Speculation: Sens, Lebreton, and the NCC part II

[Ray Kinsella]

“You have competent ownership , but a losing team and you're telling me that people will pack the stands?”

Not necessarily pack the stands, but having competent ownership would bring hope and encourage the fans, even with a not so great team. It would bring something promising.

“It is winning that matters for me. And star players.”

We don’t have either at the moment, or at least, nothing close confirmed to that. In essence, the former could help à great deal to make the fans feel confident it will happen in a closer than farther future.

 

[L'Aveuglette]

Funny how I say the same things but you do the same. Dude, place was full of freebies. I mean, how thick do you have to be to constantly ignore a fact?

Chop off a few grand and see how those numbers look.

And again, your schtick or extremist points of view. There is never any middle ground with you. I can't help you with that. Whenever someone disagrees with you, you jump to the absolute furthest distortion. Bad fans are to blame for everything said no one never.

Lack of fan support, lack of expertise in the front office, poor managerial decisions and, finally, terrible performances on the ice led by a robotic, listless coach who avoids the reality of the situation is the whole enchilada.

Right now, the fan portion is the focal point as revenues and such are being discussed. Deny, deflect, scapegoat, etc...doesn't change the fact that fans have checked out and they do not look good in comparison to the other Canadian markets.

Oh sure, you talk about other issues here, but 99% of your posts are about taking the blame away from ownership and putting it on the city and fans. And no, the focal point isn't the fan portion. You and a few others are the ones who bring it back to that every single time. I only seem to be repeating myself because you keep making the same tired argument and weak excuses over and over. No one is buying it except the small but extremely vocal group you belong to.

 

[Do Make Say Think]

We have star players.

Mark Stone and Erik Karlsson are amongst the finest at their position.

 

[L'Aveuglette]

We have star players.

Mark Stone and Erik Karlsson are amongst the finest at their position.

I believe the point is that they both have a foot wayyy out the door. You're being obtuse.

 

[mysens]

Jut got wind that the family involved has decide to liquidate a bit more than originally intended. They seem to have want a bit more skin in the game so to speak. I spoke about this about three weeks ago and it really is starting to steam roll. Looking good for everyone here, even though we all have our opinions of each, some good and some not, we all want this team here and for the stars to stick around. For what it's worth, nobody has guessed the family spearheading this. Lots of great guesses, but they have not been mentioned. As stated previously by Coladin, this family may have a former player or two contributing to this as well. They know quite a few former players personally. Buckle up people! Nighty night to all, I am just waking up in my travels in Italy.

 

[BloodRedArmy]

We have great diehard fans. We do not have enough fans though. That is the problem.

The competent ownership card is a convenient way to absolve the fans of this city from supporting the team. I don't buy it. You have competent ownership , but a losing team and you're telling me that people will pack the stands?

It is winning that matters for me. And star players. The rest is just noise. Who wouldn't want an organization that isn't run perfectly? But it doesn't happen often and typically losing teams have organizational issues. It is part of the results of losing.

This team had a great playoff run and up and coming stars in 2016-2017. This city did not do its job. It keeps getting sugarcoated.

Ok, so the city didn't do it's job. Fair enough. It's the first time in modern history (and several healthy playoff appearances and runs).

On the other hand, as per the bolded.... EXACTLY. And don't you think the parade of star players leaving, being traded away, mismanaged, etc. is a DIRECT contributor to attendance/ support? Not to mention a complete lack of investment in front office (scouting), removal of key players (Mlakar, Leeder, Alfie, Marshys, Slewidge, etc. etc.), shoestring budgets for coaches (when was the last time we hired a bonafide NHL coach? Oh, right... Bryan Murray, who took us to the FINALS).

It takes money to make money.

 

[JD1]

No matter how many ways you slice it-total revenue, revenue per fan, we have been bringing in the numbers (at least until the 2017-2018 season).

Fan shamers on this board gotta just stop it. You just alienate the very people you claim are needed. When I read your posts, it seriously makes me not want to buy tickets at all. Shaming them into coming to a game isn't going to work. If you can't tell from this thread, it will only strengthen the resolve of their mindset.

Revenue per fan in Ottawa $88. I believe only Winnipeg and Edmonton are higher. The rest of the NHL is lower. This stat inherently will skew to good small hockey markets but it is a measure of fan worthiness-directly or indirectly (in terms of TV deals) and that is what we are...a good small hockey market.

This is the number that is on the fan and it shows people in this city put up. And no it does not matter if that revenue is from TV deals. Revenue is revenue and it comes from team interest-directly or otherwise. In person viewership yields ticket revenue and those viewers at home contribute by way of the TV revenue. Ticket revenue might be higher per game per person but its irrelevant. An NHL owner will receive revenue from both and the sum is all that matters and is a measure of interest in a team in a given market.

Are there market issues? Yes, but Lebreton will go a long way in making up for them. Ottawa's market issues are corporate based. the lebreton experience will be sure to address that, but it will also result in higher regular ticket prices. A lebreton arena will yield double digit ticket revenue growth-guaranteed.

Fan issues, I'm sorry. This is precisely why posters here are fed up. The average Ottawa citizen has brought in $88 to the team and got yelled at for it while the average Toronto citizen has brought in $34 and is heaped with praise. Bob Mckenzie knows it and said so during one broadcast last winter. Bill Daly confirmed it because the NHL knows the numbers.

As for profitability....frankly, with a private company-we'll never know the full story. And there is probably good reason for that.

everything you've written here is accurate and your post was eloquently put together. I was on the main boards in June 2017 pumping up how much money the average guy was spending in that run while the Toronto media laughed about empty seats.

but the problem is that it doesn't translate into a revenue stream that enables higher end spending. we could certainly be better run with more money in hockey ops for starters.

at the end of the day we are in a bit of a pickle here. that new rink needs to get built entirely with private money and we are likely going to need to endure some lean years while that process goes forward and we'll come out the other side with more expensive tickets

 

[JD1]

That seems very optimistic. You got anything to back the claim?

I am more in agreeance with you than not but you can't say something like that without backing it up.

go look at ticket revenue on the forbes site. it breaks down revenue into several categories. if we had average ticket revenue of the other 6 Cdn teams wed be in fine shape

 

[Pancakes Pancakes]

Jut got wind that the family involved has decide to liquidate a bit more than originally intended. They seem to have want a bit more skin in the game so to speak. I spoke about this about three weeks ago and it really is starting to steam roll. Looking good for everyone here, even though we all have our opinions of each, some good and some not, we all want this team here and for the stars to stick around. For what it's worth, nobody has guessed the family spearheading this. Lots of great guesses, but they have not been mentioned. As stated previously by Coladin, this family may have a former player or two contributing to this as well. They know quite a few former players personally. Buckle up people! Nighty night to all, I am just waking up in my travels in Italy.

How about a clue as to what industry this family is in?

Always appreciate the insight btw

 

[JD1]

4000 seats per game is 160k empty seats multiplied by the average ticket price 60 is that number without concessions and whatnot. That is 9.6M just in tickets. Nothing scientific but I think you get my point.

Attendance is hurting the team. Going to Lebreton will only work for the short term until the same arguments come up again.

15000 tickets sold for 40 games is 600000 tickets. at an extra 15 bucks at ticket there's your same 9 million.

it's needed either way.

 

[Mingus Dew]

Jut got wind that the family involved has decide to liquidate a bit more than originally intended. They seem to have want a bit more skin in the game so to speak. I spoke about this about three weeks ago and it really is starting to steam roll. Looking good for everyone here, even though we all have our opinions of each, some good and some not, we all want this team here and for the stars to stick around. For what it's worth, nobody has guessed the family spearheading this. Lots of great guesses, but they have not been mentioned. As stated previously by Coladin, this family may have a former player or two contributing to this as well. They know quite a few former players personally. Buckle up people! Nighty night to all, I am just waking up in my travels in Italy.

Cheers, thank you for the update.

Have a few extra negronis today.

 

[Nac Mac Feegle]

I think a lot of people know, including media. Perhaps they are worried about jeopardizing the deal. This impending deal does not need intense media scrutiny and attention. That would be a nightmare.

I think the new partner will bring in former players in some capacity. I won't say Alfie, but wouldn't be surprised if it were another prominent Senator who is in town.

For me, this is where the story falls apart.

So dozens, maybe hundreds of folks know who this mystery buyer is, and no one is going for the glory/first and spilling some names? This goes against everything in human nature.

Either this is an extremely minor move (ie, someone is buying a paltry piece of the team, like 10%, where nothing will change at all), or the buyers are NOT local so no one legitimately knows who the hell they are, or there is just a bunch of hot air and nothing is happening. Has to be one of the three. First and third options suck, so hopefully it's #2.

 

[JD1]

I'll go with the dude that owns Mattamy Homes

he has about 3 times Melnyk's net worth

already has a presence locally

already is part of the Melnyk lebreton team

 

[Take a Bath Son]

I'll go with the dude that owns Mattamy Homes

he has about 3 times Melnyk's net worth

already has a presence locally

already is part of the Melnyk lebreton team

Either that or Brigil's Gilles Desjardins who is also part of rendezvous I believe.

 

[Mingus Dew]

I'll go with the dude that owns Mattamy Homes

he has about 3 times Melnyk's net worth

already has a presence locally

already is part of the Melnyk lebreton team

This is a good guess. I can see it for sure.

 

[Take a Bath Son]

Gilles Desjardins is co-owner of the Olympiques. JF Plante is Le Droit's junior hockey reporter so conceivably he could have an inside track. I wonder if we are getting warmer....

 

[Flamingo]

Seriously?

Wow, it is obviously about ownership.

Wow?

Yes, it’s bad writing.

 

[The Lewler]

Wake me up when something actually happens.

See you next month.

 

[mysens]

For me, this is where the story falls apart.

So dozens, maybe hundreds of folks know who this mystery buyer is, and no one is going for the glory/first and spilling some names? This goes against everything in human nature.

Either this is an extremely minor move (ie, someone is buying a paltry piece of the team, like 10%, where nothing will change at all), or the buyers are NOT local so no one legitimately knows who the hell they are, or there is just a bunch of hot air and nothing is happening. Has to be one of the three. First and third options suck, so hopefully it's #2.

If you we’re close to the source as I am, would you jeopardize your personal relationship, business relationship, your reputation as being a snitch to satisfy some forum member who wreaks of entitlement by pretty much demanding the family involved. You speak of human nature. I guess your human nature includes being a snitch and ruining any relationship you’ve cultivated in order to get the almighty glory. Yikes.

 

[L'Aveuglette]

Gilles Desjardins is co-owner of the Olympiques. JF Plante is Le Droit's junior hockey reporter so conceivably he could have an inside track. I wonder if we are getting warmer....

I doubt Desjardins would be a big enough player to co-own an NHL team. He has a lot of assets, but he's no billionaire, or close to it.

 

[Sensung]

If you we’re close to the source as I am, would you jeopardize your personal relationship, business relationship, your reputation as being a snitch to satisfy some forum member who wreaks of entitlement by pretty much demanding the family involved. You speak of human nature. I guess your human nature includes being a snitch and ruining any relationship you’ve cultivated in order to get the almighty glory. Yikes.

Yikes is correct.

All you needed to say was that for privacy reasons you are not comfortable giving any more information at this time.

But then you wouldn't get to cultivate the pompous ass persona that you're crafting so carefully.

 

[L'Aveuglette]

If you we’re close to the source as I am, would you jeopardize your personal relationship, business relationship, your reputation as being a snitch to satisfy some forum member who wreaks of entitlement by pretty much demanding the family involved. You speak of human nature. I guess your human nature includes being a snitch and ruining any relationship you’ve cultivated in order to get the almighty glory. Yikes.

I really hope you're a troll because otherwise I've never encountered someone less self-aware.

 

[Take a Bath Son]

If you we’re close to the source as I am, would you jeopardize your personal relationship, business relationship, your reputation as being a snitch to satisfy some forum member who wreaks of entitlement by pretty much demanding the family involved. You speak of human nature. I guess your human nature includes being a snitch and ruining any relationship you’ve cultivated in order to get the almighty glory. Yikes.

we really need to stop beating each other up. You absolutely have the right to retain confidentiality and it is appreciated that you shared what you shared. People here love the team and after the last 12 months, really need some good news.

I would harbour a guess you are in the construction biz and this new partner is as well-either a builder or large contractor.

 

[Tuna99]

A local group of Gilles Desjardins, Ruddy, Alfie, and maybe throw in another rich dude if they need the financing and boom - local ownership group with knowledge of the hockey community, the know how and will to develop Lebreton and Alfie to renew the fanbase and renew the trust in management (sell tickets) - this is also good if their is a Gatineau connection because a big part of the Le Breton ticket plan was to offset the season ticket lose from Kanata fans with fans in Gatineau and expand the fanbase into western Quebec.

 

[Crosside]

If you we’re close to the source as I am, would you jeopardize your personal relationship, business relationship, your reputation as being a snitch to satisfy some forum member who wreaks of entitlement by pretty much demanding the family involved. You speak of human nature. I guess your human nature includes being a snitch and ruining any relationship you’ve cultivated in order to get the almighty glory. Yikes.

When it will be announced? Do you think Karlsson sign with this partnership?