Speculation: Roster Building Thread : Part XVI (Playoffs or Retool?)

[TGWL]

Regarding Adam Fox, there was no point in NYR saying we're paying less or waiting his rights to expire. He just came off a college season where just using assist, he put up over a point per game. First team all-star and voted one of the best players that season. He did this after the hype of being one of the better players in 2 straight world junior tournaments. This was his 3rd NCAA season, I think, which means his rights would have been a year later. Anything can happen in a year. Players can be moved and fall in love with a new organization. It would have been so foolish to put your foot down on only giving up a 4th round pick, eventually missing out on the player.

 

[SnowblindNYR]

Of course he'll go to Carolina. Maybe we can get another Wennberg trade and see him do f*** all. I'm conflicted about Miller but Drury doesn't do any trades of any kind of significance. I guess Tarasenko and Kane were the two exceptions.

 

[GoAwayPanarin]

Carolina is a good fit for JT and he is a good fit for Carolina.

It would help them pump the Devils even harder in the playoffs.

I’m fine with that but they need to find another deal to move Lindgren asap.

 

[McRanger92]

Dury haggling over trade protection is the correct move.
We’re not sitting in a playoff spot. We could slide down and give up a lotto pick.
A lotto pick is more valuable long term than miller.

That's debatable. This team has no intention of picking in the lottery. if they don't add JT, they are going to add something else. even if you are adding a 70 point player over the next 5 years instead of a 90-100 point player, JT is far more valuable than a draft pick. A lottery pick has a miniscule chance of ever being a top 6 C.

 

[Profet]

That's debatable. This team has no intention of picking in the lottery. if they don't add JT, they are going to add something else. even if you are adding a 70 point player over the next 5 years instead of a 90-100 point player, JT is far more valuable than a draft pick. A lottery pick has a miniscule chance of ever being a top 6 C.

Is this actually true?

I mean, other than Lias Andersson (lolz) and Alex Turcotte, every top 10 drafted center in the last decade (not counting the two most recent drafts, for obvious reasons) years has at least 100GP.

It seems pretty easy to draft a center with a top 10 pick who can play in the NHL if you aren't the Rangers.

 

[KennyWu]

Well if he goes there for Kotkaniemi and Roslovic, we move forward. But that would be another strikeout for Drury haggling over draft pick conditions.

That's like striking out instead of grounding into a double play

 

[kovazub94]

I'm not saying I expect that, I'm just going based off your crystal ball comment and why you think they'd beat NJD, FL etc.. I don't think this team will be able to match up well against Fl, NJD, Car(esp if they upgrade goalie), even with the addition to Miller. .Going back to the reg season, sure they beat NJD last time they met but almost all reg season games against FL, NJD, TB, Wash the NYR outplayed. Miller while a good player is not going to get them through that. We've seen this core and they refuse to adapt to other teams, they're stubborn and keep trying to force things and they also can't handle teams that pressure them.

What were the factors that caused the Ranger's series loss to FL? 1. Lindgren at 1LD, Trouba at 2LD, 3. Anemic 3rd line (largely due to Chytil's not being nowhere near game shape required and his replacement having zero offensive game) and 4. Fox's injury he's being playing through. IMO if these were addressed - the team would have had a very decent change to advance.

 

[Profet]

What were the factors that caused the Ranger's series loss to FL? 1. Lindgren at 1LD, Trouba at 2LD, 3. Anemic 3rd line (largely due to Chytil's not being nowhere near game shape required and his replacement having zero offensive game) and 4. Fox's injury he's being playing through. IMO if these were addressed - the team would have had a very decent change to advance.

Disagree... the #1 issue was their play 5v5... from all lines.

They were power play merchants. That doesn't work when you can't outwork your opponent to draw power plays.

 

[McRanger92]

Is this actually true?

I mean, other than Lias Andersson (lolz) and Alex Turcotte, every top 10 drafted center in the last decade (not counting the two most recent drafts, for obvious reasons) years has at least 100GP.

It seems pretty easy to draft a center with a top 10 pick who can play in the NHL if you aren't the Rangers.

100 games played doesnt make you a top 6 C. The rangers also currently hold the 13th overall pick. You are completely out to lunch if you are keeping #13 over a 90-100 point guy for the next 5 years. I know it's "Hockey's Future" but this isnt fantasyland.

 

[NYR Viper]

Of course he'll go to Carolina. Maybe we can get another Wennberg trade and see him do f*** all. I'm conflicted about Miller but Drury doesn't do any trades of any kind of significance. I guess Tarasenko and Kane were the two exceptions.

I mean, Trouba?

 

[IDvsEGO]

100 games played doesnt make you a top 6 C. The rangers also currently hold the 13th overall pick. You are completely out to lunch if you are keeping #13 over a 90-100 point guy for the next 5 years. I know it's "Hockey's Future" but this isnt fantasyland.

Except he’s not a 90-100 pt player for the next 5 years. As seen with Mika age is a thing.

 

[surlysailor]

What were the factors that caused the Ranger's series loss to FL? 1. Lindgren at 1LD, Trouba at 2LD, 3. Anemic 3rd line (largely due to Chytil's not being nowhere near game shape required and his replacement having zero offensive game) and 4. Fox's injury he's being playing through. IMO if these were addressed - the team would have had a very decent change to advance.

While those are additions by subtraction I don't think they upgraded enough. I also don't think that was the only issues. The offense and PP could no longer produce because FL would pressure the puck and NYR never adjusted to their FL PK. Panarin couldn't create any space in that series. I mean Goodrow was the leading goal scorer in that series. Yes the defense sucked but the forwards still didn't come back enough to help defend. The team defense is an issue and while it's been better lately we don't know how it will be against the upper echelon in a 7 game series.

 

[McRanger92]

Except he’s not a 90-100 pt player for the next 5 years. As seen with Mika age is a thing.

If he's a 70 point player for 5 years, it's still a no brainer. The odds of this pick becoming the platonic ideal of what people want is nonexistent unless the Rangers rip it down to the studs and take for a top 3 pick. I dont have to tell you that's not happening.

 

[Machinehead]

Of course he'll go to Carolina. Maybe we can get another Wennberg trade and see him do f*** all. I'm conflicted about Miller but Drury doesn't do any trades of any kind of significance. I guess Tarasenko and Kane were the two exceptions.

By all accounts, he tried.

If the issue was the conditions on the #1 pick, then I happen to agree with him.

I'm not handing Vancouver a lottery pick if it ends up being that for a 32 year old.

 

[B17 Apricots]

I like JT Miller. I just don't want to give the Canucks Lafreniere and/or Schneider for him. How Drury looks at that I don't know. He's balking apparently but he also apparently was pretty close to doing something a couple days ago and probably one or both of them. I can't see however just Miller if both of them went---that's two pretty high functioning 23 year olds for a guy in his early 30's and creates a hole in our defense if Schneider leaves that Mancini is going to struggle for a while to fill.

That said JT could be a leader (and more) on the ice that Mika no longer is---he can produce but also play with a real physical and nasty edge but then again he also could be a total jackass in the locker room.

My gut tells me at least as far as this season we'd be better off sticking with what we got. Bringing JT in with the idea that somehow we're going to save the season----my gut tells me with or without him we're probably not making the playoffs and even if we do we won't last very long.

I feel its pretty unlikely either one of them get included, but who knows. Drury didn't want to give up Schneider in 2022 at the deadline. The reports are that at the time he offered a 1st, Chytil and Lundkvist. Vancouver said no. That was when Miller was only making 5.25M a year with no trade protection and another year left on his deal. A few years later... Miller is now turning 32 in a few months. He has a full NMC. Miller has complete control of where he goes. The situation in Vancouver is rocky, they have zero leverage. If Drury didn't want to give up those types a few years ago, I'd be shocked if he does this time around.

But I agree that this season doesn't need to be saved. In my eyes that isn't the point in targeting Miller. If it were my way, it'd be a summer deal after the draft. We can retain our 1st this year and if we're sending one the other way it'll be a 2026 pick. But that might be a little idealistic, it seems Drury is chomping to get something done.

Like I said in my last post. I'm as big a picks/prospects guy as they come... I'm all for the retool, recoup assets... but what exactly are peoples plans for landing a 1C? They're incredibly hard to find. I've brought up Zegras in the past. I like that option, he's a budget gamble. I wouldn't count out his skill level. There's many top line players in the game today who didn't hit their top form until their mid 20s. He's had his hiccups the past year and change while dealing with injuries. I've mentioned Rossi in Minnesota. That seems like an outside chance, but there's been rumors for years that he's on the block and Guerin isn't sold on him. Maybe it's a size thing? So for that reason it's worth mentioning. Look at the age Zibanejad and JT Miller blossomed. You're trying to identify those sorts of players that may have another gear as they mature. But it's hard to come by.

It seems like a fleeting hope that we're going to stumble into a top 5 pick this year and grab Hagens or Misa. I think that's another hang up for some people. A month ago.. I would've agreed 100%. They were a complete dumpster fire. That's not the way this team is trending so you have to adjust the expectations. People are still holding on to this idea that we're going to get a chance to draft Hagens and him and Perreault will ride off into the sunset together. Believe me I'd love that. But for better or worse, it's becoming more and more unrealistic.

So again, I'd say what are people's realistic plans to acquire a 1C? Because much of what I've seen boils down to something along the lines of pray Connor McDavid signs as a free agent. Or sign the often injured Jack Eichel as a free agent when his new deal starts at 30 years old. Or pray we get a chance to draft the big name centers this year. Maybe we can come back to this post in a few months towards the deadline. If the wheels completely fall off again and we're trending towards the basement then I'm 100% on board. Keep the pick and shelf the idea for the time being. But at this time many of these sorts of suggestions don't seem too realistic.

 

[17futurecap]

The Rangers stink, he absolutely should haggle over conditions on the 2025 first round pick.

 

[Bacon Artemi Bravo]

Of course he'll go to Carolina. Maybe we can get another Wennberg trade and see him do f*** all. I'm conflicted about Miller but Drury doesn't do any trades of any kind of significance. I guess Tarasenko and Kane were the two exceptions.

We're not competing with Carolina this year. We're competing with Carolina in 3 years, if all goes well. I'm all for them wasting their good young assets to go all in this year, if that's what it takes to get Miller.

 

[KirkAlbuquerque]

Carolina is a good fit for JT and he is a good fit for Carolina.

It would help them pump the Devils even harder in the playoffs.

I’m fine with that but they need to find another deal to move Lindgren asap.

Just waive Lindgren and I’ll be ecstatic and give Drury attaboy

 

[GoAwayPanarin]

That's debatable. This team has no intention of picking in the lottery. if they don't add JT, they are going to add something else. even if you are adding a 70 point player over the next 5 years instead of a 90-100 point player, JT is far more valuable than a draft pick. A lottery pick has a miniscule chance of ever being a top 6 C.

It’s not just the pick, it’s the pick + others.

The pick if it’s high enough turns into a contributor on an ELC. There a ton of value in that alone for a team that typically spends so closely to the cap.

I don’t think they should bend and lift all restrictions. This isn’t the deal for it. Get him on your terms or be okay with someone else getting him on theirs.

 

[SnowblindNYR]

I mean, Trouba?

I mean where he gets a legit asset back.

 

[Kovalev27]

Of course he'll go to Carolina. Maybe we can get another Wennberg trade and see him do f*** all. I'm conflicted about Miller but Drury doesn't do any trades of any kind of significance. I guess Tarasenko and Kane were the two exceptions.

Drury couldn’t close a door. Those guys had to make the trades for him.

He’s gonna blow this too

 

[McRanger92]

Drury couldn’t close a door. Those guys had to make the trades for him.

He’s gonna blow this too

Just more examples that Drury can talk a big game to the media about who he wants (he "covets" Miller and Brady T is his "top target"), but can't close and can't close on his terms when he does. Carolina stuff could still be posturing but after 3 years of JT Miller rumors, him going to a division rival for peanuts would be a massive L for Drury.

 

[SnowblindNYR]

Just more examples that Drury can talk a big game to the media about who he wants (he "covets" Miller and Brady T is his "top target"), but can't close and can't close on his terms when he does. Carolina stuff could still be posturing but after 3 years of JT Miller rumors, him going to a division rival for peanuts would be a massive L for Drury.

Every f***ing time. This is Guentzel all over again.

 

[McRanger92]

Every f***ing time. This Guentzel all over again.

Im a Drury guy but it started with Eichel non-trade and its gotten worse. Overpay or strikeout on every guy who "wants to be here". He learned from Sather.

 

[GoAwayPanarin]

Lol at the thought that Brady Tkachuk was available.

I'm sure the Rangers wanted him, but the Senators want him too.

Every f***ing time. This Guentzel all over again.

Guentzel would have allowed them to sweep the first 2 rounds instead of sweeping the opener and winning in 6.

They would have still lost to Florida.

I think this is the wrong thing to rip Drury for. Taking a hard stance on these moves is the right way to go. I say this as someone who would have booted Panarin in a heart beat to ink Guentzel. The former wasn't happening even if it should have IMO.

If we want to rip him, rip him for allowing Lindgren to continue being a thing here. He was the biggest hole on a team that was otherwise pretty good last year and he and Trouba were why they ended up losing eventually, Guentzel wouldn't have changed that. Trouba's situation was complicated but Lindgren's has never been, thats a spot that could have and should have been upgraded years ago before RL's game really fell off a cliff.

Thats what irks me. Its not the lack of toughness or any other BS that people think were an issue (You don't know how many times I've read that the Rangers D was too soft and got mauled inside vs Florida despite almost every goal FLA scored being off the rush in that series) but it's the lack of making the most obvious changes. When your team looks demonstrably better with basically replacement level players in the position of Trouba and Lindgren, thats a pretty good indication that those guys shouldn't be playing in your top 4 (and in RL's case, at all.)

On JTM - If you can get him on your terms, then awesome. If not then let him go to Carolina. Theres more motivation on their end to get something done because they've been contending for a half decade now with nothing to show for it other than a few runs to the ECF on the years where they don't get knocked out by the Rangers before getting there.

Someone else will shake loose.