Roster/Rumors/Speculation/Trade Talk - 2023-24: Hotel California

[Throttle]

Not crazy about giving up our first round pick this year. Not opposed, but has to be the right fit which is difficult. It would soften the blow if Lou can pick up another second round pick.

Tarasenko is going to cost a lot and will be 31 next month. Plus, if we resign him, he is going to want a hefty contract, plus movement protection. We have too many players as it is who have a nmc or ntc up front and are over 30.

Debrincat would be great as a UFA but so many other teams will be suitors. The team is in a tight spot and needs some skill up front. Maybe Lou pulls in in between like a Garland or something similar. Maybe it is time to sit Beau for a game or so. He is just one of a few others who need a fire lit under them.

They can always pass on upgrading and just concentrate on building the future.

 

[Tahoeblue]

They can always pass on upgrading and just concentrate on building the future.

Yep, that's a legit strategy and one we should consider. Let the chips fall where they and will hold onto picks and try to dump salary. Many may argue that we should try to capitalize on the window we have with an elite goaltender, a blossoming RHD, and the other pieces we have. It's an aging roster with not a lot of cap space and an average prospect pool.

Bottom Line- This team is not good for my health most days.

 

[Foppberg]

Unlike my wife

Now this is the sort of posting that keeps me coming back here.

 

[Mike C]

Now this is the sort of posting that keeps me coming back here.

Thanks man. I always try and keep the humor!

 

[Mike C]

Yep, that's a legit strategy and one we should consider. Let the chips fall where they and will hold onto picks and try to dump salary. Many may argue that we should try to capitalize on the window we have with an elite goaltender, a blossoming RHD, and the other pieces we have. It's an aging roster with not a lot of cap space and an average prospect pool.

Bottom Line- This team is not good for my health most days.

I got the solution for that baby

Prescription happy pills !!

 

[Throttle]

Yep, that's a legit strategy and one we should consider. Let the chips fall where they and will hold onto picks and try to dump salary. Many may argue that we should try to capitalize on the window we have with an elite goaltender, a blossoming RHD, and the other pieces we have. It's an aging roster with not a lot of cap space and an average prospect pool.

Bottom Line- This team is not good for my health most days.

I’m more in the camp of going for it. The Isles are in their window, aged or not. If the team is humming along, well, the D and G are among the best in the league. The offense can be opportunistic in the playoffs.

Most of the teams in the playoffs last year were defensively and goalie flawed, that’s why the playoffs were a mess. Probably gonna be the same this year too. No team in the East improved on that. And I don’t see COL repeating, I expect because the West is a hot mess defensively a random team to go deep.

 

[Mike C]

I’m more in the camp of going for it. The Isles are in their window, aged or not. If the team is humming along, well, the D and G are among the best in the league. The offense can be opportunistic in the playoffs.

Most of the teams in the playoffs last year were defensively and goalie flawed, that’s why the playoffs were a mess. Probably gonna be the same this year too. No team in the East improved on that. And I don’t see COL repeating, I expect because the West is a hot mess defensively a random team to go deep.

Plus you never know what the future holds. One key injury and it all goes to hell anyway

If you have a chance to compete now, go for the gusto!

 

[Chapin Landvogt]

I think our biggest chips going to the TDL would be Beau, Wahlstrom, and the 2023 first. What a package of 2/3 or all 3 can get I'm not sure.

The 1st rounder is likely as good as gone already. Maybe even the 2nd rounder and next year's first could very well be on the table as well.

(As a sidenote, our third is, I believe, already headed to Arizona. The stipulation involving Ladd's contract and play this year looks like it'll be met. We only really retain that pick if Ladd retires before the end of the season.)

If an actual NHL body is moved for another NHL body, it'll be the first time in Lou's 5-year tenure as Isles GM.

Unless one includes the 2022 1st for Romanov as a "hockey trade" (which I don't think many do), we're still waiting for the hockey trade(s) Lou said he'd have to make at last year's deadline.

 

[LeapOnOver]

The 1st rounder is likely as good as gone already. Maybe even the 2nd rounder and next year's first could very well be on the table as well.

(As a sidenote, our third is, I believe, already headed to Arizona. The stipulation involving Ladd's contract and play this year looks like it'll be met. We only really retain that pick if Ladd retires before the end of the season.)

If an actual NHL body is moved for another NHL body, it'll be the first time in Lou's 5-year tenure as Isles GM.

Unless one includes the 2022 1st for Romanov as a "hockey trade" (which I don't think many do), we're still waiting for the hockey trade(s) Lou said he'd have to make at last year's deadline.

Feel like Lou would consider the Romanov trade a "hockey trade" because it was for a guy under team control and not some soon to be UFA. I get what you are saying, but I'd consider it a hockey trade as well. Other than that, I doubt we are going to get a hockey trade anytime soon. Gonna be like you said, emptying the well for firepower.

 

[Chapin Landvogt]

Feel like Lou would consider the Romanov trade a "hockey trade" because it was for a guy under team control and not some soon to be UFA. I get what you are saying, but I'd consider it a hockey trade as well. Other than that, I doubt we are going to get a hockey trade anytime soon. Gonna be like you said, emptying the well for firepower.

I agree that I would certainly classify it in and of itself as a hockey trade, but when I mentioned that shortly after the Romanov deal, several posters pointed out that they did not see it as a hockey trade, which they understood to be "one or more real NHL players" for "one or more real NHL players", not just futures for an NHL body, which has been Lou's MO to date as the Isles' GM.

Judging by the way Lou described it at the deadline last spring, I too felt he was indicating that he was going to need to move a current NHLer or two for another current NHLer or two... That he was going to need to take a different approach than he had been to date in order to acquire what the team needs moving forward.

But like you mention, I'm counting on any move to make this team more dangerous approaching the TD to be one that is going to involve him emptying the well for the requird piece(s).

 

[leeroggy]

I agree that I would certainly classify it in and of itself as a hockey trade, but when I mentioned that shortly after the Romanov deal, several posters pointed out that they did not see it as a hockey trade, which they understood to be "one or more real NHL players" for "one or more real NHL players", not just futures for an NHL body, which has been Lou's MO to date as the Isles' GM.

Judging by the way Lou described it at the deadline last spring, I too felt he was indicating that he was going to need to move a current NHLer or two for another current NHLer or two... That he was going to need to take a different approach than he had been to date in order to acquire what the team needs moving forward.

But like you mention, I'm counting on any move to make this team more dangerous approaching the TD to be one that is going to involve him emptying the well for the requird piece(s).

I think we can all agree that the move of the 1st for a rental is very risky, but the trade of it for a say a 23-year old who scores goals and has a few years left, could be easily defensible. Of course, if a Holmstrom is ready now, that opens more options up too.

 

[Throttle]

Plus you never know what the future holds. One key injury and it all goes to hell anyway

If you have a chance to compete now, go for the gusto!

You just don’t wanna be the Sharks. They kept going for it - rightfully so - but had flawed goalkeepers, then signed some premium guys until 2046.

The 1st rounder is likely as good as gone already. Maybe even the 2nd rounder and next year's first could very well be on the table as well.

(As a sidenote, our third is, I believe, already headed to Arizona. The stipulation involving Ladd's contract and play this year looks like it'll be met. We only really retain that pick if Ladd retires before the end of the season.)

If an actual NHL body is moved for another NHL body, it'll be the first time in Lou's 5-year tenure as Isles GM.

Unless one includes the 2022 1st for Romanov as a "hockey trade" (which I don't think many do), we're still waiting for the hockey trade(s) Lou said he'd have to make at last year's deadline.

What is the relevance of the body-for-body trade that fans keep raising?

If anything, it shows Lou believes in the team, looking for internal growth, and trading/resigning to add to the roster. Playoffs 3/4 years, 2 b2b conference finals kinda indicates this is a ‘fan’ issue and nothing more.

He appears to have tried to acquire a d-man last year, didn’t work out. They kinda suffered because of it. There’s a team in Vancouver that’s experiencing the same issue as the Isles did last year. They have a host of problems, but they sought a d-man and it never materialized and, in part, they are paying for it.

 

[Mike C]

You just don’t wanna be the Sharks. They kept going for it - rightfully so - but had flawed goalkeepers, then signed some premium guys until 2046.

What is the relevance of the body-for-body trade that fans keep raising?

If anything, it shows Lou believes in the team, looking for internal growth, and trading/resigning to add to the roster. Playoffs 3/4 years, 2 b2b conference finals kinda indicates this is a ‘fan’ issue and nothing more.

He appears to have tried to acquire a d-man last year, didn’t work out. They kinda suffered because of it. There’s a team in Vancouver that’s experiencing the same issue as the Isles did last year. They have a host of problems, but they sought a d-man and it never materialized and, in part, they are paying for it.

i don't understand. isn't the guy who would have been picked in the draft a body? If Lou felt Romanov, at age 22, NHL ready was worth picking at 13, isn't that better than taking a shot at a guy who may or may not pan out and will have to develop for God knows how long in the minors

 

[MJF]

What is the relevance of the body-for-body trade that fans keep raising?

I think people here use that as a measuring stick for Lou’s skill as a GM.

 

[crasherino]

The 1st rounder is likely as good as gone already. Maybe even the 2nd rounder and next year's first could very well be on the table as well.

Man...I hope that's not the case, but I fear you're correct.

I don't have any major issue with any of the moves we've made individually, but the collective nature of our trades (Palmieri, JGP, Romanov, etc.) have left us with a big deficiency in young prospects. At some point, you've gotta dance with those that brought ya and see where you land. I guess if come February, we can snag Kane for lil more than a first and it really looks like that will make us a SC contender, I may feel differently. But I would love to have both a first AND a second round pick in a draft for the first time in recent memory.

We've been somewhat fortunate to grab Dufour and Raty after the first round but guys like that should be the icing in your prospect pool - not your whole cake.

 

[Mike C]

I agree that I would certainly classify it in and of itself as a hockey trade, but when I mentioned that shortly after the Romanov deal, several posters pointed out that they did not see it as a hockey trade, which they understood to be "one or more real NHL players" for "one or more real NHL players", not just futures for an NHL body, which has been Lou's MO to date as the Isles' GM.

Judging by the way Lou described it at the deadline last spring, I too felt he was indicating that he was going to need to move a current NHLer or two for another current NHLer or two... That he was going to need to take a different approach than he had been to date in order to acquire what the team needs moving forward.

But like you mention, I'm counting on any move to make this team more dangerous approaching the TD to be one that is going to involve him emptying the well for the requird piece(s).

it's all semantics. a trade is a trade by any other name

 

[Throttle]

i don't understand. isn't the guy who would have been picked in the draft a body? If Lou felt Romanov, at age 22, NHL ready was worth picking at 13, isn't that better than taking a shot at a guy who may or may not pan out and will have to develop for God knows how long in the minors

Seems to me, if anything Lou accelerated the development of that pick and guaranteed an actual immediate return of a NHL player, let alone a top 4 guy that’s 22, cost controlled, and you can have for a decade. And filled a need the team desperately needed to. That’s a SMART move.

However, it’s not us fun as drafting a Bellows with a first round pick and coming up with 800 reasons he didn’t get a chance in six years of his draft year. But, that’s the future!

 

[SI]

Not crazy about giving up our first round pick this year. Not opposed, but has to be the right fit which is difficult. It would soften the blow if Lou can pick up another second round pick.

Tarasenko is going to cost a lot and will be 31 next month. Plus, if we resign him, he is going to want a hefty contract, plus movement protection. We have too many players as it is who have a nmc or ntc up front and are over 30.

Debrincat would be great as a UFA but so many other teams will be suitors. The team is in a tight spot and needs some skill up front. Maybe Lou pulls in in between like a Garland or something similar. Maybe it is time to sit Beau for a game or so. He is just one of a few others who need a fire lit under them.

I think you have to define what a lot would be? Because DeBrincat would be great and he will be an RFA and the cost for him will be a lot.

Tarasenko should return close to if not exactly what Philly got for Giroux. The same will probably go for Horvat and Kane (maybe slightly more).

Horvat fits the character profile and turns 28 at the end of this season - Nelson could move to Barzal's wing. Tarasenko 31 fits the position as well as Kane, who is 34 this week.

IMO, the team needs an upgrade to Bailey and Beauvillier. I love Beau, but I cannot see him being more than 2nd and 3rd line player. For me, a Bailey, Beau, 2023 1st and Bolduc for Horvat and Garland would be the move.
A top 6 of -
Nelson Barzal Wahlstrom
Lee Horvat Garland

 

[JKP]

Seems to me, if anything Lou accelerated the development of that pick and guaranteed an actual immediate return of a NHL player, let alone a top 4 guy that’s 22, cost controlled, and you can have for a decade. And filled a need the team desperately needed to. That’s a SMART move.

However, it’s not us fun as drafting a Bellows with a first round pick and coming up with 800 reasons he didn’t get a chance in six years of his draft year. But, that’s the future!

Couldn’t agree more! 25% of first rounders never play 100 games in the NHL. To trade 13OA for a 22yo D already with 100gms experience is smart, imo.

 

[Mike C]

Seems to me, if anything Lou accelerated the development of that pick and guaranteed an actual immediate return of a NHL player, let alone a top 4 guy that’s 22, cost controlled, and you can have for a decade. And filled a need the team desperately needed to. That’s a SMART move.

However, it’s not us fun as drafting a Bellows with a first round pick and coming up with 800 reasons he didn’t get a chance in six years of his draft year. But, that’s the future!

totally agree with 1st paragraph

back in the day, we used to call what you described in 2nd part as "backwards logic"

 

[The Real JT]

I think you have to define what a lot would be? Because DeBrincat would be great and he will be an RFA and the cost for him will be a lot.

Tarasenko should return close to if not exactly what Philly got for Giroux. The same will probably go for Horvat and Kane (maybe slightly more).

Horvat fits the character profile and turns 28 at the end of this season - Nelson could move to Barzal's wing. Tarasenko 31 fits the position as well as Kane, who is 34 this week.

IMO, the team needs an upgrade to Bailey and Beauvillier. I love Beau, but I cannot see him being more than 2nd and 3rd line player. For me, a Bailey, Beau, 2023 1st and Bolduc for Horvat and Garland would be the move.
A top 6 of -
Nelson Barzal Wahlstrom
Lee Horvat Garland

I think you’re overstating the value of our current players in your hypothetical trade.

In my mind, the combination of Beau and Bailey is a wash and each player balances the other out on a value scale. If we accept that, then there’s no way we get both Horvat and Garland for what is probably no better than a mid first round pick + Bolduc.

Of course I’d do those deals in a heartbeat.

 

[crashthenet]

Not sure that PLD is interested in being in Winnipeg going forward. I would pay the premium for him if we could negotiate ahead of time.

 

[Uncle Lou]

Not sure that PLD is interested in being in Winnipeg going forward. I would pay the premium for him if we could negotiate ahead of time.

Yes sir. PLD is very good and would slot in nice behind Barzy and move Nelson to wing. Bailey,holmstrom 1st 2023 and Wilde enough? Gives them a guy who can step in and play in the top 6 and some young futures

Nelson-Barzal-wahlstrom
Lee-PLD-beau
Parise-Pageau-Palmeri
4th line

Like that forward group quite a bit.

 

[WangMustGo]

I think you have to define what a lot would be? Because DeBrincat would be great and he will be an RFA and the cost for him will be a lot.

Tarasenko should return close to if not exactly what Philly got for Giroux. The same will probably go for Horvat and Kane (maybe slightly more).

Horvat fits the character profile and turns 28 at the end of this season - Nelson could move to Barzal's wing. Tarasenko 31 fits the position as well as Kane, who is 34 this week.

IMO, the team needs an upgrade to Bailey and Beauvillier. I love Beau, but I cannot see him being more than 2nd and 3rd line player. For me, a Bailey, Beau, 2023 1st and Bolduc for Horvat and Garland would be the move.
A top 6 of -
Nelson Barzal Wahlstrom
Lee Horvat Garland

We have both been on the Horvat train, I think he would be a huge addition for this team. Swiss army knife of a player.

Another player id be interested in is Gostisbehere. I think he would be a great addition for the PP, and Mayfield can cover up for alot of his defensive issues.

 

[steveat]

you could look at the Lou trade as being Romanov for Dach. That's essentially what it was.

Horvat would be a good pickup. He's great at faceoffs and is still 27, so we could get him in his prime. I'd even try Horvat at centre and use Barzal on wing. Unless Barzal can win some faceoffs!