Speculation: Roster Building Thread: Part XVII - Want some, get some

[RangerBoy]

I think he's a very good player that compliments his linemates, possesses a very unique set of skills and is a legit top 6 LW. I didn't say he was impossible to replace but it won't be easy. Who do the Rangers have in the pipeline to take his place when they trade him in February?

The Rangers are not playing for just this season.

Kreider has f***ing disappeared. He is a non-factor and you’re worried about who will replace him. He does nothing. His game has fallen apart in 2019. He has 13 goals in 68 games in 2019. One of those goals was an empty net goal.

The Rangers have traded away so many players in the last 20 plus months without a replacement in the pipeline. Why would a Kreider trade be any different?

 

[Pawnee Rangers]

The Rangers are not playing for just this season.

Kreider has ****ing disappeared. He is a non-factor and you’re worried about who will replace him. He does nothing. His game has fallen apart in 2019. He has 13 goals in 68 games in 2019. One of those goals was an empty net goal.

The Rangers have traded away so many players in the last 20 plus months without a replacement in the pipeline. Why would a Kreider trade be any different?

Because at some point you have to stop trading and start constructing the right team. They just gave out big money to Panarin and Trouba. Zib is another year older. They have a ton of money coming off the books within two years. How many more years do you think they settle for not making the playoffs? I get you think you know best, that's cool. There's more than one perspective though. Then again you were bitching when the signed Panarin and traded for Trouba, so.

 

[pld459666]

The net-front presence he brings every nights. Especially on the PP. However, that's probably the most easily-repeatable skill. He's at his best when he's skating around like a wrecking ball, winning battles, forcing the play with his speed. It has always seemed like he'll go through prolonged stretches where he's not really causing any disruption with his speed or his size. And in turn, he's not exactly effective.

I like Kreider and would gladly keep him at the right price. But IMO, he's one of the streakiest players we've had in recent memory.

That's a false statement.

If it was easily repeatable, we would have more than two guys that do it.

Right now its Kreider and Lemieux and that's it.

It take a willingness and desire to battle it out in front of the goalie night in and night out.

We do not appear to have a team that's willing to pay the price every night, not sure who on this team outside of the guys mentioned are going to do what Kreider does in front of the net

 

[Mikos87]

IMO you move Kreider and not consider re-signing him at all.

The Rangers have done very well in trades, and moving Kreider will help the for years down the line.

Think about the Hayes trade tree. If you net it out, you got Brendan Lemeuix, and Jacob Trouba for Neal Pionk and 25 games of Hayes.

That's a bloody steal.

Depending on the dance partner Kreider will get you a late first and a B- prospect, or a B+ prospect and a 2nd.

If the Rangers could turn Chris into a future 4th line winger that can play next September and a 1st, you are in a great position to backfill through youth or UFA with assets.

 

[Mikos87]

Look I dont have a problem with a man making money. Lord knows that's what most of us on here spend our professions doing, I have zero problems seeing another man get paid.

That said, if you're paying go Kreider, you're paying a guy who only shows up to work with his hard hat on just part of the time.

You don't blow a good chunk of your budget on a low compete guy. He'll get his retirement deal elsewhere.

To me, a winning team has guys that fulfill their roles on a consistently reliable basis. That's where I would put my dollars.

 

[Trxjw]

I've been saying it forever. It doesn't get talked about enough. Remove Kreider from the top 6 and they're too one dimensional. They lose size and speed, not a great combo especially come playoff time.

Well it certainly seems like the Rangers are exploring options to find a guy who brings at least some of that back into the fold. Puljujarvi is hardly a Kreider clone, but he does bring size and good straight-ahead speed to the top-six -- assuming he reaches that level. I think Julien Gauthier's name was bandied about a couple months ago as a player who the Rangers were asking about. I think the Rangers know they need to address that once Kreider is gone, but instead of someone like Tuch who is established, I would guess that they look for someone who is ready to take the next step forward on a new team. Maybe a guy from the 15 or 16 draft class who can't quite break into his current club or who has fallen out of favor as a top-six option.

 

[True Blue]

One more bloody draft to add another plethora of skill into the already smoking pipeline. Then the upgrade game shall begin in the earnest. Fill the holes and upgrade the mediocre points like Skjei... Not exactly rocket science. Totally agree that the final product needs more NA presence. But straighten out the talent issue first and deal from strength btw.

Not seeing exactly eye to eye here regarding Skje, but overall yeah....that is about the size of it.

 

[Deleted member 23124]

Yeah I agree, me neither.

Just think its a move that could be hard to defend, if we are somewhat in a running for a PO spot and then we deal a RFA -- i.e. a player that we don't even risk losing -- at the deadline for futures. So I think he would deal Kreider even if we are in a PO hunt. But lets say we are in the PO race up say 2-3 pts and then we deal Strome for futures at the deadline and lose 10 straight -- it wouldn't look good on Gorton...

However if we are 6-8 pts out of it, it could be a different story. There will be so many teams in the running, that it would take a miracle to gain 6-8 pts on not only 1-2 teams, but like 6-7 teams.

I dont' think Gorts is worried about how he'll look ... I believe they'll still to "the plan" no matter where we are come deadline day. This is just not a playoff team....only Bettman's Parity Party (read "mediocre teams almost everywhere) would put us look like one.

 

[Edge]

Well it certainly seems like the Rangers are exploring options to find a guy who brings at least some of that back into the fold. Puljujarvi is hardly a Kreider clone, but he does bring size and good straight-ahead speed to the top-six -- assuming he reaches that level. I think Julien Gauthier's name was bandied about a couple months ago as a player who the Rangers were asking about. I think the Rangers know they need to address that once Kreider is gone, but instead of someone like Tuch who is established, I would guess that they look for someone who is ready to take the next step forward on a new team. Maybe a guy from the 15 or 16 draft class who can't quite break into his current club or who has fallen out of favor as a top-six option.

This echoes something I said in draft thread, but if the Rangers are picking around the 8-12 spot, Holloway is a guy who could be the best guy on the board and fit an organizational need.

 

[Pawnee Rangers]

Well it certainly seems like the Rangers are exploring options to find a guy who brings at least some of that back into the fold. Puljujarvi is hardly a Kreider clone, but he does bring size and good straight-ahead speed to the top-six -- assuming he reaches that level. I think Julien Gauthier's name was bandied about a couple months ago as a player who the Rangers were asking about. I think the Rangers know they need to address that once Kreider is gone, but instead of someone like Tuch who is established, I would guess that they look for someone who is ready to take the next step forward on a new team. Maybe a guy from the 15 or 16 draft class who can't quite break into his current club or who has fallen out of favor as a top-six option.

And that's totally reasonable, although I'd prefer it if they stayed away from Puljuarvi. My point is, don't trade him for the 20th pick in next year's draft. Identify the player you want and go get him.

 

[Pawnee Rangers]

IMO you move Kreider and not consider re-signing him at all.

The Rangers have done very well in trades, and moving Kreider will help the for years down the line.

Think about the Hayes trade tree. If you net it out, you got Brendan Lemeuix, and Jacob Trouba for Neal Pionk and 25 games of Hayes.

That's a bloody steal.

Depending on the dance partner Kreider will get you a late first and a B- prospect, or a B+ prospect and a 2nd.

If the Rangers could turn Chris into a future 4th line winger that can play next September and a 1st, you are in a great position to backfill through youth or UFA with assets.

So a kid that's maybe three years out and a 3rd/4th line player? Unless they're worried he's gonna walk at the end of the year, that's not a good return and you still have no one outside of Panarin to play LW in the top 6 next year.

 

[Trxjw]

And that's totally reasonable, although I'd prefer it if they stayed away from Puljuarvi. My point is, don't trade him for the 20th pick in next year's draft. Identify the player you want and go get him.

Well you gotta look at the long-game at this point. Kreider isn't likely to net you that player directly, but the pieces you get for him may give you the assets needed to find the guy you do want. Either by freeing up someone you previously didn't want to move, or by giving you pieces someone else wants. So while a 1st and a prospect from Boston isn't likely to get you a Kreider, it may give you the extra pick you need to move up from 8 to get a guy at 5 or that you can move straight across for a RFA you think will be available at the draft.

 

[nyr2k2]

That's a false statement.

If it was easily repeatable, we would have more than two guys that do it.

Right now its Kreider and Lemieux and that's it.

It take a willingness and desire to battle it out in front of the goalie night in and night out.

We do not appear to have a team that's willing to pay the price every night, not sure who on this team outside of the guys mentioned are going to do what Kreider does in front of the net

I didn't mean to imply it's easy, but it's easily repeatable for him--particularly because we make him park it there on the PP all the time. I understand he takes a beating in doing it and it's often a thankless task. Point is, while he seems to struggle to use his speed and his strength to consistently wreak havoc, he's always able to make an impact in front of the crease. Again, not easy in general; just something he has no problem doing every night.

 

[Pawnee Rangers]

Well you gotta look at the long-game at this point. Kreider isn't likely to net you that player directly, but the pieces you get for him may give you the assets needed to find the guy you do want. Either by freeing up someone you previously didn't want to move, or by giving you pieces someone else wants. So while a 1st and a prospect from Boston isn't likely to get you a Kreider, it may give you the extra pick you need to move up from 8 to get a guy at 5 or that you can move straight across for a RFA you think will be available at the draft.

I'd rather them overpay for "the" guy then settle for a maybe at this stage of the game. If moving Kreider ultimately lands you in the top 5, great. I'd be surprised but who knows.

 

[Trxjw]

This echoes something I said in draft thread, but if the Rangers are picking around the 8-12 spot, Holloway is a guy who could be the best guy on the board and fit an organizational need.

He'll certainly have a lot of stat watchers moaning and groaning, but there's a really enticing set of tools there. Certainly not a sexy pick or the cherry to top off a rebuild but he's a guy you can easily see having a very long and productive NHL career.

 

[RangersFan1994]

Well it certainly seems like the Rangers are exploring options to find a guy who brings at least some of that back into the fold. Puljujarvi is hardly a Kreider clone, but he does bring size and good straight-ahead speed to the top-six -- assuming he reaches that level. I think Julien Gauthier's name was bandied about a couple months ago as a player who the Rangers were asking about. I think the Rangers know they need to address that once Kreider is gone, but instead of someone like Tuch who is established, I would guess that they look for someone who is ready to take the next step forward on a new team. Maybe a guy from the 15 or 16 draft class who can't quite break into his current club or who has fallen out of favor as a top-six option.

too bad the Wild suck, Greenway would be a good pickup, played for Quinn and is big, skill and some has size.

 

[NickyLongLegz]

I hope we can pull a Chicago and barely miss the playoffs this year yet still win the lottery like they did last year. That would be pretty cool.

 

[Ola]

I dont' think Gorts is worried about how he'll look ... I believe they'll still to "the plan" no matter where we are come deadline day. This is just not a playoff team....only Bettman's Parity Party (read "mediocre teams almost everywhere) would put us look like one.

I don’t think this realistic.

Like sure we can easily be out of the POs by a wide margin at the deadline which could result in Strome gout for futures. But to expect Gorton to deal deal a RFA for futures if the team is in a PO spot is a bigger deal than you make it out to be — IMO.

 

[Brooklyn Rangers Fan]

Why is Vegas trading Tuch? Why are the Rangers trading Deangelo?

Because we have a glut of smallish, offensive RHD and they could use one. Whereas we are light on big, strong, fast, talented wingers (especially once Kreider gets traded).

Would be a hockey deal, and likely wouldn't happen until '20-'21 at the earliest anyway.

 

[Ola]

I think DQ is making a big mistake with Brendan Smith to be honest. Smith himself does not play bad, but there is no hockey played when he is on the ice as a forward.

We almost exclusively run 4th line vs 4th line and our is what corsi just around 40% even.

A good 4th should overtake your 3rd line on a good night. We have had that many times before, a 3a/3b situation.

Just look at how extremely big the difference is between our 3rd and 4th right now. It’s a joke.

DQ don’t think that it matters, obviously, but the NHL is a 4 line league right now. Just look around the league.

 

[LokiDog]

I don’t know that I’d move ADA for Tuch. Right now I’m not of the mind to move him at all. He’s an RFA. Absolute worst case scenario is if he plays as well as he has all season and prices himself out of town we still control his rights and there will be demand for a highly productive RHD under team control. I think he is a sure bet to be re-signed and if we feel we have the depth to move him, perhaps in a package with other assets, to land a big fish that addresses a different whole that won’t be until at least 1-2 years from today.

However, Tuch is a guy I would certainly be open to acquiring. He would replace the Kreider element and has higher upside with an age and contract that fits our timeline. Tuch is a slightly more skilled Kreider who brings much of the same size and speed so if there were a way to bring him in while moving on from Kreider I would certainly be open to that. He’s also from Smithtown if I remember correctly.

 

[LokiDog]

Because we have a glut of smallish, offensive RHD and they could use one. Whereas we are light on big, strong, fast, talented wingers (especially once Kreider gets traded).

Would be a hockey deal, and likely wouldn't happen until '20-'21 at the earliest anyway.

Evidently we’re on the exact same page.

 

[Pawnee Rangers]

Because we have a glut of smallish, offensive RHD and they could use one. Whereas we are light on big, strong, fast, talented wingers (especially once Kreider gets traded).

Would be a hockey deal, and likely wouldn't happen until '20-'21 at the earliest anyway.

But is that factoring in Deangelo's next contract? Isn't Vegas in cap trouble? I don't know how much Tuch makes but I doubt salaries will be even.

 

[kovazub94]

I don’t think Columbus is moving Anderson. They invested way too much to keep him away from Vegas to bail on him. Also don’t think Columbus is going to do the Rangers any favors.

Lol, trading Buchnevich to Columbus for Anderson is doing the Rangers a favor???

 

[LokiDog]

But is that factoring in Deangelo's next contract? Isn't Vegas in cap trouble? I don't know how much Tuch makes but I doubt salaries will be even.

By the time a trade like this would realistically happen, Vegas’ cap situation will likely shift. This isn’t a move that either team makes this season IMO. If ADA continues to produce and earns a fat contract, he’s the type of player Vegas would likely move a depth player out to make room for.