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Sabres Management and Coaching Thread

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WJZ3 said:
What? How many times have teams in the lottery dealt high drafts picks the deadline before the lottery. That would be very poor asset management
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I'm pretty sure he is saying Murray could have tanked the season by giving away UFA's rather than keeping them.

But I don't think the season goes any different if they did move out Kulikov, Franson, and Gionta.
 
Duddy said:
Oh no someone we could've drafted is playing good in the AHl. Fire Murray right now
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you don't think draft picks are the most critical part of building an NHL team? so if Thatcher Demko turns into a #1 goalie for the Canucks that's kinda meaningless? Barbashev is already in the NHL btw

Fact, Tim Murray's success/failure in the draft will determine what the Buffalo Sabres become.
 
BiPolarBear said:
you don't think draft picks are the most critical part of building an NHL team? so if Thatcher Demko turns into a #1 goalie for the Canucks that's kinda meaningless? Barbashev is already in the NHL btw

Fact, Tim Murray's success/failure in the draft will determine what the Buffalo Sabres become.
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Grading Tim on who he could have taken is pointless. He could have taken anyone available.
 
Sabre Dance said:
Grading Tim on who he could have taken is pointless. He could have taken anyone available.
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You grade a GM on who he takes and who he could have had - it's called 'opportunity cost' and is part of evaluating a GM and scouting staff. BUT I'm not one of those to fault a GM for not taking some guy from the 3rd round who became a superstar. First 40 picks in a draft, we all know the players who are in the mix, you need your GM to be better than the others with those picks.

But if you're fine with a GM whose results are middling I don't know what to tell you other than enjoy the mediocre team you'll be posting about for the next decade.
 
BiPolarBear said:
You grade a GM on who he takes and who he could have had - it's called 'opportunity cost' and is part of evaluating a GM and scouting staff. BUT I'm not one of those to fault a GM for not taking some guy from the 3rd round who became a superstar. First 40 picks in a draft, we all know the players who are in the mix, you need your GM to be better than the others with those picks.

But if you're fine with a GM whose results are middling I don't know what to tell you other than enjoy the mediocre team you'll be posting about for the next decade.
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If he picks a bust his grade will be poor anyways. So it's a waste of time focusing on who he could have picked.
 
sabrebuild said:
Sure they might have won a few more games, especially if kulikov looked like normal kulikov, but hard to say it would have been a huge difference?

We don't have the developed talent that the pens had to overcome bylsma's simpleton structure and refusal to make significant adjustments. The injuries simply magnified his failings.
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You seem to have me confused with someone that's a fan of Disco.

I can see his failings while also realizing we would have been a better team to start the season healthy. I would think that was obvious and not an indication of liking Disco.
 
Zip15 said:
I don't think they're much different. I believe talent and health, particularly to the top or most relied upon players, have more bearing on results than coaching. On Sabres HF Boards that is clearly a fringe opinion right now, which is jarring.
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This from the guy who consistently ripped Nolan during the tank year. Who was coaching a team specifically built to be the worst team in the NHL.

You tried to call me a hypocrite when I called out Disco last year since I had defended Nolan. Ironic since my defense of Nolan generally revolved around the fact that he had no talent BY DESIGN and the system and player usage arguments against him were pointless because of it. We had a team built to be the worst in the NHL and no system or magical player usage would overcome that. Yet we now have you arguing essentially what I did to defend Nolan in defense of Disco. That Disco doesn't have enough talent to do better than he has this year. But Nolan did?

I just find it odd that you give a pass to the coach with the team possessing light years more talent (even with injuries). But pummeled the coach with very little.

Let me ask you: what do you think the standings look like if the coaches are reversed? To borrow a quote, "I can't take you seriously" if you think Buffalo is a playoff team just by changing coaches.
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So in your opinion Disco tried everything possible to get the most put of this team? He tried ever single possible adjustment or change to tactics, strategy or player usage that could have been tried?

You may want to hold onto the "I can't take you seriously" stuff. Another coach could get similar results, better ones or even worse. But to act like Disco has done all that could be done with this roster and no one could do better is a bit ridiculous.
 
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If before the 2015 draft I told you in Eichel's 2nd season he would be a point per game player, Reinhart a 50 point player, Ryan O'Reilly and Kyle Okposo are Sabres, Kane a 30 goal scorer, Risto a 50 point 27 minute D, Sabres have the #1 power play, and Lehner is our goalie top 10 in Sav %. Wouldn't you think we had a playoff team?
 
Sabre Dance said:
If before the 2015 draft I told you in Eichel's 2nd season he would be a point per game player, Reinhart a 50 point player, Ryan O'Reilly and Kyle Okposo are Sabres, Kane a 30 goal scorer, Risto a 50 point 27 minute D, Sabres have the #1 power play, and Lehner is our goalie top 10 in Sav %. Wouldn't you think we had a playoff team?
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You just did something...not sure what...

Carrier proves to be an nhl player and mccabe is fine as a #3 dman...
 
So when does our absentee owner clear house and fire the pathetic losers Murray and Bylsma? I have pretty much
been blue in the face yelling over and over ever since the hire that Murray was a loser and the worst GM in the league.

But but but he just needs more time! :laugh:

Yeah, this is his 4th draft and he just needs more time, that's it! Even though we have finished bottom 8 or worse every season Murray has been in charge we are close! Not. This team is far away from a playoff team. It doesn't take 2 full seasons after adding a superstar talent in Eichel, a 1C in RoR, a 25+ goal scorer in Kane, a proven RW1 in Okposo, a young ~50 point top 6 C/W in Reinhart and a supposed "franchise" goalie. That is what he has added since 14-15. And two full seasons later they have made zero progress. And guess what? There is minimal trade pieces left in the organization and a mediocre to bad prospect pool.

I didn't want to be right about Tim Murray. But I was. He's a horrible GM. Not only did he totally **** up the Sabres he totally ****ed up the Amerks. But that doesn't matter. Murray is a hip edgy pee pee slapper who says 3 words at the draft podium. Newsflash Mr No Eyebrows Murray that doesn't make you cool. It makes you a disrespectful jackass which is why no one wants to do business with Murray unless they are ripping him off (which is what happens in 95% of his trades)

Can anyone name ONE trade that Murray has made in his entire tenure that he unequivocally won? Didn't think so. The best Murray has done in a trade was paying fair full retail value on RoR. That's it. The Kane trade was average at best and every other one was a clear loss. (Not counting the simple rental dumping which any garbage GM can do)

The longer Pegula keeps Murray the longer it takes for us to make the playoffs. Murray is a joke. The day he gets fired is going to be a joyous occasion. I will bet right now Murray doesn't lead us to the playoffs next year either. Not that I'm going out on a limb, we can't score, we can't defend and we can't compete. Robin Lehner is a JOKE. Mediocre to average at best goalie. Trading a first in an elite draft for a mediocre goalie only in Buffalo, and of course you have the Murray lovers applauding that deal.
 
La Cosa Nostra said:
So when does our absentee owner clear house and fire the pathetic losers Murray and Bylsma? I have pretty much
been blue in the face yelling over and over ever since the hire that Murray was a loser and the worst GM in the league.

But but but he just needs more time! :laugh:

Yeah, this is his 4th draft and he just needs more time, that's it! Even though we have finished bottom 8 or worse every season Murray has been in charge we are close! Not. This team is far away from a playoff team. It doesn't take 2 full seasons after adding a superstar talent in Eichel, a 1C in RoR, a 25+ goal scorer in Kane, a proven RW1 in Okposo, a young ~50 point top 6 C/W in Reinhart and a supposed "franchise" goalie. That is what he has added since 14-15. And two full seasons later they have made zero progress. And guess what? There is minimal trade pieces left in the organization and a mediocre to bad prospect pool.

I didn't want to be right about Tim Murray. But I was. He's a horrible GM. Not only did he totally **** up the Sabres he totally ****ed up the Amerks. But that doesn't matter. Murray is a hip edgy pee pee slapper who says 3 words at the draft podium. Newsflash Mr No Eyebrows Murray that doesn't make you cool. It makes you a disrespectful jackass which is why no one wants to do business with Murray unless they are ripping him off (which is what happens in 95% of his trades)

Can anyone name ONE trade that Murray has made in his entire tenure that he unequivocally won? Didn't think so. The best Murray has done in a trade was paying fair full retail value on RoR. That's it. The Kane trade was average at best and every other one was a clear loss. (Not counting the simple rental dumping which any garbage GM can do)

The longer Pegula keeps Murray the longer it takes for us to make the playoffs. Murray is a joke. The day he gets fired is going to be a joyous occasion. I will bet right now Murray doesn't lead us to the playoffs next year either. Not that I'm going out on a limb, we can't score, we can't defend and we can't compete. Robin Lehner is a JOKE. Mediocre to average at best goalie. Trading a first in an elite draft for a mediocre goalie only in Buffalo, and of course you have the Murray lovers applauding that deal.
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This is one of your top 3 man baby rants after a loss. I enjoyed this one a lot.

What GMs in this league "win" their trades? Front offices are more equipped with analytics these days, no one is fleecing anybody.
 
flashsabre said:
This is one of your top 3 man baby rants after a loss. I enjoyed this one a lot.

What GMs in this league "win" their trades? Front offices are more equipped with analytics these days, no one is fleecing anybody.
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that's gonna stick. :laugh:
 
flashsabre said:
This is one of your top 3 man baby rants after a loss. I enjoyed this one a lot.

What GMs in this league "win" their trades? Front offices are more equipped with analytics these days, no one is fleecing anybody.
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Yea but what about Brayden McNabb?????
 
I'm not going to touch that man baby rant above, but is anyone going to make a case that GMTM has been good? 4 years into a GM job, you shouldn't have 3 pro teams in the basement, with one of them folding. If we had a top prospect system with all that losing, it'd be one thing, but the Sabres pool is middle of the pack at best. There literally isn't a single argument besides, 'patience,' that supports the idea that Murray has been other than bad. Get ready for Arizona to blow past us in the rebuild next year. I cannot believe that Murray has this franchise in a worse state than Regier/Quinn/Golisano had us in.

This is so depressing.
 
1point21Gigawatts said:
I still have no problem with Murray in regards to drafting and contracts. If he sticks with Bylsma, then he'll have completely lost me.
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Same, outside of the Bylsma hire, I don't have much issue with murray

If he sticks with bylsma, I won't have faith going forward.

Bylsma is the problem. Period.
 
Jame said:
Same, outside of the Bylsma hire, I don't have much issue with murray

If he sticks with bylsma, I won't have faith going forward.

Bylsma is the problem. Period.
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Not saying Bylsma isn't a problem, or even the worst problem, but I don't see what Murrays done with the roster to justify his staying.
 
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