Speculation: Roster Building Thread: Part XLVII

[Savant]

I gave you a possible scenario in the previous post but you ignored it for some reason. Add in a Staal buyout and a possible HL retirement.

At this point I dont know what you're arguing? It's too hard to make a trade, so lets just do nothing?

Middle6 centers are needed. A big reason as to why 'we're not hard to play against' is because of the middle 6 centers. Just as Gorton addressed RHD last year with Trouba and Fox, Gorton should address Center this year.

I didn’t ignore it. What center are you getting for Buchnevich without taking a bath on value? If you move Strome, where is the upgrade? Chytil is a wing. Would you rather play Haley or Chytil? That makes you tougher.
There aren’t easy solutions for this. It doesn’t happen over night. If Quinn has a system they could mitigate some of this with play style, but they don’t have that kind of identity.

 

[Amazing Kreiderman]

That's awesome. Kreider's workout regimen is one of the best in the league.

Yeah. Kreider's dedication to training is praised by many in the organization. Miller stayin with Kreider is a really good thing. I hope it all works out

 

[Savant]

15-20 spots? The Car pick is likely to be around 20 overall. Lundell looks to possibly go around 13-15. You’re probably talking about 5-7 spots.

you might be able to get it for a 3rd round pick included in the trade. At worst, probably a 2nd from next years Draft.

I don’t agree with that. Even if it’s 10 spots up that is still a lot. When the Rangers moved up for Miller look what that cost. And this is a bigger leap. I think Lundell goes earlier than 13 too

 

[Savant]

Gotcha. What if Gorton acquired an early 2nd?
Curious because Lundell is projected to be a plug and play type of pick with many scouts seeing him being able to play in the league as soon as next season as well as being projected to be in the league for a long time. Having him center Kakko and Lafreniere... Carolina's 1st and a 2nd... I'd make that trade in a heartbeat otherwise like you said try and use other chips to fill in other holes.

That is too much calculus. Rarely do things work that way.

 

[Chytilmania]

Yeah. Kreider's dedication to training is praised by many in the organization. Miller stayin with Kreider is a really good thing. I hope it all works out

I was on the trade him boat but because of how he takes care of himself and how he contributes in front of the net I don't think we should be worrying about him falling off a cliff like many are saying. He just may not get the same breakaways at age 35.

 

[Amazing Kreiderman]

Complete f***ing delusion

Fast is probably not a top 6 finisher but his ability to win battles created half of the offense of that line. Strome couldn't win a board battle if the other player had one leg. Panarin's strength is stick checks and positioning and not on the boards. Fast is one of the best board players in the league and created a ton of space for that line. HE also scores at a high rate at even strength (it doesn't appear so because he doesn't get PP time).

We saw how useless Strome and even Panarin can be when the games are tight. Nobody else gelled with them and was able to do the dirty work while both of them f***ed off to nowhere when the puck was up for grabs.

You'd think after that line got bludgeoned without Fast winning every puck would've stopped but I guess not.

I know it may sound a bit weird to single out one moment, but the OT winner by Stepan in game 7 vs the Caps in 2015 would not have happened if Fast doesn't win the puck battle after the puck drop, halfway inside the face off circle. That moment personifies Fast to me

 

[Fitzy]

Tough to play against is as much a team mentality and a coaching scheme as it is a particular assortment of players.

The 01-02 Red Wings were a lot tougher to play against than Vityaz.

 

[broadwayblue]

15-20 spots? The Car pick is likely to be around 20 overall. Lundell looks to possibly go around 13-15. You’re probably talking about 5-7 spots.

you might be able to get it for a 3rd round pick included in the trade. At worst, probably a 2nd from next years Draft.

Lundell could crack the top 10. I've seen plenty of mocks having him go at 11.

 

[Savant]

I don’t see any reason to not try to bring Fast back, at least on a one year deal. Worst case in scenario he is in bottom six and can move up if needed and be reliable.

Another center would be nice. Need a guy that can win face offs.
Secondary scoring
Need to improve the PK. Badly.
Need to get Trouba a partner.

That is the off-season agenda

 

[Leetch3]

for me being 'tough to play against' is a mindset or attitude more than anything...and very often 1 or 2 guys leading the way can completely change the mindset of the team as it becomes contagious for lack of a better term.

 

[Anthony5967]

Trading Chytil negates the whole purpose of the trade... Do you really want Brett Howden to be your go to 3rd line center for the next X years? Barkov is also UFA in 2 years. The rangers are looking to build a perennial contender for the next decade.

Honestly the best move would be to have Strome or some other stop gap be in place for the next year or 2 and make a trade to move up in the draft or to bring in a young cheap 2C.

Trying to get a Barkov or an Eichel is just inviting the type of cap hell that the Leafs are going through right now and being forced to play with no depth.

True. I'd personally stick with Strome. He's developed his game and is in a much better place than he ever has been. He's comfortable with Panarin, he kills penalties, too. I just wish their C's were better on draws.

 

[Savant]

True. I'd personally stick with Strome. He's developed his game and is in a much better place than he ever has been. He's comfortable with Panarin, he kills penalties, too. I just wish their C's were better on draws.

I am no Strome fan, but they don’t improve the team by just dumping him. Need a plan.

 

[BklynTerp]

I know it may sound a bit weird to single out one moment, but the OT winner by Stepan in game 7 vs the Caps in 2015 would not have happened if Fast doesn't win the puck battle after the puck drop, halfway inside the face off circle. That moment personifies Fast to me

It's not weird at all. If you go back and watch some highlight videos of those playoff runs its amazing how often Fast comes up. McDonaghs OT winner against the Caps is another one, Fast bats a pass out of the air in the neutral zone, gains the zone, puts a perfect pass cross ice which then sets up McDonagh.

To borrow a favorite coach cliche, hes been through it and is someone I want around when this team finds itself in the playoffs these next few years.

 

[cheech70]

I know it may sound a bit weird to single out one moment, but the OT winner by Stepan in game 7 vs the Caps in 2015 would not have happened if Fast doesn't win the puck battle after the puck drop, halfway inside the face off circle. That moment personifies Fast to me

I was there I almost passed out when I jumped and screamed everthing went wobbly (ps No drinks)

 

[Amazing Kreiderman]

It's not weird at all. If you go back and watch some highlight videos of those playoff runs its amazing how often Fast comes up. McDonaghs OT winner against the Caps is another one, Fast bats a pass out of the air in the neutral zone, gains the zone, puts a perfect pass cross ice which then sets up McDonagh.

To borrow a favorite coach cliche, hes been through it and is someone I want around when this team finds itself in the playoffs these next few years.

That was also his rookie season. I often forget he has only been on the team for 5 years. It feels like he has been around ever since the Tortorella days for some reason

 

[Avery16]

I am no Strome fan, but they don’t improve the team by just dumping him. Need a plan.

If dumping him allows us to keep Buch and ADA, then yes it would.

 

[Vitto79]

If Hank moves on and cap space opens is there a good ufa faceoff specialist c?

I also think Fast returns w space . He’s the type of guy you win with

 

[Shesterkybomb]

Centers on expiring (Summer 2021) contracts w/ face off win % over 50% - some names I mentioned yesterday

• Bozak 55.0%
• Stastny 54.8%
  
• Danault 54.5%
• Bonino 52.6%
  
• Krejci 50.3%

Only one or two of those guys won't be getting resigned. 3 of them are expensive, and Bozak would be the 2nd oldest on our team behind Lundqvist, why does his name keep popping up he wasn't good 2 years ago.

 

[Savant]

Really wondering if there is a deal to be had with Vegas. They have really bad cap issues. Would try to get Stastny and Martinez out of there. DeAngelo and 2020 Carolina 1st to headline a deal.

Either individually greatly improve the Rangers but getting gives a really good foundation. Vegas gets cap relief and can have Glass step in for Stastny. DeAngelo is a great fit there and Rangers sell high. Not a perfect deal necessarily but solves some issues. Makes Rangers harder to play against too to make y’all happy. Vegas gets good ROI on those Guys too. Not a complete idea yet but it’s in the workshop.

 

[Shesterkybomb]

If dumping him allows us to keep Buch and ADA, then yes it would.

Neither of those guys play center.

 

[Off Sides]

Say they ended up keeping Trouba, Fox and DeAngelo, how if that not a good thing other than it being expensive?

From there is just becomes situational and match-up based.

It would not take extraordinary coaching to play Trouba against the other teams better players as often as they can, and put him on the primary PK, then play DeAngelo more when trailing or on the PP. Hopefully Fox continues to round out his game where he can be more or become a lot of both.

If the idea that three LWs could make the Rangers forwards deep, I don't see how having three RD would not be similar given one of them would be on the ice at all times.

Given the LD, is likely to end up, if they do nothing, entry level contracts or RFA deals for a pretty long time, that should counter the expensive RD side for a while.

If the Rangers need to cost cut beyond that, why not do so on the 4th line and 3rd lines. Where some drafted entry level players should play.

Another way to keep cap hits down or get back assets, giving out long term contract extensions off entry levels before they hit RFA arbitration and UFA age. Even though I always believed the Skjei contract was a bit of an over-payment, they still were able to trade him for a 1st likely mostly because of his age, contract and lack of clauses relative to his skill level. That requires not being capped out headed out of UFA buying time, something they should be avoiding anyway.

 

[Trxjw]

"Tough to play against" is such a nebulous term in hockey. It really doesn't mean what most people often think it means. I.e. that the team wants to stack their roster with guys who can throw hands and throw hits. Usually it's a signal that the coaches and staff think the team is too one-dimensional and needs to find alternative ways to win when their go-to isn't working. In our case, how the team basically flat-out folded when they could't capitalize offensively the way they had been leading up to the break.

I think the more relevant term that we've seen thrown around is "north-south." To me that means guys who can do the things that compliment the skill players. Create space for them. Be relentless on the forecheck. Separate guys from pucks and actually know what to do with it when they get it on their stick. It really has less to do with aggression than it does versatility. If you can vary the way in which you can win games, you increase the number of games that you win. By that definition alone, you're "tough to play against."

The Rangers have been looking for "north-south" guys since last fall.

 

[Savant]

Only one or two of those guys won't be getting resigned. 3 of them are expensive, and Bozak would be the 2nd oldest on our team behind Lundqvist, why does his name keep popping up he wasn't good 2 years ago.

Because STL has major cap issues and because he is great of faceoffs. A veteran leader who has won the cup coming in for a year, likely not costing a lot, wouldn’t be the worst thing in the world either.
Rangers don’t necessarily need a Strome replacement as long as the partnership with Panarin is still working. Replacing Howden with Bozak isn’t sexy but that makes the Rangers a lot better.

 

[Avery16]

Neither of those guys play center.

That wasn't the question. It was whether dumping Strome improves the team.

 

[Edge]

Lundell could crack the top 10. I've seen plenty of mocks having him go at 11.

So to chime in on this discussion, Lundell is probably going to be out of reach at this point.

He likely goes anywhere from 8-12. So he would be 8-16 picks outside of where the Carolina pick is likely to fall.

Now, if he's sitting there at 14 or 15, for some strange reason, and the Carolina pick lands on the 20 spot, it is possible, though difficult even with that kind of gap, to imagine a scenario where the Rangers attempt to make a deal.

But, the cost is likely going to be on the higher end, and the Rangers will need to decide if that's how they want to utilize those assets.

Any move-up scenario comes down to the teams involved and the gap. In addition to organizational preferences, the further the teams are from each other as rivals (division, conference, etc.), and the smaller the gap between the two picks, the higher the probability of making a deal.

Going from 20 to 18 is easier than 20 to 16. And going from 20 to 12 is just highly improbable.

Also, I really don't think the Rangers first preference is to move a roster player for a draft pick right now.

Could that change based on salary demands and other factors? Yes, but I don't think it's a targeted plan for the team right now.