Roster Building Thread VI (2022-23): Offseason edition

[bleedblue94]

Well, to be honest, if we ignore his draft position, a D+3 21 year old getting practically no PP time playing with two other young players also still finding their games, getting 15:15 per game who scored at a .48PPG clip, has showed flashes of highlight reel skill, and was second among forwards with 141 hits, certainly DOES have value to the team. The issue as I see it is his current value/level of play in relation to his draft position. If he had been picked 29OA we'd all be pretty thrilled with him. Well most of us. Hahahaha. Instead, most of us, myself included, are disappointed. He's still a valuable player, just not 1OA valuable. But also he would certainly not be the first high pick to blossom outside of his D+1-3 if he can manage to do so. We will see. One way or the other.

Highlight reel skill? He's had two highlight goals in 3 years. I think one of the biggest problems most of us have is the fact that elite skill is not noticeable in his game. I'm not really sure where you're seeing it

 

[NYR Viper]

Lafreniere seems to do very well when he is in and around the net. His hand-eye coordination and ability to score in tight and create chances in that way were noticeable to me all season. The Rangers really didn't create much in the way of chances that way this year.

I am hoping that, with a change in offensive philosophy, we see more production

 

[McRanger92]

I love Mika and I like Vinny, I don't care about reg season as much as others, and I felt the entire time we needed Mika, X, Vinny and hope chytil was ready to be the X. He wasn't, Vinny was asked to do more than he should be (and did well overall) but for this team to do what it wants to do Vinny should not be the 2c come playoff time. This isn't just about point totals. He plays too many minutes a game and after a stretch he starts to make so many metal mistakes it negates the good he does.


Chytil is not a natural finisher. In fact none of the three of the kids is at this point. All have average or below average shots.

Chytil has had a shooting % over 10.5 3 of the last 4 years. He, like the other 2 Kids, just need to take more shots when they are there.

 

[bleedblue94]

Chytil has had a shooting % over 10.5 3 of the last 4 years. He, like the other 2 Kids, just need to take more shots when they are there.

Watch the game, watch how goalie's react when he shoots. No goalie is ever cleanly beat by his shot and no goalie ever looks fooled by his shot. Just because he has a good shooting percentage doesn't mean that he has a good shot. Shooting percentage can be affected based on where you are on the ice when you shoot and what type of goals you score. He shot is not good, none of the three have a good shot

 

[NYR Viper]

Watch the game, watch how goalie's react when he shoots. No goalie is ever cleanly beat by his shot and no goalie ever looks fooled by his shot. Just because he has a good shooting percentage doesn't mean that he has a good shot. Shooting percentage can be affected based on where you are on the ice when you shoot and what type of goals you score. He shot is not good, none of the three have a good shot

I would vehemently disagree. I can recall more than a few times where he has beaten a goalie cleanly

 

[Guyute]

Chytil shoots well off the rush. He doesn’t snipe from standstill like Mika or even Panarin.

 

[McRanger92]

Watch the game, watch how goalie's react when he shoots. No goalie is ever cleanly beat by his shot and no goalie ever looks fooled by his shot. Just because he has a good shooting percentage doesn't mean that he has a good shot. Shooting percentage can be affected based on where you are on the ice when you shoot and what type of goals you score. He shot is not good, none of the three have a good shot

I watch every game, and I've seen him beat plenty of goalies clean with a quick wrister or backhander. He scored 22 goals this year in 74 games. If they gave him Vinny Off the Iron's minutes he probably scores 30. But by all means continue to tell me he can't finish.

I would vehemently disagree. I can recall more than a few times where he has beaten a goalie cleanly

You must not be watching the games lol

 

[McRanger92]

Not everyone hated him. I thought he should've been given a shot on lines 2 & 3 when the team was sleep walking in late November, early December. He was drawing a penalty a game, plus his speed & energy were noticeable almost every shift he took the ice. And he was such an easy kid to root for. I hated giving him up in the Motte deal.

There was something there with Gauthier but he is about to be in his 4th organization. Rangers with a glut of wingers weren't in a position to bring that player out of him. Not engaged enough shift to shift and he did not protect himself well for a big guy. The back to back concussions from Blais (lol) and Reaves (LOL) did not help.

 

[bleedblue94]

Chytil shoots well off the rush. He doesn’t snipe from standstill like Mika or even Panarin.

100 percent.

Goalies are not fooled by his shot. Scoring on a rush or passing play is not the same as using a good shot and beating a goalie cleanly. Above average shots are also harder for goalies to read off the blade and control rebounds on. Nyr is one of the worst teams at generating rebounds. Overall the team is a group of below average shooters except for Mika and occasionally panarin but he doesn't shoot.

@McRanger92 @NYR Viper this is what I am talking about.

 

[NYR Viper]

I understood moving on from Gauthier. In terms of the type of guy the team needs, I'd say there is more of a need for a Motte-type than a Gauthier type moving in to next year, especially given Cuylle and Othmann on the way.

 

[McRanger92]

100 percent.

Goalies are not fooled by his shot. Scoring on a rush or passing play is not the same as using a good shot and beating a goalie cleanly. Above average shots are also harder for goalies to read off the blade and control rebounds on. Nyr is one of the worst teams at generating rebounds. Overall the team is a group of below average shooters except for Mika and occasionally panarin but he doesn't shoot.

@McRanger92 @NYR Viper this is what I am talking about.

Semantics. Finishing is putting the puck in the back of the net regardless of how it gets there. Chytil was 4th on the team in goals and 8th in average ice time among forwards, without a bloated shooting percentage. As long as he's healthy there's a 30+ goal center staring right at us. Roope Hintz broke out at 24, thats what I envision next year for Chytil (age 23).

 

[tomobson]

I like Panarin with Chytil a lot but I think Trocheck's skill set is wasted as a babysitter for Panarin. Chytil just needs to improve his faceoffs to a respectable level and Drury needs to add a speedy, physical forechecker to the RW. Ive championed Fast, but i've seen other good suggestions of guys who arent necessarily "Top 6" wingers, but they'd fill the role (Garland, Hathaway, Haula, etc.) Panarin has had his most 5v5 success with right handed RW (Fast/Blackwell).

The rangers need to stop babysitting Panarin. Bringing in a third liner to play RW to please Panarin is not the route to go and the rangers can't add much to begin with because of the cap. Chytil is already here and had a good but short stint at RW with Panarin/Strome last season. I think he was PPG. Trocheck and Chytil will feed off each other rather nicely I feel and take some of the pressure off of Panarin.

On top of that, Kakko is most likely moving up to the top line and now you're gonna leave Chytil on the third line with no talent to play with and that's just going to be a complete waste. Unless, Laf suddenly remembers he's a hockey player again. Let Goodrow or another veteran 3c mentor whatever rookie is coming up. Chytil is a shooter and we need scorers in the top six.

 

[leetch99]

Colorado I can see, but what does Chicago even have to offer that isn't the #1 pick? They can take his whole salary, but what is the return? They're in full blown rebuild.

To me it is Colorado or Florida. Panthers don't own their 1st for the next three seasons, so they have to go for it. Darkhorse is Montreal, but something tells me Panarin wouldn't want to deal with the Canadian media.

LOL.....even a few hockey sticks and maybe a couple of goalie sticks in return for saving 11.6 in Cap if they are eating it all and at half cap I would just drop the player sticks and ask for the goalie sticks but if push comes to shove....we would just take a couple of Bedard autographed sticks . If Drury gets a chance to move him ANYWHERE for one or the other cap savings.....you do it . That alone plus the money to add a player that plays 200 ft game is a WIN .

 

[Pawnee Rangers]

I think Drury built a solid team for the playoffs. Even if one the top 3 lines weren't going, there was plenty of firepower elsewhere in the top 9 to pick up the slack. What I don't think he or any of us could have ever imagine was that you'd only have 2.5 players doing anything for most of the series. There was too much talent for that to happen. And I'm not even talking talent on paper, I'm talking talent from this season. The regular season production fro ZIb, Panarin, Trocheck, and to a lesser extent the kid line never ever materialized in the post season. One or two guys, ok. But 6 guys going MIA? That's a rough look for these players.

 

[McRanger92]

The rangers need to stop babysitting Panarin. Bringing in a third liner to play RW to please Panarin is not the route to go and the rangers can't add much to begin with because of the cap. Chytil is already here and had a good but short stint at RW with Panarin/Strome last season. I think he was PPG. Trocheck and Chytil will feed off each other rather nicely I feel and take some of the pressure off of Panarin.

On top of that, Kakko is most likely moving up to the top line and now you're gonna leave Chytil on the third line with no talent to play with and that's just going to be a complete waste. Unless, Laf suddenly remembers he's a hockey player again. Let Goodrow or another veteran 3c mentor whatever rookie is coming up. Chytil is a shooter and we need scorers in the top six.

Im not bringing in a 3rd line winder to placate Panarin, im bringing in a Fast type because its an overall team need, and he'd fit best with Panarin. Don't cut off your nose to spite your face.

Laf-Mika-Kakko
Panarin-Chytil-Fast*
Kreider-Trocheck-Vesey

Play all 3 lines the same amount of time at even strength. Chytil is a center; i get the logic behind moving him to wing but it hurts the overall team in my opinion. Many teams have won Cups have 3 balanced lines.

 

[leetch99]

11.6 doesn't go as far as it used to. I also don't see him going anywhere without retention.

Some of that is used on raises. The rest might get you one guy that comes close but probably doesn't replace Panarin's chance creation at 5v5, and a depth guy.

You do have a point about different types of chance creation. If we actually commit to being a cycle team, we could replace Panarin with a speedier, heavier player and get better overall.

What are Panarin's "chance retention" numbers like in the playoffs ? Regular season numbers mean shit if he can't earn some of his 11.6 million in real games .

I'd also be interested in his reg season chance retention #'s less the chances that are given to our opposition from his blind cross ice or hearing footsteps 2 on 1 or breakaway , passes on Shesty !!!

 

[CLW]

Semantics. Finishing is putting the puck in the back of the net regardless of how it gets there. Chytil was 4th on the team in goals and 8th in average ice time among forwards, without a bloated shooting percentage. As long as he's healthy there's a 30+ goal center staring right at us. Roope Hintz broke out at 24, thats what I envision next year for Chytil (age 23).

We can only hope. Roope's hands and skating are in a different tier to Chytil's.

 

[Profet]

There is a reason Panarin liked playing with Fast. Panarin basically needs someone to do the dirty work and get the puck out of the corners.

I've had enough of watching him coast in behind a scrum of players against the boards only to see the puck shoot out and catch everyone deep in the offensive zone.

That is not Panarin's game, and if he doesn't have other players on his line that will do it for him, he is not effective, and can even be a detriment.

 

[bhamill]

Highlight reel skill? He's had two highlight goals in 3 years. I think one of the biggest problems most of us have is the fact that elite skill is not noticeable in his game. I'm not really sure where you're seeing it

Yes, that's why I specifically used the phrase "FLASHES of highlight reel skill." You saw the two goals at least, so you know where I saw it. You can't do that once if you don't have the SKILL to do it, never mind TWICE, so the skill is there. It's a matter of seeing if it will ever be more than flashed.

 

[McRanger92]

We can only hope. Roope's hands and skating are in a different tier to Chytil's.

I have confidence in Chytil's skills and makeup that he will continue to improve. Im sure people around the league were expecting a big breakout after last year's playoffs. He had his best regular season by a mile last year and I haven't lost faith in him after 1 playoff series where everyone played poorly.

 

[GoAwayPanarin]

Panarin makes 11.6.

He shouldn't "need" to play with anyone. He should be capable of producing with out someone to carry the water for him.

Plus a digger won't help him at this point because he'll just end up turning the puck over before anything even has a chance to materialize. He is always going to be the primary carrier on his line and he's become so easy to contain because he refuses to do anything with the puck other than hold on to it, curl up and eventually get snuffed out.

Booting him and using the money on good "diggers" and playing them together would be a better strategy.

 

[Fitzy]

The main question that remains to be answered regarding a lot of these proposed major moves is whether Drury firing GG means he wants to give the current group one last season to prove themselves under different leadership.

A lot of the minor reforms like Goodrow out may be all that we see. Then if the team disappoints again you've possibly got an offseason where we say farewell to Trouba, Panarin, and even possibly Shesty, Laf, Kreider- only Fox, Miller, and Zibanejad are off the table for me.

 

[bhamill]

I have confidence in Chytil's skills and makeup that he will continue to improve. Im sure people around the league were expecting a big breakout after last year's playoffs. He had his best regular season by a mile last year and I haven't lost faith in him after 1 playoff series where everyone played poorly.

Please. If he's a NYR, he must break out by his 3rd year in the league, no matter how young he is, or he's a bust.

 

[Machinehead]

What are Panarin's "chance retention" numbers like in the playoffs ? Regular season numbers mean shit if he can't earn some of his 11.6 million in real games .

I'd also be interested in his reg season chance retention #'s less the chances that are given to our opposition from his blind cross ice or hearing footsteps 2 on 1 or breakaway , passes on Shesty !!!

Panarin had the second best 5v5 chance generation on the team against the Devils.

He's becoming a scapegoat for something the entire team is absolutely terrible at.

Also, his defensive analytics are well above average so his dumb passes aren't leading to as many chances against as we think.

He does a lot of dumb things, but again, the whole team is an absolute trainwreck at 5v5 offense.

 

[McRanger92]

Please. If he's a NYR, he must break out by his 3rd year in the league, no matter how young he is, or he's a bust.

Impatient fanbase remains impatient. NYR fans are buying too much into media hype around the team and rebuild. The Letter was sent 5 years ago and we already have 2 100 point seasons and an ECF appearance since. Why are the Rangers graded on such a harsh curve when half the league is in a massive playoff or Cup drought?

This Tampa Bay Lighting team that won 2 and appeared in 3 straight Finals first appeared in a Stanley Cup in 2015 lol, and it still took them an additional 5 years (missing the playoffs once and suffering the biggest 1st round upset in NHL history) to get over the hump. The idea that Rangers "need" to win in the next 2 years is a joke with the amount of young and under control talent on the NHL roster and in the minors. We were sold sustained success by the organization, and to me it looks like we are very much on track for that.