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Speculation: Roster Building Thread: Part XXI

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If Gorts is trading Zucc, Hayes and Kreider I wonder if one or more of those go for just prospects and not picks... or maybe a really good prospect and a 2020 pick (not 1st)

I seem to remember Gorton saying something about not having all the kids hit RFA/UFA at exactly the same time
 
One Winged Angel said:
I could see that, I think you explained that pretty well. If that’s the case, then a trade down would be ideal. I do agree that you don’t see a lot of them drafted in the first round for a reason, but I feel like part that is that it’s not nearly as often that you end up needing a goaltender as you do a center, wing or defender and there are more positions to fill.

I also think part of that is due to goaltender values being the toughest to gauge. You don’t see big goaltender trades often and more often than not, the returns on them are either underwhelming or less than expected by fans. Starting goaltenders are hard to find and that’s not even talking about a legitimate franchise goaltender, so once you find either, you’re most likely set for a long time on top of having only 2 positions available per team.
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Right. I mean, I love goalies. I'm a soccer goalie and have been for 25+ years. My two favorite Rangers are Richter and Henke. I just tend to "devalue" the position when it comes to obtaining those players, because I think you can find awesome ones without burning a top pick. Everyone killed the Lindbom pick--I would have been okay with him in the third or very happy if he fell to the fourth. Third or fourth would be good value. Second seemed too much to me.

Like they could have had Jakub Skarek, who is doing very well in Liiga and was regarded as equal to or better than Lindbom by most pundits, in the third round. I understand if their scouts preferred Lindbom, but unless it was by a substantial margin, it just seems like the better approach would have been to go and pick Wilde, Drury, McLeod, Perunovich, Ishakov, Akil Thomas, Groulx, Eriksson, etc., etc. Like those guys have some real upside, and the system would be better with one of them plus Skarek than Lindbom plus Keane (IMO anyway). Or even better, one of those other guys plus Keane and no goalie until later. LOL.
 
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Man, I can't help but think Buffalo would be ALL OVER adding Kreider or Hayes. (3) possible 1st's this year. For sure they have (4) 1st's in the next 2 years. Eichel and Skinner are tearing apart the league. They have money coming off the books in Moulson and Pominville at years end. After next season they have Scandella, Bogosian, Sheary and Sobotka up for contracts. That's about $10m coming off the books this year and $16m next year. Some of that will go to some of their RFA's but not all.

Reinhart has taken a big step this year.

Okposo looks to be their anchor. 4 more years @ $6m and he has 17 points so far this year. He's another guy with concussion issues.
 
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Webster said:
Hayes, Zucc and McQuaid to Toronto for Nylander? :thumbu:
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For 3 UFA's...?

Ok.

61EpV7so1hL._AC_SX215_.jpg
 
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nyr2k2 said:
Right. I mean, I love goalies. I'm a soccer goalie and have been for 25+ years. My two favorite Rangers are Richter and Henke. I just tend to "devalue" the position when it comes to obtaining those players, because I think you can find awesome ones without burning a top pick. Everyone killed the Lindbom pick--I would have been okay with him in the third or very happy if he fell to the fourth. Third or fourth would be good value. Second seemed too much to me.

Like they could have had Jakub Skarek, who is doing very well in Liiga and was regarded as equal to or better than Lindbom by most pundits, in the third round. I understand if their scouts preferred Lindbom, but unless it was by a substantial margin, it just seems like the better approach would have been to go and pick Wilde, Drury, McLeod, Perunovich, Ishakov, Akil Thomas, Groulx, Eriksson, etc., etc. Like those guys have some real upside, and the system would be better with one of them plus Skarek than Lindbom plus Keane (IMO anyway). Or even better, one of those other guys plus Keane and no goalie until later. LOL.
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I hear you there, I wanted Wilde there. I was hoping we were gonna take him there. I understand why he slipped, when I talked with Sam Cosentino, he said it was his hockey sense that people were scared about. He’d make plays that would blow your mind and then others he’d have brain farts that would leave you asking how the hell he got to that level.

Groulx, I think will be a real good and solid, but not spectacular player. He does the little things right and has some talent. Wouldn’t be surprised if he ends up being a real good middle-6 guy. I heard someone mention Antoine Vermette as a comparable. Not a bad pick there.

Scouts were all over the place with Thomas. I couldn’t get one consistent report on him. Some love his athleticism and think it can translate, others worry about a lack of overall talent and think that his athleticism won’t make up for that at the next level.
 
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Kupo said:
Can I be totally honest? I did too. I thought he was an UFA when we signed him. Surprised Ottawa didn't bring him back or at least try and move him for something...? Weird.
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It's not uncommon for that to happen with arbitration eligible, lower-tier players I wouldn't be surprised if he isn't qualified this summer either.
 
SA16 said:
He piggy backed off his linemates yet he was the one who led the team in points? He also had almost 25% of his ice time with Aaron Voros. His most common linemate was Dubinsky who put up 41 points.

The year before his most common linemates in CBJ were Michael Peca (34 pts in 65 games), Jason Chimera (31 pts), Rick Nash, and Jiri Novotny (22 pts in 65 games).

His linemates, outside of Nash, were far inferior players.

Zherdev is easily the most misunderstood Ranger since the lockout. Even more than Rick Nash I would say. And letting him go for nothing is among the worst decisions the organization has made.
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I would've agreed with your conclusion if Zherdev had post-Rangers success elsewhere. Instead, soon after he couldn't even make any NHL roster and a few years later - not even KHL's.
 
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One Winged Angel said:
I hear you there, I wanted Wilde there. I was hoping we were gonna take him there. I understand why he slipped, when I talked with Sam Cosentino, he said it was his hockey sense that people were scared about. He’d make plays that would blow your mind and then others he’d have brain farts that would leave you asking how the hell he got to that level.

Groulx, I think will be a real good and solid, but not spectacular player. He does the little things right and has some talent. Wouldn’t be surprised if he ends up being a real good middle-6 guy. I heard someone mention Antoine Vermette as a comparable. Not a bad pick there.

Scouts were all over the place with Thomas. I couldn’t get one consistent report on him. Some love his athleticism and think it can translate, others worry about a lack of overall talent and think that his athleticism won’t make up for that at the next level.
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I went into last season thinking Thomas would be top 10. The more I watched him, the worse it got. What was worse is he was consistently talked up nearly every game. I didn't see it by the end of the season.
 
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offdacrossbar said:
rebuilding a team via the draft sounds sexy. do we have 5 years of this in the tank ?

we trade away the entire "core" and hope the draft rebuilds us.

and all the while relying on this scouting staff to drive the bus.

dunno.
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Yeah, but there are other variables. How old would that core be in 5 years? Would keeping the core together just keep you in the dreaded middle and not allow for better chances in the draft? Both sides have pros and cons.
 
Edge said:
The reality is that there's a big drop off when you get outside the top 15-20 in most drafts, and the second rounds aren't quite the gold mines they used to be.
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One of the many reasons I detested the "Who cares about draft picks? The draft is just a crapshoot anyway" lines of justifications when discussing all of the draft picks that Sather traded away.
 
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kovazub94 said:
I would've agreed with your conclusion if Zherdev had post-Rangers success elsewhere. Instead, soon after he couldn't even make any NHL roster and a few years later - not even KHL's.
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We always seem to think we know more than the coaches and GM's etc.

They watch these guys every day... not just with season tickets or on TV... they see them in practice and behind the scenes and when they don't resign guys that we like we complain. In the end IF they're proven right we never talk about that.

I wanted to keep Z too... but in that instance the NYR brass knew better
 
SA16 said:
Honestly Howden shouldn't have even made the team in the first place. He was completely invisible in the preseason and looking at his numbers now they were awful as well (1 goal on 1 shot in 3 games with 21 shot attempts for to 44 against). He needs time in the AHL player against lesser competition. I don't think it's the same for Chytil because he shows far more flashes of skill with the puck and he already put in 46 successful AHL games last year.
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They all should have went to Hartford and dominated. Didn’t think anybody was ready yet. Plus the camaraderie factor is nice to build in.
 
RGY said:
Zucc has to asap at this point.
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Nah...his comments about how sad he is having to leave his beloved Rangers he considers his home, melted Gorton's heart. He just can't trade him and gives him a new deal ;)
 
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