Roster Talk: News, Theories, Lineups, Rumors Etc. New Season Cometh!

[Trolfoli]

That could be true. Here's where they stand now: Shore 71.4%, Pearson 65.5%, Lewis 64.9%. They're actually our top 3 Corsi forwards.

Wait for the road trip.

 

[PJ Kings Hockey]

So did you just post this to stir the pot?

You cannot relaly compare as Williams is playing with Ovechkin and a team that relies on getting goals to win..LA relies on shutting the other team down.. Two differently ran clubs.
Plus Lucic helps balance the kings lines being a LW. Williams was playing mostly on the 3rd line last year.
Glad he is doing better in Washington, but I do not think a straight point comparison is fair.

IMO it's not about points being a difference maker or game changer, Lucic is neither. It was a 'want' over 'need' decision by DL, he got the player he wanted (and has coveted for years) not the one he needed. Lucic won't make a difference puttimg the Kings deep or for a cup run as they already had a power forward with a physical edge in brown who had years of success in the first line role and taking Pearson off the 2nd line, a player who is faster and more skilled, where he had chemistry, to fit Lucic in is another poor decision. Pearson is now on line w/o finishers, cutting down his scoring ops.
If you are giving away that much in a trade, DL should have gotten a Player the kings 'needed', either a top d or a yoiung veteran , 3rd center who isn't a rental, that could have given them the strenght down the middle they now lack for success in a playoff run.
He didn't consider that because he traded for Lucic, not a position or need.
Don't forget, Lucic didn't choose to come here and won't be staying. For him it's a weigh station between jobs.
Williams was an integral part of the leadership group, an active voice who was respected as he had years in, losing, fighting to win, back to the wall and warrioring his way out on this team. That's not something you can replace and it goes far beyond points. He had to go, I get that, but Lucic isn't a replacement, not even close.

Always reminds me of the scene in Moneyball where Beane trades Pena so Art Howe can't play him

Williams also got a 2 year deal from the Caps, which you didn't take into account, even though it probably should be. So that's some extra cap space for Kopitar's next deal with Lucic instead of him.

And it was more of a mid 1st round pick than a high one, but that's all subjective, and depends on what argument you want to make. High sounds worse than middle.

On a break and I want to address these interesting points. First off, I truly hope that Lucic fits in like a glove with the team.

* Williams had 18 goals and 23 assists last season in 81 games last season.
Lucic had 18 goals and 26 assists last season in 81 games last season.
(Williams did play on the 3rd line some of the time last season and Lucic played with his regular center Kreijci for quite a bit of the season. We can assume both affected totals.)

*I wanted to highlight Dee's entire post.

* Moneyball showed that the management had metrics for evaluating players and how potential trades would affect the winning percentage. Lombardi knows that book well. We have to assume that Lombardi et al have metrics for evaluating all the moves they make as well. How do we evaluate the value of letting Williams walk and giving up a lot for Lucic? Their individual points were similar. Willliams has a clutch playoff grit in him. (See Jason's Lewis' blog on that.) Their cap hits are pretty close this year, aren't they? Yes, Williams signed a two-year deal at quite a reasonable cap hit. Boston won't be paying for nearly half Lucic's salary next year and we are looking at nearly double this year's amount next year.

So then, does this move make the team slot in better then way the Richards trade enabled Stoll to move down to 3C? When King comes back, maybe we'll get a better idea.

* Yes, the 13th pick in the first-round is a mid-range pick, but I read that the Kings were planning on trading up to get a pick in the 6-10 range.

So I have genuine curiosity, by what metric will we know that the Lucic for 1st round pick/Martin Jones/Colin Miller was a successful trade?

 

[HeadInjury]

FYI, if you want to buy Voynov's home in Redondo Beach, it's on the market.

http://www.realtor.com/realestatean...e-C_Redondo-Beach_CA_90277_M18838-93868?row=4

 

[YP44]

FYI, if you want to buy Voynov's home in Redondo Beach, it's on the market.

http://www.realtor.com/realestatean...e-C_Redondo-Beach_CA_90277_M18838-93868?row=4

where it all went down

 

[HeadInjury]

where it all went down

The blood spatter is not included.

 

[Reclamation Project]

Realtors love hackneyed marketing hooks. Surprised they didn't say it was owned previously by a two-time Stanley Cup winner.

 

[YP44]

The blood spatter is not included.

piss on it then

 

[Bandit]

5 Full, 2 Half Baths for a 4 bedroom place. Makes no sense.

 

[Bandit]

On a break and I want to address these interesting points. First off, I truly hope that Lucic fits in like a glove with the team.

* Williams had 18 goals and 23 assists last season in 81 games last season.
Lucic had 18 goals and 26 assists last season in 81 games last season.
(Williams did play on the 3rd line some of the time last season and Lucic played with his regular center Kreijci for quite a bit of the season. We can assume both affected totals.)

*I wanted to highlight Dee's entire post.

* Moneyball showed that the management had metrics for evaluating players and how potential trades would affect the winning percentage. Lombardi knows that book well. We have to assume that Lombardi et al have metrics for evaluating all the moves they make as well. How do we evaluate the value of letting Williams walk and giving up a lot for Lucic? Their individual points were similar. Willliams has a clutch playoff grit in him. (See Jason's Lewis' blog on that.) Their cap hits are pretty close this year, aren't they? Yes, Williams signed a two-year deal at quite a reasonable cap hit. Boston won't be paying for nearly half Lucic's salary next year and we are looking at nearly double this year's amount next year.

So then, does this move make the team slot in better then way the Richards trade enabled Stoll to move down to 3C? When King comes back, maybe we'll get a better idea.

* Yes, the 13th pick in the first-round is a mid-range pick, but I read that the Kings were planning on trading up to get a pick in the 6-10 range.

So I have genuine curiosity, by what metric will we know that the Lucic for 1st round pick/Martin Jones/Colin Miller was a successful trade?

 

[kingsfan28]

So we play 3 in 4 nights [with a home/away back to back], including two travel days. So what, they couldn't have found a way to fit a game in between Sun-Thurs?

 

[Reclamation Project]

This schedule blows. And it blows even more that the Kings haven't capitalized on it.

 

[KopitarFAN]

So we play 3 in 4 nights [with a home/away back to back], including two travel days. So what, they couldn't have found a way to fit a game in between Sun-Thurs?

NHL scheduling seems way too similar to baseball, in the first 50 days of the baseball season they seem to get like 10 off-days, then wind up playing numerous stretches of 15+ days in a row as a result. By comparison, the Kings (and many others coming into tonight) have played 5 games in 14 days, meaning they will play 77 in 168 days.

 

[Trolfoli]

5 Full, 2 Half Baths for a 4 bedroom place. Makes no sense.

Sure it does... bomb bathroom for each room... then 2 half baths down stairs so when you have a party the half baths get trashed and you're nice bath with the Jacuzzi tub is free from the debauchery...

Edit: plus one full bath downstairs for that "friend" that will get too drunk and puke on himself before passing out in the tub.

 

[Herby]

Edit: plus one full bath downstairs for that "friend" that will get too drunk and puke on himself before passing out in the tub.

 

[Reclamation Project]

Richie could fish in that pool. The Hoodlum House!

 

[stebo]

Kopitar

It's amazing that he leads all forwards in TOI in the entire NHL by almost 2:30 mins (second being eric staal.

The coach seems to favour him over all other Cs (even Carter) on the Kings. Maybe he's a bit burnt out. )

GO KINGS

 

[KINGS17]

It's amazing that he leads all forwards in TOI in the entire NHL by almost 2:30 mins (second being eric staal.

The coach seems to favour him over all other Cs (even Carter) on the Kings. Maybe he's a bit burnt out. )

GO KINGS

He would probably have less ice time if his line was putting the puck in the net with more frequency.

GO KINGS

 

[KingsFan7824]

So I have genuine curiosity, by what metric will we know that the Lucic for 1st round pick/Martin Jones/Colin Miller was a successful trade?

Like with everything else, it depends. If they make the playoffs this year, that will have been more successful than last year. Lucic, no matter how far the Kings go, probably won't win the Conn Smythe, so it might not be as successful there. If he gets 20 goals, that will have been more than Williams. He might do it on the 2nd line though, so that might not count as much.

Outside of the two extremes, where the Kings win the Cup, or miss the playoffs and Lucic walks, you can do all sorts of dances with metrics. I'd say wait until the season is over, and then we'll find out.

 

[Raccoon Jesus]

Like with everything else, it depends. If they make the playoffs this year, that will have been more successful than last year. Lucic, no matter how far the Kings go, probably won't win the Conn Smythe, so it might not be as successful there. If he gets 20 goals, that will have been more than Williams. He might do it on the 2nd line though, so that might not count as much.

Outside of the two extremes, where the Kings win the Cup, or miss the playoffs and Lucic walks, you can do all sorts of dances with metrics. I'd say wait until the season is over, and then we'll find out.

It won't matter. Just like with Sekera, some people are waiting to jump on how negative it is no matter what. There's a vocal minority around here that was blasting him after the preseason and bemoaning that Colin Miller made the Bruins (who were missing how many of their top defensemen?) and that Martin Jones was unstoppable and the mystery box was sure to be another stud. The only way everyone would be satisfied is if we won another cup with Lucic getting the Conn Smythe--then everyone would be upset we can't afford him.

For example, the Penner trade was forgiven, because even though he had fantastic moments, he had large stretches of awful and forgettable play--but we won a Cup. Teubert was still seen as a project at that point and a first round pick became one of the Oilers best defenseman, but you don't see anyone complaining about that at this point. The assets in this case are obviously more valuable, but that only strengthens the venom that gets shot at him every game that he doesn't score.

I agree with you. I think the narrative is just going to get twisted to whatever people feel unless we win the Cup and Lucic has his best season. But that's the nature of trades that aren't sure things, which is okay, I'm just peeved by the folks who are writing off players before the 10-game mark. And, just so everyone knows where I stand, I think it was only a slight overpayment by a guy who was obviously overly excited about the type of player he was getting--Jones was a goner anyway, Miller wasn't cracking this roster soon with his defensive IQ, and I'm more upset about the first than anything but I trust this staff--and it was obviously done to get this team one more crack at a cup while it's still completely possible, as the pick we were going to use wouldn't have likely been more impactful than Lucic. Context. You use the assets you have to make yourself a better team, and none of those assets stood to help us this year. Eventually the well obviously runs dry, but you'd better get everything you can out of it while the getting is good. And for the last half decade, only one team has had a gooder getting

 

[LAKings88]

If Mersch or kempe have good years in the AHL, could it tempt DL to move Lucic at the deadline to try to recoup a first?

 

[ScoreZeGoals]

If Mersch or kempe have good years in the AHL, could it tempt DL to move Lucic at the deadline to try to recoup a first?

Nope.

 

[AlphaBravo]

It won't matter. Just like with Sekera, some people are waiting to jump on how negative it is no matter what. There's a vocal minority around here that was blasting him after the preseason and bemoaning that Colin Miller made the Bruins (who were missing how many of their top defensemen?) and that Martin Jones was unstoppable and the mystery box was sure to be another stud. The only way everyone would be satisfied is if we won another cup with Lucic getting the Conn Smythe--then everyone would be upset we can't afford him.

For example, the Penner trade was forgiven, because even though he had fantastic moments, he had large stretches of awful and forgettable play--but we won a Cup. Teubert was still seen as a project at that point and a first round pick became one of the Oilers best defenseman, but you don't see anyone complaining about that at this point. The assets in this case are obviously more valuable, but that only strengthens the venom that gets shot at him every game that he doesn't score.

I agree with you. I think the narrative is just going to get twisted to whatever people feel unless we win the Cup and Lucic has his best season. But that's the nature of trades that aren't sure things, which is okay, I'm just peeved by the folks who are writing off players before the 10-game mark. And, just so everyone knows where I stand, I think it was only a slight overpayment by a guy who was obviously overly excited about the type of player he was getting--Jones was a goner anyway, Miller wasn't cracking this roster soon with his defensive IQ, and I'm more upset about the first than anything but I trust this staff--and it was obviously done to get this team one more crack at a cup while it's still completely possible, as the pick we were going to use wouldn't have likely been more impactful than Lucic. Context. You use the assets you have to make yourself a better team, and none of those assets stood to help us this year. Eventually the well obviously runs dry, but you'd better get everything you can out of it while the getting is good. And for the last half decade, only one team has had a gooder getting

I agree with this line of thinking. If it is necessary to trade the first round pick to make ourselves competitive now, we should do so. Our cup window could close in as little as two or three years. Might as well put the chips in now and cash out. That said, the one problem I had with the Lucic trade is that our greatest need was not a top 6 left winger (of course its always great to get one, but not a priority). As most of the members on this board recognized in the offseason, we needed a second pairing defenseman and/or a veteran third or fourth line center. Assuming Dean tried to address these needs in the offseason, but there just weren't any trade partners or good options, then getting Lucic is fine. Better than no improvement.

 

[AlphaBravo]

If Mersch or kempe have good years in the AHL, could it tempt DL to move Lucic at the deadline to try to recoup a first?

The only possible scenario I can see Dean moving Lucic is if we are clearly out of a playoff spot. Realistically, Lucic is just a rental for this season. Unless Dean trades Brown in the offseason (assuming he can and Brown has another bad year), we likely cannot afford Lucic.

 

[Raccoon Jesus]

I agree with this line of thinking. If it is necessary to trade the first round pick to make ourselves competitive now, we should do so. Our cup window could close in as little as two or three years. Might as well put the chips in now and cash out. That said, the one problem I had with the Lucic trade is that our greatest need was not a top 6 left winger (of course its always great to get one, but not a priority). As most of the members on this board recognized in the offseason, we needed a second pairing defenseman and/or a veteran third or fourth line center. Assuming Dean tried to address these needs in the offseason, but there just weren't any trade partners or good options, then getting Lucic is fine. Better than no improvement.

100% agreed. And makes you wonder what other GMs knew about a guy like Hamilton, for example, that DL didn't even necessarily bother (or thought Lucic was going to be a bigger deal). As far as the vet center, the lack of a signing/trade there was a pretty big message to me at least that the org was going to let Weal/Shore/Andreoff royal rumble over the spots after what they've seen in them the past couple of years.

Edit: but to be fair, I can see why people would DISagree with the line of thinking I proposed above, I just have no brain space to process the negativity that comes with rooting against a guy's success simply because we traded an asset/a pick/your favorite player for him. We saw it with Sekera, we've seen it with Quick, I hope it doesn't pick up with Lucic because it makes this place insufferable.

 

[Trolfoli]

I agree with this line of thinking. If it is necessary to trade the first round pick to make ourselves competitive now, we should do so. Our cup window could close in as little as two or three years. Might as well put the chips in now and cash out. That said, the one problem I had with the Lucic trade is that our greatest need was not a top 6 left winger (of course its always great to get one, but not a priority). As most of the members on this board recognized in the offseason, we needed a second pairing defenseman and/or a veteran third or fourth line center. Assuming Dean tried to address these needs in the offseason, but there just weren't any trade partners or good options, then getting Lucic is fine. Better than no improvement.

Getting Lewis out of the top 6 was a major need.