Round 2, Vote 7 (HOH Top Non-NHL Europeans)

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Guldskridskon (Best Swedish player at the WHC/Olympics)
Sterner 2 (67, 69)
Svedberg 0

Why has Svedberg never won this award?

Alexandrov, Hlinka, Sologubov, Ragulin, Malecek and Kapustin are the definitive top guys for me this time. Then Svedberg, Davydov, Lutchenko, and the bottom three are Shadrin, Lindmark and Dzurilla. What is Lindmark's case over e.g. Ulf Sterner? Was Dzurilla much better than even e.g. Konovalenko? How is Shadrin's international or domestic record more impressive than e.g. Vladimir Vikulov's?

Come on now. Their record are not really comparable (longevity, awards...).

Soviet goalies playing in 60s (Konovalenko and Zinger) were considered to be the main weakness of the Tarasov´s squad by Czechoslovak players.

I had Lindmark over both Dzurilla and Kralik on my initial list. Lindmark destroys Kralik in longevity, and I think he was perhaps more consistent than Dzurilla. Starting goalie for team Sweden for more than a decade, right? Won gold at the WHCs in 1987 and 1991, Sweden's first two wins since 1962, the 1987 win over a still excellent Soviet team.

My perception of Dzurilla is that he was always above average goalie with occasional greatness. Now the case for him lies in two things - the former thing he did for much longer than any of his peers in Europe, the latter thing he did in any age, resp. in different eras and different competion.

To the first point, Dzurilla, unlike Holecek, was recognized as great talent right from the start. He started his pro-career in Slovan already in 1959 when he played his 1st elite-league game (he was 17 y/o) - last elite domestic season of Zabrodsky for example.
His first international game was played against Sweden (with Tumba in the lineup) only year after his debut --> in 1960.
His first international tournament should have been WC 1962, but countries of the Eastern bloc refused to come over. So his first one was in 1963 when he was 21 years old.
Then his last international tournament was WC 1977 when he outplayed Holecek, replaced him and won gold medal (35 y/o).
He played in 19 domestic seasons and 571 games - by far the most at the time. And he actually won one domestic title with his team in Germany somewhere in 1980 or 81 :).

To the second point, consider his best tournaments: WC 1965, WC 1969, OG 1972, CC 1976 and perhaps WC 1977. See how much they´re spread out?
___________________________

I´ll post a little more about him yet but 2 more facts:

1) Despite his long career and many championships, he was never outplayed by his backup when he started as number one goalie (though he had some weaker tournaments).

2) Correct me if I´m wrong, but when Dzurilla in his famous game against Soviets in 1969 (2:0 in first game for CSSR) posted a shutout, it was for the only time in 60s in major tournaments when Soviets didn´t score a goal! From 1954 to 1970 USSR scored at least one goal in every game of every championship, except for Canada x USSR in 1955, and CSSR x USSR in 1969.
___________________________

Question of longevity:

number of major international tournaments (WC, OG, CC):
Dzurilla - 12
Lindmark - 11
 
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Why has Svedberg never won this award?

This is of course very hard to answer and the only ones who really can give an answer is probably the people who voted on the award (the team management and members of the hockey federation). It should also be pointed out that we probably not should punish Svedberg too much for never winning the award considering that we don´t have the full voting record. It is of course possible that Svedberg finished 2nd or 3rd in the voting on multiple occassions and actually has a strong overall record despite never winning the award. The same is true for Tumba who also never won the award. Because based on Tumbas and Svedbergs strong international record it seems likely that both of them should have many strong finishes in the Guldskridskon voting. But it still seems pretty clear that the international observers liked Svedberg (and Tumba) more than the Swedish hockey federation and team management did.

Edit: Why Svedberg did not win the award in 1969 is easy to figure out considering that Sterner was voted the best forward of the tournament by both the media and the directorate. In 1970 it seems somewhat strange that Svedberg did not win considering that he won the directorate best defenceman award and was second among defencemen in the All-Star voting. But the winner Leif Holmqvist also had a good tournament and finished second among goaltenders in the All-Star voting. So that year may be somewhat strange but not that hard to understand. The real headscratcher is in 1968 where Svedberg was second among defencemen in the All-Star voting but still lost the Guldskridskon award to Bert-Olov Nordlander who did not get any support from the international observers (or at best 6 votes). It seems likely that Svedberg was one of the top votegetters in each of these years though.
 
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Why has Svedberg never won this award?

I don't think the Guldskridskon award is a good award to use to determine the greatness of a player. It uses a small sample size (one tournament), a small group pf players (one team) and a small amount of voters (team management). It might give a hint on who had a strong tournament, but doesn't really tell us anything about how a certain player compared to his international competition overall.

The Swedish All-Star Team is a much better guide if the goal is to determine the Swedish view on a player's performance. It takes both domestic and international performance in consideration. Svedberg and Sterner both have a strong record here.

Players who have been elected to the Swedish All-Star Team the most times
[table="head;title=list"]Player|Position|Times elected|Years
Tord Lundström|F|8 times|1965, 1968, 1970, 1971, 1972, 1973, 1975, 1976
Leif Holmqvist|G|7 times|1965, 1966, 1967, 1968, 1969, 1970, 1971
Ulf Sterner|F|6 times|1961, 1962, 1963, 1966, 1967, 1969
Mats Sundin|F|6 times|1991, 1992, 1994, 1997, 1998, 2002
Lennart Svedberg|D|6 times|1965, 1966, 1968, 1969, 1970, 1971
Bert-Olov Nordlander|D|6 times|1961, 1962, 1963, 1968, 1969, 1971
Johan Davidsson|F|5 times|2003, 2004, 2007, 2008, 2010
Anders Eldebrink|D|5 times|1984, 1985, 1987, 1988, 1989
Peter Forsberg|F|5 times|1992, 1993, 1994, 1997, 1998
Peter Lindmark|G|5 times|1981, 1985, 1986, 1987, 1988
HÃ¥kan Loob|F|5 times|1983, 1985, 1990, 1991, 1992
Nils Nilsson|F|5 times|1959, 1960, 1962, 1965, 1967
Mats Näslund|F|5 times|1979, 1980, 1981, 1982, 1983
Ronald Pettersson|F|5 times|1959, 1960, 1962, 1965, 1966
Roland Stoltz|D|5 times|1959, 1960, 1963, 1964, 1966
Thomas Eriksson|D|4 times|1980, 1983, 1990, 1991
Tomas Jonsson|D|4 times|1979, 1980, 1990, 1995
Nicklas Lidström|D|4 times|1991, 1997, 1998, 2000
Rolf Ridderwall|G|4 times|1984, 1989, 1990, 1991
Thomas Rundqvist|F|4 times|1988, 1989, 1990, 1991
Tommy Salo|G|4 times|1997, 1998, 1999, 2002
Mats Ã…hlberg|F|4 times|1973, 1974, 1975, 1977
[/table]
 
Lennart Svedberg

A few articles about Lennart Svedberg.

1969 Dink Carroll column from The Gazette announcing that Svedberg was placed on the Red Wings' negotiation list:

https://news.google.com/newspapers?id=6vktAAAAIBAJ&sjid=jaAFAAAAIBAJ&hl=fr&pg=976,5279780

1969 WHC article.Last day, how the medals were decided. All-star team détails, Arne Stromberg's strategy going to six defencemen and some words about Svedberg's play:

https://news.google.com/newspapers?id=oa8tAAAAIBAJ&sjid=jqAFAAAAIBAJ&hl=fr&pg=816,7194518

1970 WHC. Article detailing Sweden's upset win over the Soviet Union. Svedberg receives kudos:

https://news.google.com/newspapers?id=6cQtAAAAIBAJ&sjid=jKAFAAAAIBAJ&hl=fr&pg=1939,1554101
 
Some preliminary thoughts:
Still not sold on Malecek going in our top 30. Does anyone have a record of how many goals he actually scored against legitimate competition (Canada, USA, Great Britain?) I really don't care how much he scored against non-competitive teams.

Games against Canada, USA, Great Britain with Malecek in the lineup:

WC 1924
Canada - Czechoslovakia 30:0

WC 1931
Canada - Czechoslovakia 2:0
USA - Czechoslovakia 1:0

WC 1933
USA - Czechoslovakia 6:0 (not 100% sure that Malecek played this game though)
Canada - Czechoslovakia 4:0

WC 1934
Great Britain - Czechoslovakia 2:1 (Malecek didn´t register assist or goal in this one)
USA - Czechoslovakia 1:0

WC 1935
Canada - Czechoslovakia 2:1 (goal scored by Cisar, Malecek likely didn´t assist on this goal)
Great Britain - Czechoslovakia 2:1 (Malecek didn´t register assist or goal in this game)

WC 1936
USA - Czechoslovakia 2:0
Great Britain - Czechoslovakia 5:0
Canada - Czechoslovakia 7:0

WC 1937
Canada - Czechoslovakia 3:0

WC 1938
Canada - Czechoslovakia 3:0
USA - Czechoslovakia 0:2 (first win! but Malecek again didn´t have any point)
Great Britain - Czechoslovakia 1:0

WC 1939
Canada - Czechoslovakia 2:1 (Malecek didn´t register a point, though I´m not sure he played this game, goal scored by Drobny)
Great Britain - Czechoslovakia 0:2 (second win! Malecek scored 2nd goal, a possible assist on 1st Trojak´s goal too)
USA - Czechoslovakia 1:0
Canada - Czechoslovakia 4:0

Summary
19 games: 1 goal and maybe 1 assist
2 wins, 17 losses
________________________________

I´ll include Zabrodsky´ and Bobrov´s record (only goals) for comparison´ sake.

Zabrodsky vs. Canada:

OG 1948
Canada - Czechoslovakia 0:0

WC 1949
Canada - Czechoslovakia 2:3 (Zabrodsky scored one goal)

WC 1954
Canada - Czechoslovakia 5:2 (Zabrodsky scored one goal)

WC 1955
Canada - Czechoslovakia 5:3 (Zabrodsky scored two goals)

OG 1956
Canada - Czechoslovakia 6:3 (Zabrodsky didn´t score)

Summary
5 games: 4 goals + ? assists
_________________________________

Bobrov vs. Canada:

WC 1954
Canada - USSR 2:7 (Bobrov scored one goal)

WC 1955
Canada - USSR 5:0

OG 1956
Canada - USSR 0:2 (Bobrov didn´t score)

WC 1957
Canada didn´t participate

Summary
3 games: 1 goal + ? assists
 
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A few articles about Lennart Svedberg.

1969 Dink Carroll column from The Gazette announcing that Svedberg was placed on the Red Wings' negotiation list:

https://news.google.com/newspapers?id=6vktAAAAIBAJ&sjid=jaAFAAAAIBAJ&hl=fr&pg=976,5279780

1969 WHC article.Last day, how the medals were decided. All-star team détails, Arne Stromberg's strategy going to six defencemen and some words about Svedberg's play:

https://news.google.com/newspapers?id=oa8tAAAAIBAJ&sjid=jqAFAAAAIBAJ&hl=fr&pg=816,7194518

1970 WHC. Article detailing Sweden's upset win over the Soviet Union. Svedberg receives kudos:

https://news.google.com/newspapers?id=6cQtAAAAIBAJ&sjid=jKAFAAAAIBAJ&hl=fr&pg=1939,1554101

Thanks for posting these. This is an example of the type of thing this project needs more of.

Some of the most relevant passages:

From the 1969 WHC article (after Sweden upset Czechoslovakia 1-0 when Czechoslovakia just needed a tie to win gold):

Swedish coach Arne Stromberg said his plan was to check heavily - he dressed six defensemen - and break up the Czech patterns.

Big Lennart Svedberg did just that, upsetting one Czech foray after another. Svedberg and Czechoslovakia's Jan Suchy were picked as the all-star defensemen in a poll of sports writers at the tournament

The article mentions that the Czechs sorely missed Jan Suchy and Jiroslav Jirik, both injured against Sweden.

Relevance to this project? At least according to this article, Svedberg's All-Star nod in 1969 was as much about his defense, as his offense.

_________________

From the 1970 WHC article:

Sweden defeated the USSR for the first time since 1963.

Article credits goaltending as playing a major role, both the stellar play of Sweden's Leif Holmqvist and the injury to the USSR's Viktor Konovalenko. After praising Holmqvist, the article turns to Svedberg:

Besides Holmqvist, another hero of the Swedish victory was Lennart Svedberg, a Soviet-trained defenseman. He stickhandled the length of the ice to set up Carlsson's goal.
 
Games against Canada, USA, Great Britain with Malecek in the lineup:

WC 1924
Canada - Czechoslovakia 30:0

WC 1931
Canada - Czechoslovakia 2:0
USA - Czechoslovakia 1:0

WC 1933
USA - Czechoslovakia 6:0 (not 100% sure that Malecek played this game though)
Canada - Czechoslovakia 4:0

WC 1934
Great Britain - Czechoslovakia 2:1 (Malecek didn´t register assist or goal in this one)
USA - Czechoslovakia 1:0

WC 1935
Canada - Czechoslovakia 2:1 (goal scored by Císař, Malecek very likely didn´t assist on this goal)
Great Britain - Czechoslovakia 2:1 (Malecek didn´t register assist or goal in this game)

WC 1936
USA - Czechoslovakia 2:0
Great Britain - Czechoslovakia 5:0
Canada - Czechoslovakia 7:0

WC 1937
Canada - Czechoslovakia 3:0

WC 1938
Canada - Czechoslovakia 3:0
USA - Czechoslovakia 0:2 (first win! but Malecek again didn´t have any point)
Great Britain - Czechoslovakia 1:0

WC 1939
Canada - Czechoslovakia 2:1 (Malecek didn´t register a point, though I´m not sure he played this game, goal scored by Drobný)
Great Britain - Czechoslovakia 0:2 (second win! Malecek scored 2nd goal, possible assist on 1st Troják´s goal too)
USA - Czechoslovakia 1:0
Canada - Czechoslovakia 4:0

Summary
19 games: 1 goal and maybe 1 assist
2 wins, 17 losses
________________________________

I´ll include Zabrodsky´s and Bobrov´s record (only goals) for comparison´ sake.

Zabrodsky vs. Canada:

OG 1948
Canada - Czechoslovakia 0:0

WC 1949
Canada - Czechoslovakia 2:3 (Zabrodsky scored one goal)

WC 1954
Canada - Czechoslovakia 5:2 (Zabrodsky scored one goal)

WC 1955
Canada - Czechoslovakia 5:3 (Zabrodsky scored two goals)

OG 1956
Canada - Czechoslovakia 6:3 (Zabrodsky didn´t score)

Summary
5 games: 4 goals + X assists
_________________________________

Bobrov vs. Canada:

WC 1954
Canada - USSR 2:7 (Bobrov scored one goal)

WC 1955
Canada - USSR 5:0

OG 1956
Canada - USSR 0:2 (Bobrov didn´t score)

WC 1957
Canada didn´t participate

Summary
3 games: 1 goal + X assists

Thank you, as well. I have to say this strengthens my opinion that it would be a pretty big error not to have a substantial gap between Zabrodsky and Malecek. 1 goal in 17 games against the only teams resembling decent competition is... not good. I do realize that Malecek was easily the best player on his team, so he didn't have much help and was easy to focus on, etc.
 
Questions

Thanks for posting these. This is an example of the type of thing this project needs more of.

Some of the most relevant passages:

From the 1969 WHC article (after Sweden upset Czechoslovakia 1-0 when Czechoslovakia just needed a tie to win gold):



The article mentions that the Czechs sorely missed Jan Suchy and Jiroslav Jirik, both injured against Sweden.

Relevance to this project? At least according to this article, Svedberg's All-Star nod in 1969 was as much about his defense, as his offense.

_________________

From the 1970 WHC article:

Sweden defeated the USSR for the first time since 1963.

Article credits goaltending as playing a major role, both the stellar play of Sweden's Leif Holmqvist and the injury to the USSR's Viktor Konovalenko. After praising Holmqvist, the article turns to Svedberg:

Thank you.

Still the articles raise more questions then they answer.

Svedberg is described as "big" yet if we look at his data from the 1969 Red Wings training camp, he would be on the average to smallish side, 5' 11" /165 LBS:

http://www.griffinscentral.com/hist/camp69.html

Arne Stromberg going to six defencemen for the final game indicates that during a short compact WHC fatigue was a factor, interesting to see how other teams managed fatigue? Also how did this change impact on the overall Swedish game. Did they switch to five player units or three lines / two pairings rotation with greater substitution for the defencemen?
 
Czechoslovakian History of Defensive hockey

Thank you, as well. I have to say this strengthens my opinion that it would be a pretty big error not to have a substantial gap between Zabrodsky and Malecek. 1 goal in 17 games against the only teams resembling decent competition is... not good. I do realize that Malecek was easily the best player on his team, so he didn't have much help and was easy to focus on, etc.

From 1920 onwards, the Czechoslovakian National team seems to have a history of defensive hockey, especially when it came to positioning for medal contention in key games. The 1924 Olympics seem to have driven home the point that they could not compete offensively, especially against Canadian or N/A sourced talent since Czechoslovakia simply did not have a long hockey season so the offensive game could not be developed. So players had to play defensive hockey to have a chance.

In terms of Malecek's legacy this means that he was more valuable keeping the score down, losing by 2 or 3 goals then having him generate 3 or 4 goals but seeing the team approach ten GAs.

Previously we saw evidence of this in Zabrodsky dissatisfaction in 1948 about the team's defensive play against Canada during the Olympic game and the post Olympic two game exhibition game.

We have further evidence in the following:

1920 Winter Olympics. 1948 Article by Dan Parker which points to the start of defensive hockey in international events in an effort to medal:

https://news.google.com/newspapers?id=1zIrAAAAIBAJ&sjid=BJkFAAAAIBAJ&hl=fr&pg=6053,2386693


Canada 1 - Czechoslovakia 1, 1961 WHC

https://news.google.com/newspapers?id=UostAAAAIBAJ&sjid=1ZwFAAAAIBAJ&hl=fr&pg=6866,1849587

Czechoslovakia admits to playing for the tie.

Sadly we do not have details about how the Czechoslovakian team executed defensively, prior to 1961, but we do have the results.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_IIHF_World_Championship_medalists

Team medaled a few times including twice in the 1930s when the WHC was played in Prgaue.
 
From 1920 onwards, the Czechoslovakian National team seems to have a history of defensive hockey, especially when it came to positioning for medal contention in key games. The 1924 Olympics seem to have driven home the point that they could not compete offensively, especially against Canadian or N/A sourced talent since Czechoslovakia simply did not have a long hockey season so the offensive game could not be developed. So players had to play defensive hockey to have a chance.

In terms of Malecek's legacy this means that he was more valuable keeping the score down, losing by 2 or 3 goals then having him generate 3 or 4 goals but seeing the team approach ten GAs.

Previously we saw evidence of this in Zabrodsky dissatisfaction in 1948 about the team's defensive play against Canada during the Olympic game and the post Olympic two game exhibition game.

We have further evidence in the following:

1920 Winter Olympics. 1948 Article by Dan Parker which points to the start of defensive hockey in international events in an effort to medal:

https://news.google.com/newspapers?id=1zIrAAAAIBAJ&sjid=BJkFAAAAIBAJ&hl=fr&pg=6053,2386693


Canada 1 - Czechoslovakia 1, 1961 WHC

https://news.google.com/newspapers?id=UostAAAAIBAJ&sjid=1ZwFAAAAIBAJ&hl=fr&pg=6866,1849587

Czechoslovakia admits to playing for the tie.

Sadly we do not have details about how the Czechoslovakian team executed defensively, prior to 1961, but we do have the results.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_IIHF_World_Championship_medalists

Team medaled a few times including twice in the 1930s when the WHC was played in Prgaue.

This article offers some evidence that Czchoslovakia was defensively-minded into the 40s when Mike Buckna took over.

Boxscorenews.com said:
At a time when the rest of European hockey stressed defense, LTC’s offensive orientated style stood out in stark contrast, influencing both Team Moscow Head Coach Arkady Chernyshev and Player-Coach Anatoli Tarasov. This style would have an impact on the future direction of the so-called 'Soviet hockey system.' The Czech’s play had been the creation of Mike Buckna from Trail, British Columbia.
...
Czechoslovakian hockey was traditionally a very defensive style with defensemen rarely touching the puck in the offensive end and with the forwards dropping back to cover the net. Even with LTC’s achievements Buckna believed the defensive coaching philosophy adopted by the Czechoslovakians was stale and limiting the development and success of their hockey. Buckna later said:

They either had old hockey players, who taught the same thing over and over, or coaches, who’d never played hockey at all, but soccer or tennis. The problem was definitely the coaching.

Buckna saw hockey as a game built on the offensive fundamentals of passing, puck-handling, and forechecking.
http://boxscorenews.com/red-storm-russian-ice-hockey-p559-68.htm

This article was written by Darril & George Fosty. I'm not at all familiar with their credentials beyond what wikipedia tells me.
 
Come on now. Their record are not really comparable (longevity, awards...).

Soviet goalies playing in 60s (Konovalenko and Zinger) were considered to be the main weakness of the Tarasov´s squad by Czechoslovak players.

Well, it wasn't until 1968 that they could sometimes exploit that so called main weakness. And it wasn't Konovalenko who was in the nets when the Soviets lost to Czechoslovakia by scores of 7-2 (1974 WHC), 9-3 (1974-75 Izvestia Cup) and 8-3 (1977 Izvestia tournament).

Dzurilla played many weak games vs. USSR too, especially in the 1960s. As a matter of fact, in some Finnish hockey books Dzurilla is called (my free translation) 'CCCP-phobic', and apparently he couldn't handle Vyacheslav Starshinov (in front of the net) at all. For example, the reason why Jiri Holecek got the chance to play in his first game (?) at the WHCs (1966) was that the Soviets scored 3 goals on Dzurilla inside 5 minutes. A similar thing happened in the 1964 OG/WHC, when Vladimir Nadrchal replaced him in the nets.
To be fair, at least from the 1969 WHC on, I think, Dzurilla started to play occasionally well against the Soviets. But it's Jiri Holecek who was the goalie hero in nearly all of Czechoslovakia's famous triumphs over USSR.

How is Dzurilla's record much more impressive than Konovalenko's? Okay, 1 IIHF directorate best goalie award, 2 all-star nods vs. 1 all-star nod. But Konovalenko was the Soviet player of the year in 1970 (did well in the voting also in 1968 and 1971); I don't think Dzurilla had an equivalent domestic accolade. Konovalenko was the #1 goalie in the Soviet Union for about 9 years, that's not too bad, is it? Even if Dzurilla played longer, it's not like his international career as the top goalie on his national team was longer.

IMO Dzurilla was a quite inconsistent goalie, and - even if we leave Tretyak and Holecek out - he was not much better even than other European top goalies of his time (Konovalenko, Holmqvist, Ylönen, Valtonen).

To the second point, consider his best tournaments: WC 1965, WC 1969, OG 1972, CC 1976 and perhaps WC 1977. See how much they´re spread out?

Spread out, fair enough, but what about his total absence in 1973-75 (plus 1967 & 1971)? And him being only the backup goalie in 1972 and 1976 (WHCs)? Your list also highlights the fact that Dzurilla's international record is quite 'narrow'. For example, if the 1972 OG was one of his best tournaments, what does that say about his international career really? In the YouTube highlights, he looks terrible in the game vs. USSR; Holecek took over after USSR's third goal, I think.
His performance in the 1976 Canada Cup was inconsistent too; sure, he was very good in the round robin game against Canada, but let in 4 goals - a couple of them bad ones (watch the Perreault goal, for example :shakehead) - in the first period of g1 of the final. He looked very good in g2 of the final (after taking over for Holecek) at first, but imo the 4th and 5th Team Canada goals were very much his goals. In the 1977 WHC, I guess he played well generally, but allowed 8 goals (when facing only 21 shots! http://forums.internationalhockey.net/showthread.php?10478-1977-IHWC-Austria) in CSSR's last medal round game against Canada, and that nearly cost Czechoslovakia the world championship; luckily for them, Sweden (again) beat the Soviet Union in the last game of the tournament, and so CSSR got the gold medal.

Question of longevity:

number of major international tournaments (WC, OG, CC):
Dzurilla - 12
Lindmark - 11

In how many of those tournaments was Dzurilla the #1 goalie for CSSR and Lindmark for SWE?
 
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Relevance to this project? At least according to this article, Svedberg's All-Star nod in 1969 was as much about his defense, as his offense.

But do they mean his checking/interceptions in the neutral zone ("upsetting one Czech foray after another") rather than his work in his own zone/in front of the net? Well, that's defense too, of course, but it was already mentioned in a previous discussion and demonstrated by clips (the old ATD biography).
 
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So Far

Did Malecek bring anything but goal scoring? Isn't the entire case for him based on how many goals he scored?

So far that is the only case presented. Mainly because Malecek's defensive skills have not been researched extensively. Likewise the Czechoslovakian approach to defensive hockey has received little attention. Yet he is a rare European player who had a long career as a forward and as a defenceman. Similar to Dit Clapper and Ebbie Goodfellow plus many NHL players who do get recognition for this attribute.

It would be worthwhile to look at the performance of the other leading scorers in the Czechoslovakian domestic leagues against Malecek and his team. What were the results especially the differentials.
 
Games against Canada, USA, Great Britain with Malecek in the lineup:

I think you have to go deeper than that.
Hi stats line from what I could find looks like this:

Canada 48-14-8-22
USA 12-3-3-6
GB 41-59-20-79

Totals: 101-76-31-107

The Canadian teams were really strong and I would love to see how these Allan Cup winners (i.e Saskatoon, Port Arthur, Sudbury, Trail etc,etc), or provincial senior champions like the Shamrocks or Superiors did in friendly/exhibition games against the professional teams in North America at the time. Maybe Canadiens1958 have some results available.

Some of these games against mostly Allan Cup and Provincial Champions with Malecek in the lineup included:

1931/32

Ottawa Shamrocks 1-2

1932/33

Edmonton Superiors 0-3

1933/34

Ottawa Shamrocks 1-1
Saskatoon Quakers 1-0
Massachusetts Rangers 2-1

1934/35

Winnipeg Monarchs 0-0

1935/36

Port Arthur Bearcats 4-5

1936/37

Kimberley Dynamiters 0-0

1937/38

Sudbury Wolves 0-0
Sudbury Wolves 0-1

1938/39

Trail Smoke Eaters 1-2



Also, when you look at the World Championship games against Canada, you have to look closer at the games to get a better picture of how things went.

1930

Czechoslovakia did not play against Canada

1931

Canada-Czechoslovakia
2-0

- Defensive game from the start. Both teams were cautious.
- Art Puttee made an incredible save on Malecek in the 2nd period.
- Tight game but Canada scored the second goal during the last minute of the game.
- Malecek’s old linemate Blake Watson had the task of shadowing Malecek who in turn have a couple of dangerous shots from the outside.

1932

Czechoslovakia did not play against Canada – No World Championships held

1933

Canada-Czechoslovakia
4-0

- In the 3rd minute a great individual effort from Malecek who zig-zags his way through the Canadian defense and sets up Tozicka who fumbles with the puck, missing an open goal.
- In the 6th minute of the 2nd period Malecek and Hromádka comes through on a break with only one defenceman between them, Malecek flips the puck to Hromádka who shoots just wide, missing the open side of the net.
- Malecek hit the crossbar in the beginning of the 3rd period.
- A little bit later Malecek and Tozicka had a great chance, but the goalie Geddes made a fine save on Tozicka.
- Ken Kane was assigned to stop Malecek throughout the game.
- The Czechs conserved their energy for the European final vs Austria the next day.

1934

Czechoslovakia did not play against Canada

1935


Canada-Czechoslovakia
2-1

- Malecek despite having two Canadians assigned to him, gets away from them and have a dangerous shot in the 1st period that the goalie saves without difficulty.
- Later in the 1st period, Malecek shoots, missing its target narrowly as the puck touches the goalpost.
- At the start of the 2nd period, Malecek is hit in the knee by the puck and have to leave the ice. This proves to be costly as Canada scores a goal while he is off the ice nursing his sore knee.
- Malecek continues to have one or two Canadians assigned to him at all times.
- In the 3rd period Malecek orchestrates several good rushes, dishing off the puck to his wings who fail to do anything with his passes.
- Roy Hinkel (a 1932 Olympian), the Canadian defenceman is on Malecek like a leech, whacking away on Malecek every time he is near him.
- This was the first game of the tournament that Canada really used their physicality to their advantage. They took the body all the time, sometimes crossing the line (mostly Hinckel), but it was effective.
- Best game of the tournament.

1937

Canada-Czechoslovakia
3-0

- Malecek swooped in beautifully and tested the goalie (Campbell) in the 1st period who had to come up with a great save on Malecek’s shot.
- In the 2nd period Malecek finds Kucera with a great pass, but he is whistled off for a questionable offside.
- In the 12th minute of the 2nd period, Malecek managed to get rid of his opponent and set Kucera free on a breakaway with a great pass, but Kucera blew it.
- In the 1st minute of the 3rd period Malecek found an open Michálek who wasn’t able to beat the goalie from a distance of 3 metres.
- In the 3rd minute another attack with Kucera and Malecek resulted in Malecek being hit heavily in front of the goal.
- Malecek tactically slows down the tempo of the game, trying to regroup his men for the last half of the period.
- Malecek is helping out on defence for most part of the 3rd period.
- Malecek who was once Again closely watched by his opponents was the leading player as always.


1938
Canada-Czechoslovakia
3-0

- The enthusiastic crowd hollers with excitement as Malecek skates through the Canadian defence in the 1st minute and tests Coulter with the first shot on goal.
- Shortly thereafter Malecek once again puts Coulter under pressure, as Coulter makes a difficult save sprawling on the ice.
- Only Malecek is able to keep up with the Canadians skating wise in the 2nd period.
- Malecek shoots off the wing and Coulter redirects his shot over the goal.
- Malecek is taken hard by the Canadians. Russell whacks Malecek with his stick and is penalized for the infraction.
- Malecek helps out on defense for most of the game.

1939

Canada-Czechoslovakia
2-1

Malecek did not play
 
Excellent

^^^ Excellent contribution RGO. Games reflect defensive play. Perhaps a worthwhile approach would be to contrast the Canadian individual team games against the Czechoslovakian teams with games that the Canadian teams played in their home leagues and playoffs. Looking at the style of play which would be reflected in data like total goals per game and the like.
 
From 1920 onwards, the Czechoslovakian National team seems to have a history of defensive hockey, especially when it came to positioning for medal contention in key games. The 1924 Olympics seem to have driven home the point that they could not compete offensively, especially against Canadian or N/A sourced talent since Czechoslovakia simply did not have a long hockey season so the offensive game could not be developed. So players had to play defensive hockey to have a chance.

In terms of Malecek's legacy this means that he was more valuable keeping the score down, losing by 2 or 3 goals then having him generate 3 or 4 goals but seeing the team approach ten GAs.

Previously we saw evidence of this in Zabrodsky dissatisfaction in 1948 about the team's defensive play against Canada during the Olympic game and the post Olympic two game exhibition game.

We have further evidence in the following:

1920 Winter Olympics. 1948 Article by Dan Parker which points to the start of defensive hockey in international events in an effort to medal:

https://news.google.com/newspapers?id=1zIrAAAAIBAJ&sjid=BJkFAAAAIBAJ&hl=fr&pg=6053,2386693


Canada 1 - Czechoslovakia 1, 1961 WHC

https://news.google.com/newspapers?id=UostAAAAIBAJ&sjid=1ZwFAAAAIBAJ&hl=fr&pg=6866,1849587

Czechoslovakia admits to playing for the tie.

Sadly we do not have details about how the Czechoslovakian team executed defensively, prior to 1961, but we do have the results.

List of IIHF World Championship medalists - Wikipedia

Team medaled a few times including twice in the 1930s when the WHC was played in Prgaue.

Yes, this was my perception too, that Czechoslovaks played very defensive hockey before WWII, but not just against NA competition but also against teams like Switzerland or Germany.

I remember citation of one player in Miloslav Jenšík´s "Chronicle of Czech hockey" that "our tactic is to stay at home and rely on Maleček´s one lucky attack" (not direct citation, I go by memory here).

EDIT: As for those two (only) Czech medals in 30s, it´s worth to point out that huge part in that success was due excellent goaltending. In 1933, Jan Peka, consistent and reliable goalie for a very long time and arguably 2nd best pre-WWII Czech player after Malecek (played 14 different int. tournaments including one before WWI, retired from int. competition at age of 42 in 1936!) played in Prague his games of life.

In 1938, Modrý was simply the MAN. His 1938 and 1949 are his best championships.

Malecek himself was still the best in 1933 as he won the scoring, but in 1938 he was average.

Did Malecek bring anything but goal scoring? Isn't the entire case for him based on how many goals he scored?

I´ve personally never seen any positive nor negative mention of Malecek´s defensive play.
 
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I think you have to go deeper than that.
Hi stats line from what I could find looks like this:

Canada 48-14-8-22
USA 12-3-3-6
GB 41-59-20-79

Totals: 101-76-31-107

These numbers look really skewed and misleading. Specifically, Great Britain. Great Britain did so well in the WHCs because they were supplemented by players with dual Canadian-British citizenship, and as shown above by DN28, Malecek (and Czecholslovakia as a whole) didn't do nearly as well in those games.

The totals you are providing have to include mostly games against the non-Canadian British, which is no more impressive than how he did against Switzerland or Germany or Poland, or what have you.

When the question is how Malecek did against the top amateur teams in the world, we mean Canada, the USA, and the British teams of the WHCs, not the pushover British teams that weren't supplemented by Canadians.

West Germany's Erich Kuhnhackl is a guy who dominated his domestic competition and scored a lot of goals against the B pool at the Olympics, but may or may not have done so well against the A pool (hopefully this will be examined further when he comes up for a vote). I'm just asking that Malecek be held to the same standard.
 
I´ve personally never seen any positive nor negative mention of Malecek´s defensive play.

Likewise. Which is why we shouldn't give Malecek credit for Czechoslovakia playing defensive hockey, when there is (as of yet) no evidence that he was a key part of this defense.
 
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I'm not impressed with what I'm reading about Malecek here. These Canadian teams in the worlds were guys who likely had no hope at an NHL career and they greatly outclassed the Czechs. I see the games were pretty defensive, and Malecek was double teamed and occasionally shone despite not scoring, but wow. If he's the kind of talent that belongs on this list right now, then he should have rose above these factors and scored against Canada.

The above can describe the relationship between Canada and the USSR for a few years, yet Bobrov stood out as a talent in those games.
 
Ottawa Shamrocks - OCHL

I'm not impressed with what I'm reading about Malecek here. These Canadian teams in the worlds were guys who likely had no hope at an NHL career and they greatly outclassed the Czechs. I see the games were pretty defensive, and Malecek was double teamed and occasionally shone despite not scoring, but wow. If he's the kind of talent that belongs on this list right now, then he should have rose above these factors and scored against Canada.

The above can describe the relationship between Canada and the USSR for a few years, yet Bobrov stood out as a talent in those games.

Nice lead-in to my post. Thank you. First Bobrov did not stand out against the Penticton Vs in 1955 when the team had some former NHL players, by accounts folded his hand early. In 1954 against Lyndhurst, a Senior B team and 1956 against KWD without reinstated pros he showed well.

In the 1930s Malecek played against the Ottawa Shamrocks on a couple of occassions. The Shamrocks were part of the Ottawa City Hockey League, a Senior A league, arguably Canada's strongest city as opposed to regional or provincial Senior A Hockey League. The league included past and future NHL alumni and was a defensive hockey stronghold. It was also a physical league.

A few examples.
1932 Finals were extended because after four games no winner had been declared, two of the games ending in scoreless overtime ties.

https://news.google.com/newspapers?id=Jzk0AAAAIBAJ&sjid=hfUIAAAAIBAJ&hl=fr&pg=6048,5493224

1932 opening game of the Finals. Game seemed to be exciting on all levels:
https://news.google.com/newspapers?id=I7svAAAAIBAJ&sjid=ANsFAAAAIBAJ&hl=fr&pg=6862,11874942

1931-32 standings. App one week before the end of the season, the standing reveal a very defensive league with only one team averaging more than two goals per game.

https://news.google.com/newspapers?id=Hjk0AAAAIBAJ&sjid=hfUIAAAAIBAJ&hl=fr&pg=6905,2981109

That a championship team from such a defensive Canadian Senior A league could shutdown a European team is not surprising. From RGOs numbers, that Malecek averaged just under .5PPG against such and similar competition without regular competition at this level yet with a reputation as the only offensive threat is laudible.
 
Nice lead-in to my post. Thank you. First Bobrov did not stand out against the Penticton Vs in 1955 when the team had some former NHL players, by accounts folded his hand early. In 1954 against Lyndhurst, a Senior B team and 1956 against KWD without reinstated pros he showed well.

.

Yes, absolutely, in 55 the vees proved the Soviets had a long way to go, but the years before and after the Soviets beat the same relative caliber of Canadians that malecek's Czechs never could.
 
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European Tours

Records of Senior A Canadian teams touring Europe.

1931-32 Ottawa All-Stars(not the Shamrocks) team featured a Young Bill Cowley.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User:Slave28/_Ottawa_All-Stars’_European_Tour/doc

1932-33 Edmonton Superiors
http://icehockey.wikia.com/wiki/1932-33_Edmonton_Superiors

1933-34 Ottawa Shamrocks
http://icehockey.wikia.com/wiki/1933-34_Ottawa_Shamrocks

1933-34 Saskatoon Quakers
http://icehockey.wikia.com/wiki/1933-34_Saskatoon_Quakers

1934-35 Winnipeg Monarchs
http://icehockey.wikia.com/wiki/1934-35_Winnipeg_Monarchs

three future NHL players on the team
http://icehockey.wikia.com/wiki/1934-35_Winnipeg_Monarchs

1935-36 Port Arthur
http://icehockey.wikia.com/wiki/1935-36_Port_Arthur_Bearcats

1936-37 Kimberley Dynamiters. This tour data includes the Canada leg of the tour from B.C. to Halifax.Comparing scores may be interesting.
http://icehockey.wikia.com/wiki/1936-37_Kimberley_Dynamiters

1937-38 Sudbury Wolves
http://icehockey.wikia.com/wiki/1937-38_Sudbury_Wolves

1938-39 Trail Smoke Eaters
http://icehockey.wikia.com/wiki/1938-39_Trail_Smoke_Eaters

Besides Bill Cowley, some of the teams included 2-3 future NHL players.
 
Yes, absolutely, in 55 the vees proved the Soviets had a long way to go, but the years before and after the Soviets beat the same relative caliber of Canadians that malecek's Czechs never could.

It is true that the European teams couldn't touch the touring Canadian teams in the 1930s, (although they ocassionally stole a point or two from them) but there is no shame in that. Only the best amateur teams were sent over, and I am pretty sure that they would have been more than capable of giving the best pro teams in North America a run for their money.

I believe Canadiens1958 knows what he's talking about in this regard. I am pretty sure that the Canadian teams that toured Europe in the 1930s were better than the Canadian teams in the 1960s for example that played against the Soviets.

Canadiens1958, I have always been under the impression that the provincial champions and Allan Cup winners in the 1920s and 30s were much stronger than the ones in the 1960s for example. (Difference between them and the NHL teams).

I don't want to go off-topic here because we are discussing individual players here on the list, but at the same time it is educational as well, and gives us a better understanding of the strength/weakness of European hockey historically.
 

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