RW Vitaly Kravtsov - Traktor Chelyabinsk, KHL (2018, 9th, NYR)

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Fun stat: other than 2 high scoring ones (6-5 and 7-2 wins), Traktor have scored 15 goals in the remaining 14 games. I mean 28 goals in 16 games sound bad enough by itself but consider almost half of those were scored in 2 games.
 
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It is so painful to be a fan of Traktor this season. Vitaly deserves much better teammates and coach. But the main reason of these troubles is management of the club. There are corrupted people from local government and their friends. This is something very strange that team still produces such great talents like Vitaly.
 
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It is so painful to be a fan of Traktor this season. Vitaly deserves much better teammates and coach. But the main reason of these troubles is management of the club. There are corrupted people from local government and their friends. This is something very strange that team still produces such great talents like Vitaly.
What's the rant? Do you have any inside information to cover your claims? To me Traktor is just on the poor ones. They don't have money to sign any top notch players. What should they do?
 
What's the rant? Do you have any inside information to cover your claims? To me Traktor is just on the poor ones. They don't have money to sign any top notch players. What should they do?
Ok, let’s see.
1) Traktor has Sentyurin on the contract for a three years, but he never played more than two games. Strange thing, isn’t it?
2) Gubarev, son of GM, plays in the team, but everyone knows that he is not KHL level player.
3) Mamayev had three year contract, but it was terminated after his divorce with daughter of club’s president and former vice governor (friend of current governor). This summer Mamayev failed his try-out contract with VHL(!) club.
4) After success of last year club offered new contract for Head coach on the same conditions and speculated that his role in success was not very significant.
5) Traktor’s budget is somewhere around top-10 in the league. If you want, I’ll try to find links that I saw.
6) Most of top talents are leaving to North America (Abramov, Zamula, Egor Sokolov, Okhotyuk ), Magnitogorsk (Sheshin) and Saint Petersburg (Zhabreyev, Zhilyakov).

I believe that my list of arguments is enough to claim that Vitaly is currently playing in absolutely awful organization.
 
Ok, let’s see.
1) Traktor has Sentyurin on the contract for a three years, but he never played more than two games. Strange thing, isn’t it?
2) Gubarev, son of GM, plays in the team, but everyone knows that he is not KHL level player.
3) Mamayev had three year contract, but it was terminated after his divorce with daughter of club’s president and former vice governor (friend of current governor). This summer Mamayev failed his try-out contract with VHL(!) club.
4) After success of last year club offered new contract for Head coach on the same conditions and speculated that his role in success was not very significant.
5) Traktor’s budget is somewhere around top-10 in the league. If you want, I’ll try to find links that I saw.
6) Most of top talents are leaving to North America (Abramov, Zamula, Egor Sokolov, Okhotyuk ), Magnitogorsk (Sheshin) and Saint Petersburg (Zhabreyev, Zhilyakov).

I believe that my list of arguments is enough to claim that Vitaly is currently playing in absolutely awful organization.
Yeah, some of that stuff sounds pretty shady.
 
Ok, let’s see.
1) Traktor has Sentyurin on the contract for a three years, but he never played more than two games. Strange thing, isn’t it?
2) Gubarev, son of GM, plays in the team, but everyone knows that he is not KHL level player.
3) Mamayev had three year contract, but it was terminated after his divorce with daughter of club’s president and former vice governor (friend of current governor). This summer Mamayev failed his try-out contract with VHL(!) club.
4) After success of last year club offered new contract for Head coach on the same conditions and speculated that his role in success was not very significant.
5) Traktor’s budget is somewhere around top-10 in the league. If you want, I’ll try to find links that I saw.
6) Most of top talents are leaving to North America (Abramov, Zamula, Egor Sokolov, Okhotyuk ), Magnitogorsk (Sheshin) and Saint Petersburg (Zhabreyev, Zhilyakov).

I believe that my list of arguments is enough to claim that Vitaly is currently playing in absolutely awful organization.

Traktor and the Sens should combine organizations. Then we can throw them out altogether and start new ones in their place lol.
 
Ok, let’s see.
1) Traktor has Sentyurin on the contract for a three years, but he never played more than two games. Strange thing, isn’t it?
2) Gubarev, son of GM, plays in the team, but everyone knows that he is not KHL level player.
3) Mamayev had three year contract, but it was terminated after his divorce with daughter of club’s president and former vice governor (friend of current governor). This summer Mamayev failed his try-out contract with VHL(!) club.
4) After success of last year club offered new contract for Head coach on the same conditions and speculated that his role in success was not very significant.
5) Traktor’s budget is somewhere around top-10 in the league. If you want, I’ll try to find links that I saw.
6) Most of top talents are leaving to North America (Abramov, Zamula, Egor Sokolov, Okhotyuk ), Magnitogorsk (Sheshin) and Saint Petersburg (Zhabreyev, Zhilyakov).

I believe that my list of arguments is enough to claim that Vitaly is currently playing in absolutely awful organization.
Your post is a perfect example of how and why populism works. NONE of your arguments is convincing or proven, but you hit the spot with simple answers and answers that resound the usual tabloid narratives. And after all that you conclude with a very generalizing statement instead of staying on my question.

Traktor is not the greatest org in the KHL for sure, but basically due to lack of financial support. The rest are just consequences directly or not.

Now to your so called arguments.

1.Claiming something is strange doesn't make it true. Your rhetorics here is misplaced. Having a player under contract who barely plays should prove what? Let me tell you a secret: every team has those players. Obukhov for AkBars is quickly declining. He's had 3pts last season and was signed for another hasn't played a game for the big club this season and by the looks of it he won't unless an injuries epidemy hits hard. That's what those players are for. They are emergency replacements. Having them on the team doesn.'t prove there is a big, shady conspiracy. Btw Sentyurin played for numerous KHL teams throughout his career. Never had more than 6pts in a season. What does that prove about all those teams?

2.Using expressions like "everyone knows" doesn't help your cause. It actually hurts it. Who's everyone? I have no problem believing that a GM son is on the team, but so are other other sons and nephews in the league. Some were even stars(Tarasenko). Is there SOME nepotism in the legue? Yes, just like it is everywhere to some extent. That's human nature. Let's crucify one of the best GMs in the league for letting the 18y.o. Platonov play alonside his father. Would he get there just like that if he wasn't the son of a team's long time vet with some rep? Those things are there. But as long as that GM son is not put on the top line every game against the coach's will how is he hurting the performance of the team that much? You are blowing this out of proportion and you make a claim without any backing it up. Yes, he is a not even a middle of the pack guy, but he's had 13 pts three years ago. He is declining even from that, but again do you know how many guys are in the league who have a similar resume? They are borderline KHLers trending towards the VHL. They are interchangeable. There are bunches of those guys. Guess who's getting a contract out of those? Surprise! It's the GM's son. Human nature. But again, I fail to see how it hurts the team that bad.

3.You are married to your boss' daughter, you break up with her and go through an ugly divorce. Guess what happens IRL ten times out of ten(unless somehow your unique and irreplaceable abilities are essential to your boss' business and even then I wouldn't count on it 'cause it's personal)? Is his name Ovechkin? Maybe Datsyuk? No, it's Mamaev.

And you know what? People sometimes shoot themselves after a divorce. A fringe KHLer who after an exhausting divorce and losing his KHL job can't make it through VHL tryouts is not surprising or proving anything.

4.No, it's you who is speculating a lot. How do you know what the team was speculating on? To be exact you don't even know for sure what they offered Gatiatullin. And what's wrong with offering the same amount? It's negotiations and the art of the possible. Traktor isn't exactly rich.

What we do know for sure is that Rotenberg and SKA COULD offer more money easily AND on top of that an assistant job on the national team as a condition. And they did. We do know that. An offer Traktor could not possibly match. The only reason for Gatiatullin to stay would be some local patriotism, but sorry, a 42 years young coach who's had a great run with a mediocre team offered a job with the national team, I don't think there was a chance he would decline. And definitely for more money too as he's basically got two jobs under two contracts: one with SKA and one with the FHR.

5.You are bending it again. It's not the NHL. There is no hard cap. Traktor being 11th(not that hard to look it up) in the league means they are spending nearly 3 times(!) less than SKA on salaries. They are in middle of the pack. And in the KHL decade they went to the SF twice(once with Kuznetsov and once last season(so what are you actually talking about?) with Kravtsov and once to the Cup Finals with Kuznetsov. Not too bad for a middle of things team salary wise. You were saying?

Sometimes a well financed team gets to the bottom of the standings in a hurry and/or dwells there long enough. Just ask Toronto and Montreal fans how that works. Bad management happens. And even good or decent GMs make mistakes sometimes.

6.Oh,and the other teams somehow don't have the same problem? How is it on the team? It is on stupid younglings and their stupid parents who throw promising careers away for some dumb hype like being drafted high or the ice is always whiter on the other side of the pond. It's probably a length record setting post for me already, but IIRC Abramov for instance was offered a contract, but he went out of his way demanding(!) a roster spot and minutes in the KHL as an 18y.o. or else he'd leave for NA. Where is he now? Still playing in the "american VHL"?

So please stop spinning the wheel of conspiracy theories and political nonsense about corrupt crooks which ruin Traktor. Traktor is a quite okay org, that has had some success in the KHL, more than the vast majority of teams. They are going through an ugly stretch right now. They lack the money to be one of the league's powerhouses. And that's it.
 
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It is so painful to be a fan of Traktor this season. Vitaly deserves much better teammates and coach. But the main reason of these troubles is management of the club. There are corrupted people from local government and their friends. This is something very strange that team still produces such great talents like Vitaly.

He deserves better? Kravtsov is in the perfect situation. Sure, constantly losing sucks and he’s not being rewarded on the scoresheet, but he’s receiving playing time and responibility he otherwise wouldnt get if he played on a team with a bigger budget. Plus he’s playing at home, on the team who developed him; so he knows everybody and is confortable with them.
 
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He deserves better? Kravtsov is in the perfect situation. Sure, constantly losing sucks and he’s not being rewarded on the scoresheet, but he’s receiving playing time and responibility he otherwise wouldnt get if he played on a team with a bigger budget. Plus he’s playing at home, on the team who developed him; so he knows everybody and is confortable with them.
Of course he gets a lot of time, it is very good for his development. But I want to watch interesting hockey, not that strange thing that Traktor does, where almost only Kravtsov can play hockey.
 
Didn't read rest of thread so don't know if already mentioned. When is he expected to come over to NA? Next season?
Most likely. He’s on the last year of his contract, and he and the Rangers were thinking about getting him over for this season after the draft, so I don’t think he’ll be signing/resigning to stay in the KHL. It also wouldn’t surprise me if he signed an ATO to finish the season in the AHL later this season
 
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He deserves better? Kravtsov is in the perfect situation. Sure, constantly losing sucks and he’s not being rewarded on the scoresheet, but he’s receiving playing time and responibility he otherwise wouldnt get if he played on a team with a bigger budget. Plus he’s playing at home, on the team who developed him; so he knows everybody and is confortable with them.

And builds mental fortitude!
 
And builds mental fortitude!

Seriously, Rangers fans are delirious.
Yea OK his team is a tire fire, but, developmentally, as long as he's getting ice time, PP time and responsibility, who gives a crap if he's not being rewarded on the statsheet.......particularly when he's facing competition that's the best in the world second only to the NHL.
I mean if he was on SKA he'd be a 4th line scrub at best, probably a 3rd liner on an Avangard or whoever.
 
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Seriously, Rangers fans are delirious.
Yea OK his team is a tire fire, but, developmentally, as long as he's getting ice time, PP time and responsibility, who gives a crap if he's not being being rewarded on the statsheet? Particularly when he's facing competition that's the best in the world second only to the NHL.
I mean if he was on SKA he'd be a 4th line scrub at best, probably a 3rd liner on an Avangard or whoever.
It’s a vocal minority of us. I’m fine with his situation and production as long as he keeps up the way he’s been playing
 
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I don't see the point in posting gifs when he didn't score. Our fans keep doing this. This is part of why other fans are starting to criticize Kravtsov. They see a gif of a game he didn't score, which is his main job as a forward, and they conclude he's not doing well. When he doesn't score, let the thread be.
There's a whole game of hockey that occurs when points aren't scored. This is where you find the difference between a great player and a one tool ok utility player. I think you need to seriously look more at things besides scoring
 
If anything those clips give those people who haven't watched him, an idea that he is in fact generating chances out there, despite it not appearing on the scoresheet. Which is pretty much the one thing you want to see.

KHL's a tough league to score in. As long as he's a) playing alot of minutes and b) creating chances for himself and his line, he's in business.
 
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Seriously, Rangers fans are delirious.
Yea OK his team is a tire fire, but, developmentally, as long as he's getting ice time, PP time and responsibility, who gives a crap if he's not being rewarded on the statsheet.......particularly when he's facing competition that's the best in the world second only to the NHL.
I mean if he was on SKA he'd be a 4th line scrub at best, probably a 3rd liner on an Avangard or whoever.
We're not used to having prospects like Kravtsov cut us some slack
 
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Seriously, Rangers fans are delirious.
Yea OK his team is a tire fire, but, developmentally, as long as he's getting ice time, PP time and responsibility, who gives a crap if he's not being rewarded on the statsheet.......particularly when he's facing competition that's the best in the world second only to the NHL.
I mean if he was on SKA he'd be a 4th line scrub at best, probably a 3rd liner on an Avangard or whoever.

I hope they don't trade him because as you say it's good for him to play top-6 minutes.
 
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This is one of my favorite prospect threads now. Somehow I get a huge kick out of coming back daily and hearing about his almost points. (I hope this isn't taken as disrespect, he's obviously talented and just playing in the KHL at his age is impressive).
 
This is one of my favorite prospect threads now. Somehow I get a huge kick out of coming back daily and hearing about his almost points. (I hope this isn't taken as disrespect, he's obviously talented and just playing in the KHL at his age is impressive).

We Rangers fans are starved for a talent like Kravtsov, so naturally we get mad hype about every little thing
 
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