You're blaming HIM of all people for our struggles and he didn't even ****ing play in our losses? Do you honestly not see the problem with that reasoning?

I'm not saying his absence is why we lost I'm saying it's ridiculous to blame him for our troubles.

Like I said, I'm fairly certain he wasn't even on the ice for a goal against all tournament. What exactly did he do that hurt us so much?

 

[nobuddy]

Oh, Martin was on the ice for the lone goal against in a 7-1 win. That's it. Yep, clearly he was a major detriment to this squad.

 

[DaveG]

I'm having a hard time understanding how it's "blame the coach" after the offensive juggernaut scored no goals in their last two games. You can blame Burke and Co. for maybe one forward omission (Ryan) but damn...how about some player accountability? They are better players than the Finns, but laid an egg today. That's not a coaching issue. That's a player performance issue.

Honestly I figured today was going to be mail it in time anyway. Bad as it is to say, the absolute letdown of yesterday with what had been by far the most potent offense against some good teams (Czechs and Slovakia) being absolutely shut down was not going to end well.

But yes, I agree, it's absolutely a player selection issue. Wheeler over Ryan and Orpik over about half a dozen guys are both wtf level stupid. The difference to be made was in yesterdays game, not todays.

I hate being right sometimes (re: Ryan), but I still stand by what I say with the incredulous lack of discussion about someone as ill-suited for the international ice as Orpik compared to other guys that were considered locks. And I still say that was largely because Bylsma was at the helm, though I have no problem with people heaving some of that blame at Burke as well.

 

[nobuddy]

Lol at all of you who ridiculed me when I said we didn't take enough offensive players and it was a bad idea to set up the forward group so defensively.

 

[Novacane]

We lost?

Wow. Good job boys.

Go Canada. I might puke if that piece of **** Edler gets the gold medal.

 

[tomdundo]

I know it sounds bad to say it...but after losing to Canada I almost definitely expected a loss today.

I'm really not too upset about the loss. If they can't find a way to score a goal in two straight games, they don't deserve a medal.

 

[Oenatzu]

Tuomo Ruutu has represented Finland in major tournaments 11 times and has went home with a medal every time.

Under-18 World Championships 2000: gold
Under-20 World Championships 2001: silver
Under-20 World Championships 2002: bronze
Under-20 World Championships 2003: bronze
World Cup 2004: silver
World Championships 2006: bronze
World Championships 2007: silver
World Championships 2008: bronze
Olympic Games 2010: bronze
World Championships 2011: gold
Olympic Games 2014: bronze