So... Are the Penguins Even Going to Try?

[BigEezyE22]

This is a good assessment of the primary difference. It looks to me like the Caps are a good 3-5 years ahead of Pittsburgh. LTIR Backstrom was a big game changer for Washington. This year, Oshie probably there as well. Cap flexibility, especially this year was really used well.

Some of Washington’s top ten has graduated. Lapierre and McMichael no longer considered prospects. It’s scary how under the radar good Hendrix Lapierre is looking.

Add to that, Lapierre and Miroshnishenko, both slipped due to serious injury/illness. Both were considered near the top of their draft class.

Pittsburgh went all in more than Washington. Who can blame them, they had a great run. But Washington rarely ever traded their firsts, while Pittsburgh mostly did.

Pittsburgh needs to cash in their chips, and stop adding older players to an older core. Caps added Strome, Pittsburgh opted for more Jeff Carter. Washington added PLD, Pittsburgh Karlsson. Say what you will about PLD, but both he and Strome were in their mid twenties.

Sixth place in the Metro is the last place this team needs to end up.

The guy who opted for more Jeff Carter is gonezo.

 

[Duffy13]

Its hilarious what's being ignored is that a better Powerplay the last 2 years put the Penguins in the playoffs both years. The panic amongst the plebs about the Pens demise should be celebrated.

The only teams in the Met that are significantly better than the Pens are NYR and Carolina.

Everyone else is clumped together and are one stretch of games above average from the rest can take spot 3 and maybe a wildcard, and then bounced in the 1st round. The whole Met division is garbage right now, the only fun in it, is that because everyone is bad, the games are unpredictable and actually mean something. NJ should be better this year, I'm picking them as the 3rd spot, then its a cluster of garbage fighting for the 2nd wildcard, if the Atlantic doesn't take both of them.

I don't see the big deal about Wash, PLD is terrible and has a full NMC lol, Chychrun and Roy are fine pickups, but hardly franchise movers. and are also 14 million over the cap, so some LTIR and salary dumps have to be made.

Duclaire helps the Islanders, but not as much as a Sorokin return to his potential does. If not then they could easily miss the playoffs.

Philly is weird, I'm not sure what they call this rebuild, I am looking forward to Michkov though.

CBJ has 18million in cap space and a Laine trade to get sorted.

We have entered the same era the old Patrick Division was in from 86 to 91 when every team in the division was basically the same and every team had a shot at the playoffs due to everyone else having major flaws.

1 long injury to Shesterkin and the Rangers are no better than the top of the garbage heap behind them.

 

[AD1066]

Crosby - 37
Malkin - 38
Letang - 37
Karlsson - 34

That is one ancient core. Seems like we've seen the last of playoff Crosby.

 

[wetcoast]

Foegele would fit PIT perfectly, would be great beside Crosby, and brings energy that PIT desperately needs, instead of a walking stiff in Hayes and a bland, more.of the same defender in Grzelcyk. I get though that the Hayes trade is about the 2nd rounder.

Man I like Foegle but he simply isn't a top 6 player and doesn't have the offensive skills to play with Crosby

If Necas is really on the table, this is the get. Perhaps something around Rakell (with retention) +.

Man Canes fans must be drooling about Rakell....well not really as he is the type of contract teams look to unload like Hayes.

I like Necas but he is seeking a contract that most teams just won't be interest in.

You invest in Necas and then send him off for major returns once the core retires.

Sure but at what cost, even assuming that the canes would agree to take Rakell they would have to attach something just for Rakell and the trade would end up looking something like Necas for Rakell, one or 2 first rounders, Yager and maybe Pickering as well.

So I don't think that's even workable.

 

[pi314]

Signing overpriced free agents is not “trying”.

The Pens have other issues.

But standing down this time of year isn’t one of them.

 

[Wings4Life]

That is one ancient core. Seems like we've seen the last of playoff Crosby.

If so, he will at least retire with a sky-high playoff points per game. He will avoid that decline in playoff points per game we see happen when guys continue to play playoff games at age 35 or so.

 

[MetalheadPenguinsFan]

Seeing as they still stupidly refuse to fire Sullivan…I’d say no they aren’t trying at all.

 

[WarriorofTime]

Its hilarious what's being ignored is that a better Powerplay the last 2 years put the Penguins in the playoffs both years. The panic amongst the plebs about the Pens demise should be celebrated.

They've missed the Playoffs two straight seasons and Malkin, Letang and Crosby enter next season 38, 37 and 37. The Penguins in current form are donezo.

 

[Maple Leaf]

You just got dubased just like NJ got keefed

 

[wetcoast]

They're stuck in no man's land. I think if they're as bad or worse than last season then the inevitable will happen and Crosby will get traded and then the rebuild will begin.

This is probably the best thing that could happen for both the Pens and Crosby.

I can't see him wanting to stick around and sign another contract to play for nothing year after year. He could really get the rebuild started in a great way as a 50% retained Crosby at the deadline will fetch a bundle of picks and prospects to build around.

Agreed.

 

[Nogatco Rd]

I don't see the big deal about Wash, PLD is terrible and has a full NMC lol, Chychrun and Roy are fine pickups, but hardly franchise movers. and are also 14 million over the cap, so some LTIR and salary dumps have to be made.

It’s widely expected that Oshie and Backstrom are done. With them on LTIR, the team is cap compliant with no need to dump salary.

 

[Human]

It doesn’t matter what Dubas/Pens are doing while Mike Sullivan and Todd Reirden are still there…

 

[The Hockey Tonk Man]

Not the biggest Dubas fan, but he seems pretty handcuffed having to keep the core 3 + Sullivan. Gotta think Sully’s lost the room at this point. Coaches have a shelf life & he’s way past his with the Pens.

Bringing in Hayes was a head scratcher, goaltending also isn’t the best.

Not the biggest Dubas fan, but he seems pretty handcuffed having to keep the core 3 + Sullivan. Gotta think Sully’s lost the room at this point. Coaches have a shelf life & he’s way past his with the Pens.

 

[Hockey4Lyfe]

Will never understand the comparison of the Penguins to the Capitals. Capitals held onto 1st rounders and rarely went for it and the results in comparison to the Penguins show exactly that.

Also they have gotten lucky with some ugly ass contracts and guys seemingly being put on LTIR to open up cap space.

So yes, they should 100% be further along with much better cap space and draft picks compared to the Pens.

But do you think any Penguins fan would trade the past 15 years for the Capitals? Absolutely not. Results and winning matter.

This happening to them was inevitable. They have been on top for too long and now their superstars are no longer in their primes.

 

[MetalheadPenguinsFan]

It doesn’t matter what Dubas/Pens are doing while Mike Sullivan and Todd Reirden are still there…

Reirden is gone, but not Sullivan.

 

[PenguinSuitedUp]

Will never understand the comparison of the Penguins to the Capitals. Capitals held onto 1st rounders and rarely went for it and the results in comparison to the Penguins show exactly that.

Also they have gotten lucky with some ugly ass contracts and guys seemingly being put on LTIR to open up cap space.

So yes, they should 100% be further along with much better cap space and draft picks compared to the Pens.

But do you think any Penguins fan would trade the past 15 years for the Capitals? Absolutely not. Results and winning matter.

This happening to them was inevitable. They have been on top for too long and now their superstars are no longer in their primes.

This is a good point. The Penguins are in a different tier of franchise than the Capitals in terms of success. Nothing the Capitals are doing right now will change that. In my opinion, it only will lengthen the timeline it takes for them to compete in the long run, because they’ve acquired some pretty brutal long term contracts. But I do understand what they’re trying to do for OV, and I don’t disagree with it from that perspective.

 

[Pens x]

The Pens have had horrible front offices and coaching since 2018. Every offseason is horrible. Dubas’ 2024 summer plans seem to basically undo everything he did last summer. One misstep after another. He did nothing last year to even try to improve the power play when it struggled all season.

Dubas, like Hextall, has been a massive disappointment.

 

[Rodgerwilco]

Crosby - 37
Malkin - 38
Letang - 37
Karlsson - 34

That is one ancient core. Seems like we've seen the last of playoff Crosby.

In 2016 when the Sharks went to the Finals the Sharks core was:

Thornton - 36 (2 weeks off 37 in the finals)
Marleau - 36
Ward - 35
Martin - 34

I'm not saying it would be easy by any means, but teams can make it very far with old cores. Obviously the Sharks had some other important complimentary players, but with the right players around the aging care they can still help the team make a deep run for Pittsburgh.

They were 1 game away from playoffs the last two seasons. An even even half-decent PP and the Penguins easily make playoffs this past season.

 

[thegazelle]

As long as Dubas is at the helm, the Penguins will not see success.

 

[SomeDude]

In 2016 when the Sharks went to the Finals the Sharks core was:

Thornton - 36 (2 weeks off 37 in the finals)
Marleau - 36
Ward - 35
Martin - 34

In what universe were Joel Ward and Paul Martin core players for the Sharks?

Couture was 26 and had a Conn Smythe level performance, Pavelski was 31, Burns was 30, Hertl was 22, Martin Jones was 26 and again had a Conn Smythe level performance.

The Pens are nothing like that Sharks team. They’re worse. Much worse.

 

[Rodgerwilco]

In what universe were Joel Ward and Paul Martin core players for the Sharks?

Couture was 26 and had a Conn Smythe level performance, Pavelski was 31, Burns was 30, Hertl was 22, Martin Jones was 26 and again had a Conn Smythe level performance.

The Pens are nothing like that Sharks team. They’re worse. Much worse.

Ward was the 5th highest scoring forward for them (Playoffs and reg. season) and 5th in average ice time on the team (more than Hertl and only 30 seconds average less than Couture) for forwards.

Martin had 3rd most average ice time for the Sharks in playoffs. Ward and Martin were old, but definitely were still important pieces of that roster.

I said in my comment that they obviously had other players who were big impacts, but with the right players around them an older roster can still make a deep run.

 

[AD1066]

In 2016 when the Sharks went to the Finals the Sharks core was:

Thornton - 36 (2 weeks off 37 in the finals)
Marleau - 36
Ward - 35
Martin - 34

I'm not saying it would be easy by any means, but teams can make it very far with old cores. Obviously the Sharks had some other important complimentary players, but with the right players around the aging care they can still help the team make a deep run for Pittsburgh.

They were 1 game away from playoffs the last two seasons. An even even half-decent PP and the Penguins easily make playoffs this past season.

Couture would have been in his late 20s at the time and had 30 points in 24 games. After losing Guentzel, the Pens are more reliant on their core than the Sharks, while also being older.
Granted, Crosby is still a monster, but Malkin has noticeably lost a step. The duo also played all 82 games last season. Just knowing their histories, especially Malkin, that seems unlikely to happen again.

edit: didn't see the responses already posted above

 

[Neil Racki]

Caps made some decent upgrades .. that may help them cling to the 8th seed this upcoming season.

Caps and Pens will both be fighting for that spot again next season

Caps and Pens are both still winding down

 

[Rodgerwilco]

Couture would have been in his late 20s at the time and had 30 points in 24 games. After losing Guentzel, the Pens are more reliant on their core than the Sharks, while also being older.
Granted, Crosby is still a monster, but Malkin has noticeably lost a step. The duo also played all 82 games last season. Just knowing their histories, especially Malkin, that seems unlikely to happen again.

edit: didn't see the responses already posted above

Yeah trust me man, I definitely don't think it would be easy, and I wouldn't put money on it happening the way things look right now. My point was simply that Crosby, Malkin, Letang, and Karlsson are still very capable players and cores not much younger than them have led teams all the way to the finals with the right pieces behind them.

 

[weastern bias]

In 2016 when the Sharks went to the Finals the Sharks core was:

Thornton - 36 (2 weeks off 37 in the finals)
Marleau - 36
Ward - 35
Martin - 34

This is very funny