Roster Moves: Roster Thread Talk 2021: it never ends

[wasup]

seriously, dont waste your time..

Thanks

 

[deadhead]

He kind of tailed off more than people seem to recall. But his personality was sorely needed.

He "tailed off" but everything is relative:
last five games, CF 45.57%, xGF 54.14%, HDCA/60: 3.51, scoring 2-3 5 at 5x5.

 

[Rebels57]

What I want to happen:

Giroux - Couturier - Konecny
Farabee - Hayes - Atkinson
JVR - Frost - Allison
Lindblom - Laughton - NAK
Brassard

Provorov - Ellis
Sanheim - Ristolainen
York - Braun
Yandle

What will likely happen:

Giroux - Couturier - Farabee
TK - Hayes - Atkinson
JVR - Laughton - Lindblom
Brassard - Thompson - Allison
NAK

Provorov - Ellis
Sanheim - Ristolainen
Yandle - Braun
Morin

Why do you think it's likely that Konecny will switch to LW after playing the vast majority of his career on RW? Doesn't add up. Otherwise you're probably pretty close on the likely lines.

 

[Magua]

While I don't think anyone denied the need for an Ellis-type, Fletcher is really laying it on thick with the young players being an issue. The youngest player on the team, Farabee, was one of the best. Patrick was next up, and he had mitigating factors, and was traded. Then it was Hart, Konecny, Provorov, Myers (traded). Hart struggled the most, but signing some 4th line plugs doesn't really mean much for a goalie. Not a single rookie was playing until the final few weeks. We might, again, start the season with zero rookies. Flahr straight up said Allison will not play 4th line.

You have Chuckles salivating over all the cheap veterans he acquired -- saying they NEED them. He can't talk enough about their importance. Any talk about young players is just handwaving.

 

[Beef Invictus]

While I don't think anyone denied the need for an Ellis-type, Fletcher is really laying it on thick with the young players being an issue. The youngest player on the team, Farabee, was one of the best. Patrick was next up, and he had mitigating factors, and was traded. Then it was Hart, Konecny, Provorov, Myers (traded). Hart struggled the most, but signing some 4th line plugs doesn't really mean much for a goalie. Not a single rookie was playing until the final few weeks. We might, again, start the season with zero rookies. Flahr straight up said Allison will not play 4th line.

You have Chuckles salivating over all the cheap veterans he acquired -- saying they NEED them. He can't talk enough about their importance. Any talk about young players is just handwaving.

Well the team is traditionally so good at picking veterans, what can go wrong?

 

[Asnito]

 

[deadhead]

Nice article by O'Conner on Lindblom's season:

What's Oskar Lindblom's new ceiling? Analyzing the Flyers forward's comeback season — and what comes next – The Athletic

He started really slow, then got closer to his norm, but wore down.
Which makes sense, it's amazing he even played last season.
With four months to get his strength and stamina back, I expect him to be close to 100% this season.

 

[captainpaxil]

I have such bitter feelings left over from Roger Nelson that if lindblom plays out his contract on the fourth line I'll still be happy for him.

 

[deadhead]

Other than Ellis and Atkinson, what veteran has anything close to a guaranteed job? All are on what are essentially one year deals.
Brassard, Thompson, Yandle and Braun.

The problem isn't playing young players, Farabee started at 19, Lindblom was in the top 6 in AV's first year, it's finding the RIGHT young players. Patrick missed a year then stunk out the joint, Frost flopped as a rookie and couldn't last two games his second season, Twarynski, Bunnaman, Vorobyev, Kase came up short.

Young players are like the girl with the curl, when they're bad, they're often very bad.

 

[flyerslducks]

Other than Ellis and Atkinson, what veteran has anything close to a guaranteed job? All are on what are essentially one year deals.
Brassard, Thompson, Yandle and Braun.

The problem isn't playing young players, Farabee started at 19, Lindblom was in the top 6 in AV's first year, it's finding the RIGHT young players. Patrick missed a year then stunk out the joint, Frost flopped as a rookie and couldn't last two games his second season, Twarynski, Bunnaman, Vorobyev, Kase came up short.

Young players are like the girl with the curl, when they're bad, they're often very bad.

and old vets like Thompson who are just bad....will always be bad! Amazing argument!

 

[flyerslducks]

i would much rather suffer frost learning the nhl ropes than suffering through nate f***ing thompson and his uselessness. We don't need faceoff help, we don't need his supposed "pk expertise" as we just got ellis/atkinson to help that area (plus lindblom, farabee getting more looks there)/....we literally need nothing that he provides (which is nothing). Even if frost goes to the ahl to get "experience", he is still going to have rookie mistakes when he eventually comes....so why tf are we waiting on him like he is the reason we arent getting better as a team.

brassard should be the 4c, frost should be the 3c...allison should be the 4th line rw and nak/thompson should be on the outside.

 

[deeshamrock]

 

[LegionOfDoom91]

View attachment 464992

 

[Asnito]

View attachment 465007

Why our fourth line sucks

 

[renberg]

I have no problem with Tanner starting in the AHL.

NAK's scoring is perfectly fine for his cap hit, assuming he bounces back closer to 20-21 levels. In that season he was actually one of our most efficient producers at 5v5. I agree on the penalties but it's too soon to give up on him. He provides good cheap depth.

Guys such as NAK are going to get moved out as better younger players come on to the big club. Soon it will be Laczynski, Foerster, Brink, Cates and others pushing their way onto the roster. The system is loaded with talent right now.

 

[Rebels57]

Guys such as NAK are going to get moved out as better younger players come on to the big club. Soon it will be Laczynski, Foerster, Brink, Cates and others pushing their way onto the roster. The system is loaded with talent right now.

All well and good. We'll move him when the time comes. I doubt he's here to start the 22-23 season but i'm happy to have the depth he brings heading into 21-22.

 

[Curufinwe]

This is the 2021 roster thread, right? Cause guys like Brink, Foerster and the good Cates aren’t playing for the Flyers till 2022 at the earliest.

 

[deadhead]

There's a couple reasons Fletcher wants young players to outplay the veterans in training camp.

1) If you keep a marginal prospect, and cut the veteran, if the prospect then goes belly up, next in line is a less prepared prospect in LHV.

2) If a young player can only "tie" someone like Thompson, he needs a lot more development (or he's not very talented), so he's better off in LHV until the team needs to bring him up. Playing all situations in LHV is better than 8-10 minutes in Philly

The idea that it's better to keep the young player with upside ignores that LHV isn't in Siberia, it's two hours away. The young player can develop in the AHL and be available for callup if he excels (for an offensive player, that's scoring > 0.5 ppg at ES) or due to injury. The AHL schedule allows for more structured practices b/c you're not on the road for weeks at a time with compressed practices focused on the next game, not on player development.

And the worst thing you can do with a young player is make them the 13th forward or 7th D-man sitting in the press box.

 

[Beef Invictus]

There's a couple reasons Fletcher wants young players to outplay the veterans in training camp.

1) If you keep a marginal prospect, and cut the veteran, if the prospect then goes belly up, next in line is a less prepared prospect in LHV.

2) If a young player can only "tie" someone like Thompson, he needs a lot more development (or he's not very talented), so he's better off in LHV until the team needs to bring him up. Playing all situations in LHV is better than 8-10 minutes in Philly

The idea that it's better to keep the young player with upside ignores that LHV isn't in Siberia, it's two hours away. The young player can develop in the AHL and be available for callup if he excels (for an offensive player, that's scoring > 0.5 ppg at ES) or due to injury. The AHL schedule allows for more structured practices b/c you're not on the road for weeks at a time with compressed practices focused on the next game, not on player development.

And the worst thing you can do with a young player is make them the 13th forward or 7th D-man sitting in the press box.

He doesn't want young players to merely outplay the vets. He wants them to dramatically outplay then. Because the team isn't run on merit

 

[deadhead]

He doesn't want young players to Jeremy outplay the vets. He wants them to dramatically outplay then. Because the team isn't run on merit

Well, yeah. I mean if you can't dramatically outplay Thompson, you're not very good (unless you want to claim Thompson is better than advertised ).

Someone like Brassard is not going at 100% in TC, veterans rarely do - unless some kids come along and threaten his job.

Plus, you have to discount a prospect's SSS performance, often driven by adrenalin that can't be sustained over 80 games, veterans are better at pacing themselves. So you want a prospect to perform at a high enough level that they're still useful if they can't sustain it.

 

[Beef Invictus]

Well, yeah. I mean if you can't dramatically outplay Thompson, you're not very good (unless you want to claim Thompson is better than advertised ).

Someone like Brassard is not going at 100% in TC, veterans rarely do - unless some kids come along and threaten his job.

Plus, you have to discount a prospect's SSS performance, often driven by adrenalin that can't be sustained over 80 games, veterans are better at pacing themselves. So you want a prospect to perform at a high enough level that they're still useful if they can't sustain it.

If Thompson is as bad as you're claiming then signing him and having him anywhere in the organization as any form of obstacle is an egregious error.

Regardless of that, my point stands: being better, not dramatically better, should be all it takes to beat any of them out. However, this team isn't run on merit. You're even admitting it by playing along with this need to dramatically outplay.

 

[Adtar02]

He doesn't want young players to merely outplay the vets. He wants them to dramatically outplay then. Because the team isn't run on merit

I mean I think those were his exact words. Kind of hard to misconstrue that.

 

[FlyerNutter]

For a team that imo isn’t anywhere near a model of development - it’s weird that they refuse to acknowledge the need for improvement.

Of course that would mean admitting that the coaches, Samuelsson, Schultz, and Riley (among others) are bad at their jobs.

It’s so vogue to blame the players though.

Even for the RECENT ones that “made it”, Sanheim, Provorov, Konecny, Hagg, Ghost, Myers, NAK. Aside from Farabee, all examples of good development? Because I’d say poor talent utilization and stagnation, if not regression.

 

[FlyerNutter]

If Thompson is as bad as you're claiming then signing him and having him anywhere in the organization as any form of obstacle is an egregious error.

Regardless of that, my point stands: being better, not dramatically better, should be all it takes to beat any of them out. However, this team isn't run on merit. You're even admitting it by playing along with this need to dramatically outplay.

It’s a cowardly approach of wanting prospects to shine like diamonds, with no mistakes to their game.

Let’s go even a step farther. I’ll bet my ass that the organizational philosophy is on getting every kid to improve on their defensive game first and foremost.

These guys don’t develop creativity or offensive skill, that’s not the Flyers approach to their youth.

 

[FlyerNutter]

Rant Thursday?

Those glorified scouts can go suck ass, with that development team as well. No they haven’t drafted near the top of the draft very much, but Lindros, Giroux, Couturier.

That’s really all there is? That’s it? It’s shocking, absolutely shocking that they are about as marketable league wide as a turnip.