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Ryane Clowe

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Bleed Ranger Blue said:
If "I dont think this guy will be 1. good for his cap hit AND 2. good for the entire term" is considered a weak counter point, then I better gracefully bow out of this conversation.

Because a perfectly legitimate concern, some might say THE most important concern, like that gets ignored by this organization too, and it pisses me off.
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Neither of those were points that you made. You said:

1. A goon isn't worth 4-5 mil.
2. Only worth his contract if he scores 50 pts.

And implied that both of those things were things I said (you were responding to my question which was - what was I predicting that was so crazy?). So yes, it was a weak counter point if you were trying to say that my expectations were insane... since neither of those were my expectations. We can have different ideas of what we want out of a cap hit in that range, which seems to be the case, without my "expectations being divorced from reality." But, ok. Fine to end the discussion since it is clear we're both pretty entrenched.
 
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RGY said:
Clowe looks like crap tonight.
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I missed the first ~9 min or so... but funny, cuz I see a guy in the time that I've watched with 2 hits in one period, who out hustled two Florida defenders to be the 2nd man in a 2 on 1, and a guy who won two big puck battles in one shift to create two scoring chances (at about the 3:30 min mark) -- one in the neutral zone and one behind the net. Just because he's not on the scoreboard doesn't mean he's crap. We'll see how the rest of the night goes.
 
looked pretty good on the third goal. he's most effective on the boards down low, and in front of the net...
 
Richter Scale said:
I missed the first ~9 min or so... but funny, cuz I see a guy in the time that I've watched with 2 hits in one period, who out hustled two Florida defenders to be the 2nd man in a 2 on 1, and a guy who won two big puck battles in one shift to create two scoring chances (at about the 3:30 min mark) -- one in the neutral zone and one behind the net. Just because he's not on the scoreboard doesn't mean he's crap. We'll see how the rest of the night goes.
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Has nothing to do with the scoresheet. The shift he got the assist on was his best one but then again he was fresh off the bench against tired panthers players. He has made some poor decisions with the puck. He made a stupid play icing the puck in the first. He has been very slow out there, getting beat to pucks and space. He is not using his size against a young and vulnerable team. I can understand you want to look at the good but there's been more bad than good
 
The shift with the icing and offsides was rough but other than that I thought Clowe played a real solid game.

He is a force in the corners and makes extremely good decisions in the offensive zone.
 
He is actually good inside the blue line in the last 25 feet down to the end boards where flat out speed is not important but he is pretty slow in the other 175 feet of the ice.
 
he never has had speed.. hes a brute force.. does the dirty work and give teammates space to opperate..hes playing fine..
 
Was at game and in person, its amazing to see what a slow skater he is. So slow he can't get into plays on the boards to use his size,

Please don't keep him and waste another pick & the cap space.
 
Joe11 said:
Was at game and in person, its amazing to see what a slow skater he is. So slow he can't get into plays on the boards to use his size,

Please don't keep him and waste another pick & the cap space.
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yea I know, like when he got into the play on the boards and behind the net to set Zucc up for the 3rd Goal? I was at home, and I caught that one.
 
Speed was never Clowe's strong suit...he's been an effective player in the past without it.

That said, I would not go long-term on this guy. Hopefully Sather doesn't either.
 
Bleed Ranger Blue said:
Imagine what he'll look like in 4 years.

Mike Rupp.
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I'm not sure that's fair. Rupp is a one-dimensional guy.

Clowe has a higher hockey IQ and decent vision. The first Zuccarello goal was all him. The biggest question is can his already average skating maintain a level were that vision and IQ can be effective.
 
Exactly... Clowe's passing and vision will always make him better than Rupp.

The problem is his lack of speed is overwhelming... The guy is a big hitter but he can't get into position to make a hit because he's so slow.
 
I understand he is slow, but most guys his size are not burners. That is what makes Nash so valuable. I am also not seeing how he has been bad. He is a unique player for sure. I would still re-sign him IF his contract demands are reasonable. Even on the 3rd line he is a solid player to have for the PP and for team toughness. Match him up with some speedier forwards and he will be fine. He controls the boards and sticks up for his teammates,
 
The contract demands are for a player who can play in the top 6. $4M per plus. You can't pay those dollars for a third line player.
 
We know what he can and can't do, the question is what is a reasonable contract for his skillset.
 
RangerBoy said:
The contract demands are for a player who can play in the top 6. $4M per plus. You can't pay those dollars for a third line player.
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@ 4 million on the 3rd line in his final year or 2 he would be overpaid, but for a player of his skill-set, that is about right.

Prust got 2.5 million. Clowe is a FAR superior player to him. People have been clamoring for the fact that the Rangers should have re-signed him. The difference is, Clowe is a top-6 player right now and a proven playoff performer.

If the Rangers were to move Pyatt AND Boyle in the off-season, replacing them with young players (which is reasonable looking at the prospect pool), they wouldn't be adding much in terms of cap.

I think he has added some much needed leadership, toughness and playmaking.

Again, if his demands are reasonable, I would like to re-sign him.
 
NYR Boyler87 said:
@ 4 million on the 3rd line in his final year or 2 he would be overpaid, but for a player of his skill-set, that is about right.

Prust got 2.5 million. Clowe is a FAR superior player to him. People have been clamoring for the fact that the Rangers should have re-signed him. The difference is, Clowe is a top-6 player right now and a proven playoff performer.

If the Rangers were to move Pyatt AND Boyle in the off-season, replacing them with young players (which is reasonable looking at the prospect pool), they wouldn't be adding much in terms of cap.

I think he has added some much needed leadership, toughness and playmaking.

Again, if his demands are reasonable, I would like to re-sign him.
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He has 2 goals in 36 games.

Why is there a need to justify Clowe as a top 6 player, when he clearly hasnt been one, just so we can sign him to a contract that will inevitably be too high with too much term?
 
Bleed Ranger Blue said:
He has 2 goals in 36 games.

Why is there a need to justify Clowe as a top 6 player, when he clearly hasnt been one, just so we can sign him to a contract that will inevitably be too high with too much term?
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In a down year he is on pace for 36 points in 82 games with well over 200 PIM's. Thats valuable. Assists do not count as points?
 
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