Speaking of Musty it is interesting to see how he would be viewed if he went the USNDT and college route. He was seen as one of the best 2005 US players at a young age. If he played on the USNDT he would maybe even have been on the top line with Smith and would have likely been a top 5-10 pick.
Prospect Info: Sharks Prospect Info & Discussion Thread XX
- Thread starter The Nemesis
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Juxtaposer
Outro: Divina Comedia
Precisely. I like Musty the most out of all of them, but we really do only need one of them to really hit.
sharks_dynasty
Registered User
I’m voting for all three to hit so we can sell high and upgrade our D!
jMoneyBrah
Registered User
Eklund - Celebrini - Zetterlund
Musty/Halttunen/Chernyshov - Smith - ???
Am I missing something? Wouldn’t that only be 5 top 6?
CaptainShark
Registered User
You can easily fill that last spot via trade/UFA-signing.
Zetterlund isn’t a bona-fide top-6-winger either, he should be on the 3rd-line for a team with real ambitions.
jMoneyBrah
Registered User
Prior to Toffoli, who was the last top-6 forward the Sharks signed? Like, I’m not being flippant. Have they ever?
Edit: okay, some poking around and so far @Sheng Peng’s good work from a while back tells me our best forward signings are: Tony Granato, Mike Grier, and Scott Thornton
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I did a little research to see exactly how many top 6 forwards have the Sharks signed as UFA’s. The answer is more than zero but not many you would want in your top 6. The criteria is ATOI min 20 games. Players listed in order.
23-24
Granlund (Trade)
Hertl
Zetterlund (Trade)
Eklund
Duclair (Trade)
Barabonov (Trade)
22-23
Meier
Hertl
Couture
Barabonov (Trade)
Bonino (UFA)
Nieto (UFA)
21-22
Hertl
Meier
Couture
Barabonov (Trade)
Bonino (UFA)
Balcers (Waivers)
20-21
Kane (Trade)
Couture
Hertl
Labanc
Meier
Gambrell
19-20
Kane (Trade)
Couture
Hertl
Meier
Goodrow (undrafted FA)
Labanc
18-19
Pavelski
Hertl
Couture
Kane (Trade)
Meier
Thornton (Trade)
17-18
Kane (Trade)
Pavelski
Couture
Thornton (Trade)
Hertl
Tierney
16-17
Pavelski
Thornton (Trade)
Couture
Hertl
Marleau
Ward (UFA)
15-16
Pavelski
Marleau
Thornton (Trade)
Couture
Ward (UFA)
Hertl
14-15
Pavelski
Marleau
Couture
Thornton (Trade)
Wingles
Karlsson (Euro FA)
13-14
Marleau
Pavelski
Thornton (Trade)
Couture
Burns (Trade)
Wingles
12-13
Marleau
Pavelski
Thornton (Trade)
Couture
Clowe
Havlát (Trade)
11-12
Pavelski
Marleau
Thornton (Trade)
Couture
Clowe
Havlát (Trade)
10-11
Marleau
Thornton (Trade)
Pavelski
Heatley (Trade)
Clowe
Couture
09-10
Marleau
Heatley (Trade)
Thornton (Trade)
Pavelski
Clowe
Malhotra (UFA)
08-09
Marleau
Thornton (Trade)
Pavelski
Michalek
Clowe
Setoguchi
07-08
Thornton (Trade)
Marleau
Michalek
Cheechoo
Grier (UFA)
Mitchell
06-07
Thornton (Trade)
Marleau
Cheechoo
Michalek
Grier (UFA)
Pavelski
05-06
Thornton (Trade)
Cheechoo
Marleau
Sturm
Michalek
Nieminen (Trade)
OrrNumber4
Registered User
- Jul 25, 2002
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Great work; the steelman of the "Sharks can't sign good forwards" case. Now for the other side...in the cap era, the Sharks just couldn't sign those upper-range free agents. They didn't have the money, the cap space, or the need.
Until 2014, the Sharks were owned by a fairly frugal group. They couldn't give out term, or the front-loaded, big-bonus contracts that were standard. With Hasso Plattner, this issue is moot.
From 2005-2022, when they were competing (or "competing") the Sharks have always been a "cap" team. Hard to pay FAs when they literally can't. This will eventually be an issue, but shouldn't be an obstacle.
On the need, the Sharks have historically (really, from franchise-founding) had a great forward group. More scoring is always good, but find me a year where an additional scoring forward was a big need. And they have a middling record of bringing in upper-half players in the other positions...Blake, Martin, Preissing, Stuart, Schlemko, Niemi, and Reimer off the top of my head.
Lastly, I'll add that the Sharks have been very close on several giant fish (Niedemayer, Chara, Weber, and Tavares). "Very slose" doesn't get you anything, but it's clear that players are interested in signing in SJ.
Juxtaposer
Outro: Divina Comedia
No team has six home grown top-6 forwards, or even five if you don’t want to count Zetterlund. Just doesn’t happen.
Grinner
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- May 31, 2022
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Aren't Haltunnen and Chernyshov both right hand shots?
There were a few Sharks teams where Thornton was the only non homegrown member of the top-6.
I do think this team with the recent drafting and most of the players on similar timelines has a chance to have an entirely homegrown top-6.
OrrNumber4
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- Jul 25, 2002
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0 cups...
Plus for me, it's about having some experience in the team. I don't think it would with with 6 top-6 forwards under 23.
STL Shark
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- Mar 6, 2013
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Not even just experience, but different experiences in the game. Guys that have played under different coaches and different development staffs that can trade ideas and make each other better. Something often taken for granted in sports.
Getting guys in that are older, have been through tough playoff series, and just have different professional backgrounds will be invaluable, even if they cost a little more and will mean we trade some prospects along the way. The goal of drafting is to draft a core group rather than draft the entire group. No team in the league drafts at a level even remotely close enough to compete with a homegrown group entirely.
If your group is all homegrown, it's not going to be very good because there simply isn't enough competition for jobs.
Prime Heatley was really good but that was his Ottawa days not his Sharks days.
I do agree that Halttunen is a long shot - I'm rooting for him but too early to pencil him in the top 6. I hope he gets bigger 5 on 5 role with London this year
It is objectively funny that this is what we’re arguing about now. Like we’ve ever been in the position to have 5 guys all develop simultaneously into top 6 forwards.
Crankshaft Mechanic
Registered User
- Jun 27, 2024
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It is objectively funny that this is what we’re arguing about now. Like we’ve ever been in the position to have 5 guys all develop simultaneously into top 6 forwards.
An embarrassment of riches. And even more high-end talent incoming next June in all likelihood.
Hodge
Registered User
- Apr 27, 2021
- 6,181
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2 years ago our top prospects were Eklund, Bordeleau, Wiesblatt and Merkley. Then we hired a competent GM.
The 08-09 team had Marleau, Pavelski, Michalek, Clowe, and Seto to go along with Jumbo. It is not unheard of to have 5 top 6 forwards drafted and developed by an organization.It is objectively funny that this is what we’re arguing about now. Like we’ve ever been in the position to have 5 guys all develop simultaneously into top 6 forwards.
sharks_dynasty
Registered User
It’s more than just the hiring of a competent GM. The GM came in with an aggressive plan to tear down, accumulate assets, and invest heavily in drafting and development. It’s a pretty good playbook and requires absolute commitment by Hasso to execute. The previous regime didn’t have this plan or commitment from Hasso, so it’s hard lay blame when they were executing to a different plan.
Star Platinum
Registered User
- May 11, 2024
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To be fair, for the past 15 years the team didn’t really need top end talent at the forward position.
Pavelski2112
Bold as Boognish
Juxtaposer
Outro: Divina Comedia
I would argue that Setoguchi, Michalek, Pavelski, and Clowe was pretty damn close. Of course they only lasted one season as Michalek was traded and Setoguchi couldn’t stay consistent, but there was one season where our top-6 was filled with homegrown quasi-prospects.It is objectively funny that this is what we’re arguing about now. Like we’ve ever been in the position to have 5 guys all develop simultaneously into top 6 forwards.
It’s less about me not wanting to have a top-6 filled with Sharks prospects (I would love that!) and more about how unlikely it is that all these non-Celebrini prospects hit their upsides.
RussianShark
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