Rumor: Rumors & Proposals Thread: "Wanted Dead or Alive: A Goalie, Defense & Depth (preferably alive)

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Took a pill in Sbisa

2showToffoliIwascool
Apr 23, 2004
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I don’t see why we spend an actual asset to attain a boat anchor contract in exchange for or own boat anchor contract which we were going to buy out.

A trade wouldn't be orchestrated to this specific of a place if he was going to be bought out. There's a number of teams all around North America that have the cap space to do that. He's been on a crap team and would easily be our 2nd best LHD.
 

FlameChampion

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Jul 13, 2011
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Unless its Keith for Neal straight across (or with a minor add), I dont really see it being all that feasible for the Oilers. Spending assets on a 37 year old dman isnt a good idea. If were giving up assets of any value, then just buy-out Neal and move on.
 

Trafalgar Sadge Law

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Nov 8, 2007
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Duncan Keith is terrible and is only gonna get worse at age 38, also unlike Neal who has a buyout friendly contract Keith's is nearly buyout immune. Veterancy/experience/intangibles is the most overrated thing in pro sports, that experience and intangibles don't mean a damn thing when they're a blatant negative value asset in terms of actual play. You know what actually matters? TANGIBLES! Demonstrable, measurable, observable contribution! The only way I'd consider trading for Keith is if the Oilers aren't planning on using a buyout on Neal this summer and do a 1 for 1 swap, no picks added, no prospects added, nothing.

Whenever you're thinking about whether we should go after a player, think to yourself, what's the first word that comes to mind about a player. If it's some intangibles filth like "leadership, heart, grit, culture, locker-room, veteran, experience, character" or whatever the f***, the answer is a big fat NO! Stay away! The whole reason the Oilers are in this mess today is because we overindexed and overpayed on this kind of trash during both the Decade of Darkness (Belanger, Gordon, Sutton, N Schultz, Ference, Fayne, Horcoff, Smyth etc) and the Chiarelli era (Lucic, Kassian, Chiasson, Larsson, Sekera, Russell etc).

All the posters talking about how the problem is no veteran presence or character whatever, get this through your heads:

Tangibles>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Intangibles
 
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PKSpecialist

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Feb 6, 2010
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Unless its Keith for Neal straight across (or with a minor add), I dont really see it being all that feasible for the Oilers. Spending assets on a 37 year old dman isnt a good idea. If were giving up assets of any value, then just buy-out Neal and move on.
Agreed. I don't care what the stats say, having a guy with Keith's pedigree around won't hurt this team. He's a Stanley Cup champion who knows how to win. You hear it every year in the playoffs. Teams need to learn how to win. Need to have players who have been through the ups and downs of the playoffs to keep the team from going into lulls. If we don't have a suitor for James Neal's contract, and don't intend to buy him out, Duncan Keith is a better option than Neal for the Oilers. He's a placeholder for Broberg or Samorukov, and a stop-gap if Klefbom can't play. I'm not willing to part with any assets other than a B prospect or late round draft pick on top of Neal, but if we are spending the 5 million anyways, I'd prefer it be on a piece with a chance to contribute in a meaningful way. I'd rather bet on Keith than Neal.
 
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McSpecial DraiBlend

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I haven't read through all of the comments but if we can add Keith you do it. This is not a Andrew Ference situation. The guy would be an amazing partner and mentor for Bouchard. Also it would be very valuable having his leadership and winning pedigree in the room. I don't know what it takes and won't speculate but i'm all over this addition.
 

Trafalgar Sadge Law

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Nov 8, 2007
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I haven't read through all of the comments but if we can add Keith you do it. This is not a Andrew Ference situation. The guy would be an amazing partner and mentor for Bouchard. Also it would be very valuable having his leadership and winning pedigree in the room. I don't know what it takes and won't speculate but i'm all over this addition.
Yeah you're right it's WORSE than a Ference situation. Ference was 3.25 million when the cap was still growing at a rapid rate. Keith is an over 5.5 million dollar cap hit in a frozen cap lmfao. You can get a solid #2 or 3 dman whose young and/or in their prime for that kind of money. Who cares about leadership or winning pedigree or whatever the f***? Pretty sure major Cup contributor Milan Lucic decreased our chances of winning and hurt our players' development if anything.

Agreed. I don't care what the stats say, having a guy with Keith's pedigree around won't hurt this team. He's a Stanley Cup champion who knows how to win. You hear it every year in the playoffs. Teams need to learn how to win. Need to have players who have been through the ups and downs of the playoffs to keep the team from going into lulls. If we don't have a suitor for James Neal's contract, and don't intend to buy him out, Duncan Keith is a better option than Neal for the Oilers. He's a placeholder for Broberg or Samorukov, and a stop-gap if Klefbom can't play. I'm not willing to part with any assets other than a B prospect or late round draft pick on top of Neal, but if we are spending the 5 million anyways, I'd prefer it be on a piece with a chance to contribute in a meaningful way. I'd rather bet on Keith than Neal.
Pretty sure 5.5 million in cap space hurts this team. Pretty sure near league bottom defensive metrics hurts this team. Pretty sure Milan Lucic was a Stanley Cup champion who knew how to win. I'm fine with trading Neal for Keith if we're not planning to buy him out, but lets not pretend like this guy is a positive value asset.
 
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Canovin

1% is the new 11.5%
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Yeah you're right it's WORSE than a Ference situation. Ference was 3.25 million when the cap was still growing at a rapid rate. Keith is an over 5.5 million dollar cap hit in a frozen cap lmfao. You can get a solid #2 or 3 dman whose young and/or in their prime for that kind of money. Who cares about leadership or winning pedigree or whatever the f***? Pretty sure major Cup contributor Milan Lucic decreased our chances of winning and hurt our players' development if anything.
Keith plays a cerebral game tho. That's huge for our players.
 
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Aceboogie

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Aug 25, 2012
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I haven't read through all of the comments but if we can add Keith you do it. This is not a Andrew Ference situation. The guy would be an amazing partner and mentor for Bouchard. Also it would be very valuable having his leadership and winning pedigree in the room. I don't know what it takes and won't speculate but i'm all over this addition.

This is a joke hopefully. Adding Keith is worse than adding Ference. Keith is barely an NHL caliber D (likely on par with Ference back then), but just on a much worse contract

We also signed Ference for the "leadership", howd that turn out?
 

Trafalgar Sadge Law

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Keith plays a cerebral game tho. That's huge for our players.
Ah yes, that cerebral game really coming in huge there helping him to a whopping 3rd percentile even strength defensive metrics. What a huge help! Obviously his abysmal defensive metrics are partly due to him playing far too many minutes and facing higher quality of competition than a 37 year old should be, but chances are he'd be well below average even in a reduced role.

 
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HugentNopkins

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Oct 13, 2019
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I would be excited for Duncan Keith if this was five years ago. He's a shell of his former self and has not been good for a long time.

I pray Holland inquired on him just to raise his value and have little brother Treliving throw some big name assets to acquire him.
 

Canovin

1% is the new 11.5%
Oct 27, 2010
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Ah yes, that cerebral game really coming in huge there helping him to a whopping 3rd percentile even strength defensive metrics. What a huge help! Obviously his abysmal defensive metrics are partly due to him playing far too many minutes and facing higher quality of competition than a 37 year old should be, but chances are he'd be well below average even in a reduced role.


If I had to choose Duncan or Kosko/Neal, I choose the former
 
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Trafalgar Sadge Law

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If I had to choose Duncan or Kosko/Neal, I choose the former
I'd take Koskinen over Keith every millisecond of every day simply because you only have to deal with Koskinen for 1 more year and Keith's albatross is 2 more. Neal and Keith are both terrible and can be swapped 1 for 1.
 
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Aceboogie

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Aug 25, 2012
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I know they are just rumors. But it'd be fun to start seeing some rumors of Oilers being involved with trading for a good player.

Or even better yet, being the team that takes advantage of dumb GMs in a trade. Be on the other side for once

Would make the offseason discussion less depressing forsure
 
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Paralyzer

Oilers Win Cup in 2025
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Yeah you're right it's WORSE than a Ference situation. Ference was 3.25 million when the cap was still growing at a rapid rate. Keith is an over 5.5 million dollar cap hit in a frozen cap lmfao. You can get a solid #2 or 3 dman whose young and/or in their prime for that kind of money. Who cares about leadership or winning pedigree or whatever the f***? Pretty sure major Cup contributor Milan Lucic decreased our chances of winning and hurt our players' development if anything.


Pretty sure 5.5 million in cap space hurts this team. Pretty sure near league bottom defensive metrics hurts this team. Pretty sure Milan Lucic was a Stanley Cup champion who knew how to win. I'm fine with trading Neal for Keith if we're not planning to buy him out, but lets not pretend like this guy is a positive value asset.

Love how it's all about cap and not what a player can bring to the team. Might as well not sign anyone then if it's all about cap space. Keep it at 20M. Must be amazing to have all this amazing cap space. Cap space.
 

Trafalgar Sadge Law

Registered User
Nov 8, 2007
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Love how it's all about cap and not what a player can bring to the team. Might as well not sign anyone then if it's all about cap space. Keep it at 20M. Must be amazing to have all this amazing cap space. Cap space.
What does he bring to the team exactly? Near league bottom defensive metrics? Declining speed and puck skills? Awesome!
 

Mr Sakich

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If it was Neal for Keith straight up, do you do it?

Same cap hit and years, Neal cannot fill any need while Kieth may be a decent 3rd pairing guy to pair with Bouchard or Bear
 

PKSpecialist

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Feb 6, 2010
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Pretty sure 5.5 million in cap space hurts this team. Pretty sure near league bottom defensive metrics hurts this team. Pretty sure Milan Lucic was a Stanley Cup champion who knew how to win. I'm fine with trading Neal for Keith if we're not planning to buy him out, but lets not pretend like this guy is a positive value asset.
Paying Neal 5 million to sit in the press box hurts this team. If the decision is made NOT to buy out Neal, I'd rather have Keith. End point. LD is a huge question mark for the Oil this year with Klefbom's uncertainty. With Nurse playing 25 minutes a night, I'd be good with Keith playing 18. I wouldn't trade assets for Keith, but if we are carrying a boat anchor on the team, I'd rather Keith than Neal.

And for the record, this team's one and only playoff series win in the last decade plus came with Milan Lucic and his intangibles coming to this team and losing Taylor Hall... maybe, just maybe, there's something to this.

Again, I'm not delusional and thinking that Duncan Keith is going to be our saviour or that he is going to be the player he was 7 years ago, but given the choice between Keith and Neal...I go Keith.
 

Paralyzer

Oilers Win Cup in 2025
Sep 29, 2006
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What does he bring to the team exactly? Near league bottom defensive metrics? Declining speed and puck skills? Awesome!

Do you even listen to yourself when you talk? He's a PROVEN vet who KNOWS how to WIN it ALL. Just like Mike Smith, he is a great voice to have in the locker room and can be a mentor to the younger dmen like Broberg and Bouchard, which is huge for Keith as he knows how much mentorship means to a young defender (ie. Campbell and Timonen when signed in Chicago). He's also still a viable 3rd-4th Dman. He can take some load off Nurse having to be out there 25+ mins a game. But no, let's make false claims and think cap space is more important that leadership and mentorship.
 
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Ck1

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What does he bring to the team exactly? Near league bottom defensive metrics? Declining speed and puck skills? Awesome!
If you could swing a 1 for 1 deal with Neal and have them retain a little . Then he brings exp and winning to the dressing room. I’ll take that over Neal.
 

Beerfish

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Apr 14, 2007
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I haven't read through all of the comments but if we can add Keith you do it. This is not a Andrew Ference situation. The guy would be an amazing partner and mentor for Bouchard. Also it would be very valuable having his leadership and winning pedigree in the room. I don't know what it takes and won't speculate but i'm all over this addition.

It is very very much like Ference, almost the same. This is a nice to have,,,,,,10 years ago player. To be an effectual mentor leader you still have to be able to play and not be a liability. You do not have to be the super all star you were in your peak but you have to be as good as the lower end dmen you already have and keith is not that.
 
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