Speculation: Sharks 2015-2016 Roster Talk: Rumors, Roster, Proposals. Part III ‎

[pappaf2]

As a Sharks fan I'd prefer they not spend assets on subban. He's obviously a tremendously skilled player but I think he's got a bad attitude.

 

[Sharksrule04]

Well, if we can send Stalock back to the Wild as part of a deal, we'll actually improve our cap situation, since Kuemper has a lower cap hit than Stalock does. If not, we just bury him in the minors, meaning the net cap hit is going to be pretty small. I also believe that the Sharks will convince Raffi to shut it down and get put on LTIR before the deadline, which would give us some extra cap room too.

I'm confused about why anyone is concerned about cap space for the current season. Don't we have over 2M available? When you acquire players at the deadline their salary is pro rated, so with 2M available can't we technically acquire a player who is making as much as 8M for the final 20 or so games that would be left?

 

[Pinkfloyd]

Marleau sold his house 5 years ago, i am still waiting on that trade every one was expecting.

He sold his house not too long ago either...within the last year or two, I think. But this one's coming true, people just know it!

 

[magic school bus]

As a Sharks fan I'd prefer they not spend assets on subban. He's obviously a tremendously skilled player but I think he's got a bad attitude.

Umm hmm.

 

[Pinkfloyd]

I'm confused about why anyone is concerned about cap space for the current season. Don't we have over 2M available? When you acquire players at the deadline their salary is pro rated, so with 2M available can't we technically acquire a player who is making as much as 8M for the final 20 or so games that would be left?

Because there are other needs that may be acquired that they probably want to account for before worrying about a position that may play five or six games the rest of the way. If Wingels is hurt long term, would you want a replacement for him or a possible upgrade on Stalock? I'll take the skater every time. The team can probably afford around a 4 mil annual cap hit at the deadline. If we want a good defenseman, that's probably going to take the bulk of it. If we go cheap on a d-man and need depth up front, it will certainly take most of it.

 

[Barrie22]

He sold his house not too long ago either...within the last year or two, I think. But this one's coming true, people just know it!

I still say it isn't.

 

[pappaf2]

Umm hmm.

Seems like a Prima Donna. Seems to have a number of issues with teammates and coaches that have been talked about. Maybe that's just Canadian media blowing it out of proportion but seems like a bit of a red flag to me.

 

[magic school bus]

My deal? Nothing. I'd have no problems with that contract. DW and Hasso seem to have a different philosophy on those things. Dollars and term seems to be a real issue with the people in charge of signing and/or acquiring those contracts. Which is what I specifically asked about and you seemed to ignore to focus on me.

Because you brought it up earlier saying a backup goalie can't make $2M and now an elite #1 defenseman can't make $9M. You're salary constrictions are both unrealistic and inflexible which is a huge problem imo. I'd hate to have a gm who thought that way.

You don't know exactly what DW or Hasso thinks about this, you're projecting your own opinions on them. Just own up to it.

Seems like a Prima Donna. Seems to have a number of issues with teammates and coaches that have been talked about. Maybe that's just Canadian media blowing it out of proportion but seems like a bit of a red flag to me.

Racism is everywhere, pappaf2.

 

[Quid Pro Clowe]

Don't start with the racism bull ****.

 

[Fistfullofbeer]

Because you brought it up earlier saying a backup goalie can't make $2M and now an elite #1 defenseman can't make $9M. You're salary constrictions are both unrealistic and inflexible which is a huge problem imo. I'd hate to have a gm who thought that way.

You don't know exactly what DW or Hasso thinks about this, you're projecting your own opinions on them. Just own up to it.



Racism is everywhere, pappaf2.

That is ridiculous man. To me it is racist for you to assume that Subban being black is something to do with any talk about him. People have character issues regardless whether they are colored or not.

 

[pappaf2]

Racism is everywhere, pappaf2.

Can you clarify what you mean by this?

Are you saying he has more issues because his teammates and coaches are racist towards him?

Are you saying the media is racist because they blow incidents involving subban out of proportion?

Or are you actually insinuating that I am a racist?

 

[hockeyball]

That is ridiculous man. To me it is racist for you to assume that Subban being black is something to do with any talk about him. People have character issues regardless whether they are colored or not.

Seriously. No one seems concerned about Ward and how he's being mistreated.

I am pretty confident racism has absolutely nothing to do with any of this. There certainly are racist people still in the world, a lot of them, but not so many that an entire international organization is going to be controlled by them. That's absurd.

 

[Gene Parmesan]

Subban will not be traded per Dreger.

 

[Barrie22]

If there is any racism regarding subban it has nothing do with the color of his but the language that he speaks.

 

[Celly4Celebrini]

As a Sharks fan I'd prefer they not spend assets on subban. He's obviously a tremendously skilled player but I think he's got a bad attitude.

Subban to me is the PERFECT partner for Vlasic.

 

[Dicdonya]

I'm confused, has subban ever had character issues? I've always thought it was on ice antics that got the hate thrown at him, not relationships within the locker room or off the ice. Plus I feel like I haven't heard any indication he's still like that, but instead that he's grown out of it, and is a really well liked player.

 

[magic school bus]

Can you clarify what you mean by this?

Are you saying he has more issues because his teammates and coaches are racist towards him?

Are you saying the media is racist because they blow incidents involving subban out of proportion?

Or are you actually insinuating that I am a racist?

Not you, the media. Others as well.

A poster on the habs board had a great point comparing the treatment of Patrick Kane (a similar flashy player on the ice) to PK Subban. Think about what each has done and the way they're talked about, and which one is defended more/ treated better.

PK is a model citizen. And a great player. There shouldn't be a sniff of criticism around him, but there is.

And to the posters who can't handle an adult conversation about race, keep burying your head in the sand and pretending everything is sunshine and lollypops.

 

[Fistfullofbeer]

Not you, the media. Others as well.

A poster on the habs board had a great point comparing the treatment of Patrick Kane (a similar flashy player on the ice) to PK Subban. Think about what each has done and the way they're talked about, and which one is defended more/ treated better.

PK is a model citizen. And a great player. There shouldn't be a sniff of criticism around him, but there is.

And to the posters who can't handle an adult conversation about race, keep burying your head in the sand and pretending everything is sunshine and lollypops.

I have seen a lot more criticism about Kane than that of Subban. Also, I have pretty much never heard that Subban has character issues. I know he is confident and sometimes comes off as cocky but I would hardly call that a character issue. That cockiness and his defensive lapses sometimes on the ice are what I hear him get criticized about.

I am not sure exactly where you are looking and getting this information but honestly, this is the first time I have heard that people are bad-mouthing Subban or that anything to do with him could be because of the color of his skin.

As far as having an adult conversation about race is concerned. Like HB, I know racism exists. I have seen/experienced it first hand. But that does not mean anything bad that is said about Subban (or anyone else) is because of the color of their skin. The way your first set of comments came off were:

People are bad-mouthing Subban.
Subban is black.
Racism exists in this world.

Based on the above, let us assume that Subban is being bad-mouthed because he is black. To me, that is racist.

 

[hockeyball]

Not you, the media. Others as well.

A poster on the habs board had a great point comparing the treatment of Patrick Kane (a similar flashy player on the ice) to PK Subban. Think about what each has done and the way they're talked about, and which one is defended more/ treated better.

PK is a model citizen. And a great player. There shouldn't be a sniff of criticism around him, but there is.

And to the posters who can't handle an adult conversation about race, keep burying your head in the sand and pretending everything is sunshine and lollypops.

You don't think possibly there are a whole lot more variables there when comparing Kane and Subban besides race? Like the fact that one plays for Montreal where criticism is much higher and the team has had trouble in the playoffs in recent years. The other being a dynasty team in the USA after decades of abysmal teams?

Race has zero to do with it.

I have an in-law who is so deluded about this topic that she has alienated her entire family and literally sends christmas cards chastising everyone for treating black people poorly and boasting about how she is going to save black people in America. I've tried to have a conversation with her on the topic, but it goes absolutely no where. She cannot even comprehend of an open discussion on the topic, she just starts blaming and yelling at you and calling you racist the second you try to disagree with her. It's pure crazy and crap like that is doing a LOT more harm to racism efforts than it is helping.

 

[Led Zappa]

I'm having a deja vu. Seems like we've had this exact same Subban race discussion before and I didn't like it the first time.

 

[Gene Parmesan]

The Montreal media is much like Philly's in regards to the Eagles. Subban is a target based on his status as the face of the franchise.

 

[Quid Pro Clowe]

Subban has a personality that is cherished when things are going well and disliked when they aren't. Has 0 to do with skin color.

 

[Pinkfloyd]

Because you brought it up earlier saying a backup goalie can't make $2M and now an elite #1 defenseman can't make $9M. You're salary constrictions are both unrealistic and inflexible which is a huge problem imo. I'd hate to have a gm who thought that way.

You don't know exactly what DW or Hasso thinks about this, you're projecting your own opinions on them. Just own up to it.

Where did I say that those people can't make that amount? That's just you reading more into it than what it is. I'm saying that the team in the situation that it's in shouldn't be spending two million on a backup goalie that will play five or six games because it is wasteful. They have other things they should be looking to use that space to get better in. That's also a different thing than the Subban deal. The Subban deal is his contract is significantly larger than any contract that DW and his ownership groups have ever taken on in his tenure. Why would I need to know exactly what they think when history suggests it's not the kind of contract they would want to take on? That's an absurd standard to place because if that were the case, you don't know that they would want to take that on and we're just pointlessly bickering about the situation. And subsequently defeating the purpose of a message board.

It's not a matter of me being inflexible and it's not a matter of salary constrictions. One is a matter of cap space now and how to best utilize it. The other is a matter of a contract relative to the tendencies of the person and group that would hypothetically acquire said contract. Don't make more of it than it really is and you're just as guilty of projecting as anyone else would when we are discussing hypotheticals.

 

[hohosaregood]

There's probably some inherent and maybe institutional racism in hockey based on the high cost to play for kids and the general division of wealth. There's probably a lot of petty casual racism and general prejudices too. I generally don't think that any management is gonna keep an ethnic minority in the pits because of race anyways. I don't think I've ever seen much racist critiques in hockey media other than the "enigmatic Russian".

Actually, Russians probably get the most racist critiques from hockey media. Like PK gets unfairly criticized for his flair, Ovi got unfairly criticized for being Russian.

 

[Pinkfloyd]

The Montreal media is much like Philly's in regards to the Eagles. Subban is a target based on his status as the face of the franchise.

I believe this has more to do with it than anything else. There may be issues of racism within the media regarding it...maybe? I don't really know but the comparisons to Kane aren't so great because hockey and how it's treated in Montreal is vastly different than hockey and how it's treated in Chicago. The fans in Chicago aren't nearly as passionate and prone to stupidity from said passion as Montreal is.