Speculation: Roster Building Thread: Part XV

[GAGLine]

Quinn press conference:

 

[GoAwayPanarin]

I feel I have been taking some knocks today
At least it is from generational posters...

well that’s what happens when you insinuate that 2 guys who have about 30 games of NHL experience between them may become as good as 2 Hall of Famers, including a guy who is 2nd all time in scoring.

If Kakko puts up 50% of Jagrs career production he’d be almost a 1000 point player. I’d sign up for that right now.

 

[kovazub94]

Columbus gave Nash his contract

And the Rangers traded for it.

 

[Drew4u]

And the Rangers traded for it.

Nothing wrong with the Nash contract or trade.

 

[leetch99]

Based on what the Rangers have done the last few years, I think there's at least a distinct possibility that Zibanejad's next contract is with another team.

I brought that up a couple of days ago. Probably be the best move long term for the Rangers . Money-age-health...all factors to be considered . Can't compete if you are right up against the Cap all the time . It's not a popular subject Edge...but definitely is likely being discussed by upper management as we speak. This would require long term planning as it is a pivotal move for us to make . Timing will be everything . Getting back a younger version of Zibs in a deal will work fine for us and some team that needs that established # 1-2 guy won't think twice if they figure Zibs puts them over the top. Our club has time on our side whereas some clubs/GM's don't .

 

[Ola]

Zibanejad won't be at the start of his peak as a 29-year old. He was at the start of his peak last year.

The worry is that it turns into a Loui Eriksson, who is not LTIR-able and isn't going to retire. I don't totally agree with being overly cautious for that reason, but there's another possibility besides what you mentioned.

I wouldn’t bet the house on it, but I could see Ziba taking a Zucc like discount. Like just something to get it done. But you never know.

 

[bobbop]

I brought that up a couple of days ago. Probably be the best move long term for the Rangers . Money-age-health...all factors to be considered . Can't compete if you are right up against the Cap all the time . It's not a popular subject Edge...but definitely is likely being discussed by upper management as we speak. This would require long term planning as it is a pivotal move for us to make . Timing will be everything . Getting back a younger version of Zibs in a deal will work fine for us and some team that needs that established # 1-2 guy won't think twice if they figure Zibs puts them over the top. Our club has time on our side whereas some clubs/GM's don't .

It would call for another Zibanejad for Brassard trade.

Hope it doesn't come to this, but it might.

 

[leetch99]

It would call for another Zibanejad for Brassard trade.

Hope it doesn't come to this, but it might.

Haha could be one of them darned if you do....and darned if you don't trades . His health though is very concerning as will be his age in a couple of more seasons .

 

[Edge]

It would call for another Zibanejad for Brassard trade.

Hope it doesn't come to this, but it might.

I think that's a very real possibility that I could see happening.

Obviously, there's a ton of time left and it's hard to predict things a year from now, let along three years from now.

But one thing is for certain: if Zibanejad maintains his current level, he's going to get paid handsomely. Whether it is the Rangers paying him or someone else, we'll just have to wait and see.

 

[kovazub94]

Nothing wrong with the Nash contract or trade.

In the context of what we are discussing re. Zibanejad's next contract?

 

[effen]

Mika not at practice today tells me he’s going to miss at least his 10th game. That’s a big time amount of games to miss. That’s a serious injury so this bull**** day to day story needs to be challenged. Someone needs to bring up the concussion word again and get some answers.

Billion dollar NHL franchise needs to provide legendary internet message board poster kovalev27 with some answers, damnit.

 

[Mikos87]

Interesting. I must admit I know very little about zonal defense in hockey. Tried to find something on the web, but mostly is was about the starting positions in the system. How does this system work when the first defender fail? Is it the nearest guy who then goes to work? Reason I ask is that in the early nineties Norway got a new coach for the national soccer team. With a strict zonal defense he took the team from nowhere to 2nd in the FIFA World ranking. When he described how it worked I found it was much more complex than players defending their zone. Very very very simplified the nearest defender would defend against the player who had the ball and rest would position themselves according to that. So the next guy could try if the first defender failed.

There's really 3 "schemes" in the NHL. Zone, Man on Man, and Box+1. All of the schemes have switches in coverage, but it's how you switch, and where you are on the ice that limits passing lanes. The success of each depends on the overall style of play, and personnel that you have. Most teams either do a zone or a man on man. Some teams will still deploy a box+1, but you need good centers with young legs in today's game to play that effectively, otherwise you where your guys out.

I'm a bit short on time, so I'll cover zone for now, and post the rest later.

Zone:

The CLB Bluejackets are one of the better zone defense teams out there. The same was true for the 2012 Rangers. Tortorella preaches this system, but you need the right personnel for it. A good zone defense will contain teams on the outside, take away the cross ice pass, and hardly ever have a defenseman vacate the slot without a coverage switch. There are more stops and starts.

If you have a defense that's willing to block shots, especially after a cross pass, then this helps the goalie out tremendously. Teams like Vegas, the 2016 Panthers, the Trotz teams are won or are winning with older or "weaker" goaltenders because the team structure is designed to prevent shots and one-timers from "in-the-box".

The "box" is the homeplate shape from the top side of each crease to the faceoff dots, and the area in front. Outside of Stamkos and Ovechkin, there are not a lot of guys who can consistently beat a goalie clean outside the box, and even then that's on the PP. Most NHL goalies can stop shots outside the box, especially from a non-rush situation.

Teams that play zone effectively will take a trade-off of pressuring aggressively, and actually give-away end zone time if the puck and passing options are kept outside the box. This is one of those things that shows poorly in some corsi stats or timed possession stats, and I've heard about luck and regression towards the mean on this phenomena, but always found it to be dumb because you have teams that do this by design, and do it very well. The Trotz teams are probably the best at this in the current NHL but they are one of the worst "timed possession teams".

If the Rangers are trying to play a zone, then they are doing it poorly. In a zone scheme, it's a cardinal sin to have both defense below the red line, or vacate coverage in the box to pressure the puck carrier, unless the center switches. This also requires the wingers to collapse and provide support. A good offensive team will try to counter this by either bringing a 5 man forecheck, or throwing it back to the point. A point shot that's well outside the box is the trade off. If the forwards are willing to block that shot, then you take away the danger of a scoring chance. Not counting bad bounces.

 

[NYSPORTS]

generational players list of our generation:

Crosby
Ovi
Malkin
McJesus

It’s off the charts luck the Penguins history goes from;

Lemieux to
Jagr to
Crosby and Malkin.

 

[Avery16]

Last week: DILEMMA NEARS BREAKING POINT.
This week: ok, maybe not.

https://nypost.com/2019/11/18/every...medium=site buttons&utm_campaign=site buttons

 

[Cag29]

Best center in 20 years? Check. Finally a borderline elite level legit 1st line center? Check.

Pretty sure that is how they will reason resigning him.

Hard hit and he’s out a month check.

 

[Cag29]

How do you figure? If he stays healthy, they finally have a 1C at the start of his peak. If he gets seriously hurt or has to retire, he doesn't count against the cap.

I didn’t know that. So that cap would go for signing his replacement?

 

[Edge]

Last week: DILEMMA NEARS BREAKING POINT.
This week: ok, maybe not.

https://nypost.com/2019/11/18/everything-is-on-the-table-for-rangers-when-it-comes-to-lias-andersson/?utm_source=twitter_sitebuttons&utm_medium=site buttons&utm_campaign=site buttons

Those are the times I wish I was the reporter, because I know exactly what my follow-up questions would be.

 

[FIRE DRURY]

Quinn press conference:

5:08 in the presser.

Reporter asks Quinn if he think Andersson playing a top-9 role would spark him.

Quinn responds with a yes.

LOL.. So why not try it?

 

[Fitzy]

generational players list of our generation:

Crosby
Ovi
Malkin
McJesus

Malkin isn't in this tier. Malkins in a tier with like, Pat Kane and Iginla. He isn't anywhere close to Jagr, who I assume you left out because he just retired from the NHL

 

[NYSPORTS]

Malkin isn't in this tier. Malkins in a tier with like, Pat Kane and Iginla. He isn't anywhere close to Jagr, who I assume you left out because he just retired from the NHL

I agree but he is another very lucky gem. The other three are generational.

Hmm, read too fast and was confused. Thought you quoted my post

 

[Leetch3]

Quinn press conference:

I could be wrong but I think this is the first time he has said that wing is on the table for lias...previously the team was adamant that guys were centers. doesn't mean he will move to wing, but if the option is 'on the table' do we see him play wing at all in hartford?

also thought his response to the question about Lias' linemates was interesting (from brooks' article)

“I get that, and everybody talks about that, but there are things in this game that you need to do regardless of who your linemates are,” the coach said. “This isn’t about points. This is about, you watch the game and a player should be doing this and they’re doing that, a player should be doing this quicker and they’re not doing it quick enough, a player should be physical and they’re not physical. That has nothing to do with who your linemates are.
“I’m not just talking about Lias. I’m talking in general. A lot of players think along those lines and that’s a big mistake, that’s a big mistake if that’s what players are thinking because you should be able to be an effective player regardless of who you’re playing with. There are things this game is going to demand and you should be able to do them regardless of who’s on your wing or your D-partner is, or whoever. There’s an easy evaluation process for an individual.”

I'm sure people will say thats a load of crap or whatever but thought it was interesting to get a clearer picture of what he is looking for

 

[NYRFANMANI]

Malkin isn't in this tier. Malkins in a tier with like, Pat Kane and Iginla.

Mjeh ... this ain't worth debating about it. My argument stand as generational = stepping into the league being a PPG-player. Malkin did that with 304 points in his first three seasons and he's at 1011 point in 861 games ...

Active NHL Players - Points per Game Leaders

Looking at this, I get the feeling it's only McJesus and Crosby that are generational. Crosby 1.27 P/G, McJesus 1.29 P/G, Malkin 1.17 P/G, Ovi 1.11 P/G (gets pass because of goals/game).

He isn't anywhere close to Jagr, who I assume you left out because he just retired from the NHL

Obviously I count Jagr as one generation before these guys, no question there.

 

[Fitzy]

Mjeh ... this ain't worth debating about it.
.

This is true. I just dislike Malkin and feel he gets heavily overrated.

 

[SA16]

There's no such thing as another Brassard for Zibanejad trade. That's called a rip off. Hopefully another team also does something stupid but I wouldn't bank on it.

 

[Bleed Ranger Blue]

5:08 in the presser.

Reporter asks Quinn if he think Andersson playing a top-9 role would spark him.

Quinn responds with a yes.

LOL.. So why not try it?

It’s equal parts funny and bizarre that so many people seem to just pretend it wasn’t tried.