Value of: Sabres three first round picks

[Weltschmerz]

I guess to me at least, that just looks like fretting about mostly irrelevant marginal details when there's a far bigger organizational problem overshadowing everything. Missing the forest for the trees.

Bleeding a 2nd or 3rd round pick here and there, losing mostly not that valuable players/acquiring mostly not that valuable players for small futures isn't really the reason Buffalo are stuck in this hole. Getting a little bit more value for one of those guys isn't changing the team's fortunes dramatically.

It's the broader brush strokes of team building where things have been an absolute trainwreck. And part of that, has been vacillating between trying to collect far too many prospects and integrate them all simultaneously...while at the same time, occasionally delving into the UFA market to make huge splashes on spendy older players on the downside of their careers. With tumultuous coaching and management on top of it all...just no coherent plan to move the team forward in the rebuild.

Not sure the bolded ever happened unless you speak about this season where it is a good think.

Few prospects even made it to the show, because of poor drafting, development or they were traded.

 

[tsujimoto74]

Boeser (with extension in place) for Olafsson + Vegas 1st

lol no.

 

[is the answer jesus]

The only way I'd consider moving any of those picks is for a top 4 RD with term or for a young guy with that potential. Buffalo doesn't need more wingers.

 

[Havok89]

Sabres desperately need a starting goalie for next season. Could see the Vegas or FLA pick used to get a quality starter.

 

[flashsabre]

Buffalo have Quinn and Peterka tearing up the AHL as rookies. Those are 2 more wingers looking to move up.

Their biggest needs are a starting goalie and a 3rd pairing dman with some size and grit.

THey have to spend a lot of money to hit the cap floor.

They might think signing Gudbransen and Husso fill their needs without spending assets.

Vancouver insiders said management is looking to turn the team upside down and a guy like Bo Horvat could be available. This is where I could see the Sabres using their assets. One of the best face off guys and a 30 goal scorer.

 

[is the answer jesus]

Sabres desperately need a starting goalie for next season. Could see the Vegas or FLA pick used to get a quality starter.

Goalie certainly needs to be addressed, but I'd be very reluctant to use a 1st round pick. I think we're better off overpaying a UFA in the short-term.

 

[SnuggaRUDE]

I guess to me at least, that just looks like fretting about mostly irrelevant marginal details when there's a far bigger organizational problem overshadowing everything. Missing the forest for the trees.

Bleeding a 2nd or 3rd round pick here and there, losing mostly not that valuable players/acquiring mostly not that valuable players for small futures isn't really the reason Buffalo are stuck in this hole. Getting a little bit more value for one of those guys isn't changing the team's fortunes dramatically.

It's the broader brush strokes of team building where things have been an absolute trainwreck. And part of that, has been vacillating between trying to collect far too many prospects and integrate them all simultaneously...while at the same time, occasionally delving into the UFA market to make huge splashes on spendy older players on the downside of their careers. With tumultuous coaching and management on top of it all...just no coherent plan to move the team forward in the rebuild.

3 1sts, 5 2nds, 4 3rds and a handful of other minor assets isn't pissing away 'irrelevant marginal details'. It's a good portion of a hockey team.

They had 4 big UFA acquisitions during the same time: Moulson, Okposo, Skinner, Hall

Moulson was a trash signing, Okposo and Skinner are still productive though overpaid. Hall wasn't around long enough to be anything more than a $6M 2nd rounder pick.

 

[Havok89]

Goalie certainly needs to be addressed, but I'd be very reluctant to use a 1st round pick. I think we're better off overpaying a UFA in the short-term.

If that’s an option, then yes I agree. That position is holding the Sabres back though, and I’m not sure if a UFA stopgap is enough to help the young team push for a playoff spot.

 

[dkollidas]

I don't really see it in terms of bundling 3 picks to move up in the draft "NFL Style".

Buffalo are surely going to be keeping their own 1st rounder as well. But working with those other two 1st rounders trying to bring in a quality young player, is definitely something that i could understand from a Buffalo perspective. They really need some sort of jolt to try to pull themselves out of the deep hole they've found themselves in for years now. At some point, you really do end up with too much "maybe" with prospects all competing for the same spots and opportunities and roles in the roster. That doesn't work. So getting a good young player to "accelerate" things a little bit makes sense to me.

Preying on a team that has a potential cap issue that might prohibit them from fitting someone in easily.

-Fiala in MIN.
-Someone out of TBL.
-Boeser out of VAN (though seems kind of redundant with Skinner and Olafsson already in the fold).
-Maybe one of the PHI Defencemen like Provorov? Would be a kind of funny merry-go-round swap with Ristolainen.
-CGY seem like they may have some real business decisions to make, pending what those Gaudreau/Tkachuk extensions look like. Things could get really tight there, and squeeze somebody out.
-PIT could have something shake loose if they want to get Malkin and Letang both retained. Maybe Kapanen for a later 1st?
-CBJ have Laine potentially dangling (though again, kind of redundant with BUF current wingers).
-WPG also seem like they're probably going to be looking to reconfigure or retool some things, and might be enticed to move a good player to free up that room to do something different?


Seems like there are potentially a lot of situations around the league where teams might be open to moving a good player for a 1st round pick or two, to free themselves up to reinvest elsewhere in their lineup up against the cap.


I think the idea of Buffalo (who are already extremely heavy on young/unproven picks/prospects) actually making all three of those 1st round picks really stretches the bounds of what is feasible to incorporate into your lineup all at once like that. I get why Buffalo fans might recoil at the notion of "accelerating" anything, as the attempts to accelerate the rebuild through UFA have been an unmitigated disaster. But i think dealing later 1st round picks for more established and younger NHL talent is a more viable route to that.

I get the point of not having too big of a prospect pool. At the same time, the amount of picks that actually hit should make you want to use the picks. Some of them just won’t pan out.

 

[Gabrielor]

If we're in the business of trading our 1sts, it'll 100% be for goaltending.

Any pick should be in play too, depending on the goaltender.

 

[Zman5778]

If we're in the business of trading our 1sts, it'll 100% be for goaltending.

Nah. I could absolutely see us offloading a 1st for a RHD that's solid defensively that still has term left on his deal.

 

[GreatSaveEssensa]

Boeser (with extension in place) for Olafsson + Vegas 1st

I wouldn't do Boeser for Olaffson straight up if I was Buffalo GM. Never mind adding a 1st

 

[MarkusKetterer]

I get the point of not having too big of a prospect pool. At the same time, the amount of picks that actually hit should make you want to use the picks. Some of them just won’t pan out.

Last draft, this draft, and next year’s draft the team should keep all of their picks (unless it’s like the Minnesota offer earlier in this thread where they get back a player and pick, keeping them at the same amount of picks), then think about moving them.

If they’re smart, and some luck involved, they can have the ability to ice a team in waves. Especially seeing the team isn’t a prime UFA destination (both NHL, Europeans, and UDFA guys).

 

[Number1RedWingsFan52]

Boeser (with extension in place) for Olafsson + Vegas 1st

And why would Vancouver do that? Allvin wants a young RHD for Brock Boeser Boeser with an extension cost far more then this.

 

[Irie]

3 1sts, 5 2nds, 4 3rds and a handful of other minor assets isn't pissing away 'irrelevant marginal details'. It's a good portion of a hockey team.

They had 4 big UFA acquisitions during the same time: Moulson, Okposo, Skinner, Hall

Moulson was a trash signing, Okposo and Skinner are still productive though overpaid. Hall wasn't around long enough to be anything more than a $6M 2nd rounder pick.

I think Skinner and Moulson were aquired via trade, and then extended.

Ultimately, probably doesn't change the premise of your argument, but they weren't UFA signings like Okposo was so there was a different perceived value on them at the time. Thought that might be worthwhile to differentiate.

 

[Djp]

I think Skinner and Moulson were aquired via trade, and then extended.

Ultimately, probably doesn't change the premise of your argument, but they weren't UFA signings like Okposo was so there was a different perceived value on them at the time. Thought that might be worthwhile to differentiate.

Moulson was traded to minnesota then resigned as a UFA.

 

[Satanphonehome]

And why would Vancouver do that? Allvin wants a young RHD for Brock Boeser Boeser with an extension cost far more then this.

Why?

Boeser and Olofsson are similar age and play similar roles.
Olofsson has 53 goals and 123 points in 180 games over the past 3 years.
Boeser has 60 goals and 128 points in 180 games over the same period.
Olofsson is faster than Boeser and makes less.

Canucks would get faster, more cap space and free 1st round pick. They should pounce on an offer like that.

 

[Irie]

Moulson was traded to minnesota then resigned as a UFA.

oooooh, that's right! I totally forgot about that. Good catch, and thank you.

 

[Irie]

Why?

Boeser and Olofsson are similar age and play similar roles.
Olofsson has 53 goals and 123 points in 180 games over the past 3 years.
Boeser has 60 goals and 128 points in 180 games over the same period.
Olofsson is faster than Boeser and makes less.

Canucks would get faster, more cap space and free 1st round pick. They should pounce on an offer like that.

Olofsson is criminally underrated on these boards due to the narrative posted by a few posters that never watch him play.

Cause you know... One dimensional powerplay specialist....

Nevermind that he gets by far most of his points at even strength, has solid hockey sense, passes well, and doesn't float defensively.

But then again, 98% of Buffalo players are labelled incorrectly in some way or another on these boards, so at this point I just expect it.

 

[SnuggaRUDE]

oooooh, that's right! I totally forgot about that. Good catch, and thank you.

And Skinner was an expiring contract when traded for. That $9M monster is their own doing.

 

[TS Quint]

Olofsson is criminally underrated on these boards due to the narrative posted by a few posters that never watch him play.

Cause you know... One dimensional powerplay specialist....

Nevermind that he gets by far most of his points at even strength, has solid hockey sense, passes well, and doesn't float defensively.

But then again, 98% of Buffalo players are labelled incorrectly in some way or another on these boards, so at this point I just expect it.

Poor Buffalo players.

 

[rams]

Sabres need to keep all three picks. If they wanted a goalie they should have drafted Wallstedt last year.

 

[Irie]

And Skinner was an expiring contract when traded for. That $9M monster is their own doing.

True, but he was acquired in the offseason, so he wasn't a short term rental.

I thought it important to make the distinction because I feel it is relevant due to the fact that Buffalo has a really difficult time attracting UFAs that have never played for them before, so overpaying is pretty much a requirement in such cases.

(the skinner contract was just Botts bidding against himself - I have no explanation for that one).

 

[SnuggaRUDE]

True, but he was acquired in the offseason, so he wasn't a short term rental.

I thought it important to make the distinction because I feel it is relevant due to the fact that Buffalo has a really difficult time attracting UFAs that have never played for them before, so overpaying is pretty much a requirement in such cases.

(the skinner contract was just Botts bidding against himself - I have no explanation for that one).

I think it's quite probable Skinner had other offers after putting up 40 goals. And the whole only signing here type shtick is tough to follow through with if someone is dangling serious cash.

 

[Irie]

I think it's quite probable Skinner had other offers after putting up 40 goals. And the whole only signing here type shtick is tough to follow through with if someone is dangling serious cash.

I don't think anyone was giving Skinner 9 million and obviously, 8 years was out of the question. I am pretty sure 7.5x8 would have worked, and that extra 12 million saved over the life of the contract would be a lot better for the franchise. Even 8m x 7 would probably have gotten it done, but his cap hit is helping them hit the floor now, so it currently is not that big of a problem.

There is a pretty big disadvantage for teams like Buffalo trying to attract top end talent in free agency. They have to pay more, and even then, players will choose Toronto, New York, Boston all over them and usually sign for less money in doing so.