RW Matvei Michkov (2023, 7th, PHI) Part 4

[WarriorofTime]

Because he knew what he was signing up for?

He knew he was going to be foolishly scratched despite being one of the more talented players?

 

[Hanji]

Or it could be many Russian coaches view development as a marathon, not a sprint.
All in good time, practice makes perfect.

Is it any surprise a lot of later blooming higher-end talent comes out of Russia?

Kind of the opposite of the NHL where, as a big business, the focus tends to be on immediate gratification. Generally speaking of course.

 

[ValeriKamensky]

KHL is not a development league. It’s a mature professional hockey league, where teams reach their tournament and financial goals. As one poster said before, SKA have 2 wins in 2 games. So from this point of view they make it right.

If Briere didn’t know about this - it’s a Briere’s problem.

 

[Pavel Buchnevich]

Ok then he shouldn't be complaining he isn't playing. Neither should the fans.

I think you're wrong on both fronts.

Just because he signed a contract doesn't mean he shouldn't be able to play in actual games. Having a contract with a team shouldn't entitle that team to treat you however they like.

As for fans, why? How is this good for hockey? Even if you hate the Flyers (I don't like them any more than you do), this is bad for hockey. Nobody should support this. It could happen to their team too.

 

[Hanji]

I think you're wrong on both fronts.

Just because he signed a contract doesn't mean he shouldn't be able to play in actual games. Having a contract with a team shouldn't entitle that team to treat you however they like.

As for fans, why? How is this good for hockey? Even if you hate the Flyers (I don't like them any more than you do), this is bad for hockey. Nobody should support this. It could happen to their team too.

Doesn't that open the door for every prospect to say that? Just because (insert player name) signed a contract doesn't mean (insert player name) shouldn't be able to play in actual games.

 

[Petes2424]

People just want to completely ignore what’s going on with the KHL in general.

Russia is literally “Nationalizing” the league and honestly, I’m not sure anyone can blame them. Not after what the IIHF has been doing to their programs.

The Fedotov thing isn’t the beginning. There’s already been a lot going on. It is however, a big moment. The KHL and the Russian Government, drew a line in the sand, when they allowed him to step on that ice.…. Pretending they didn’t is naive, or it’s someone trying to convince themselves otherwise.

Whether you’re Philly, Detroit, Carolina, Arizona, or anyone else with a really good Russian prospect, flip a coin at this point. There’s a good chance you never see your prospect come to North America.

Any player under about 28, who’s not breaking the bank salary wise, is now at risk. Morozov is another player who likely never plays for Vegas again. Loan? Yea right. Lol. There’s a team with a few good young Russians, they need to keep an eye on. If Chayka doesn’t think he’s getting a fair shot, or Dorofeyev feels slighted somehow, they now know, they can walk whenever they feel like it, and the Russian Government will stand by them.

It opens the door for all kinds of chaos, and it will come. It was a very, very big deal that he played in that game. Politicians don’t start commenting, if it isn’t.

Sometimes people in the West just can’t comprehend what it’s like to live in a country like Russia. Nationalism is a huge thing. Probably the most important thing. The moron politicians over here pretend the Russian people will suddenly force Putin out somehow. The majority of Russians love him because the most important thing to most Russians, is keeping their country together. Putin has been able to accomplish that after some scary years, and they respect that.

They see things very different than we do. The KHL is no different. It’s a matter of pride for most Russians, and they’re very angry with not being allowed to compete Internationally. They will convince themselves, if they keep their great young players, the league would rival the NHL. They really believe that.

A couple of things we’ve been seeing. Obviously the big exodus of import players before last season…. Many of the leagues best players left. The last couple of years, a lot more of their top prospects have been signing long term contracts in the KHL….. The MHL shut down North American scouts last year. You couldn’t get anything really, and it all came from one source… The forcing of Canadian and American players to become Russian citizens to get a contract. BTW, I’ve heard almost all NA players have, except from the one obvious team.… Then all the IIHF issues….. topped off with Fedotov stepping on that ice Friday.

They’re Nationalizing the league. Of course they’re going to try making it appear the best in the world. That’s how they’ll market it to Russians. When they ultimately announce these kids won’t be leaving for the NHL, they’ll make it a very big deal. Making sure everyone understands, the NHL wanted these players so badly, they used top picks on them.

Putin loves the sport and the league. It’s already being marketed as an “us against the world” type thing.

People are naive to ignore the geopolitics here. It’s playing out right in front of us.

Obviously, I’m just like anyone else in North America. I want to see the best players in the world, play in the NHL. Putin and the KHL are now going to have something to say about that. I’d be shocked at this point if we see any of these kids come over. There’s a reason many teams had no intentions of drafting a Russian with a high pick this summer. Once Fedotov returned from the military that fast, with a KHL contract in hand, flashbacks to the late 80s, early 90s popped in many heads. It’s been at least a year since I first heard Buchelnikov probably never comes over. That he’s committed to playing in Russia.

So Michkov being benched and punished (like all young players should be) for that lazy play a couple of weeks ago, should be the least of concerns for Philly fans. It’s gonna suck too, because you’re just not going to get any straight answers from anyone in Russia for awhile here. It could be years, or it could be after the next big moment in this situation. Maybe when the first of these really good prospects is supposed to come over and suddenly it’s announced he’s staying. Who knows really. They’re in no hurry to tell anyone. They’ll just keep doing things in their best interest. That doesn’t include having great young Russian players, leaving Russia for Canada and America right now. The optics of it are horrible for the KHL in Russia.

They will do everything in their power to keep those kids from coming over.

It’s going to be years after this war ends, before Russia and the IIHF make up. By the time all of this is over, Michkov could be 35. Maybe much older.

 

[Pavel Buchnevich]

Doesn't that open the door for every prospect to say that? Just because (insert player name) signed a contract doesn't mean (insert player name) shouldn't be able to play in actual games.

If you operate this a completely literal sense, yes, but I think it's very apparent how different Michkov's situation (in so many ways) is from almost every player to come along in Russia in a very long time, probably since the USSR.

As good as someone like Demidov is, even if SKA was to do the same thing with him, I don't his situation will be anywhere near as polarizing for a lot of reasons.

 

[Hanji]

People just want to completely ignore what’s going on with the KHL in general.

Russia is literally “Nationalizing” the league and honestly, I’m not sure anyone can blame them. Not after what the IIHF has been doing to their programs.

The Fedotov thing isn’t the beginning. There’s already been a lot going on. It is however, a big moment. The KHL and the Russian Government, drew a line in the sand, when they allowed him to step on that ice.…. Pretending they didn’t is naive, or it’s someone trying to convince themselves otherwise.

Whether you’re Philly, Detroit, Carolina, Arizona, or anyone else with a really good Russian prospect, flip a coin at this point. There’s a good chance you never see your prospect come to North America.

Any player under about 28, who’s not breaking the bank salary wise, is now at risk. Morozov is another player who likely never plays for Vegas again. Loan? Yea right. Lol. There’s a team with a few good young Russians, they need to keep an eye on. If Chayka doesn’t think he’s getting a fair shot, or Dorofeyev feels slighted somehow, they now know, they can walk whenever they feel like it, and the Russian Government will stand by them.

It opens the door for all kinds of chaos, and it will come. It was a very, very big deal that he played in that game. Politicians don’t start commenting, if it isn’t.

Sometimes people in the West just can’t comprehend what it’s like to live in a country like Russia. Nationalism is a huge thing. Probably the most important thing. The moron politicians over here pretend the Russian people will suddenly force Putin out somehow. The majority of Russians love him because the most important thing to most Russians, is keeping their country together. Putin has been able to accomplish that after some scary years, and they respect that.

They see things very different than we do. The KHL is no different. It’s a matter of pride for most Russians, and they’re very angry with not being allowed to compete Internationally. They will convince themselves, if they keep their great young players, the league would rival the NHL. They really believe that.

A couple of things we’ve been seeing. Obviously the big exodus of import players before last season…. Many of the leagues best players left. The last couple of years, a lot more of their top prospects have been signing long term contracts in the KHL….. The MHL shut down North American scouts last year. You couldn’t get anything really, and it all came from one source… The forcing of Canadian and American players to become Russian citizens to get a contract. BTW, I’ve heard almost all NA players have, except from the one obvious team.… Then all the IIHF issues….. topped off with Fedotov stepping on that ice Friday.

They’re Nationalizing the league. Of course they’re going to try making it appear the best in the world. That’s how they’ll market it to Russians. When they ultimately announce these kids won’t be leaving for the NHL, they’ll make it a very big deal. Making sure everyone understands, the NHL wanted these players so badly, they used top picks on them.

Putin loves the sport and the league. It’s already being marketed as an “us against the world” type thing.

People are naive to ignore the geopolitics here. It’s playing out right in front of us.

Obviously, I’m just like anyone else in North America. I want to see the best players in the world, play in the NHL. Putin and the KHL are now going to have something to say about that. I’d be shocked at this point if we see any of these kids come over. There’s a reason many teams had no intentions of drafting a Russian with a high pick this summer. Once Fedotov returned from the military that fast, with a KHL contract in hand, flashbacks to the late 80s, early 90s popped in many heads. It’s been at least a year since I first heard Buchelnikov probably never comes over. That he’s committed to playing in Russia.

So Michkov being benched and punished (like all young players should be) for that lazy play a couple of weeks ago, should be the least of concerns for Philly fans. It’s gonna suck too, because you’re just not going to get any straight answers from anyone in Russia for awhile here. It could be years, or it could be after the next big moment in this situation. Maybe when the first of these really good prospects is supposed to come over and suddenly it’s announced he’s staying. Who knows really. They’re in no hurry to tell anyone. They’ll just keep doing things in their best interest. That doesn’t include having great young Russian players, leaving Russia for Canada and America right now. The optics of it are horrible for the KHL in Russia.

They will do everything in their power to keep those kids from coming over.

It’s going to be years after this war ends, before Russia and the IIHF make up. By the time all of this is over, Michkov could be 35. Maybe much older.

Wow. CNN has a HFBoards account. Who knew?

 

[Albatros]

KHL is not a development league. It’s a mature professional hockey league, where teams reach their tournament and financial goals. As one poster said before, SKA have 2 wins in 2 games. So from this point of view they make it right.

If Briere didn’t know about this - it’s a Briere’s problem.

The money comes from Gazprom, not from professional hockey operations which would be absolutely unable to finance themselves sustainably.

 

[ReHabs]

The money comes from Gazprom, not from professional hockey operations which would be absolutely unable to finance themselves sustainably.

And? Money for most NHL teams comes from their billionaire owners and the teams would be in financial difficulties otherwise. Some teams run at a loss at all times -- Coyotes for example. It doesn't make SKA any less driven to succeed in the league that they have a financial underwriter.

All of this is immaterial to the topic: Neither SKA nor any KHL team are in the business to develop talents for the NHL. The sooner North American hockey fans accept this, the sooner they'll learn to calm down and trust that their prospect, if he's good enough, will develop all the same.

 

[Albatros]

And? Money for most NHL teams comes from their billionaire owners and the teams would be in financial difficulties otherwise. Some teams run at a loss at all times -- Coyotes for example. It doesn't make SKA any less driven to succeed in the league that they have a financial underwriter.

In the NHL the revenues are north of 6 billion dollars a season at the moment, it's very sustainable. Whether one franchise should be located in Arizona or somewhere else doesn't significantly affect the equation. But even the Coyotes have André Tourigny and not Alex Meruelo Jr. as their head coach.

 

[Kipper933]

Scout's Analysis: On Matvei Michkov and developing a prospect in Russia

Seventh overall NHL draft pick Matvei Michkov was scratched for SKA St. Petersburg's first two KHL games. Jason Bukala writes about the risk Philadelphia took with the selection, and what, if anything, to make of this.

www.sportsnet.ca

 

[ReHabs]

In the NHL the revenues are north of 6 billion dollars a season at the moment, it's very sustainable. Whether one franchise should be located in Arizona or somewhere else doesn't significantly affect the equation. But even the Coyotes have André Tourigny and not Alex Meruelo Jr. as their head coach.

What does this have to do with Matvei Michkov? I feel like many of the comments here have nothing to do with Michkov or SKA in any way.

 

[Albatros]

What does this have to do with Matvei Michkov? I feel like many of the comments here have nothing to do with Michkov or SKA in any way.

You're arguing that the SKA is driven to succeed, yet has a totally incompetent amateur appointed only due to nepotism as their head coach. Of course those are not mutually exclusive, but says something about the quality of the organization.

 

[Dr Jablonski PhD]

Maybe Michkov is just not good enough yet. SKA is 2-0 without him, only leaking 1 goal. Maybe with Michkov they score 1-2 more but also give up 2-3 more. Who knows?

Glad my team didn't draft him though, enjoy your next three years of drama.

I don't think Michkov was on the ice for a goal against in the whole preseason tbh. Maybe like one that I don't remember. And say what you will about the stat, but the average +/- stat for a player with 10 or more games played for HC Sochi last year was *-10*. Michkov came out at +1. One of the best two scores on the team. But continue on in your ignorance

 

[ReHabs]

You're arguing that the SKA is driven to succeed, yet has a totally incompetent amateur appointed only due to nepotism as their head coach. Of course those are not mutually exclusive, but says something about the quality of the organization.

SKA is not a development team and the KHL is not a development league. The quality of its head coach has nothing to do with this fact. The KHL does not exist to produce ready made players for the NHL to take from them, and FOR FREE no less.

 

[Albatros]

SKA is not a development team and the KHL is not a development league. The quality of its head coach has nothing to do with this fact. The KHL does not exist to produce ready made players for the NHL to take from them, and FOR FREE no less.

Of course not, that's exactly why Michkov has little to gain there and would be better off leaving as soon as possible.

 

[ReHabs]

Of course not, that's exactly why Michkov has little to gain there and would be better off leaving as soon as possible.

Michkov is not nearly NHL-ready and would need to have some reps in the AHL before he's up to speed. Every honest scouting report corroborates what SKA's management feel about Michkov: he's not a powerful enough skater to make up for his size and he's not good enough defensively to be entrusted against the highest-level competition. He's a developing player and is still a teenager. He is under contract for at least the rest of this season so the point of saying he needs to leave is moot. His best way forward is to carve out TOI this season by being as good as possible.

 

[Zine]

Of course not, that's exactly why Michkov has little to gain there and would be better off leaving as soon as possible.

From SKA’s perspective he still has 2 years on his contract after this season.
A bigger, stronger, more mature Michkov is, without question, in SKA’s interest to develop….. even if they only reap the benefits for 2 years.
Why do you think he was sent to Sochi last season?

 

[Albatros]

Michkov is not nearly NHL-ready and would need to have some reps in the AHL before he's up to speed. Every honest scouting report corroborates what SKA's management feel about Michkov: he's not a powerful enough skater to make up for his size and he's not good enough defensively to be entrusted against the highest-level competition. He's a developing player and is still a teenager. He is under contract for at least the rest of this season so the point of saying he needs to leave is moot. His best way forward is to carve out TOI this season by being as good as possible.

Charlottetown is a fine place for a teenager if he's not ready for the AHL. They had by far the weakest offense in the Q last year (yet made the playoffs) so he'd have that end of the ice all for himself.

 

[Zine]

As ReHabs stated, the KHL isnt in the business of developing players for the NHL.

But that doesnt mean development is neglected, or a player is ‘punished’ if clubs know he’s leaving.
All organizations have a vested interest in seeing their KHL, VHL, MHL, or affiliated teams succeed. Every player is an asset in some way or another, even if only for 1 year.
The amount of $ teams invest in developing players from youth to adult is crazy. Teams wanna get the most out of everything they can. Not to mention the unified interest in developing players for the national team also.

 

[Albatros]

Not to mention the unified interest in developing players for the national team also.

Russia Z5?

 

[WarriorofTime]

Whether you’re Philly, Detroit, Carolina, Arizona, or anyone else with a really good Russian prospect, flip a coin at this point. There’s a good chance you never see your prospect come to North America.

This is alarmist and not accurate. Numerous players have signed NHL deals out of Russia since the invasion. Fedotov remains a one off and appears related to him avoiding military service (which is illegal in Russia) with fake papers. I would put the odds at Michkov not coming to Philadelphia upon expiration of his current contract at less than 5 %. Russians are just like everyone else and want to take their chance against the best in the world and know their earnings ceiling is substantially higher if they become a big NHL star.

 

[FriarChill]

That's probably one of the bigger myths around here. There are probably more NCAA picks bailing on the team who drafted them than russian prospects not coming to the NHL. I can't think of a single one.

Hope we can get back to discuss Michkov. Last few pages are really bad...

 

[rsteen]

It's funny searching "Michkov" on Twitter and seeing half the discussion in French. Habs fans are seemingly monitoring this situation as closely as Flyers fans. We all know why.

Shane Wright breathes a sigh of relief.