Shea Theodore Out Until Playoffs

[Blueline Bomber]

If every team is allowed to do it, and they are then Vegas isn't breaking any rules.

Even if they were who cares it works.

But since every team is allowed to do it they aren't.

I'm surprised they haven't been defering money when doing contract extensions.

That would be a Vegas thing to do but Carolina did it first, then Toronto did it with McCabe.

So far Vegas hasn't done it which surprises me.

Technically, Arizona did it first for one of the Doan contracts. No one remembers though because it was in 2016.

 

[LEAFANFORLIFE23]

Technically, Arizona did it first for one of the Doan contracts. No one remembers though because it was in 2016.

I certainly didn't remember it.

 

[K1984]

You can't LTIR just for the sake of doing so. The league has to sign off on it. If there were actually rule breaking and the league discovered that the team is misusing it the league will punish the team. So you can't say the league just will ignore it.

What’s more likely?

Every Vegas player that goes on LTIR every year is coincidentally healthy for Game 1 of the playoffs, not a day sooner or later, or that they have players that are healthy and eligible to play, but are instead burning the rest of the year off on LTIR?

If every team is allowed to do it, and they are then Vegas isn't breaking any rules.

Even if they were who cares it works.

But since every team is allowed to do it they aren't.

I'm surprised they haven't been defering money when doing contract extensions.

That would be a Vegas thing to do but Carolina did it first, then Toronto did it with McCabe.

So far Vegas hasn't done it which surprises me.

They’re pretty clearly breaking rules, but the league doesn’t care and isn’t willing to enforce them.

 

[PlayMakers]

What’s more likely?

Every Vegas player that goes on LTIR every year is coincidentally healthy for Game 1 of the playoffs, not a day sooner or later, or that they have players that are healthy and eligible to play, but are instead burning the rest of the year off on LTIR?

Ding ding ding we have a winner.

 

[Star Platinum]

If they exploit the loophole constantly, close the f***ing loophole.

 

[gstommylee]

What’s more likely?

Every Vegas player that goes on LTIR every year is coincidentally healthy for Game 1 of the playoffs, not a day sooner or later, or that they have players that are healthy and eligible to play, but are instead burning the rest of the year off on LTIR?



They’re pretty clearly breaking rules, but the league doesn’t care and isn’t willing to enforce them.

First of all the NHL won't let teams use LTIR just for the sake of using it. Second of all there has been ZERO rule breaking. What is actually rule breaking is putting a healthy guy on LTIR. No doctor would risk his medical lisence by making up an injury and lying to the league about it.

Ever consider that time line of injuries do happen to sometimes lineup to where the player is cleared to play when the playoffs happen. There is nothing against the rules of what vegas is doing. Injuries happen and the rules do ALLOW for a team to put a player on LTIR when they can't afford to replace the hurt player which AGAIN the NHL has to sign off on it and use that cap space to replace said player or add additional players to the roster to the max of that cap hit.


If NHL actually ingored abuse of LTIR and it comes back to find out that there being some legit case of medical forgery and made up reports just so teams can LTIR someone, there can be some very very huge legal immplications both against the league, team and the doctors. Medical fraud is very much ILLEGAL.

 

[BigDaddyLurch]

 

[MetalheadPenguinsFan]

 

[TheBeard]

What is actually rule breaking is putting a healthy guy on LTIR. No doctor would risk his medical lisence by making up an injury and lying to the league about it.

And no way the NHL would come out and insist a player come off LTIR if the club and their “doctors” deem it too early. The NHLPA would have a field day and the publicity would be awful.

 

[hangman005]

First of all the NHL won't let teams use LTIR just for the sake of using it. Second of all there has been ZERO rule breaking. What is actually rule breaking is putting a healthy guy on LTIR. No doctor would risk his medical lisence by making up an injury and lying to the league about it.

Ever consider that time line of injuries do happen to sometimes lineup to where the player is cleared to play when the playoffs happen. There is nothing against the rules of what vegas is doing. Injuries happen and the rules do ALLOW for a team to put a player on LTIR when they can't afford to replace the hurt player which AGAIN the NHL has to sign off on it and use that cap space to replace said player or add additional players to the roster to the max of that cap hit.


If NHL actually ingored abuse of LTIR and it comes back to find out that there being some legit case of medical forgery and made up reports just so teams can LTIR someone, there can be some very very huge legal immplications both against the league, team and the doctors. Medical fraud is very much ILLEGAL.

And notice the narative is always that the player stays "injured" until the end of the regular seasons, and not the player has returned early because playoffs.

 

[Bruce Granville]

And again the neutral fans are on the Oilers, Kings, Nucks and Flames bandwagon…

 

[Sergei Shirokov]

Only took 1 day for a Vegas injury to go from 'week-to-week' to out until playoffs. Someone must've slipped up with the initial report.

Good on them for continuing to exploit this loophole its just sad the league keeps playing favourites with them.

 

[12ozPapa]

No dog in this fight but it is getting quite silly how these Vegas players keep having injuries that keep them out until game 1 of the playoffs

 

[izzy]

This is getting to be a bit out of hand..

 

[wunderpanda]

everyone needs to stop being jealous of vegas and accept their business model best exploits the established system. be mad at your gm being too stupid to do the same thing. be mad you don't have the depth to pressbox a top player for months and not fall off. don't be mad at vegas for highlighting the incompetence you cheer for.

 

[LuGBuG]

Welcome to Vegas, Trevor Zegras

Not only are they not going to trade him. They certainly aren’t going to trade him in the division.

 

[ijuka]

What a coincidence that he will be all ready to go for the first playoff game.

everyone needs to stop being jealous of vegas and accept their business model best exploits the established system. be mad at your gm being too stupid to do the same thing. be mad you don't have the depth to pressbox a top player for months and not fall off. don't be mad at vegas for highlighting the incompetence you cheer for.

"breaking the rules through loopholes is fine because you could break them too"

 

[Random schmoe]

And notice the narative is always that the player stays "injured" until the end of the regular seasons, and not the player has returned early because playoffs.

I think the fundamental complaint is that if a player is healthy enough to play in the playoffs, they are also healthy enough to play in the regular season.

I hate that Vegas does this year after year, I think it's against the spirit of the rules. But, not the letter. They're likely* not breaking any of the rules. (*Assuming there are legitimate injuries and they're following the internal NHL protocols, which I'm sure is accurate.)

But I do believe personally that the rules should be changed to one of the countless options that have been proposed around here over the years. Not that my opinion means a damn thing.

 

[Blueline Bomber]

The thing is, they are legitimate injuries that put them on LTIR. That’s not the issue. The issue is that they likely stay on LTIR to exploit that loophole, even when the players have become healthy enough to play.

“But team doctors won’t risk medical license!” First, no one is taking a doctors medical license for exaggerating an injury for a professional team. Second, the doctors can get by the questionable ethics of it by stating the obvious: It’s late in the NHL season. It’s likely 85-90% of players are nursing SOME kind of injury by this point. So while the player may hit LTIR because of a serious injury, they can stay on LTIR because they’re not “healthy”, just like 85-90% of the league.

 

[HabsQC]

Sorry but that was right after the injury in the GDT :

 

[TheSuperElite]

shocker!

 

[Fatass]

That’s a big loss for Vegas. Pietrangelo made a smart choice.

 

[HanSolo]

If you NEED to take advantage of a loophole like this, you weren't good at team building to begin with.

In all honesty though, you might be right. I really feel like McCrimmon just chases the acquirable big names and hopes they stick. Vegas was a finalist for Erik Karlsson before they ended up going after Pietrangelo. They're currently rumored to be in the mix for Marchand. I could go on and on. I don't think McCrimmon is targeting guys with some carefully crafted plan that considers team chemistry/make up, I think he's just playing a slot matching and hoping he hits a jackpot with the players he cycles in and out.

I mean in 2023 Vegas won on the back of a deep line up and great defensive systems coached in by Cassidy that helped elevate Hill. Since then, McCrimmon seems to be pulling guys in at random after he had to dump millions in cap from the cap hell he put the team in.

All that to say, I don't really think there's a deeper plan to acquisitions McCrimmon picks up. Just bodies to replace what he had to give away. All that said, I really doubt Vegas is pleased Theodore is going to be out this long. With Hill and Samsonov so inconsistent, missing a top defenseman for that long on top of missing their best defensive forward in Karlsson, it could really hurt their playoff standing.

 

[Voight]

I've said it before and I'll say it again, if your GM isn't cheating by abusing the LTIR loophole, it's just being a bad GM.

I wouldn't even call it a loophole. These injuries are real; it's entirely possible the team medical staff does not want guys like him and Stone rushing back to play meaningless game at the end of the year. Also, the league has independent doctors that review this stuff. They could say Theodore for example should be good to go in a month, but that wouldn't make Vegas' team doctor wrong, just a difference of medical opinion.

Don't tell me to not hate the team I hated an entire year before they started playing because of their owner's West Point fetish. I'll hate who I want for whatever reason, and there is plenty of reason to hate them as a team.

Again, if it's not against the rules and it keeps getting exploited, make it against the rules. My team got screwed by rule changes after the 2004-05 lockout. It's happened before.

How are you got g to make it against the rules? There isn't anything they could do.

If the league says anyone who didn't play game 82 isn't eligible for half or all of the first round, the NHLPA will riot. It's entirely possible some guys are healthy for the last game or two but the team doesn't take them off LTIR because it doesn't make sense to risk aggravating the injury that kept them out.

 

[Voight]

Vegas and Tampa fans: We obviously need a cap limit, otherwise other richer teams could just spend more money and their roster and it would be unfair! Teams should all be spending up to the same limit for parity, otherwise teams that spend more have an unfair advantage over us

Also Vegas and Tampa fans: It's not cheating if we abuse LTIR to spend above the cap limit and more than the rest of the league. All we're doing is spending more money on our roster, it's within the rules!


Just fix it already, it isn't rocket science. So many ways to do it.


1) A player that ends the regular season on LTIR cannot be activated in the playoffs. You expect him back in the playoffs ? Cool, don't go adding another 10M (or whatever his cap hit is) worth of player(s) and then re-activate the "injured player"

You're not expecting him back for playoffs ? Cool you get the cap relief to bolster the roster and spend up to the cap limit just like everyone else.

2) LTIR with limit vs season ending LTIR. Players put on LTIR must remain out of the lineup a minimum of 90 days, maximum of 150 days. If his time on LTIR exceeds 150 days, he is put on season ending LTIR and ineligible to return at any point.

3) Add a luxury tax with a soft cap. The teams that spend over the cap, pay a luxury tax, which is then evenly distributed among say the bottom 5-10 revenue generating teams. Similar to what the NBA does. LTIR players must be activated be before the season ends, if that pushes you over the cap, pay a luxury tax.

4) Re-activation window. If it's in the regular season, something like a 1 week window. Player must be activated 7 days before being eligible to play/practice. If it's in the playoffs, make it a 2-3 week window.


But honestly keep it simple, you finish the season on LTIR, you are ineligible to play in the playoffs. You expect to play in the playoffs ? Ok get activated and cap compliant by game 82. With the expected increases in the cap, this can easily be implemented. If the cap goes up say 5M this year, implement the rule and GMs should manage their cap properly in case of injury. Don't spend 100% up to the cap, give yourself like 5% to breathe.

NHLPA will never agree to any of these.