Speculation: Roster Building Thread - Part XXXIV

[mas0764]

What is my unrealistic bias about the team exactly?

Being unwilling to listen to any trades about your favorite veterans?

I mention that it would be smart to listen on offers for Kreider, who clearly is having a career year at age 30-31, and you spazz out and call it "magic beans."

What if someone makes a godfather offer? 50 goal seasons sometimes have that affect on teams.

Because my opinion is that they are a really freaking good team that has responded to every challenge and gotten better as the year has gone on.

And I have my own opinion that is met with constant scorn from you. What's the difference?

I'm also talking about AFTER the season, so it won't interfere with our precious Cup run while Panarin, Zibanejad and Kreider are at their current ages. Instead, I'm talking about dealing age 31-32 Kreider. A player approaching decline.

Youve been trying to re-write history all year based on hypothetical Kreider & Buchnevich trades so you can say "I told you so" when (and if) the Rangers dont win a Cup.

Saying we should have taken a different path isn't "re-writing" history. It's saying we made bad choices.

Which is my opinion.

You and I both cant predict the future, but the object of competitive sports is to, you know, actually try to win, not rebuild forever.

We wouldn't be rebuilding anymore if we had done any of the things I was advocating for.

Instead, we march on in search of long term center solutions.

 

[effen]

If you traded Kreider you'd need a new 3rd line LW.

 

[mas0764]

If you traded Kreider you'd need a new 3rd line LW.

And I'll reiterate that I'm not saying trade Kreider for Barrett Hayton (though I would be very interested in seeing if I could acquire Hayton this summer).

But maybe someone wants to give you a top young ELC center AND an established middle six winger AND a first round pick?

Why not? 50 goal scorers don't command hauls?

 

[JimmyG89]

So, they've got 13.5M in cap space with the cap going up 1M. That number is their current space + Brodzinski being in the minors (which should be the goal).

If Copp is at 5.5M, that leaves 8M for the rest of the roster. Blais and Kakko are the only other RFAs that are coming back. Blais is probably at his same number (1.5M). Kakko gets the Chytil extension (2.3M)? Could he get the Lindgren deal (3x3)? Anything longer that probably gets closer to Copp since his agent is going to expect increased production. I'm going with the Chytil deal if I can because after the rest of the deals needed, it is what keeps the rest of the roster the same.

You've then got 11 forwards signed, 6 defenders, and 1 goalie

Leaves 4.2M left for the rest of the roster. So you need 2 forwards, a goalie, and an extra defender. Jones/Nils/Robertson can be the 7th defender on the roster (not necessarily on the depth chart). Goalie will be a UFA that is going to be around 1M. So 2.2M for two forwards. Motte becomes too much I think. Rooney can probably come back at his same number (750K).

If Drury can just get rid of Nemeth and his cap hit entirely, it makes the offseason much easier to build a roster. It is his worst move. If there is a team willing to take him on, I'd attach what is needed to him. An extra 2.5M in cap space would allow them to have some space in season and possibly bring someone like Motte back.

So the lineup is this:

Kreider-Zibanejad-Kakko
Panarin-Copp-XXXX
Lafreniere-Chytil-Goodrow
Blais-Rooney/(~1M UFA)-Reaves/Hunt

Kakko fills one RW slot. Goodrow fills another at this point, probably on the 3rd line. Blais on the 4th line makes sense. Give him chance to comeback and not be overworked. Hunt, for all his issues being on the 2nd line at times, has earned a spot on this team and is on a great deal. Him on the 4th line is more ideal.

The 2RW slot is going to be where someone is needed. Is Kravtsov on the team next year? Can any other young guy fill that role? Without Nemeth, you do have a little extra wiggle room. Maybe Vatrano would re-sign for less than his current number.

Lindgren-Fox
Miller-Trouba
Robertson/Jones-Schneider/Lundkvist
7th D (vet ~1M)

Shesterkin
UFA (~1M)

 

[tomobson]

Listening to trade offers on Krieder is about all Drury can do at the moment. There is really no indication that he's interesting in playing anywhere else. Maybe Boston but that teams window is shutting while ours is just opening. I think Trouba can be persuaded into moving but it won't be easy either. Trading these players won't bring in a haul like some people think because there would be no teams bidding up for these players until their NMC ends. The rangers won't be in a position of power in these trades with only one or at most two teams that are even options. These trades will just open up cap space and can't really be relied on to bring much NHL talent back because every other team knows why the rangers would want to move on from those players.

 

[Chalfdiggity3]

So the lineup is this:

Kreider-Zibanejad-Kakko
Panarin-Copp-XXXX
Lafreniere-Chytil-Goodrow
Blais-Rooney/(~1M UFA)-Reaves/Hunt

Kakko fills one RW slot. Goodrow fills another at this point, probably on the 3rd line. Blais on the 4th line makes sense. Give him chance to comeback and not be overworked. Hunt, for all his issues being on the 2nd line at times, has earned a spot on this team and is on a great deal. Him on the 4th line is more ideal.

The 2RW slot is going to be where someone is needed. Is Kravtsov on the team next year? Can any other young guy fill that role? Without Nemeth, you do have a little extra wiggle room. Maybe Vatrano would re-sign for less than his current number.

Lindgren-Fox
Miller-Trouba
Robertson/Jones-Schneider/Lundkvist
7th D (vet ~1M)

Shesterkin
UFA (~1M)

I honestly dont see why we are trying to keep rooney in this situation. I like the guy but Johnny B is less expensive, and has earned the right to stay here. He will be less money.

Blais can play 2nd line if kept. No need to keep him on the 4th. Let the 4th be Hunt, Jonny B, Reeves. Or just keep Vatrano and trade Blais.

 

[GoAwayPanarin]

Rooney sucks and we should let him walk.

He shouldn't play this season even when everyone is healthy.

 

[duhmetreE]

Rooney sucks and we should let him walk.

He shouldn't play this season even when everyone is healthy.

Yeah, I prefer Brodz tbh

but we'll get Rooney. Hopefully he looks like he did to start the year

 

[leetch99]

#2 in the division would be great, but honestly I hope we don't win it. I think the WC#1 will be tougher than Pittsburgh.

Yup....I agree ...both the Bruins/Leafs would be tougher first round opps...even potentially the Caps could be in play if we finished first OA and Caps were 8th in conference .....never know....

 

[GoAwayPanarin]

I don't fear Boston, Toronto and especially Washington as much as some of you do.

Toronto SHOULD be feared, but I can't take them seriously until they do something in the playoffs. I guess Florida kind of falls into that bucket too, but I like their make up MUCH more than I do Toronto's.

Washington is as much of a one and done as any team has ever been.

 

[TominNC]

True, but some people don't care about wasting all their assets on unrealistic Cup chases as long as they get to see an extra playoff round right now.

How many years do you want to wait

 

[DanielBrassard]

I wouldn't pay Rooney more than what Jonny B is getting paid. We need to save cap space on the margins and that's one area we definitely should. Same goes for Reaves as much as that might be controversial.

 

[bl02]

All fair in wanting Brod over Rooney especially the way he's been working his butt off but If the coach feels Rooney is completely 100 percent I have a hard time believing he is not getting his 4C spot back.

 

[mas0764]

How many years do you want to wait

My plan would have sacrificed Kreider for assets, Tony DeAngelo before he imploded for assets, Buch for assets, and Strome for assets, and I'd probably be done.

Assuming deals that were reported by Edge existed, or substantially similar did, I would now be down Kreider, DeAngelo, Buch/Blais, and Strome, but I'd be up Jason Robertson, Rasmus Kupari, two or more firsts, and whatever I got from DeAngelo, which, before he imploded, was probably at least another first and a decent prospect.

And I would have liquidated a ton of that capital in 2020 to move up from the latter first to get Lundell instead of Schneider.

My long term assets would form a skeleton roster looking like:

Panarin Zibanejad Kakko
Lafreniere Lundell Kravtsov
Robertson Kupari Chytil
fourth line

Lindgren Fox
Miller Trouba
Robertson Nils
Jones

It would be full speed ahead from here on out. I think that roster would be a playoff team right now. It wouldn't be the second seed in the Atlantic, but it would be a wildcard team I think. It might have Kupari in the minors, Lundell on the third line, still might have traded picks for Copp, Motte, Vatrano, etc, to give the roster some depth and experience.

And next year watch the F out.

 

[leetch99]

So, they've got 13.5M in cap space with the cap going up 1M. That number is their current space + Brodzinski being in the minors (which should be the goal).

If Copp is at 5.5M, that leaves 8M for the rest of the roster. Blais and Kakko are the only other RFAs that are coming back. Blais is probably at his same number (1.5M). Kakko gets the Chytil extension (2.3M)? Could he get the Lindgren deal (3x3)? Anything longer that probably gets closer to Copp since his agent is going to expect increased production. I'm going with the Chytil deal if I can because after the rest of the deals needed, it is what keeps the rest of the roster the same.

You've then got 11 forwards signed, 6 defenders, and 1 goalie

Leaves 4.2M left for the rest of the roster. So you need 2 forwards, a goalie, and an extra defender. Jones/Nils/Robertson can be the 7th defender on the roster (not necessarily on the depth chart). Goalie will be a UFA that is going to be around 1M. So 2.2M for two forwards. Motte becomes too much I think. Rooney can probably come back at his same number (750K).

If Drury can just get rid of Nemeth and his cap hit entirely, it makes the offseason much easier to build a roster. It is his worst move. If there is a team willing to take him on, I'd attach what is needed to him. An extra 2.5M in cap space would allow them to have some space in season and possibly bring someone like Motte back.

Gauthier will be back with a slight raise ...still around 800,000.00 knows the team and system & big and fast...he is a lock for 60 games for sure . You won't get much more out of an unknown for that kind of money with his wheels and size......and he still has time.....

 

[Taluss]

So the lineup is this:

Kreider-Zibanejad-Kakko
Panarin-Copp-XXXX
Lafreniere-Chytil-Goodrow
Blais-Rooney/(~1M UFA)-Reaves/Hunt

Kakko fills one RW slot. Goodrow fills another at this point, probably on the 3rd line. Blais on the 4th line makes sense. Give him chance to comeback and not be overworked. Hunt, for all his issues being on the 2nd line at times, has earned a spot on this team and is on a great deal. Him on the 4th line is more ideal.

The 2RW slot is going to be where someone is needed. Is Kravtsov on the team next year? Can any other young guy fill that role? Without Nemeth, you do have a little extra wiggle room. Maybe Vatrano would re-sign for less than his current number.

Lindgren-Fox
Miller-Trouba
Robertson/Jones-Schneider/Lundkvist
7th D (vet ~1M)

Shesterkin
UFA (~1M)

I like those lines. Hopefully Krav can fill that 2nd line role if he comes back.

Only nitpick is if possible I’d like to keep at least 1 of Motte or Vatrano to replace someone on they 4th line.

 

[mas0764]

So the lineup is this:

Kreider-Zibanejad-Kakko
Panarin-Copp-XXXX
Lafreniere-Chytil-Goodrow
Blais-Rooney/(~1M UFA)-Reaves/Hunt

Kakko fills one RW slot. Goodrow fills another at this point, probably on the 3rd line. Blais on the 4th line makes sense. Give him chance to comeback and not be overworked. Hunt, for all his issues being on the 2nd line at times, has earned a spot on this team and is on a great deal. Him on the 4th line is more ideal.

The 2RW slot is going to be where someone is needed. Is Kravtsov on the team next year? Can any other young guy fill that role? Without Nemeth, you do have a little extra wiggle room. Maybe Vatrano would re-sign for less than his current number.

Lindgren-Fox
Miller-Trouba
Robertson/Jones-Schneider/Lundkvist
7th D (vet ~1M)

Shesterkin
UFA (~1M)

Love it, bring back Kravtsov and let's do it.

 

[Doctyl]

Read on the Jets boards he turned down 4m x 5 years from Winnipeg.

Somethings rotten in Winnipeg. City isn’t that desirable and lots of guys seem to not want to play for that team over the past few years.

 

[Alluckks]

I think we see Copp come back using a mold of the Goodrow contract. Extra years added on, but by the time the player is on the decline the cap should be making bigger jumps each season again.

6 years 4.66 per year (28 mil total), 15 team no trade list

 

[RangerBoy]

Arthur Staple had Ken Wiebe from Winnipeg on his podcast. Wiebe brought up Zach Hyman and Jared McCann as two comparables to Copp. Hyman got a crazy deal. 7 years/$5.5M. McCann got 5 times 5. Copp wants some security. He has taken short term deals in Winnipeg. Wiebe said maybe Copp will take 5 years. Copp wants to win. The McCann deal works. Wiebe loves Copp.

They brought up Mark Schiefele. Wiebe said something about Lafreniere being in the deal. Winnipeg would want someone like Lafreniere in the deal. He isn't sure if Winnipeg will move the player. If the player is moved, Scheifele would prefer going to team where he is the #1 center and not sharing the spot with another player. PLD is now there. Wiebe brought up the Flyers as a better spot for Scheifele where he can be the #1 center. He doesn't like the 1A and 1B center thing. The Jets like Provorov and Konecky. When Trouba was holding out in 2017, Winnipeg wanted Provorov for Trouba. I remember that. Both of those players will be available this summer. Sanheim too. Winnipeg isn't trading the player for a pick and a couple of prospects.

 

[OTGHockey]

Gauthier will be back with a slight raise ...still around 800,000.00 knows the team and system & big and fast...he is a lock for 60 games for sure . You won't get much more out of an unknown for that kind of money with his wheels and size......and he still has time.....

He may be back, though I wouldn't be surprised if the Rangers don't qualify him. He's big and fast, and has strength on the puck...but his shot and hands appear to not be good enough for the NHL level. He's not really been a great passer of the puck either, so when you are making plays and you can't score, and you aren't better than guys like Dryden Hunt from a puck retrieval and defensive side, then you're going to be sitting on the sidelines.

It's easy to get drawn by his size, strength and skating...but if he can't score, then he doesn't really provide much to the line-up.

 

[OTGHockey]

I think we see Copp come back using a mold of the Goodrow contract. Extra years added on, but by the time the player is on the decline the cap should be making bigger jumps each season again.

6 years 4.66 per year (28 mil total), 15 team no trade list

This seems in the ballpark (I read somewhere he turned down $4Mx5 with the Jets. I still think it's early to determine whether he should be back though. At the moment he's probably a very good 3rd line center, and a weaker 2nd line center. Playing with Panarin could certainly change that dynamic, but we'll have to wait and see.

Given the Rangers are going to be a lot more constrained this year and next, with Kakko, Blais (2022) and Lafreniere, Miller (2023) all coming off contracts, there's not as much room to maneuver. There's also the risk of an offer sheet for some of these young guys if the Rangers don't get the contracts in order before they hit RFA status, which might make it difficult to keep them all around.

 

[Alluckks]

CapFriendly has us at 11.7 for next year

Blais -1.5
Kakko -2.3
Copp -4.66
Robertson/Jones -.8/.925

Brodzinski +.76
Nemeth +2.5

4.775 remaining for 2 forwards and a backup goalie

We would have the ammo to make a trade for someone like Hoglander (.9 cap hit), Chychrun with Lindgren going out (1.6 increase in cap hit), then just sign a vet bottom 6 forward and vet backup goalie for around 1 mil each

Kreider Zib Laf
Panarin Copp Kakko
Hog Chytil Blais
Vet Goodrow Reaves
Hunt

Chychrun Fox
Miller Trouba
Jones Schneider
Robertson

Igor
Vet

 

[The Crypto Guy]

This is why is vital to get our FREE and CHEAP asset back and playing for his 1M salary...Kravstov.

 

[Alluckks]

Kravstov is done here, his best use to us will be as a secondary piece in a trade, kid is a loser