Speculation: Roster Building Thread XXXIII: 33rd thread twds the line of dead

[TheBloodyNine]

Rangers have shown considerable growth this year. They didn’t make the playoffs last season. Growth is possible without making the playoffs. The Rangers should get another high pick.

 

[Calad]

Dreger said on Insider Trading that Colorado sees Namestnikov as a backup to Kreider, so yeah, they should be motivated to get Kreider.

Between seeing Tatar and Namestnikov as fallback plans for Colorado in case they don't get Kreider, it reeks of cheapo Sakic leaking to insiders trying to get Gorton to budge on price. Steadfast and resolute, gorts.

 

[NYSPORTS]

This Rangers team has given up the 4th most shots in the league with 2 and 3 games in hand trailing other teams.

Based on even games played, the Rangers have given up the 2nd most shots in the entire NHL

This team would be annihilated in the playoffs if they ever made it. They can’t stop nobody, the cross ice passes would be gone and they don’t have the overall personnel to win on the boards.

It’s a rebuild and I believe Gordon/J.D. know this.

 

[Calad]

Would rather 1 amazing piece than multiple pieces. Would byram for kreider straight up even be remotely possible

Not a chance.

 

[JESSEWENEEDTOCOOK]

Between seeing Tatar and Namestnikov as fallback plans for Colorado in case they don't get Kreider, it reeks of cheapo Sakic leaking to insiders trying to get Gorton to budge on price. Steadfast and resolute, gorts.

Tatar is one thing. He’s a talented player who has term on his contract. Not a bad target if he can’t get Kreider at all.

Namestnikov would be a joke as a Kreider/Tatar alternative

 

[SA16]

Well if you GUARANTEED we would lose in the first round then I certainly would prefer not to make the playoffs.

 

[Alluckks]

In 05'-06' the Rangers limped into the playoffs on the back of a phenomenal rookie goaltender and a MVP caliber season from a forward. They then decided to commit to the idea of being a playoff team going forward...

and the next 5 years consisted of (in order):
2nd round exit
2nd round exit
1st round exit
Did not qualify
1st round exit

Then in 11'-12' we lost in the Conference Finals
2nd round exit the year after
Then the Stanley Cup loss in 13'-14'

So, when we had a very, very good rookie goalie, and some other young players (albeit not as good as the collection we have now), we decided that henceforth we would be a team aimed at the playoffs... and it took us 6 additional years to make our first Conference Finals appearnace, and 8 years from that original starting point to make a Stanley Cup Finals.

It was a good decade stretch, no doubt.

However, if we go by the phrase of 'if you don't learn from history then you are doomed to repeat it' - well, I think it best to be sellers again, stock assets, and look for the corner turn next year. Rather than to push the button now simply because the season is going better than expected.

 

[Alluckks]

At this point I’d rather make the playoffs and get booted early than lose a bunch after the deadline so we can get the 8th best odds at winning the lottery. Pretty easily. I think it would be very bad moving forward if the team completely collapsed post deadline.

But that isn't the question. The question involved collecting assets for trade deadline pieces as well.

 

[Avery16]

I would prefer never to trade with Tampa again.

I feel like on that league roster age chart, we should have to take the average age of NYR and TB since they have recycled so many of our past-prime players

 

[LaffyTaffy]

The difference between Lee and Kreider is Lee cant skate for shit. Thats why his contract is bad

 

[SA16]

The difference between Lee and Kreider is Lee cant skate for shit. Thats why his contract is bad

Why does it matter if he looks worse on the ice when he still provides very strong production? If he can perform well now as a bad skater I feel comfortable that he knows how to play without being a great skater and can sustain that. Or at least more comfortable than a guy who relies on his speed to get into position and make plays who will have to completely change his game if he loses it.

 

[GAGLine]

Honestly the only example I can think of of a big skater who aged well was Jason Chimera. And he was never much more than a 3rd line winger. Maybe Fedorov but he was less physical and a much better player at his peak.

The examples of power forwards aging poorly however are legion.

A Kreider contract has the potential to be an albatross 3-4 years in. That's not ideal.

I think people forget too about the abuse Kreider takes by standing in front of the net. Adam Graves played the same role. He was traded at age 32 and done at age 34.

Maybe Kreider will weather it better, but it takes a toll.

 

[RGY]

I’m curious what people’s opinion would be:

Would we prefer this team just make the playoffs and get ousted in the first round in 4-5 games or not make the playoffs and get the better draft picks?

Make the playoffs.

I always prefer to make the playoffs. I especially prefer it when you have a lot of young kids who can get an early taste of what that atmosphere and gameplay is like so that when this team thinks it is really ready to compete, these kids arent getting shell shocked. They have an idea of what to expect and how to prepare.

I prefer it over banking on a lottery system hoping to jump from spots 12-15 because thats where they will be. The West is tight and the Rangers will finish with more points than many of the non-playoff teams

 

[Fitzy]

Well if you GUARANTEED we would lose in the first round then I certainly would prefer not to make the playoffs.

Teams re entering the playoffs after a draught tend to bomb out badly. Is rather get that out of the way this year. It's a valuable learning experience to the kids about what you have to bring in the postseason

 

[RGY]

Hell just look at the deterioration of Rick Nash who was a MUCH better player than Kreider and was here in NY. That guy was also known as a big guy who skated VERY well.

Rick Nash suffered multiple concussions. You are a way better and more intelligent poster than this Viper.

Dustin Brown, Ryan Callahan, Milan Lucic...are we f***ing kidding with these examples trying to be passed off as viable reasons not extend Kreider? Still going on with these awful examples.

I have said all along, I can understand certain reasoning for not re-signing him but please save this garbage for the trash can

 

[JESSEWENEEDTOCOOK]

Honestly the only example I can think of of a big skater who aged well was Jason Chimera. And he was never much more than a 3rd line winger. Maybe Fedorov but he was less physical and a much better player at his peak.

The examples of power forwards aging poorly however are legion.

A Kreider contract has the potential to be an albatross 3-4 years in. That's not ideal.

Kreider is a freak among freaks though, at least athletically. I *think* he'll age well, but it's definitely a risk, no doubt about it.

 

[Synergy27]

A Kreider contract has the potential to be an albatross 3-4 years in. That's not ideal.

But, given the state of the “accelerated” rebuild, the question becomes whether or not that’s something we can live with. We’d ideally have had 2-3 legitimate Cup runs with Kreider at that point. If they haven’t won yet, we’d be looking at another rebuild, significant retool, by then anyway.

 

[RGY]

I think people forget too about the abuse Kreider takes by standing in front of the net. Adam Graves played the same role. He was traded at age 32 and done at age 34.

Maybe Kreider will weather it better, but it takes a toll.

The game is SIGNIFICANTLY different than from when Graves played the game in front of the net. Heck its different from when Holmstrom made a living there. Defenders cannot take liberties with the opposing forward in front. Cant be done anymore.

 

[NYRangers0723]

Rick Nash suffered multiple concussions. You are a way better and more intelligent poster than this Viper.

Dustin Brown, Ryan Callahan, Milan Lucic...are we f*cking kidding with these examples trying to be passed off as viable reasons not extend Kreider? Still going on with these awful examples.

I have said all along, I can understand certain reasoning for not re-signing him but please save this garbage for the trash can.

Great Post!!

 

[Synergy27]

I think people forget too about the abuse Kreider takes by standing in front of the net. Adam Graves played the same role. He was traded at age 32 and done at age 34.

Maybe Kreider will weather it better, but it takes a toll.

Different eras. The “beating” Kreider takes is laughable in comparison to what Graves withstood.

 

[Fitzy]

But, given the state of the “accelerated” rebuild, the question becomes whether or not that’s something we can live with. We’d ideally have had 2-3 legitimate Cup runs with Kreider at that point. If they haven’t won yet, we’d be looking at another rebuild, significant retool, by then anyway.

I'd hope they'd aim to sustain the teams competence over the next full decade, in which shesty, fox, Kakko and the like will all be in their primes. I'm not interested in lives that help us slightly in the first half of the decade that screw us over in the second.

 

[GAGLine]

The game is SIGNIFICANTLY different than from when Graves played the game in front of the net. Heck its different from when Holmstrom made a living there. Defenders cannot take liberties with the opposing forward in front. Cant be done anymore.

Not as much, no, but it's still a lot of physical battles.

 

[RGY]

Not as much, no, but it's still a lot of physical battles.

Yea sure theres battles. Nothing like Graves and others endured.

Dont foresee that ending Kreider’s career by age 34, which by the way would be year 5 of a potential 7 year contract. Theres your “out clause”

 

[TheBloodyNine]

Teams re entering the playoffs after a draught tend to bomb out badly. Is rather get that out of the way this year. It's a valuable learning experience to the kids about what you have to bring in the postseason

The Blackhawks went to the conference final after missing for 5 years straight.

 

[Fitzy]

The Blackhawks went to the conference final after missing for 5 years straight.

It happens, and I don't have the stats in front of me. Just based in my anecdotal observations over the years that it's a tendency.