Sidney Crosby hasn't won an Art Ross trophy after his age 26 season. Neither has McDavid. Will McDavid win more still?

[Canovin]

McDavid is only missing 2 trophies. Selke and Stanley cup. Like others said, Art Ross is not his priority.

Edit: Forgot Olympic gold

 

[Voight]

The answer is a resounding yes. The only group that tries to tear down Gretzky religiously as well.

I blame the Steelers partially as their success/arrogance bled into the pens fanbase. We always have to either be the best or have the best. When we don’t (which we don’t) we will attack the actual best and their fans even though being content with what we’ve had for championships and generational talent should be easy. Having lived here my whole life I can say that not all of us are like this (really solid minority of content pens fans) but there is a central cult mind that dictates a lot of the stuff you see.

Gretzky and McDavid live rent free here for the majority. You’ll hear it in conversations and online and for obvious reasons. It isn’t because they hate Edmonton (a western conference non rival). You’ll see some online pens fans really pulling hard for MacKinnon and it isn’t because they like the Avs.

It's the definition of an inferiority complex. Kind oof sad people can put things aside and simply acknowledge that Lemieux isn't as good as Gretzky and McDavid is better than Sid. Nobody is calling those two bottom feeders; they can be all time greats while not being at the same lelevel of the Edmonton duo.

 

[SomeDude]

A pretty interesting topic and discussion that the usual fan boys have devolved into yet another pissing contest.

It all comes down to health. I don’t see how he doesn’t win at least 1 more if he stays healthy. Until/if Chicago gets their act together around Bedard, I do not see a legitimate young contender for being a perennial threat right now.

I think for the next 3-5 years the winner will be between McDavid, Mackinnon, Draisaitl, and Kucherov. There are some guys in the tier below who could take the next step or have a big year, but if all those 4 are healthy I think they will have it nailed down. They should start noticeably slowing down after that window.

 

[Homesick]

He's only 8 points behind and puts up more points Jan-Apr over the past 4-5 years

 

[Phosphophyllite]

I see McDavid winning 2-3 more in the next 5 years, and continuing to have an outside shot at it even past his prime. His current competition is slightly older than he is, and the current crop of youngsters in the league are unlikely to ever reach his level of offensive dominance. Whoever the "next one" is, I don't think they are currently in the league.

 

[BraveCanadian]

I think there is a good chance McDavid is still competing for the next few.

It isn't even out of left field that he could overtake people this year.

 

[Nadal On Clay]

It all comes back to Daver stating that Crosby was the best player in the world at age 30 (2017-18 season). I disagree with this and think that McDavid pretty clearly took that title some time during the 2016-17 season. I never said anything about any player being garbage.

I said one of the weakest Smythes. Both of Crosby's Conn Smythes are on the weaker side. Yes the 2016 Smythe is weaker than the 2017 Smythe, but they are both weak.

Crosby’s 2017 Smythe when he was playing at a 92 pts per 82 level? That would’ve landed him 2nd place in scoring that year in the RS scoring race.

In comparison, McDavid’s “generational run” last year saw him pacing for 138 pts per 82 games, which would have been good for 3rd in the RS scoring race.

Crosby’s 2017 Smythe definitely was not weak. Scoring environment matters.

 

[Staniowski]

Crosby's last Art Ross was at age 26 (his 9th season); McDavid's most recent was at age 25 (his 8th season).

They're only the same age if you're using the weirdo Hockey-Reference age cut-off.

 

[Staniowski]

McDavid certainly is capable of winning multiple scoring titles over the next several years. But he has some excellent competition (with some younger players with the potential to join the group), and he ain't getting any younger, so it's not assured.

 

[TheLegend27]

Crosby’s 2017 Smythe when he was playing at a 92 pts per 82 level? That would’ve landed him 2nd place in scoring that year in the RS scoring race.

In comparison, McDavid’s “generational run” last year saw him pacing for 138 pts per 82 games, which would have been good for 3rd in the RS scoring race.

Crosby’s 2017 Smythe definitely was not weak. Scoring environment matters.

Mario’s 44 in 23(1.91 pace) would have landed him second in 90-91 as well, that’s not a good way of comparing anything because you ignore the level of competition. Malkin had one more point in one more game, which to me looks like a larger impact on offense since the games you didn’t play are worthless to your team. Can we admit that 2016 & 2017 Pens cups were a collection of team effort rather than pure individual brilliance. That doesn’t hurt Crosby’s legacy, just shows how everyone played their role perfectly at the right time.

 

[Nathaniel Skywalker]

Incoming suspension

 

[bobbyking]

regardless crosby is not as dominant as mcdavid. we've seen enough now

 

[Nadal On Clay]

Mario’s 44 in 23(1.91 pace) would have landed him second in 90-91 as well, that’s not a good way of comparing anything because you ignore the level of competition. Malkin had one more point in one more game, which to me looks like a larger impact on offense since the games you didn’t play are worthless to your team. Can we admit that 2016 & 2017 Pens cups were a collection of team effort rather than pure individual brilliance. That doesn’t hurt Crosby’s legacy, just shows how everyone played their role perfectly at the right time.

Yes, Crosby and Malkin were both great during that run. Malkin compiled a bit more in the first round while Crosby was better in the finals while drawing the tougher matchups. Not sure what the point is here.

 

[daver]

Mario’s 44 in 23(1.91 pace) would have landed him second in 90-91 as well, that’s not a good way of comparing anything because you ignore the level of competition. Malkin had one more point in one more game, which to me looks like a larger impact on offense since the games you didn’t play are worthless to your team. Can we admit that 2016 & 2017 Pens cups were a collection of team effort rather than pure individual brilliance. That doesn’t hurt Crosby’s legacy, just shows how everyone played their role perfectly at the right time.

A bunch of secondary assists against an overwhelmed first round opponent does not equal greater offensive impact. Crosby's four points in the first two games if the Caps series was much more significant.

 

[Dessloch]

Sidney Crosby played his entire 26+ year old career as a completely different player thanks to the Steckel hit. He was a wrecking ball going hard to the net creating chances on his own up til that happened and had to adapt to as more perimeter passive passing game to keep more safe from further head/neck injuries. The Sidney Crosby beating guy 1 on 1 and crashing the net without hesitation was gone after his comeback. Its insane he adapted his game and still were successful, not with as good as results he had before, but still elite.

So its not a valid comparison to make with McDavid!

On top of that McDavid keeps playing on the same line as Drasaitl a quality linemate Crosby never had.

McDavid will win 2 to 4 more Art Rosses for sure unless he gets hurt, he is that good!

 

[daver]

Sidney Crosby played his entire 26+ year old career as a completely different player thanks to the Steckel hit. He was a wrecking ball going hard to the net creating chances on his own up til that happened and had to adapt to as more perimeter passive passing game to keep more safe from further head/neck injuries. The Sidney Crosby beating guy 1 on 1 and crashing the net without hesitation was gone after his comeback. Its insane he adapted his game and still were successful, not with as good as results he had before, but still elite.

NHL Stats

The official source for NHL Stats including skaters, goalies, teams stats and more.

www.nhl.com

Here are his stats after being recovered completely up until his 14/15 season was affected by a viral illness and new coach who went full defensive mode. He was 21% clear in points and 18% clear in PPG. It was fluke that he didn't win another Ross after 13/14. Yes, he changed his playing style for awhile but still was on another level offensively.

After Sullivan was hired in Dec of 2016, he returned to league best form:

NHL Stats

The official source for NHL Stats including skaters, goalies, teams stats and more.

www.nhl.com

His PPG wasn't quite as dominant but he did also return to being an elite goalscorer as he was willing to go to the net more which lead to two more concussions which likely cost him the 16/17 Ross and the 2017 playoff scoring title.

McDavid has been fortunate with injuries to this point but as we have seen this season and last, he is not necessarily an automatic for the Ross despite being the clear favourite.

 

[bobbyking]

It all comes back to Daver stating that Crosby was the best player in the world at age 30 (2017-18 season). I disagree with this and think that McDavid pretty clearly took that title some time during the 2016-17 season. I never said anything about any player being garbage.

I said one of the weakest Smythes. Both of Crosby's Conn Smythes are on the weaker side. Yes the 2016 Smythe is weaker than the 2017 Smythe, but they are both weak.

only a clown or hater would say 2017 was weak

 

[bobbyking]

McDavid is only missing 2 trophies. Selke and Stanley cup. Like others said, Art Ross is not his priority.

Edit: Forgot Olympic gold

he wasn't going to win missing all those games

 

[wetcoast]

Incoming suspension

Ya and while I voted for 2 more I was thinking he would win it this year but with 3 more missed games that seems unlikely now.

No doubt some of the people that have crapped on Crosby will find the same things to say about their guy in the future about this season and other ones right?

I mean he still might win 2 more after this season but a lot has to go right even for the great ones today.

 

[Nathaniel Skywalker]

Ya and while I voted for 2 more I was thinking he would win it this year but with 3 more missed games that seems unlikely now.

No doubt some of the people that have crapped on Crosby will find the same things to say about their guy in the future about this season and other ones right?

I mean he still might win 2 more after this season but a lot has to go right even for the great ones today.

They were already trying that last season

 

[Ezpz]

He's washed. He will never win another award.

 

[TheLegend27]

Sidney Crosby played his entire 26+ year old career as a completely different player thanks to the Steckel hit. He was a wrecking ball going hard to the net creating chances on his own up til that happened and had to adapt to as more perimeter passive passing game to keep more safe from further head/neck injuries. The Sidney Crosby beating guy 1 on 1 and crashing the net without hesitation was gone after his comeback. Its insane he adapted his game and still were successful, not with as good as results he had before, but still elite.

So its not a valid comparison to make with McDavid!

On top of that McDavid keeps playing on the same line as Drasaitl a quality linemate Crosby never had.

McDavid will win 2 to 4 more Art Rosses for sure unless he gets hurt, he is that good!

It would be far more believable that the Steckel hit significantly impacted his production if his PPG went from 1.61 in 2011 to something like 1.2 the following years. Instead, we get small samples in both 12 and 13 that show his PPG being directly in line with pre Steckel 2010-2011. You’re either saying 12 & 13 were fluke, unsustainable pace years after his play was significantly altered, or that those years were legit and the hit hasn’t significantly hindered his production. Which one is it?.

 

[bobholly39]

Ya and while I voted for 2 more I was thinking he would win it this year but with 3 more missed games that seems unlikely now.

No doubt some of the people that have crapped on Crosby will find the same things to say about their guy in the future about this season and other ones right?

I mean he still might win 2 more after this season but a lot has to go right even for the great ones today.

Still a lot of ways this could go.

McDavid can come back supremely motivated and wanting to prove a point, and go off after his suspension and win the Ross this year still. Historically, he does have a habit of finishing seasons really strong in the last ~1-2 months of season.

But yes - I started this thread because I thought it was intriguing some of the similarities with Crosby's career path. I say there's a lot of ways it can go, and one of those ways is that McDavid doesn't win an art ross beyond age 26, just like Crosby. Maybe this year is because of suspension, maybe he gets injured in a future season, maybe a guy like Bedard or whoever takes off after that...very plausible.

And McDavid winning the Art Ross this year, as well as the next 3 in a row, is also a possibility too. But again - we said the same thing about Crosby at this age.