Buffalo Bills Season over. Ow.

[TageGod]

For the 7th straight Year under McDermott, the D-line sucks. Draft a receiver with 1st and 2nd then draft the rest defensive line, someone has to stick.

 

[Chaos2k7]

Our biggest need is at CB IMO

 

[1specter]

Time is slowly slipping away, unfortunately. It pains me to know the odds are favoring Allen not getting a chip, but rather- a career full of post season heartbreaks. He turns 29 in May, and I'd venture a guess most QBs who have won a SB won it before they turned 30. It seems wrongly poetic that the pick we traded to KC for White turned into Mahomes- who will probably be the reason we won't have a parade in Buffalo during Allen's tenure.

I mean Burrow and Lamar are in a similar situation too.... it's just unfortunate timing that Brady/Pats dynasty ends and another dynasty props up almost immediately in KC.

 

[Willgamesh]

I mean Burrow and Lamar are in a similar situation too.... it's just unfortunate timing that Brady/Pats dynasty ends and another dynasty props up almost immediately in KC.

Lamar and Burrow have way better players around them. Bills need to shore up on defense.

 

[FIRE DRURY]

Our biggest need is at CB IMO

Considering how much we play Zone, and the fact that we have a real #1 in Benford, I don't think I want to see Beane go CB/DB with our 1st or 2nd picks. It's D-line. That's been our achilles heal. You also don't need great corners if you can generate consistent pressure. There are also some interesting names that might be available this summer.

 

[Der Jaeger]

While I agree. I also hate it. We don't penetrate like the Tampa D of old. We rotate a ton and they still aren't strong/fresh enough to pressure enough.

It's like, keep on trotting Jeff Skinner (or pick a name) out there for the shootout even though he's 0-16 in shootouts.

We tried with multiple 1st rounders. We tried with the splash FA signing (Miller). We just keep trying? Another 1st rounder this year? Maybe again in 2026! All I'm really saying is. Another swing and a miss on the D side in round 1 is nauseating.

If you run a 40 front defense which penetrates and uses smaller linebackers to sift through blocking to makes plays, there are two ways teams have generally used when they were successful (and one variant):

- Steelers/Bucs model: load up on elite defensive linemen. Eagles are sort of doing that now.
- Jimmy Johnson model: load up on rotational players

-Variant: Jim Bates model. Bring in two giant DTs and hold gaps so the rest of the defense can fly around (Eagles are also sort of doing this with Davis and Carter).

I'm a fan of the Jimmy Johnson model with where the Bills are right now. They've got two really good linemen and three other starting caliber linemen.

I mean, I know they tried this with Von Miller, but the really need an absolute game wrecker on defense, more than anything else. They've always had solid group of D-men held together by decent coaching.

Right now, you have two good linebackers (Milano and Benard), one good DL in Oliver, a good DE in Groot, and a good Corner in Benford.

We need a prime aged defensive superstar to mirror Allen. The defense needs someone the other side has to game plan for.

Kicking around the Parsons and Garrett ideas in my head all day. What if Cleveland takes Carter at 2, and then after the draft, Beane sends a Khalil Mack type package to Cleveland to help them load up to take a QB in future years?

Lamar and Burrow have way better players around them. Bills need to shore up on defense.

Debatable. Cincinnati's defense sucks. Higgins is gone. Their DL is not young anymore. And they are losing more important players than Buffalo in free agency.

Baltimore's OL was masked by Jackson and Henry. They are losing both OTs. Henry is 31 now... a repeat performance would be tough.

Considering how much we play Zone, and the fact that we have a real #1 in Benford, I don't think I want to see Beane go CB/DB with our 1st or 2nd picks. It's D-line. That's been our achilles heal. You also don't need great corners if you can generate consistent pressure. There are also some interesting names that might be available this summer.

View attachment 968423

Agree. I can see him looking hard at Shavon Revel, because he's a top 10 talent who is constantly available at the end of round 1 due to injury. That would be my exception.

 

[Husko]

Considering how much we play Zone, and the fact that we have a real #1 in Benford, I don't think I want to see Beane go CB/DB with our 1st or 2nd picks. It's D-line. That's been our achilles heal. You also don't need great corners if you can generate consistent pressure. There are also some interesting names that might be available this summer.

View attachment 968423

I'm ok with a splash pick on a talented safety. But no interest in drafting a corner high

 

[brian_griffin]

they probably should have won that game, but also probably should have lost to the ravens. Agony and ecstasy I suppose

Again, between the Ravens, Chiefs, Bills, each of those teams plays the other two 10 times each, they likely split 5-5 and 5-5. they are all complete enough teams and a notch about others in the AFC. Bengals get a better defense and figure out a way to not suffer too much the loss of 1 of their top-2 alpha WR this offseason, and they likely join the KC-BUF-BAL trio.

Kincaid was injured and playing injured

You can question play calling and incorrrct/ non calls all day

What has been forgotten....

If the Bill's just licked XP instead of going force its 31-31 with 330 left.

Not overpaying for Garrett. Drsft target is OLB/ edge

It's not dire. See what happens in free agency.

All Worthy does are outside routes and runs. You ned a receiver like Coleman who has size and can do close coverage catches

Hurting how?

I've been saying thus, dalton was not 100%

It was known he was injured. He missed games. Dudnt have surgery. Likely because he cou look d p ln ah hurt but surgery would end the sesson.

I dont think DT is as big of a need. LB is a bigger need

I agree with each of these points except the last one, where I instead 1000% agree with Der Jaeger.

Completely disagree. The Bills have been able to successfully run their defense by rotating in undersized linebackers. As good as Milano is, he wasn't a top pick. Bernard and Williams were 3rd round picks. They can add linebackers but they don't need to commit much. And they've got two good starters (Milano and Bernard), tested back ups (Williams, Spector), and youth (Andreessen, Ulofoshio).

In contrast, the Bills have a star 3DT (Oliver), a good backup 3DT (Carter), and a good but aging 1DT (Jones). That's it. They'll need another 1DT, and ideally, one that can command a double team. They could also use a run plugger DT.

Schematically, the DTs in Buffalo's defense don't take up blockers to the linebackers can make all the plays. They penetrate to create disruption, which allows the linebackers to flow through and make plays. Very similar in personnel structure to the old Tampa defense. Look at that defense, and you've got Sapp, Rice, McFarland, and White on the line. That's an elite line. Derrick Brooks was elite at linebacker, but the others were just undersized players who could run.

If the Bills get better at linebacker, who sits? Bernard? Milano? Doesn't make much sense to stack the linebacker position beyond the starting spots available, while the line in front of them gets manhandled.

Wholly agree. Re: the scheme, we saw that on display vs. KC where so few plays were stopped by the front 4 (see posts in this thread with the counting stats for several of the front 4) and the majority of plays were stopped by the back 7. The problem was the front 4 didn't get enough lateral contain on Mahomes. I strongly wonder if Benford didn't go out and they could play with slightly better overall talent (despite likely being weaker there with their original starting 5 vs. KC than they wanted) if they would have considered a couple blitzes.

It does feel pretty bleak at the moment. The AFC is just a gauntlet with the QBs we have to deal with.

All these big moments they've tripped up on the past 4 years are big time wasted opportunities. The odds only get more steep with every season wasted without a championship. Allen had the ball in his hands with 3 (ish) mins left and down 3 two years in a row and couldn't get it done. It's just full of heartaches. The one time he did get his career highlight reel play- McD and the defense folded like a lawn chair.

Time is slowly slipping away, unfortunately. It pains me to know the odds are favoring Allen not getting a chip, but rather- a career full of post season heartbreaks. He turns 29 in May, and I'd venture a guess most QBs who have won a SB won it before they turned 30. It seems wrongly poetic that the pick we traded to KC for White turned into Mahomes- who will probably be the reason we won't have a parade in Buffalo during Allen's tenure.

As I said, let's just hope Allen is the John Elway of his generation, and he gets one before his time is up. I will say, his post-game interview hit differently than years past. You can see it on his face that all these missed opportunities are weighing on him. You have to think he's wondering the same thing most of us are- will his career be defined by all these playoff woes? Seems more likely than not, unfortunately, but it's still going to be one hell of a ride.

Since 1980 season (arbitrarily chosen). Super Bowl would have been played in the following year January.
Winning QB listed first (at left), loser at right.
30yo or older underlined.
Bolded = 1st SB win.

'80 Plunkett vs. Jaworksi (2 months shy of turning 30)
Montana vs. Anderson
Theismann vs. Woodley
Plunkett vs. Theismann
Montana vs. Marino
McMahon vs. Eason
Simms (had just turned 30 two months prior) vs. Elway
Williams vs. Elway
Montana vs. Esiason
Montana vs. Elway
'90 Hostetler (just shy) vs. Kelly
Rypien (9 months shy) vs. Kelly
Aikman vs. Kelly
Aikman vs. Kelly
Young vs. Stan Humphries
Aikman vs. O'Donnell
Favre vs. Bledsoe
Elway vs. Favre
Elway vs. Chris Chandler
Warner vs. McNair
'00 Dilfer vs. Kerry Collins
Brady vs. Warner
Brad Johnson vs. Gannon
Brady vs. Jake Delhomme
Brady vs. McNabb
Roethlisberger vs. Hasselbeck
P. Manning vs. Rex Grossman
E. Manning vs. Brady
Roethlisberger vs. Warner
Brees vs. P. Manning
'10 Rodgers vs. Roethlisberger
E. Manning vs. Brady
Flacco vs. Kaepernick
Wilson vs. P. Manning
Brady vs. Wilson
P. Manning vs. Newton
Brady vs. Ryan
Foles vs. Brady
Brady vs. Goff
Mahomes vs. Garoppolo
'20 Brady vs. Mahomes
Stafford vs. Burrow
Mahomes vs. Hurts
Mahomes vs. Purdy


1980s ~half of SB QBs age 30 or older.
1990s just shy of half.
2000s just shy of half.
2010s just shy of half
2020s only 2 of 8.
It has been a relatively recent trend for <30 yo QBs to be playing in the SB.

10 of 45 SB QBs won their first at age 30 or older.

Given NFL QBs 1st season is typically an age 22 season, I don't think it's unusual for 4 decades to have half or just under half of the SB winning QBs to be age 30 or older.

Politely, I think it's Tuesday after a season-ending heartbreaking loss and you're in the 3rd (bargaining) or 4th (depression) stages of grief.

 

[Sabre the Win]

As an outside viewer of the Bills and some sentimental value to them since my extended family in Western, NY are Buffalo Bills fans. I don't think moving on from McDermott is the right move, your team has been competitive since he has taken over. You need to hit better in the draft. Its not your coaching, you had the Chiefs beat. Kincaid not making that catch and your defence not showing up is a personal on the field issue.

Our biggest need is at CB IMO

So important of a position, the Eagles went into the off-season after the epic season collapse and wild card elimination last year needing corners and we walked away with Quinyon Mitchell and Cooper DeJean as our first two picks who are now both up for defensive rookie of the year.

 

[ValJamesDuex]

Brown/Tasker on One Bill's Live: Bills have to add a top notch pass rusher and #1 receiver in the off-season.

Moving on from coaching is ridiculous, he's here to stay long term. Although I do believe they will look hard at upgrading Special Teams this off season.

 

[Djp]

Again, between the Ravens, Chiefs, Bills, each of those teams plays the other two 10 times each, they likely split 5-5 and 5-5. they are all complete enough teams and a notch about others in the AFC. Bengals get a better defense and figure out a way to not suffer too much the loss of 1 of their top-2 alpha WR this offseason, and they likely join the KC-BUF-BAL trio.

I agree with each of these points except the last one, where I instead 1000% agree with Der Jaeger.

Wholly agree. Re: the scheme, we saw that on display vs. KC where so few plays were stopped by the front 4 (see posts in this thread with the counting stats for several of the front 4) and the majority of plays were stopped by the back 7. The problem was the front 4 didn't get enough lateral contain on Mahomes. I strongly wonder if Benford didn't go out and they could play with slightly better overall talent (despite likely being weaker there with their original starting 5 vs. KC than they wanted) if they would have considered a couple blitzes.

Since 1980 season (arbitrarily chosen). Super Bowl would have been played in the following year January.
Winning QB listed first (at left), loser at right.
30yo or older underlined.
Bolded = 1st SB win.

'80 Plunkett vs. Jaworksi (2 months shy of turning 30)
Montana vs. Anderson
Theismann vs. Woodley
Plunkett vs. Theismann
Montana vs. Marino
McMahon vs. Eason
Simms (had just turned 30 two months prior) vs. Elway
Williams vs. Elway
Montana vs. Esiason
Montana vs. Elway
'90 Hostetler (just shy) vs. Kelly
Rypien (9 months shy) vs. Kelly
Aikman vs. Kelly
Aikman vs. Kelly
Young vs. Stan Humphries
Aikman vs. O'Donnell
Favre vs. Bledsoe
Elway vs. Favre
Elway vs. Chris Chandler
Warner vs. McNair
'00 Dilfer vs. Kerry Collins
Brady vs. Warner
Brad Johnson vs. Gannon
Brady vs. Jake Delhomme
Brady vs. McNabb
Roethlisberger vs. Hasselbeck
P. Manning vs. Rex Grossman
E. Manning vs. Brady
Roethlisberger vs. Warner
Brees vs. P. Manning
'10 Rodgers vs. Roethlisberger
E. Manning vs. Brady
Flacco vs. Kaepernick
Wilson vs. P. Manning
Brady vs. Wilson
P. Manning vs. Newton
Brady vs. Ryan
Foles vs. Brady
Brady vs. Goff
Mahomes vs. Garoppolo
'20 Brady vs. Mahomes
Stafford vs. Burrow
Mahomes vs. Hurts
Mahomes vs. Purdy


1980s ~half of SB QBs age 30 or older.
1990s just shy of half.
2000s just shy of half.
2010s just shy of half
2020s only 2 of 8.
It has been a relatively recent trend for <30 yo QBs to be playing in the SB.

10 of 45 SB QBs won their first at age 30 or older.

Given NFL QBs 1st season is typically an age 22 season, I don't think it's unusual for 4 decades to have half or just under half of the SB winning QBs to be age 30 or older.

Politely, I think it's Tuesday after a season-ending heartbreaking loss and you're in the 3rd (bargaining) or 4th (depression) stages of grief.

Where I think you are missing....

LB can also br a pass rusher.. these are hard to get in late rounds but you can get an interior DL in later round who controls nlovkers/ stuffs run.

 

[FIRE DRURY]

Agree. I can see him looking hard at Shavon Revel, because he's a top 10 talent who is constantly available at the end of round 1 due to injury. That would be my exception.

We have 10 picks so I don't mind seeing a CB taken. We desperately need a pass rush. I don't think it matters if you have 2 lockdown corners when you can't generate pressure. Someone will eventually get open. Addressing the Dline not only helps the pass rush, but also help limiting the run game which was a problem for us this year.

I like Tyleik, but would prefer a bigger DT paired next to Oliver who's also a bit undersized. Would like to see Beane move up in the early/mid teens for Kenneth Grant if he's available. He's got like 50lbs on Tyleik and can move very well for a big man. Not sure what the cost would be to go from 30 to like, 10~15.

 

[Jim Bob]

While I agree. I also hate it. We don't penetrate like the Tampa D of old. We rotate a ton and they still aren't strong/fresh enough to pressure enough.

It's like, keep on trotting Jeff Skinner (or pick a name) out there for the shootout even though he's 0-16 in shootouts.

We tried with multiple 1st rounders. We tried with the splash FA signing (Miller). We just keep trying? Another 1st rounder this year? Maybe again in 2026! All I'm really saying is. Another swing and a miss on the D side in round 1 is nauseating.

What is the option?

Not even try to build a quality DL and get run over by other team's offenses repeatedly?

Playoff games are won and lost in the trenches. We saw that on Sunday.

They have a really good OL and a great OL coach.

Now they need to fix the DL.

 

[Jim Bob]

Brown/Tasker on One Bill's Live: Bills have to add a top notch pass rusher and #1 receiver in the off-season.

Moving on from coaching is ridiculous, he's here to stay long term. Although I do believe they will look hard at upgrading Special Teams this off season.

I think the #1 WR piece is overstated.

They want a balanced offense that doesn't have just one guy that the defense can focus on.

I do think that they need a speed WR and/or someone that can separate.

Plus, if they add an Alpha #1 WR (aka Diggs and not Cooper), I think you open up the door to a lot of the issues that they did not have this year.

They have big needs at DT, as well.

 

[Jim Bob]

 

[zenthusiast]

Listen I disagree vehemently that this is the coach to take us further but I can respect why people see differently

Saying they’re two or three plays away from being the best dynasty of the era when they’ve been competitive in one afc championship is deranged

 

[Husko]

Listen I disagree vehemently that this is the coach to take us further but I can respect why people see differently

Saying they’re two or three plays away from being the best dynasty of the era when they’ve been competitive in one afc championship is deranged

I assume he means "beating"

 

[TageGod]

We are overthinking this. To win, we just have to throw the regular season game, so voodoo allows us to win the playoff game.

 

[Der Jaeger]

We have 10 picks so I don't mind seeing a CB taken. We desperately need a pass rush. I don't think it matters if you have 2 lockdown corners when you can't generate pressure. Someone will eventually get open. Addressing the Dline not only helps the pass rush, but also help limiting the run game which was a problem for us this year.

I like Tyleik, but would prefer a bigger DT paired next to Oliver who's also a bit undersized. Would like to see Beane move up in the early/mid teens for Kenneth Grant if he's available. He's got like 50lbs on Tyleik and can move very well for a big man. Not sure what the cost would be to go from 30 to like, 10~15.

There are some outlets which have Tyleik Williams' weight around 290. That's way off. He's around 320 at least.

I'd be good with Grant too, who is a natural 1DT.

 

[zenthusiast]

I assume he means "beating"

that’d certainly be more reasonable but with sports network talking heads turning into cheerleaders for engagement one never knows

 

[brian_griffin]

As an outside viewer of the Bills and some sentimental value to them since my extended family in Western, NY are Buffalo Bills fans. I don't think moving on from McDermott is the right move, your team has been competitive since he has taken over. You need to hit better in the draft. Its not your coaching, you had the Chiefs beat. Kincaid not making that catch and your defence not showing up is a personal on the field issue.


So important of a position, the Eagles went into the off-season after the epic season collapse and wild card elimination last year needing corners and we walked away with Quinyon Mitchell and Cooper DeJean as our first two picks who are now both up for defensive rookie of the year.

Many Bills fans on these boards touted DeJean and would have been pleased with the pick, especially because of his physicality and likely positional versatility in the Bills scheme. And the Bills secondary scheme base of 2-high nickel is similar to Fangio's 2-high.

You may or may not be aware for the Bills Chiefs game the Bills secondary was without the following:
LCB Christian Benford - concussion prior week, played <1Q before being concussed again. Backup Kaiir Elam (a poor substitute) finished the game.
SS Taylor Rapp was scratched due to injury. Backup rookie Cole Bishop started in his place..
FS Damar Hamlin but Backup Cam Lewis also played.
RCB Rasul Douglas (Backup CB and PR Codrington was scratched; I think lingering mild injury.)
Nickel Taron Johnson but backup Ja'Marcus Ingram also played.

So the Bills had 2 starters out of their top-5 for essentially the whole game and had only 2 additional non-starting backups to rotate in.

 

[buffalowing88]

Listen I disagree vehemently that this is the coach to take us further but I can respect why people see differently

Saying they’re two or three plays away from being the best dynasty of the era when they’ve been competitive in one afc championship is deranged

Nitpicking but this year's AFCC was certainly competitive, too.

 

[Dubi Doo]

Politely, I think it's Tuesday after a season-ending heartbreaking loss and you're in the 3rd (bargaining) or 4th (depression) stages of grief.

For sure, though I don't think it's an overreaction to say the odds are stacked against us to win a SB in the Allen era. Too many missed opportunities, and now were probably half way through Allen's prime. I also think the quality of competition within the conference and division will only get tougher. The past two seasons were glorious opportunities to get one (Burrow was out, KC looked human, the division is probably one of the weaker ones outside of Buffalo, etc...)

That being said, Im looking forward to next season, and we're in a better position to win a SB than 90% of the league. This team is just fun to watch, and Beane + McD are a great duo. Regardless if they get a championship, we're in for one hell of a ride.

 

[Der Jaeger]

Some Spotrac-ology.

Restructured Allen, Miller, Milano, Knox with no void years.

Traded Elam to the Giants for Jalin Hyatt.

$17M is cap space even with draft picks factored in ($14M if we just outright cut Miller).

Need to re-sign Hollins, Gilliam, and Johnson. Ferguson too. Morris is a RFA, Van Demark and Anderson are ERFAs.

A trade for Garrett doesn't add a lot to this coming season's cap. A trade would get two years of him.

 

[Zman5778]

Seems like we've processed the loss and are moving into true offseason talk. Will fire up a new thread when I get home from work