Rumor: San Jose trying to trade Evander Kane

[bandwagonesque]

I'm surprised that Sharks fans think it's possible to trade him. I honestly can't see any team wanting him even at full retention. The off-ice issues aren't merely "a distraction" -- half the team was asking for him to be removed, he's facing bankruptcy, and he's under investigation for throwing games. He's completely untradeable, at least for the time being, unless the Sharks retain and include other assets. No one's trying to kick you guys while you're down, this is just most people's rational conclusion.

 

[Pinkfloyd]

he also consistently has ruined team cohesion and morale. Both I think should be highly valued. I mean he did it with the jets, buffalo and now SJ. Any thought to the contrary is complete horseshit.

I think the common denominator is more the losing exacerbating issues rather than anything else.

 

[UseTheBoards]

Kane has been very consistent as a Shark and any thought to the contrary is complete horseshit.

He led the league in pims in each of the first 2 seasons with them

 

[Pinkfloyd]

He led the league in pims in each of the first 2 seasons with them

And scoring at a 30 goal and 55-70 point pace which is incredibly good production. So yeah it’s still consistent. Taking penalties doesn’t speak to consistency issues.

 

[UseTheBoards]

Oh my god I just looked at his avatar and realized I am arguing with a sharks fan about the state of the sharks

 

[bandwagonesque]

I think the common denominator is more the losing exacerbating issues rather than anything else.

If he can't handle losing without behaving so poorly that basically his entire team wants him gone and players approach the general manager and ask him to kick Kane off the team, isn't that just as damning as pretty much anything else that's been said about him?

 

[UseTheBoards]

And scoring at a 30 goal and 55-70 point pace which is incredibly good production. So yeah it’s still consistent. Taking penalties doesn’t speak to consistency issues.

You're right, penalties mean the player is making good decisions.

 

[Pinkfloyd]

If he can't handle losing without behaving so poorly that basically his entire team wants him gone and players approach the general manager and ask him to kick Kane off the team, isn't that just as damning as pretty much anything else that's been said about him?

They all look like shit in this situation for different reasons. To me the team is using some legitimate Kane issues as an excuse for their poor play and that isn’t acceptable to me. Getting rid of Kane isn’t going to make any of them better.

You're right, penalties mean the player is making good decisions.

If you think that cancels out everything else or even is more negative than his positives in play then you’re just looking for excuses. Kane has been one of their best players since he put on the sweater. Bottom line.

 

[bandwagonesque]

They all look like shit in this situation for different reasons. To me the team is using some legitimate Kane issues as an excuse for their poor play and that isn’t acceptable to me. Getting rid of Kane isn’t going to make any of them better.

How would this explain nearly identical situations taking place wherever he's played?

 

[Pinkfloyd]

How would this explain nearly identical situations taking place wherever he's played?

I don’t really care if it’s nearly identical or not. The team wasn’t losing because of Kane and if anyone in that org thinks moving one of their best players will make them better then they’re delusional.

 

[bandwagonesque]

I don’t really care if it’s nearly identical or not. The team wasn’t losing because of Kane and if anyone in that org thinks moving one of their best players will make them better then they’re delusional.

If you don't care about information that contradicts a position you're taking, then you aren't really saying anything. What exactly do you believe the Sharks should do here?

 

[Pinkfloyd]

If you don't care about information that contradicts a position you're taking, then you aren't really saying anything. What exactly do you believe the Sharks should do here?

The information doesn’t contradict anything because it’s a very limited amount of actual information and a lot of assumptions.

The Sharks needed to move a lot of players and only did some.

 

[bandwagonesque]

The information doesn’t contradict anything because it’s a very limited amount of actual information and a lot of assumptions.

The Sharks needed to move a lot of players and only did some.

I mean, what do you actually think the team should do with Kane?

 

[antiqueslivers]

The information doesn’t contradict anything because it’s a very limited amount of actual information and a lot of assumptions.

The Sharks needed to move a lot of players and only did some.

gotta say, its far from limited with plenty of documented issues (far more then the average malcontent that I can remember) as well as the the assumptions ending up being true in the end. If serveral of your team mates warn the GM of keeping you on the team, that's bad. He almost got in a fistfight apparently with a coach during practice.. this with out getting properly reprimanded is terrible for morale. Thinking that this would have no impact on team play even with out considering the lost practice/planning time because of his selfish antics is kinda wild. The game is never won with one player, I'd much rather have a happy cohesive team that likes playing together then one hotshot (he's not a gamebreaker.)

 

[one2gamble]

I mean, what do you actually think the team should do with Kane?

They should wait for the nhl investigation to conclude and if found innocent they should let him play hockey since he's good at it.

They should also fire the coach since he exacerbates the locker room issues.

To be honest. His off ice issues have not impacted his on ice performance at all and the rest of the team should take that to heart and look in the god damned.mirror

 

[bandwagonesque]

They should wait for the nhl investigation to conclude and if found innocent they should let him play hockey since he's good at it.

They should also fire the coach since he exacerbates the locker room issues.

To be honest. His off ice issues have not impacted his on ice performance at all and the rest of the team should take that to heart and look in the god damned.mirror

No one's claiming his performance has been poor. This entire discussion has revolved around who he is as a person and how that's affected the teams he's played for and the other players on those teams.

 

[one2gamble]

how that's affected the teams he's played for and the other players on those teams.

This is the issue. Fans sometimes forget this is a job. The simple fact is if he can help the team win they need to suck it up and do their job. Nobody is making them hang out after practice

I don't have sympathy for any of them

 

[Pinkfloyd]

I mean, what do you actually think the team should do with Kane?

Nothing as of yet because the league needs to complete its business with him before anything happens.

gotta say, its far from limited with plenty of documented issues (far more then the average malcontent that I can remember) as well as the the assumptions ending up being true in the end. If serveral of your team mates warn the GM of keeping you on the team, that's bad. He almost got in a fistfight apparently with a coach during practice.. this with out getting properly reprimanded is terrible for morale. Thinking that this would have no impact on team play even with out considering the lost practice/planning time because of his selfish antics is kinda wild. The game is never won with one player, I'd much rather have a happy cohesive team that likes playing together then one hotshot (he's not a gamebreaker.)

If a bunch of teammates who played poorly played as such because of this then they are absolutely as much of a problem as they make Kane out to be. They won’t be a happy cohesive team even with Kane gone. They have far deeper issues than that.

 

[bandwagonesque]

This is the issue. Fans sometimes forget this is a job. The simple fact is if he can help the team win they need to suck it up and do their job. Nobody is making them hang out after practice

I don't have sympathy for any of them

The whole point is that is appears he isn't helping the team win because he's so unpleasant to be around that people have trouble doing their jobs. This has nothing to do with hanging out after practice, "sucking it up," etc. And it's happened on every team he's played on. At a certain point, and we're long past it, it's untenable to chalk it up to his teammates needing to relax. Do you honestly think half his teammates would have gone to the GM and had sober conversations about how detrimental he is to the team if they didn't mean it, and hadn't thought about whether taking that step was worth it or whether there were other options?

 

[bandwagonesque]

Nothing as of yet because the league needs to complete its business with him before anything happens.

It seems like you're avoiding giving an answer. What would you do if he was permitted to play?

 

[one2gamble]

Do you honestly think half his teammates would have gone to the GM and had sober conversations about how detrimental he is to the team

This is a coaching issue. The information that was leaked indicates that the issue is the double standard on the team. It's a legitimate gripe but it's one that should be pointed at the HC.

Again, his on ice performance is good. If his team mates cant match that dedication they need to look in the mirror.

 

[bandwagonesque]

This is a coaching issue. The information that was leaked indicates that the issue is the double standard on the team. It's a legitimate gripe but it's one that should be pointed at the HC.

Again, his on ice performance is good. If his team mates cant match that dedication they need to look in the mirror.

Just so we're clear -- are you alleging it was a coaching issue all three times he's alienated most of his teammates, and that in every case the fact that his on-ice performance was good ought to have obliged his teammates to accept his behaviour, which they didn't do because of some unspecified personal failing they all shared?

 

[TheWayToRefJose]

Just so we're clear -- are you alleging it was a coaching issue all three times he's alienated most of his teammates, and that in every case the fact that his on-ice performance was good ought to have obliged his teammates to accept his behaviour, which they didn't do because of some unspecified personal failing they all shared?

This specific issue was. There was nothing of the sort going on with the previous coaching staff or when there was strong leaders such as Pavs and Jumbo in the room.

They were letting him slide with being late and no punishments because they thought him not playing was more detrimental than letting him be late and whatnot.

It almost sounds like Bougner was being told not to bench him from someone higher up from his comments and I highly doubt someone like Bougner, who racked up 1382 PIMs in 630 NHL games, would let something like that slide on his own.

 

[Pinkfloyd]

It seems like you're avoiding giving an answer. What would you do if he was permitted to play?

It depends on who is doing the complaining and what their actual options are. It’s not going to be some simple answer. The only players I would give a shit about complaining about Kane would be Ferraro and maybe Hertl depending on his contract status. I’d rather use Kane to drive any other player out than sit Kane.

 

[antiqueslivers]

Nothing as of yet because the league needs to complete its business with him before anything happens.



If a bunch of teammates who played poorly played as such because of this then they are absolutely as much of a problem as they make Kane out to be. They won’t be a happy cohesive team even with Kane gone. They have far deeper issues than that.

I disagree the jets were a much happier, more cohesive team. I think the Sharks will be as well.

Every NHL team the kane has played on in the past has deemed him to detrimental to keep on their team. His off ice antics have only gotten worse and from what has been leaked from SJ his on team antics have stayed the same since Winnipeg. I don't play professional team sports but i would most if not all players credit the "great room" for many winning performances. I imagine rallying a team between periods is less efficient with a player who expresses his lack of respect for his fellow teammates consistently (coming late for practices, ignoring team rules, etc).