Speculation: Roster building thread XXIV:

[Avery16]

That's a smallish corps that definitely leans more toward the puck-moving approach.

Not sure more is better when it comes to that skill set.

Even after last nights game, you have no faith in either Fox’s or ADAs defense ability?

 

[Avery16]

How can you guarantee our LD will be fine or that we wont be competing next year? So youre just going to assume Fox is going to grow and become this physical defenseman? DeAngelo too? Youre going to assume they can take on the same tasks with the same level of play? Same ability to defend the front of the net? DeAngelo is still lacking defensively. He still gets caught running around in his own end. It is nowhere near a strength for him and now we will expect it to be?

Optimistic, but also naive.

This team needs defense more than it needs offense. They need quality defense and we want to move out one of the few defensively minded players we have because some are drooling over the offense others provide while ignoring their shortcomings.

I’d rather take the hit on defense and move Trouba if it means we get to keep ADA long term. If you think we’d ever live down moving ADA right now, that’s naive.

 

[Shesterkybomb]

I would like to keep Strome on the right terms. With a more talented winger on his other side (than Jesper), the line will be a lot more tough to handle and his blemishes won't be quite as apparent... not to mention how his production would be positively impacted.

So, what is the best way to keep Strome? I think its to trade him. If we trade him, chances are he'll be asked to anchor a 2nd or 3rd line, which I think we see is beyond his capability - i.e. he relies on Panarin to look good. And so if we trade him into that scenario, he is more likely to be exposed, in which case his asking price at UFA will go down. Of course that assumes that being exposed doesnt force his hand to take an extension before his RFA year expires, or that it doesnt lead to him getting traded to another team where he fills a more appropriate role. But given the potential return on him now, and given his current output and having another year of control, i think the potential to reel him in after a downturn for a discount is worth the risk of trading and losing him. Having one or two low-cost guys fill top-6 is important for building out a quality, sustainable roster.

Strome once again scored last night, Fast went offside and it was called back but the narrative of him only being decent because of Panarin is overplayed. He was good with us last year too. Everyone is better with Panarin, everyone is better with Zibanajad too but we never pin that narrative on Kreider or Buch. Strome fits this team and age group, if he can be resigned for a reasonable amount we would be bananas to trade him.

 

[RGY]

I’d rather take the hit on defense and move Trouba if it means we get to keep ADA long term. If you think we’d ever live down moving ADA right now, that’s naive.

Because taking the hit on defense, which we are already doing, is working out so well for us now?

You keep ignoring all the other points being made about why defense is important, the role Trouba assumes every game. You are, like another poster here who loves to attack Trouba, infatuated with the inflated numbers DeAngelo has put up this year. And not coincidentally after he sat out part of Training Camp because he didnt get paid the money he wanted. You think he is gona be any easier to deal with? He knows what he is playing for. DeAngelo easily screams a player who gets paid and then coasts it while he collects his check.

But quite honestly, I am fine with keeping DeAngelo. However, find another way to do it. Because trading Trouba is not the answer and will only expose the whole defense, not just the right side, once we everyone is forced to fill that role. It will go back to being the revolving door it was before.

 

[RGY]

Strome once again scored last night, Fast went offside and it was called back but the narrative of him only being decent because of Panarin is overplayed. He was good with us last year too. Everyone is better with Panarin, everyone is better with Zibanajad too but we never pin that narrative on Kreider or Buch. Strome fits this team and age group, if he can be resigned for a reasonable amount we would be bananas to trade him.

What’s reasonable for a guy who is still sloppy in his own end, careless with the lazy penalties he takes, and his PPG pace is absolutely inflated with Panarin? Sure he was decent for us last season, but he wasnt producing like this.

I dont care about his disallowed goal last night. It was his stupid asinine offensive zone penalty that swung the momentum in the game. That is his problem.

 

[Shesterkybomb]

What's the point of this, Bergeron has one more pim than him, when you back check and battle you get penalties.

 

[Avery16]

Because taking the hit on defense, which we are already doing, is working out so well for us now?

You keep ignoring all the other points being made about why defense is important, the role Trouba assumes every game. You are, like another poster here who loves to attack Trouba, infatuated with the inflated numbers DeAngelo has put up this year. And not coincidentally after he sat out part of Training Camp because he didnt get paid the money he wanted. You think he is gona be any easier to deal with? He knows what he is playing for. DeAngelo easily screams a player who gets paid and then coasts it while he collects his check.

But quite honestly, I am fine with keeping DeAngelo. However, find another way to do it. Because trading Trouba is not the answer and will only expose the whole defense, not just the right side, once we everyone is forced to fill that role. It will go back to being the revolving door it was before.

Don’t twist my words. Find an attack I made on Trouba. I’ll wait. You don’t give Fox or ADA enough credit.

 

[Shesterkybomb]

What’s reasonable for a guy who is still sloppy in his own end, careless with the lazy penalties he takes, and his PPG pace is absolutely inflated with Panarin? Sure he was decent for us last season, but he wasnt producing like this.

I dont care about his disallowed goal last night. It was his stupid asinine offensive zone penalty that swung the momentum in the game. That is his problem.

I can't answer this when you are so biased against him. You cant be serious with all this. Tell me this.....are Deangelos stats inflated because of Panarin and Zibanajad?

 

[Shesterkybomb]

Agreed. Now would you rather keep him or ADA if you had to choose?

As good as ADA is offensively, he is getting soft minutes behind Trouba and Fox. He couldn't handle the top line minutes against other teams top players, that's a fact. So if its between the two I'd have to take Trouba especially since we have Fox already.

 

[Drew4u]

What's the point of this, Bergeron has one more pim than him, when you back check and battle you get penalties.

Or it means you don't know how to defend without taking penalties on opposing players. Penalties are not good.

 

[Avery16]

As good as ADA is offensively, he is getting soft minutes behind Trouba and Fox. He couldn't handle the top line minutes against other teams top players, that's a fact. So if its between the two I'd have to take Trouba especially since we have Fox already.

Fox is more of a replacement for Trouba than for ADA. ADA is not getting soft minutes.

 

[Shesterkybomb]

Or it means you don't know how to defend without taking penalties on opposing players. Penalties are not good.

Or it means you are in the battle, last nights penalty was a result of the other player lifting his stick so how is that his fault.

 

[Shesterkybomb]

Fox is more of a replacement for Trouba than for ADA. ADA is not getting soft minutes.

ADA is playing on the 3rd pair and top line pp.....that's as soft as it gets.

 

[RGY]

I can't answer this when you are so biased against him. You cant be serious with all this. Tell me this.....are Deangelos stats inflated because of Panarin and Zibanajad?

Biased against him? Nope. I’d rather Strome not be a damn idiot and cost the team back to back games. I asked, what’s considered reasonable? This guy has not produced like this his entire career. That isnt biased. Thats facts. He didnt even produce like this last year. Sure he has some chemistry with Panarin, but with the way Panarin is playing this year you could find a lot of guys that could fit there. What is the reasonable contract? I am very serious with all the points I made because they are very legitimate and I am sure many here would agree. Am I opposed to keeping Strome around? Certainly not. But me thinks he is going to want a nice raise with the production he has had.

And while yes I think DeAngelo has benefited from Panarin being added to the roster, as I stated in a separate post DeAngelo has some extra motivation that would be a pay raise after not getting the money he wanted for this season.

 

[SA16]

As good as ADA is offensively, he is getting soft minutes behind Trouba and Fox. He couldn't handle the top line minutes against other teams top players, that's a fact. So if its between the two I'd have to take Trouba especially since we have Fox already.

And how do you know this if he's never been given the opportunity to do so?

 

[RangerBoy]

I think, without watching the game, the need for another panarin level talent would benefit us greatly. Panarin has been better than expected but he can’t do it all himself.

Panarin can’t play any better. The Rangers are 1-9-1 in games which he doesn’t have a point. They need so much more than just him. The Rangers have one point more this season than they did last season. They spent a combined $137,500,000 on Panarin and Trouba.

 

[Avery16]

ADA is playing on the 3rd pair and top line pp.....that's as soft as it gets.

Check your math. ADA is second among RD to Trouba in EV TOI/GP.

 

[RangerBoy]

Your post wasn’t negative? Okay lol.

ANY = playoff type expectations.

If you were going into this season hoping the young players would be effective in their new roles or progressing nicely then, aside from a few outliers, I can’t see how those expectations weren't met or exceeded.

You think all of my posts are negative.

 

[RGY]

Don’t twist my words. Find an attack I made on Trouba. I’ll wait. You don’t give Fox or ADA enough credit.

Didn’t twist your words. I just compared you to another poster that attacks Trouba, but did not say you did. Just to emphasize the infatuation you have with the offense DeAngelo is providing over the defense that Trouba does. I mean they are defensemen right? Defense should come first? Thats why you have 12 forwards...or in our case 9. Ok fine, you want to have a couple defensemen that can lean more towards offense? Then you better damn well have a guy that leans heavily towards defense and makes it a priority. Trouba allows for Fox and ADA to excel offensively.

 

[Avery16]

Didn’t twist your words. I just compared you to another poster that attacks Trouba, but did not say you did. Just to emphasize the infatuation you have with the offense DeAngelo is providing over the defense that Trouba does. I mean they are defensemen right? Defense should come first? Thats why you have 12 forwards...or in our case 9. Ok fine, you want to have a couple defensemen that can lean more towards offense? Then you better damn well have a guy that leans heavily towards defense and makes it a priority. Trouba allows for Fox and ADA to excel offensively.

Fox and ADA both play defense.

 

[dccuse]

Strome once again scored last night, Fast went offside and it was called back but the narrative of him only being decent because of Panarin is overplayed. He was good with us last year too. Everyone is better with Panarin, everyone is better with Zibanajad too but we never pin that narrative on Kreider or Buch. Strome fits this team and age group, if he can be resigned for a reasonable amount we would be bananas to trade him.

not saying he's bad. Just saying his position on a top line (or 2 lines) is contingent on the quality of the wingers. Would like to have him either way, but not at a 1c (or 2c) price.


EDIT: does anyone know how to delete a signature?

 

[mas0764]

The "problem" is we're comparing a team that sold off just before the deadline, again, for a bunch of assets with the team fielding the youngest lineup in the league.

If anything, I think the Rangers have performed better than expected fielding a bunch of rookies and really young players with significant minutes each and every night. Kakko. Fox. Lindgren. Hajek. Igor. Georgiev. Andersson. Howden. Chytil.

Leave it to RB to spin it as a negative when, really, no one had ANY expectations about this year - Panarin or not.

Yeah, I don't see what the problem is.

If anything people were all freaking out and worried when we signed Panarin that we would be too good and ruin our rebuild.

If we are only a point better before yet another impending sell off, then that's great news. It means we secured two long term pieces in Trouba and Panarin and didn't compromise the rebuild by spoiling another tank year with a playoff run. We will still be in position to win the lottery, or maintain our own top-10 pick, and hopefully compile some additional assets or first rounders that we could even use as ammo to move up into the top 5 to get a guy like Stutzle or Raymond (assuming Byfield and Lafrieniere are out of reach).

 

[True Blue]

Agreed. Now would you rather keep him or ADA if you had to choose?

Two completely different type of defensemen and each brings something completely different than the other one.

 

[Bob Richards]

What's the point of this, Bergeron has one more pim than him, when you back check and battle you get penalties.

Bergeron has 18 penalty minutes. Strome has 19 minor penalties.

 

[Thirty One]

You think all of my posts are negative.

Outrageous!