Post-Game Talk: Slip Sliding Away Jets lose 4-2

[fmrdh]

The powerplay is a problem. It doesn't need to be Oilers level but for the last month or so, for the most part it feels like 2 minutes of perimeter play and failed zone entries.

Forecheck which was a strength earlier this season, is basically non-existent most nights

 

[Jets 31]

This.

Also, those lunchpail guys were not these lunchpail guys.

Prime Perreault, Copp, Armia and Tanev elevate any 4th line in the league and even most 3rd lines. Stenlund, KK, Gus, Whoever do not. Barron someday maybe.

And last night's 2nd line -- WTF was than anyway? Ehlers did what he could but that top 6 was just brutal. 2023 Wheeler should be nowhere near your top lines / PP1.

I thought Namestnikov and Ehlers were pretty good but you are right Wheeler has to come off, put Barron up there.

 

[surixon]

I don't think the lunch pail hockey was the plan from the beginning - the org knows what they have and what they are capable of.
But when a team is struggling with execution (for an extended period), coaching to a simple system makes sense.

Our players have the skill to be able to adapt or shift in how they play - I don't think anyone is asking KC, Ehlers or Scheif to play power forward roles, but they are asking them to do pretty basic hockey that might include going to the net or work to the open ice for better opportunities.
How may rebounds did Fleury leave laying around all night that our guys had no desire jump on - that takes a lot more work and a desire to go to the hard areas of the ice - there is no reason why our skill can't do that. The problem is, they don't appear to want to.

When you are playing sloppy hockey and struggling to even complete a pass, you need to reset and that usually begins with fundamentals - and your team needs to be willing to shift to that sort of game until they sort things out. I do not believe for a minute, that they are not capable of doing that. It looks more like they either don't want to or are struggling with the idea of keeping it simple.

Greasy goals count too - and Fleury left a ton of opportunity for this team to score a bunch of the last night. Is our core too elite for that task or are they not interested in getting to the hard areas of the ice. We are a perimeter team at this point - 5v5 and on the PP. That is the basic issue right now.

Good points. However I have found our offensive schemes to be lacking even earlier in the year when we were winning. Also I'd be much less concerned if this wasn't exactly what happened with Dallas under him last year.

I think Bones gets defensive hockey but I don't think he has a great grasp on the X's and O's of offensive hockey.

Anyhow the team is working and nothingness going to change systems wise with under 20 games left. We.are just goingnto have to hope they start executing.

 

[SensibleGuy]

I'm more worried about Nashville who are only 6 points back with 4 games in hand.

Yup. The Preds going 13-8 in their final 21 doesn't at all seem out of the question and that puts the line at 97 pts. We'd need to go 11-6 at least. And the reality is, it feels like 6-11 is just as likely for us.

 

[PaulPooley]

I invited one of the kids to watch the second period with me. Poor fella.

Personally I prefer your poems…

 

[BigZ65]

Yes if Helly played like normal Helly we would have won yesterday.

Probably would have got a point. Think the threshold to say “we coulda won but the goalie” is 3 goals before beat down.

 

[kanadalainen]

Personally I prefer your poems…

Noted. I'm unbelievably frustrated with this team.

 

[BigZ65]

No it won't change this year. I'm just pretty frustrated like most on here. Yeah it will come back to fundamental hockey which isn't a strong point for our group.

I don't mind our d and PK schemes but I'm so sick of this org having no clue on how to help our skilled forwards out. We aren't Colorado, Edmonton, NJ etc where we have a group of high skilled and incredibly quick forwards that can just pull teams out with pure speed or physical ability. What we have is a forward core with players with high levels of hockey iq. We need to build schemes that work around this but we just either play system less hockey in the ozone or incredibly basic puck to point and shoot it at net with traffic hockey. They need to build things that take advantage of our players ability to play In traffic, understanding of lanes and spacing etc....

I just don't get it, this team prioritizes hockey IQ on draft day more then any other attribute but doesn't employee systems to take advantage of it.

Look at the PP specialists the cap teams pull out of their arses to take a load off the top 6 types too.

We have Gagner and then really prioritize PK in the bottom 6…but none of those bottom 6 can play heavy 5 on 5 minutes once we’re down a goal or two.

 

[BoneDocUK]

Prime Perreault was several tiers above our current bottom 6 crop. He was a legit 1st line player most nights in terms of production and made every line he played on better. After Buff he's the guy I miss the most

Agree. I'd have him and Little neck and neck with most-missed former Jets.

Yeah, he slowed with age, but at his peak he could do it all, and no Jet ever hated losing a puck battle more than Matty P. Tiny Rottweiler that could pester and score.

What a difference maker he'd be right now.

Nino is doing his best, but I think ya gotta be small, fast and angry to be a Perrault-level scoring superpest.

 

[Mortimer Snerd]

This team is just absolutely snake-bit now. No one can score and Helle can't stop beach balls.

 

[Weezeric]

Agree. I'd have him and Little neck and neck with most-missed former Jets.

Yeah, he slowed with age, but at his peak he could do it all, and no Jet ever hated losing a puck battle more than Matty P. Tiny Rottweiler that could pester and score.

What a difference maker he'd be right now.

Nino is doing his best, but I think ya gotta be small, fast and angry to be a Perrault-level scoring superpest.

One of the best injury prone players to never score more than 45 points of all time?

 

[surixon]

Excellent post.

It's been a wild ride the past few years (and a Wild ride last night). Choose your poison from these two hallowed Jets' team identities:

- Team blows in most metrics, somehow outscores opposition, wins unsustainedly, lacks the structure and depth to go on a playoff run, gets swept

- Team improved in most metrics, somehow outscored by opposition, loses unsustainedly, may have the structure if not depth to go on playoff run but gets pipped to the most by [insert hated rival here], misses playoffs and/or gets swept

Welcome to our 2019-2023 Jerts. Good / not good.

Maybe it's the hockey God's enacting penance on us for all those years outscoring the many issues on the team.

 

[CorgisPer60]

Just need to win 10 of their last 17 games. The way they've been playing, that's a tall order. I can easily see this group falling out of the playoff picture overall. Maybe then we'll see the change that I wanted to see last off season. You can't just put lipstick on a pig.

 

[surixon]

Just need to win 10 of their last 17 games. The way they've been playing, that's a tall order. I can easily see this group falling out of the playoff picture overall. Maybe then we'll see the change that I wanted to see last off season. You can't just put lipstick on a pig.

What change do you want to see?

-Blowing up the core and rebuild
-Change in management
- drastic roster surgery to try to stay competetive

 

[AlaskaJet]

I think there's a pretty good chance we miss the playoffs, as ludicrous as that sounds. I'm honestly speechless. Some players just don't seem to care.

Crazy thought here..Perhaps a few core players feel they have a “special relationship” with Chipman or GM and don’t have to listen to the coach..?
Is this even possible?

 

[surixon]

Crazy thought here..Perhaps a few core players feel they have a “special relationship” with Chipman or GM and don’t have to listen to the coach..?
Is this even possible?

Honestly who isn't listening to the coach. The team is playing well and on the whole this year has played hard and is outplaying their opposition. Seems like a team bought in, we are just on the opposite side of the shot/save spectrum then what we were on 19/22.

 

[Jack7222]

This is why i think it's silly when people are like "lol screw the corsi won the scorsi" when Helle blatantly steals games for us.

This game is a much better harbinger of what's to come and instead tons of people are freaking out about needing to blow it up and fire the GM. I mean yes we need wins at this point but to me, Helle having a sh*t game while we play well is much better news than our goalie stealing games for us, isn't it? It's eminently more fixable (as long as Helle gets out of this funk...)

I've also liked Scheif's game the last few weeks.

 

[SLAYER]

Gummies are the key to coping.

I'm just so-so on edibles. The legal market dispensary ones are prohibitively expensive as I typically require (what I would consider) a "medium" amount and they're only sold 10mg at a time. The grey market ones are inconsistent with their dosages and even reliable brands are sometimes off... or you get some fake-ass gummies that are sprayed with distillate and don't do anything.

It's sort of a gamble, where hitting that sweet spot always seems elusive.

 

[AlaskaJet]

Honestly who isn't listening to the coach. The team is playing well and on the whole this year has played hard and is outplaying their opposition. Seems like a team bought in, we are just on the opposite side of the shot/save spectrum then what we were on 19/22.

My brother left Winnipeg for Australia after his geology degree in ‘72 but has been a non-stop Jets fan.
If I moved to Adelaide, would my perception of which direction the Jets are flushing make any difference?

 

[scelaton]

Honestly who isn't listening to the coach. The team is playing well and on the whole this year has played hard and is outplaying their opposition. Seems like a team bought in, we are just on the opposite side of the shot/save spectrum then what we were on 19/22.

Yes and no. I do believe the team has bought in and there is no longer the sense that the inmates are running the asylum, as in the last stages of the Maurice era. But I don't think it's just luck, randomness or something out of management's control. Coaching has stabilized the dressing room, but I don't see anything world-beating in their systems, and the PP is embarrassingly static and predictable.

In the end, this does not appear to be a winning core and unless they surprise in the next two months, surgery is in order. If they miss the playoffs, major surgery is in order. I would consider only one D, one G and one F as untouchable.

 

[surixon]

Yes and no. I do believe the team has bought in and there is no longer the sense that the inmates are running the asylum, as in the last stages of the Maurice era. But I don't think it's just luck, randomness or something out of management's control. Coaching has stabilized the dressing room, but I don't see anything world-beating in their systems, and the PP is embarrassingly static and predictable.

In the end, this does not appear to be a winning core and unless they surprise in the next two months, surgery is in order. If they miss the playoffs, major surgery is in order. I would consider only one D, one G and one F as untouchable.

Not saying I disagree with this as I've mentioned before in this thread I don't think our coaching helps us in the offensive third. But it is starting to become apparent that we may not have the horses or enough of them to make noise in the post season.

A player like Scheifele would be a 2C on every contending team at this point of his career. Can you win with him as your 1C especially as he enters his 30's. I have major doubts on that. I also don't see the calvary from our prospect pool arriving in time to push the Scheifele, Helle group up like what the JoMo, Conner, Laine, Ehelers etc group did for the Wheeler, Buff etc core.

So we really are in tough spot.

 

[gojetsgo]

lets just hope we learn to finish and stop pucks again and we will be fine

 

[Jack7222]

I'm just so-so on edibles. The legal market dispensary ones are prohibitively expensive as I typically require (what I would consider) a "medium" amount and they're only sold 10mg at a time. The grey market ones are inconsistent with their dosages and even reliable brands are sometimes off... or you get some fake-ass gummies that are sprayed with distillate and don't do anything.

It's sort of a gamble, where hitting that sweet spot always seems elusive.

Agree. What I don't like about it is that you lose the more dramatic 'transition' of a faster-acting effect (like smoking or vaping), so it's more awkward to psychologically (and socially) modulate. Like when you're in the mood for a beer or a smoke, bang you can grab it and you know what to expect and you slide into it with good vibes. If you want a little more you can grab a little more. Edibles all sneaking up on you hours later makes it way harder to purposefully enjoy properly for me...

 

[gojetsgo]

man people are crying on reddit for stanley to be suspended, I mean I'm all for samberg playing over him but that was a complete accident...

 

[sipowicz]

I get the frustration and it’s certainly warranted, but the general reaction in here is way over the top for a game that we dominated and simply got bad goaltending. No I’m not saying it’s a moral victory. Just acting like the season is done today is a bit much after a game like that. We’re actually trending back in the right direction finally.

2 wins in the last 11 games, it looks like a team that doesn't even want to be in the PO's!

Yup, the Jets are right where they want to be....